4WD vs 2WD

[stament]

Somebody recently told me that 4wd cars are much more expensive to fix than 2wd - is this true?

Secondly, are they less reliable or the same?

[IMHO]

It depends what goes wrong with it - an engine, body or interior fault is going to be no harder to fix than a 2WD - same, same. A fault with a gearbox, transfer case or front drive shaft, sure - these parts are different/missing from a 2WD.

In short, there are more moving parts involved in a 4WD, yes, but there's no linear relationship between the total amount of moving parts and the number of items that unintentionally break - which answers both of your questions.

[cumgranosalum]

Basically no - however a 4WD has more moving parts...so the odds of something going wrong are a little bit higher. There is also the possibility that someone might use the 4WD system incorrectly thus increasing the chances of a fault......

Most 4WD are just versions of th standard pick ups....there are other vehicles that have $WD too, you need to decide if you need it and for what purpose the vehicle has it....it's not simply of "off-roading"

[DavisH]

2WD rear axle pushes the ride, 4WD rear axle pushes, front axle pulls, so "perhaps" there is less strain on the rear stuff cos the front is pulling...Just one of my thoughts...

Of course there are more moving parts to possibly go wrong on a 4WD but thats the chance you must take...

Indeed, there are thousands of parts that could have issues on modern cars. My old mini was so basic even I could service it:) I've not read of major problems with 4wd systems here by TV posters, not that it doesn't happen, but it doesn't seem that common, especially on newer vehicles.

[WinnieTheKhwai]

It may also depend if it's full time all wheel drive, or that you engage 4WD separately. For the latter, it realistically gets very little use compared to the regular drivetrain, so it doesn't wear much and doesn't normally go wrong for the duration of a car's reasonable lifetime.

It does however add a little weight, and also it means that major service is a little more expensive due to having to change the oil in the front differential and 4WD transfer box.

That said, I used to get stuck all the )*#$^ time with a rear wheel drive truck, even in silly little situations like a little gutter or ditch next to the road. Not to say 4WDs never get stuck, but accomplishing that actually means going seriously out of your way.

Edited September 3, 2015 by WinnieTheKhwai

[little mary sunshine]

Unless you drive on a beach in sand or go off

Roading frequently, can't see any reason the

Average driver would even want 4WD??

[farangmick]

Nit noi more expensive, six years ago 4WD added about 40,000 baht to the price of my D-Max. I have used it maybe twenty times on red dirt tracks in the rainy season. I actually NEEDED it only about five times. I got 4WD because a 2WD raised truck is a bit of a fake, like a 2WD Landrover or Jeep Cherokee. The main reason though was road holding and handling when hit by big rain. Rear wheel drive, and most of the weight on the front of the truck makes it far easier to lose, even on a gentle bend. (I was a police advanced driver in my previous life in England).

[farangmick]

Sorry. Rather missed the thread of the OP post. (Thursday afternoon is when the local farang meet for a beer). Bought D-Max November 2009. One new battery three years ago. New tyres last year. Otherwise normal services. Manual lot better on fuel than auto, if you are not American, so can drive one.

[Don Mega]

Nit noi more expensive, six years ago 4WD added about 40,000 baht to the price of my D-Max. I have used it maybe twenty times on red dirt tracks in the rainy season. I actually NEEDED it only about five times. I got 4WD because a 2WD raised truck is a bit of a fake, like a 2WD Landrover or Jeep Cherokee. The main reason though was road holding and handling when hit by big rain. Rear wheel drive, and most of the weight on the front of the truck makes it far easier to lose, even on a gentle bend. (I was a police advanced driver in my previous life in England).

I would have thought all the 4WD gear will add more weight to the front and unless selecting 4wd every time it rains (isnt that a bit of a no no on sealed roads ?) I cannot see how there would be any handling or road holding advantage.

[ResandePohm]

Unless you drive on a beach in sand or go off

Roading frequently, can't see any reason the

Average driver would even want 4WD??

Absolutely agree!

To buy a 4WD as opposed to a 2WD is more expensive.

To drive using 4WD on normal roads uses a lot more fuel therefore increased cost

4WD is for rough off road driving not for driving down a normal dirt track so unless you are a farmer etc it is totally unnecessary

[Don Mega]

Nit noi more expensive, six years ago 4WD added about 40,000 baht to the price of my D-Max. I have used it maybe twenty times on red dirt tracks in the rainy season. I actually NEEDED it only about five times. I got 4WD because a 2WD raised truck is a bit of a fake, like a 2WD Landrover or Jeep Cherokee. The main reason though was road holding and handling when hit by big rain. Rear wheel drive, and most of the weight on the front of the truck makes it far easier to lose, even on a gentle bend. (I was a police advanced driver in my previous life in England).

I would have thought all the 4WD gear will add more weight to the front and unless selecting 4wd every time it rains (isnt that a bit of a no no on sealed roads ?) I cannot see how there would be any handling or road holding advantage.

Well it does, cos the ride is pulling as well as pushing with 4WD...Traction is conyrolled by 4 wheels and not 2...

Ahhh ok. I thought if you drive your 4x4 on a sealed road with 4wd engaged you'll get wind up in the axles and cause damage.

Goes to show I no very little about these beasts, thanks for the education.

[chilli42]

A 4wd trasmission is more expensive to fix ... but nothing else on the car. I have been driving for 45 years now and never had a problem with a 4 or 2 wd transmission. In my view what you have been told is a half truth and it likely will never matter. I would never own a vehicle in my home country (Canada) without 4wd. Here in Thailand, not so sure it matters unless you are in the back of beyond on mud roads and if that is the case best add a power winch to the 4wd. In Thailand mostly 4wd is a marketing play ... slap a 4wd logo on the vehicle and it looks more butch .... will you ever use it .... likely not.

[cumgranosalum]

There is a lot of misleading stuff going on here about 4WDs.....it seems to be overlooking that fact that there are many different 4WDs on the market - even in Thailand - with systems of differing sophistication. Nowadays they are all pretty reliable - some =may be a bit costly in the unlikely event of a major failure.

However the vast majority of 4WDs in Thailand are simply a very basic conversion on a pickup truck. They don't cost a lot more, they certainly aren't any less reliable and the fuel consumption is NOT dramatically different. (if you really worry about mpg, then you can fit free-wheeling front hubs.)

[cumgranosalum]

Unless you drive on a beach in sand or go off

Roading frequently, can't see any reason the

Average driver would even want 4WD??

Absolutely agree!

To buy a 4WD as opposed to a 2WD is more expensive.

To drive using 4WD on normal roads uses a lot more fuel therefore increased cost

4WD is for rough off road driving not for driving down a normal dirt track so unless you are a farmer etc it is totally unnecessary

4WD on a pickup is not considerably more expensive.

4wd drive not normally engaged on asphalt roads in pickups and SUVs - and on permanent 4WDs the change in mpg is often not that significant.

Most 4WDs are NOT for off-road the 4WD is for better adhesion on loose or wet surfaces. - i.e. dirt roads.

[Nuddy]

I have a Toyota 4WD Vigo with auto. I think it is the top of the range stuff. Over the life of the vehicle I have been in 4WD only a few times but each time it stopped me being really stuck. I do not know if it is worth the extra dosh but I love it when I have been able to go places that others cannot, and it has helped me in many situations when the mud road has been really bad. Driving in 4WD is totally different to normal driving. I have heard that driving on blacktop in 4WD is bad but I checked this and its not true.

Once we were really pressed for time and it was raining hard. We used the car in 4WD on the bitumen road and it worked great. I am not a yahoo with 4WD but I recommend everyone buy 4WD in Thailand. The all wheel drive vehicles are not the same and inferior in my opinion.

Regards

[fullcave]

Unless you drive on a beach in sand or go off

Roading frequently, can't see any reason the

Average driver would even want 4WD??

Other than rain and thai roads..

[cumgranosalum]

I have a Toyota 4WD Vigo with auto. I think it is the top of the range stuff. Over the life of the vehicle I have been in 4WD only a few times but each time it stopped me being really stuck. I do not know if it is worth the extra dosh but I love it when I have been able to go places that others cannot, and it has helped me in many situations when the mud road has been really bad. Driving in 4WD is totally different to normal driving. I have heard that driving on blacktop in 4WD is bad but I checked this and its not true.

Once we were really pressed for time and it was raining hard. We used the car in 4WD on the bitumen road and it worked great. I am not a yahoo with 4WD but I recommend everyone buy 4WD in Thailand. The all wheel drive vehicles are not the same and inferior in my opinion.

Regards

You are correct that driving a normal 4WD pick in 4WD is unlikely to cause a lot of damage as the rear axle has limited slip diff and the front has none.

However you are putting strain for a long period on the front wheel drive section when it is only intended for occasional use.

I can certainly say that on newly wet slippery asphalt is has saved be from trouble on at least two occasions - judging by all the other pickups sat on the verges.

$WD certainly gets me to places both here and in neighbouring countries that it is unlikely anyone with a sedan would get to and a 2WD pickup would be pretty stressful too.

some Foruners and other pickup based SUVs have permanent 4WD now as standard.

Many all wheel drive systems are liked to computer controlled power distribution anti-skid ad anti-lock systems - these vehicles are not necessarily designed of dirt-tracks etc but are very safe on poor roads in wet of hazardous conditions.

[cumgranosalum]

Unless you drive on a beach in sand or go off

Roading frequently, can't see any reason the

Average driver would even want 4WD??

Other than rain and thai roads..

I think one of the things about 4WD is knowing where and when to use it....many 4WD owners don't really consider this and the result is it never gets used......but they get through anyway.....so they don't find out how much easier it would have been in 4WD

[fullcave]

Unless you drive on a beach in sand or go off

Roading frequently, can't see any reason the

Average driver would even want 4WD??

Other than rain and thai roads..

I think one of the things about 4WD is knowing where and when to use it....many 4WD owners don't really consider this and the result is it never gets used......but they get through anyway.....so they don't find out how much easier it would have been in 4WD

Easier and safer...

[malt25]

Just my 2 cents worth.

There's all wheel drive & 4 wheel drive. All wheel drive is constant, like Subaru. Four wheel drive in most SUV. You have to select 4x4, you always have 4x4 with all wheel drive.

On wet roads all wheel or four wheel drive is somewhat of an advantage. Most sensible drivers adjust their driving to suit the prevailing conditions, so unless you are in a real hurry, you don't need any sort of 4x4. Yes, I know, I'll get conflicting opinions from some purists.

I've driven the length & breadth of Australia, beach, deserts, mountains. Bad tracks & no tracks, total wilderness. From memory have only ever needed 4x4 on 2 occasions. The main advantage of most 4x4 vehicles is the extra ground clearance. If you are sensible & use some caution there's few places you can't reach with a 2wd vehicle. As mentioned, ground clearance is the big advantage of 4x4.

So, unless you are tempted to explore the unexplored, driving where you were never meant to drive, have sufficient baht not to have to think about economics, you really don't need a 4 x 4.

To all the 4 x 4 experts out there.. I've owned & driven numerous Mitsubishi, Toyota & Nissan 4 x 4's All great vehicles. But in most instances you just don't need them.

Cheers..... Mal.

[stament]

Unless you drive on a beach in sand or go off

Roading frequently, can't see any reason the

Average driver would even want 4WD??

Other than rain and thai roads..

I think one of the things about 4WD is knowing where and when to use it....many 4WD owners don't really consider this and the result is it never gets used......but they get through anyway.....so they don't find out how much easier it would have been in 4WD

interesting point, when should one use it?

[mikiea]

It depends what goes wrong with it - an engine, body or interior fault is going to be no harder to fix than a 2WD - same, same. A fault with a gearbox, transfer case or front drive shaft, sure - these parts are different/missing from a 2WD.

In short, there are more moving parts involved in a 4WD, yes, but there's no linear relationship between the total amount of moving parts and the number of items that unintentionally break - which answers both of your questions.

and please let us not forget the awd auto .it is a sorry excuse of failed engineering . may be ok on road but off road it is a putz .........

[Kondiao]

Just my 2 cents worth.

There's all wheel drive & 4 wheel drive. All wheel drive is constant, like Subaru. Four wheel drive in most SUV. You have to select 4x4, you always have 4x4 with all wheel drive.

On wet roads all wheel or four wheel drive is somewhat of an advantage. Most sensible drivers adjust their driving to suit the prevailing conditions, so unless you are in a real hurry, you don't need any sort of 4x4. Yes, I know, I'll get conflicting opinions from some purists.

I've driven the length & breadth of Australia, beach, deserts, mountains. Bad tracks & no tracks, total wilderness. From memory have only ever needed 4x4 on 2 occasions. The main advantage of most 4x4 vehicles is the extra ground clearance. If you are sensible & use some caution there's few places you can't reach with a 2wd vehicle. As mentioned, ground clearance is the big advantage of 4x4.

So, unless you are tempted to explore the unexplored, driving where you were never meant to drive, have sufficient baht not to have to think about economics, you really don't need a 4 x 4.

To all the 4 x 4 experts out there.. I've owned & driven numerous Mitsubishi, Toyota & Nissan 4 x 4's All great vehicles. But in most instances you just don't need them.

Cheers..... Mal.

I don't understand how you and some other respondents to this post can belittle the importance of 4WD, as well as the increased likeliehood of breakdown and the extra expense.

My experience in driving 2WD pickups and sedans in the deserts of Southern California and Arizona and Utah has been than any vehicle is likely to get stuck out there in the boondocks and especially so if you are not very careful where you point your front wheels. Places where it rains very little in a year, if at all, there are lots of sandy areas, even on the dirt roads, that will catch your 2WD pickup, no matter what kind of tires you have. And if it has rained recently - though the sky is plain blue at present - there are puddles here and there where clayey soil has held the rainwater. So your tires spin and get clogged with clay and become clogged with clay in a minute. Then you sit and spin. You find out your 2WD is really 1-wheel drive, unless you have positraction - so the off-side wheel doesn't turn while the spinning wheel just digs in. It works much the same in snow.

I drive as sensibly, carefully as most people and I have gotten stuck in seemingly safe places and have blasted through flooded areas sometimes where momentum perhaps, with the weight of a small trailer behind the truck, helped push me through.

I remember in Borrego Springs, California, that rich kids from the city would come out to the desert in 4WD vehicles and party and - get stuck. Because they don't know how to drive off-road, and their expensive pickups are not the same as tanks.

And I feel like others who have mentioned the extra expense for 4WD and more parts to break and more chips to fail.

The Reason it matters to me is I have 20 acres of dirt in remote Utah - where people go because that is where they live - and they get stuck there - sometimes have to leave the truck and walk the remaining distance to the home and walk back to the truck in the morining after the water has maybe evaporated - or in the night, after the slush has frozen so they can drive over it - and I have ordinary Dodge pickup. When I start building there I will be driving in and out a lot and hauling materials. In the past I have driven off the dirt track over bushes to go around puddles in the low spots.

So, what i would like to know is what type of 4WD/AWD rig do you advise?

(Besides go back to Thailand and ride a motor scooter).

[KonaRain]

Honda or Subaru AWD does my muddy uphill road and drive well.

Honda CRVspins each wheel half a turn before grabbing traction. Subaru is brilliant!

I don't have one.

One neighbor has a Highlander Hybrid....

These vehicles are great for pulling people out of da ditch.

Sometimes Oneself..Most times.

I know Thais with 15 year old ford rangers,with optional 4WD.

keep those differentials greased, will 'ya

alohz

Americans can't drive manuals, huh?

?

[bil2054]

Just my 2 cents worth.

There's all wheel drive & 4 wheel drive. All wheel drive is constant, like Subaru. Four wheel drive in most SUV. You have to select 4x4, you always have 4x4 with all wheel drive.

On wet roads all wheel or four wheel drive is somewhat of an advantage. Most sensible drivers adjust their driving to suit the prevailing conditions, so unless you are in a real hurry, you don't need any sort of 4x4. Yes, I know, I'll get conflicting opinions from some purists.

I've driven the length & breadth of Australia, beach, deserts, mountains. Bad tracks & no tracks, total wilderness. From memory have only ever needed 4x4 on 2 occasions. The main advantage of most 4x4 vehicles is the extra ground clearance. If you are sensible & use some caution there's few places you can't reach with a 2wd vehicle. As mentioned, ground clearance is the big advantage of 4x4.

So, unless you are tempted to explore the unexplored, driving where you were never meant to drive, have sufficient baht not to have to think about economics, you really don't need a 4 x 4.

To all the 4 x 4 experts out there.. I've owned & driven numerous Mitsubishi, Toyota & Nissan 4 x 4's All great vehicles. But in most instances you just don't need them.

Cheers..... Mal.

I don't understand how you and some other respondents to this post can belittle the importance of 4WD, as well as the increased likeliehood of breakdown and the extra expense.

My experience in driving 2WD pickups and sedans in the deserts of Southern California and Arizona and Utah has been than any vehicle is likely to get stuck out there in the boondocks and especially so if you are not very careful where you point your front wheels. Places where it rains very little in a year, if at all, there are lots of sandy areas, even on the dirt roads, that will catch your 2WD pickup, no matter what kind of tires you have. And if it has rained recently - though the sky is plain blue at present - there are puddles here and there where clayey soil has held the rainwater. So your tires spin and get clogged with clay and become clogged with clay in a minute. Then you sit and spin. You find out your 2WD is really 1-wheel drive, unless you have positraction - so the off-side wheel doesn't turn while the spinning wheel just digs in. It works much the same in snow.

I drive as sensibly, carefully as most people and I have gotten stuck in seemingly safe places and have blasted through flooded areas sometimes where momentum perhaps, with the weight of a small trailer behind the truck, helped push me through.

I remember in Borrego Springs, California, that rich kids from the city would come out to the desert in 4WD vehicles and party and - get stuck. Because they don't know how to drive off-road, and their expensive pickups are not the same as tanks.

And I feel like others who have mentioned the extra expense for 4WD and more parts to break and more chips to fail.

The Reason it matters to me is I have 20 acres of dirt in remote Utah - where people go because that is where they live - and they get stuck there - sometimes have to leave the truck and walk the remaining distance to the home and walk back to the truck in the morining after the water has maybe evaporated - or in the night, after the slush has frozen so they can drive over it - and I have ordinary Dodge pickup. When I start building there I will be driving in and out a lot and hauling materials. In the past I have driven off the dirt track over bushes to go around puddles in the low spots.

So, what i would like to know is what type of 4WD/AWD rig do you advise?

(Besides go back to Thailand and ride a motor scooter).

My two or three cents worth. I have been driving for 45 years, worked as a certified mechanic, ranch hand, driven through 48 out of fifty states as well as across Canada. Had a NASCAR license, and moonlighted as a wrecker driver. Bus driver and motorcycles.Just establishing my creds for my opinions.

Similar deal here. I have been living for ten years on thirty off-grid acres in Arizona, except for some time spent living with a woman in even more rugged country in NW New Mexico. She had a Dodge power wagon.

Lots depends on the terrain and soil composition of where you operate. In New Mexico I have gotten my 4WD 2500 series Dodge stuck both in deep snow, and on the level when monsoon weather turns the clayey soil of the back roads into snot. The only time I could not "work" the truck out was when it side slipped into a deep ditch after an 18 inch snow fall. That required shovels, shoring up with logs, etc., etc.

Two wheel drive vehicles are really alternating one wheel drive, unless you have a limited slip or posi rear differential, as mentioned before on this thread. Four wheel drive vehicles are in their simplest iterations really alternating two wheel drive. Again a posi rear diff will give you an effective three wheel drive. AWD are pretty cool. Really hard to get stuck, especially if you have rugged tires.

A truck like mine does lose a little in the fuel efficiency department, but not enough to risk doing without when you need to haul a couple of tons of material over questionable terrain. Yes, over the course of 300,000 miles on this truck there have been expenses greater than for a similar two wheel drive truck. However, the two wheel drive would simply not have gone where I have to go, hauling what I have to haul. Also, when folks have gotten their two wheel drive vehicles stuck, they come knocking on my door.

I like my Dodge. It is 4WD, has a Cummins diesel engine, a limited slip differential, and if I tied a ten dollar bill to the steering wheel and sent it careening down into the canyon it would owe me no change..It can, and has, hauled in excess of 10,000 lbs.

I liked Nissan diesel 4WD trucks, Jeeps, and International scouts I have owned. The Toyota Land Cruiser when it first came along was great, (no experience with the latest models). I have sold a number of GMC trucks with the Duramax diesel engine and locker rear end... they are pretty cool, but pricey compared to the Dodge. Ford has a pretty good product, but seemed to have a tranny weakness. Maybe they have addressed that by now.

One ranch I worked in Nevada had a couple of surplus Dodge Power wagons, a six wheel drive weapons carrier, and a ten wheel drive recovery vehicle that could go anywhere. Maintenance and fuel would be a bitch on them, though.

Standard vs automatic, I call BS on some claims of one being innately superior to the other. I have driven most varieties, and actually learned to drive on a Model T Ford with a planetary transmission, so yes, I am claiming expertise. These days with creaky hips and knees I like the auto.

Thailand would be a good place for one outside of the cities. I have not driven there much so far, but I have seen places out in the boonies of Chiang Mai, Chiang Rai, and Mae Hong Son that I would want a 4WD.

[kokesaat]

We considered a 4 wheel drive truck several years ago. I asked around.....friends and neighbors with one and rode with a few of them to see how they feel. I came to the conclusion that most folks who have one....and don't travel on muddy roads......don't engage the 4 wheel drive. For that reason, we decided a 2 wheel drive was all we needed. Manual transmission, of course!

[IMHO]

I think one of the things about 4WD is knowing where and when to use it....many 4WD owners don't really consider this and the result is it never gets used......but they get through anyway.....so they don't find out how much easier it would have been in 4WD

interesting point, when should one use it?

It depends on the 4WD system being discussed - some of them are designed for "Full Time" or "All Wheel Drive" use - which means, you can use it all the time to provide better traction.

Most pickups come with much more rudimentary systems that do not provide enough (or any) "wheel slip" to be used on paved roads - they are purely for off-road (loose surface) use only. Using these on a grippy surface is actually dangerous, as it can promote loss of traction.

A full time 4WD or All-Wheel-Drive car simply would not have been involved in the near miss shown in this thread: http://www.thaivisa.com/forum/topic/853053-i-hope-u-appreciate-my-driving-skills/

Additionally, cars with stability control would have been able to correct the slide much quicker than the driver was able to do in this circumstance.

Edited September 3, 2015 by IMHO

[stevenl]

Just my 2 cents worth.

There's all wheel drive & 4 wheel drive. All wheel drive is constant, like Subaru. Four wheel drive in most SUV. You have to select 4x4, you always have 4x4 with all wheel drive.

On wet roads all wheel or four wheel drive is somewhat of an advantage. Most sensible drivers adjust their driving to suit the prevailing conditions, so unless you are in a real hurry, you don't need any sort of 4x4. Yes, I know, I'll get conflicting opinions from some purists.

I've driven the length & breadth of Australia, beach, deserts, mountains. Bad tracks & no tracks, total wilderness. From memory have only ever needed 4x4 on 2 occasions. The main advantage of most 4x4 vehicles is the extra ground clearance. If you are sensible & use some caution there's few places you can't reach with a 2wd vehicle. As mentioned, ground clearance is the big advantage of 4x4.

So, unless you are tempted to explore the unexplored, driving where you were never meant to drive, have sufficient baht not to have to think about economics, you really don't need a 4 x 4.

To all the 4 x 4 experts out there.. I've owned & driven numerous Mitsubishi, Toyota & Nissan 4 x 4's All great vehicles. But in most instances you just don't need them.

Cheers..... Mal.

I don't understand how you and some other respondents to this post can belittle the importance of 4WD, as well as the increased likeliehood of breakdown and the extra expense.

My experience in driving 2WD pickups and sedans in the deserts of Southern California and Arizona and Utah has been than any vehicle is likely to get stuck out there in the boondocks and especially so if you are not very careful where you point your front wheels. Places where it rains very little in a year, if at all, there are lots of sandy areas, even on the dirt roads, that will catch your 2WD pickup, no matter what kind of tires you have. And if it has rained recently - though the sky is plain blue at present - there are puddles here and there where clayey soil has held the rainwater. So your tires spin and get clogged with clay and become clogged with clay in a minute. Then you sit and spin. You find out your 2WD is really 1-wheel drive, unless you have positraction - so the off-side wheel doesn't turn while the spinning wheel just digs in. It works much the same in snow.

I drive as sensibly, carefully as most people and I have gotten stuck in seemingly safe places and have blasted through flooded areas sometimes where momentum perhaps, with the weight of a small trailer behind the truck, helped push me through.

I remember in Borrego Springs, California, that rich kids from the city would come out to the desert in 4WD vehicles and party and - get stuck. Because they don't know how to drive off-road, and their expensive pickups are not the same as tanks.

And I feel like others who have mentioned the extra expense for 4WD and more parts to break and more chips to fail.

The Reason it matters to me is I have 20 acres of dirt in remote Utah - where people go because that is where they live - and they get stuck there - sometimes have to leave the truck and walk the remaining distance to the home and walk back to the truck in the morining after the water has maybe evaporated - or in the night, after the slush has frozen so they can drive over it - and I have ordinary Dodge pickup. When I start building there I will be driving in and out a lot and hauling materials. In the past I have driven off the dirt track over bushes to go around puddles in the low spots.

So, what i would like to know is what type of 4WD/AWD rig do you advise?

(Besides go back to Thailand and ride a motor scooter).

Everybody their choice, but this is Thailand.

I chose a 2wd when I changed rides, previous one was 4wd. Since I hardly ever really felt the need for 4ed. Yes, I have missed it, maybe 3 times in 3+ years. IMO not worth the extra expense.

[IMHO]

Everybody their choice, but this is Thailand.

I chose a 2wd when I changed rides, previous one was 4wd. Since I hardly ever really felt the need for 4ed. Yes, I have missed it, maybe 3 times in 3+ years. IMO not worth the extra expense.

I completely agree - in the case of a pickup, where 4x4 is for off-road use only, you better think long and hard if you really need it - otherwise it's just adding 'dead weight', literally.

In the case of cars with full time 4WD / AWD that's a different story though. For these, you have to weigh up whether the safety benefits are worth the extra initial cost, extra fuel usage, and extra insurance cost.

Again, looking at this video and considering the less experienced/capable drivers that might be piloting my cars, I'd be prepared to spend the extra on AWD: http://www.thaivisa.com/forum/topic/853053-i-hope-u-appreciate-my-driving-skills/

[SiSePuede419]

The lowest cost vehicle would be a 100% Electric car. You can't buy those in Thailand, 555.

The best 4WD is the Toyota FJ Cruiser. You can't buy those in Thailand, 555.

The best 2WD car is the Toyota Prius. You can't buy those in Thailand, 555.

The best car for rain is Subaru's Symetrical AWD, but it and every other "crossover" AWD car will suffer if you try to push it through deep mud. The FJ will eat that up.