US refugee quandary: Immigrant legacy vs 9/11-era fears

[sean in udon]

What nonsense. The GOP would be quite pleased to let thousands of Christian refugees in. No radical Islamic terrorist sleeper cells to worry about.

Because christians never do such things. Here is a small list and also the facts from the FBI website.

Wisconsin Sikh Temple massacre, Aug. 5, 2012

Wade Michael Page used a semiautomatic weapon to murder six people during an attack on a Sikh temple in Oak Creek, Wisconsin.

Tennessee Valley Unitarian Universalist Church shooting, July 27, 2008.

Christian Right sympathizer Jim David Adkisson walked into the Tennessee Valley Unitarian Universalist Church in Knoxville, Tennessee during a childrens play and began shooting people at random. Two were killed, while seven others were injured but survived.

The Centennial Olympic Park bombing, July 27, 1996.

Paul Jennings Hill is hardly the only Christian terrorist who has been praised by the Army of God; that organization has also praised Eric Rudolph, who is serving life without parole for a long list of terrorist attacks committed in the name of Christianity. Rudolph is best known for carrying out the Olympic Park bombing in Atlanta during the 1996 Summer Olympicsa blast that killed spectator Alice Hawthorne and wounded 111 others

Suicide attack on IRS building in Austin, Texas, Feb. 18, 2010. When Joseph Stack flew a plane into the Echelon office complex (where an IRS office was located), Fox News coverage of the incident was calm and matter-of-fact. Republican Rep. Steve King of Iowa seemed to find the attack amusing and joked that it could have been avoided if the federal government had followed his advice and abolished the IRS. Nonetheless, there were two fatalities: Stack and IRS employee Vernon Hunter

Planned Parenthood bombing, Brookline, Massachusetts, 1994.

Seldom has the term Christian terrorist been used in connection with John C. Salvi on AM talk radio or at Fox News, but its a term that easily applies to him. In 1994, the radical anti-abortionist and Army of God member attacked a Planned Parenthood clinic in Brookline, Massachusetts, shooting and killing receptionists Shannon Lowney and Lee Ann Nichols and wounding several others. Salvi was found dead in his prison cell in 1996, and his death was ruled a suicide. The Army of God has exalted Salvi as a Christian martyr and described Lowney and Nichols not as victims of domestic terrorism, but as infidels who got what they deserved.

On the FBIs official website, there exists a chronological list of all terrorist attacks committed on U.S. From 1980 to 2005. According to this data islamic terrorist attacks in US are 6% of total attacks whereas Jewish acts of terrorism in the US is at 7%.

These radical Jews committed acts of terrorism in the name of their religion. These were not terrorists who happened to be Jews; rather, they were extremist Jews who committed acts of terrorism based on their religious passions.

The manipulation of statistics. A tactic employed by most dishonest journalists and politicians to manipulate the truth.

Jewish terrorist attacks are 1% higher than Muslim terrorist attacks in the USA? This may be true, but in one attack Muslim terrorists killed 2,972 and injured an estimated 12,000.

The Jewish defence League, Jewish Defenders and Jewish Direct Action, combined, have killed 3 and injured 33.

So, 3 deaths against 2,972; I don't see a 1% difference in the true figures.

I don't know the names of all Jewish associated terrorist groups, but they're doesn't appear to have been a Jewish terrorist attack in the USA since 1986.

https://www.fbi.gov/stats-services/publications/terrorism-2002-2005/terror02_05#disablemobile

[Scott]

The cost of refugee resettlement is primarily from the Federal Government. State participation, if any, is minimal.

At the time that a person or family is resettled, they are not a resident of the state and therefore aren't eligible for state-only funded programs.

They are eligible for state funded driver's licenses, state funded public schooling for their children, federal social security benefits after one year, food stamps, subsidized or provided housing and probably a myriad of other federal programs only the feds know about.

This isn't free at any level.

They may be eligible for a number of programs, however, until they are a legal resident of the state, they generally can't get them. For numerous programs, the federal gov't reimburses the state for costs. The same applies for a number of other groups, such as Native American Indians.

Financially, the states benefit either directly or with matching funds from the federal gov't.

[Scott]

As I have posted before the number of refugees is taken from the overall allotment of immigrants. There will be no increase in the number of people allowed into the US (legally). In this situation, the President has set a specific number of the overall refugee numbers for those from Syria. If they don't come from Syria they will come from elsewhere.

A portion of the resettlement costs are paid for by charitable organizations.

The screening process is quite rigorous and I doubt that the Department of Homeland Security is going to approve anybody if there is the least bit of concern that they might be a security risk.

The US is under no obligation to take anyone it does not want to take and who does not meet the criteria set forth. I very, very much doubt that they could get 10,000 refugees approved in a year. Unless there is a significant number of people from Syria already in the pipeline for resettlement it takes 18 - 24 months on average to resettle refugees who have already been screened.

I am neither advocating for against resettling them, but risk wise, there are probably groups that are going to be a much bigger burden on the US than many of the Syrians -- at least that is my experience from the time I spent in the country.

[willyumiii]

[willyumiii]

[Seastallion]

What nonsense. The GOP would be quite pleased to let thousands of Christian refugees in. No radical Islamic terrorist sleeper cells to worry about.

Because christians never do such things. Here is a small list and also the facts from the FBI website.

Wisconsin Sikh Temple massacre, Aug. 5, 2012

Wade Michael Page used a semiautomatic weapon to murder six people during an attack on a Sikh temple in Oak Creek, Wisconsin.

Tennessee Valley Unitarian Universalist Church shooting, July 27, 2008.

Christian Right sympathizer Jim David Adkisson walked into the Tennessee Valley Unitarian Universalist Church in Knoxville, Tennessee during a childrens play and began shooting people at random. Two were killed, while seven others were injured but survived.

The Centennial Olympic Park bombing, July 27, 1996.

Paul Jennings Hill is hardly the only Christian terrorist who has been praised by the Army of God; that organization has also praised Eric Rudolph, who is serving life without parole for a long list of terrorist attacks committed in the name of Christianity. Rudolph is best known for carrying out the Olympic Park bombing in Atlanta during the 1996 Summer Olympicsa blast that killed spectator Alice Hawthorne and wounded 111 others

Suicide attack on IRS building in Austin, Texas, Feb. 18, 2010. When Joseph Stack flew a plane into the Echelon office complex (where an IRS office was located), Fox News coverage of the incident was calm and matter-of-fact. Republican Rep. Steve King of Iowa seemed to find the attack amusing and joked that it could have been avoided if the federal government had followed his advice and abolished the IRS. Nonetheless, there were two fatalities: Stack and IRS employee Vernon Hunter

Planned Parenthood bombing, Brookline, Massachusetts, 1994.

Seldom has the term Christian terrorist been used in connection with John C. Salvi on AM talk radio or at Fox News, but its a term that easily applies to him. In 1994, the radical anti-abortionist and Army of God member attacked a Planned Parenthood clinic in Brookline, Massachusetts, shooting and killing receptionists Shannon Lowney and Lee Ann Nichols and wounding several others. Salvi was found dead in his prison cell in 1996, and his death was ruled a suicide. The Army of God has exalted Salvi as a Christian martyr and described Lowney and Nichols not as victims of domestic terrorism, but as infidels who got what they deserved.

On the FBIs official website, there exists a chronological list of all terrorist attacks committed on U.S. From 1980 to 2005. According to this data islamic terrorist attacks in US are 6% of total attacks whereas Jewish acts of terrorism in the US is at 7%.

These radical Jews committed acts of terrorism in the name of their religion. These were not terrorists who happened to be Jews; rather, they were extremist Jews who committed acts of terrorism based on their religious passions.

The manipulation of statistics. A tactic employed by most dishonest journalists and politicians to manipulate the truth.

Jewish terrorist attacks are 1% higher than Muslim terrorist attacks in the USA? This may be true, but in one attack Muslim terrorists killed 2,972 and injured an estimated 12,000.

The Jewish defence League, Jewish Defenders and Jewish Direct Action, combined, have killed 3 and injured 33.

So, 3 deaths against 2,972; I don't see a 1% difference in the true figures.

I don't know the names of all Jewish associated terrorist groups, but they're doesn't appear to have been a Jewish terrorist attack in the USA since 1986.

https://www.fbi.gov/stats-services/publications/terrorism-2002-2005/terror02_05#disablemobile

OK, so the number of casualties DOES matter when it comes to Jew kills Muslim or Muslim kills Jew, is that what you're saying?

It is not "untrue" figures to cite the actual number of attacks.

[chuckd]

The cost of refugee resettlement is primarily from the Federal Government. State participation, if any, is minimal.

At the time that a person or family is resettled, they are not a resident of the state and therefore aren't eligible for state-only funded programs.

They are eligible for state funded driver's licenses, state funded public schooling for their children, federal social security benefits after one year, food stamps, subsidized or provided housing and probably a myriad of other federal programs only the feds know about.

This isn't free at any level.

They may be eligible for a number of programs, however, until they are a legal resident of the state, they generally can't get them. For numerous programs, the federal gov't reimburses the state for costs. The same applies for a number of other groups, such as Native American Indians.

Financially, the states benefit either directly or with matching funds from the federal gov't.

The matter of state sponsored driver's licenses and free public education for children is what gave Texas standing in their suit against Obama's attempt to legalize 5 million illegal immigrants with prosecutorial discretion.

Judge Hanen and the 5th Circuit Court of Appeals said the additional costs, which must be borne by the state gave Texas standing to sue the federal government.

Driver's license and public schooling is not reimbursed by the feds. The locals have to eat those costs.

These Syrians are not illegal in the sense that they will be entering through proper channels, even if the vetting process is less than desireable.

What worries many Americans is how long will they choose to remain legal.

[chuckd]

<snip due to bad quoting>

Education, public health care and many public services were for free in Syria.

Same same for Lybia and Iraq.

Contact Barack Obama and Hillary Clinton with any questions you might have.

They were in charge during the Arab spring and they are the ones that authorized the bombings to depose the dictators in Syria and Libya.

[Seastallion]

<snip due to bad quoting>

Education, public health care and many public services were for free in Syria.

Same same for Lybia and Iraq.

Contact Barack Obama and Hillary Clinton with any questions you might have.

They were in charge during the Arab spring and they are the ones that authorized the bombings to depose the dictators in Syria and Libya.

In charge of what? The Middle East? The world?

[arjunadawn]

What nonsense. The GOP would be quite pleased to let thousands of Christian refugees in. No radical Islamic terrorist sleeper cells to worry about.

Because christians never do such things. Here is a small list and also the facts from the FBI website.

Wisconsin Sikh Temple massacre, Aug. 5, 2012

Wade Michael Page used a semiautomatic weapon to murder six people during an attack on a Sikh temple in Oak Creek, Wisconsin.

Tennessee Valley Unitarian Universalist Church shooting, July 27, 2008.

Christian Right sympathizer Jim David Adkisson walked into the Tennessee Valley Unitarian Universalist Church in Knoxville, Tennessee during a childrens play and began shooting people at random. Two were killed, while seven others were injured but survived.

The Centennial Olympic Park bombing, July 27, 1996.

Paul Jennings Hill is hardly the only Christian terrorist who has been praised by the Army of God; that organization has also praised Eric Rudolph, who is serving life without parole for a long list of terrorist attacks committed in the name of Christianity. Rudolph is best known for carrying out the Olympic Park bombing in Atlanta during the 1996 Summer Olympicsa blast that killed spectator Alice Hawthorne and wounded 111 others

Suicide attack on IRS building in Austin, Texas, Feb. 18, 2010. When Joseph Stack flew a plane into the Echelon office complex (where an IRS office was located), Fox News coverage of the incident was calm and matter-of-fact. Republican Rep. Steve King of Iowa seemed to find the attack amusing and joked that it could have been avoided if the federal government had followed his advice and abolished the IRS. Nonetheless, there were two fatalities: Stack and IRS employee Vernon Hunter

Planned Parenthood bombing, Brookline, Massachusetts, 1994.

Seldom has the term Christian terrorist been used in connection with John C. Salvi on AM talk radio or at Fox News, but its a term that easily applies to him. In 1994, the radical anti-abortionist and Army of God member attacked a Planned Parenthood clinic in Brookline, Massachusetts, shooting and killing receptionists Shannon Lowney and Lee Ann Nichols and wounding several others. Salvi was found dead in his prison cell in 1996, and his death was ruled a suicide. The Army of God has exalted Salvi as a Christian martyr and described Lowney and Nichols not as victims of domestic terrorism, but as infidels who got what they deserved.

On the FBIs official website, there exists a chronological list of all terrorist attacks committed on U.S. From 1980 to 2005. According to this data islamic terrorist attacks in US are 6% of total attacks whereas Jewish acts of terrorism in the US is at 7%.

These radical Jews committed acts of terrorism in the name of their religion. These were not terrorists who happened to be Jews; rather, they were extremist Jews who committed acts of terrorism based on their religious passions.

What is different here? You appear to make a valid case, prima faciae- at first glance, but these are criminal acts. Having a christian declaration positively makes your point, though it is incomplete. This reduces the issue to an appearance it does not have. There is no governing christian ideology/blueprint that seeks global domination and the establishment of a theocracy. Indeed, past attempts by christians to do this were absolutely not justified by their own scriptures or exegesis. The difference is another religious group does have a governing blueprint, varying degrees of international support, aid, political interference, and fraternity of worldwide enablers doing the same thing. One group falls clearly within the criminal code, and may ever qualify for a hate crime as well. The other group poses an existential threat and has already toppled numerous- numerous countries in furtherance of the same ideology. So, they are as equally different as they are similar.

[Ulysses G.]

What nonsense. The GOP would be quite pleased to let thousands of Christian refugees in. No radical Islamic terrorist sleeper cells to worry about.

Because christians never do such things. Here is a small list and also the facts from the FBI website.

The manipulation of statistics. A tactic employed by most dishonest journalists and politicians to manipulate the truth.

Jewish terrorist attacks are 1% higher than Muslim terrorist attacks in the USA? This may be true, but in one attack Muslim terrorists killed 2,972 and injured an estimated 12,000.

The Jewish defence League, Jewish Defenders and Jewish Direct Action, combined, have killed 3 and injured 33.

So, 3 deaths against 2,972; I don't see a 1% difference in the true figures.

I don't know the names of all Jewish associated terrorist groups, but they're doesn't appear to have been a Jewish terrorist attack in the USA since 1986.

https://www.fbi.gov/stats-services/publications/terrorism-2002-2005/terror02_05#disablemobile

A manipulation of statistics indeed and typical of the apologists for radical Islam that post obsessively on this web site. Muslims are encouraged to lie, to promote their religion, in the Koran and you can see many signs of it on Thai Visa every day.

Edited November 19, 2015 by Ulysses G.

[sean in udon]

What nonsense. The GOP would be quite pleased to let thousands of Christian refugees in. No radical Islamic terrorist sleeper cells to worry about.

Because christians never do such things. Here is a small list and also the facts from the FBI website.

Wisconsin Sikh Temple massacre, Aug. 5, 2012

Wade Michael Page used a semiautomatic weapon to murder six people during an attack on a Sikh temple in Oak Creek, Wisconsin.

Tennessee Valley Unitarian Universalist Church shooting, July 27, 2008.

Christian Right sympathizer Jim David Adkisson walked into the Tennessee Valley Unitarian Universalist Church in Knoxville, Tennessee during a childrens play and began shooting people at random. Two were killed, while seven others were injured but survived.

The Centennial Olympic Park bombing, July 27, 1996.

Paul Jennings Hill is hardly the only Christian terrorist who has been praised by the Army of God; that organization has also praised Eric Rudolph, who is serving life without parole for a long list of terrorist attacks committed in the name of Christianity. Rudolph is best known for carrying out the Olympic Park bombing in Atlanta during the 1996 Summer Olympicsa blast that killed spectator Alice Hawthorne and wounded 111 others

Suicide attack on IRS building in Austin, Texas, Feb. 18, 2010. When Joseph Stack flew a plane into the Echelon office complex (where an IRS office was located), Fox News coverage of the incident was calm and matter-of-fact. Republican Rep. Steve King of Iowa seemed to find the attack amusing and joked that it could have been avoided if the federal government had followed his advice and abolished the IRS. Nonetheless, there were two fatalities: Stack and IRS employee Vernon Hunter

Planned Parenthood bombing, Brookline, Massachusetts, 1994.

Seldom has the term Christian terrorist been used in connection with John C. Salvi on AM talk radio or at Fox News, but its a term that easily applies to him. In 1994, the radical anti-abortionist and Army of God member attacked a Planned Parenthood clinic in Brookline, Massachusetts, shooting and killing receptionists Shannon Lowney and Lee Ann Nichols and wounding several others. Salvi was found dead in his prison cell in 1996, and his death was ruled a suicide. The Army of God has exalted Salvi as a Christian martyr and described Lowney and Nichols not as victims of domestic terrorism, but as infidels who got what they deserved.

On the FBIs official website, there exists a chronological list of all terrorist attacks committed on U.S. From 1980 to 2005. According to this data islamic terrorist attacks in US are 6% of total attacks whereas Jewish acts of terrorism in the US is at 7%.

These radical Jews committed acts of terrorism in the name of their religion. These were not terrorists who happened to be Jews; rather, they were extremist Jews who committed acts of terrorism based on their religious passions.

The manipulation of statistics. A tactic employed by most dishonest journalists and politicians to manipulate the truth.

Jewish terrorist attacks are 1% higher than Muslim terrorist attacks in the USA? This may be true, but in one attack Muslim terrorists killed 2,972 and injured an estimated 12,000.

The Jewish defence League, Jewish Defenders and Jewish Direct Action, combined, have killed 3 and injured 33.

So, 3 deaths against 2,972; I don't see a 1% difference in the true figures.

I don't know the names of all Jewish associated terrorist groups, but they're doesn't appear to have been a Jewish terrorist attack in the USA since 1986.

https://www.fbi.gov/stats-services/publications/terrorism-2002-2005/terror02_05#disablemobile

OK, so the number of casualties DOES matter when it comes to Jew kills Muslim or Muslim kills Jew, is that what you're saying?

It is not "untrue" figures to cite the actual number of attacks.

Regarding "OK, so the number of casualties DOES matter when it comes to Jew kills Muslim or Muslim kills Jew, is that what you're saying?", I'm not quite sure how you arrived at that conclusion, but the purpose of my first post was to highlight the manipulation of the truth (regarding the use of percentages) and to make forum members aware of the dates. Extremist nut jobs, regardless of their label, religion or motivation, are extremist nut jobs. When extremist nut jobs kill innocent people, I don't consider religion, colour, nationality, etc, I'm aware only of extremist nut jobs killing innocent people.

At first glance the 7%, 6% comparison seems to infer that the radical/extremist Jews are more active, and potentially a bigger problem, than the radical/extremist muslims.

The world today has changed dramatically since the 1980s. Hence my reference to 1986.

If the dates were more current eg from 2000 to 2015, I doubt very much the muslim attacks would be 6%. And the Jewish attacks would be 0%

I have little knowledge of Jewish terrorist actions and have neither the time or inclination to research their motivation. Perhaps they were only interested in damaging property to make a point and get attention directed to their cause. Perhaps they were crap terrorists. Muslim terrorists on the other hand, seem to be massively motivated to maim, kill and destroy.

And you are correct that the figures are not "untrue". However, the presentation of accurate, informative information is appropriate in any debate. Manipulation of statistics is spin and imo, spin and manipulation are not the truth.