SURVEY: Do you support the UK petition to ban Donald Trump for hate speech?

[MrTee]

I wonder how many of you realise that the petition to "Block Donald J Trump from UK entry" was started before his Ban all Muslims outburst?

[sanukjim]

I voted not a UK citizen but support the ban.

Why, you ask?

I want to read all the moaning and wailing from the Brits on this forum in a year or so after a ban comes up and bites them in the posterior.

We've bailed them out enough. Let them sort out the problems this causes all by themselves.

You have 'bailed us out enough' ! Can you let us know where you have done that? Please do not include any incidences which include stepping in at the last minute when it suited you as you were getting a bloody nose.

As for Trump, banning him is a ridiculous idea when we can't even ban clerics at the Finsbury Park Mosque in London who openly call for the beheading of our own soldiers.

In your only war since Burma The US loaned you the aircraft to transport the UKs helicopters to South America and we had the only aircraft to do in air refueling for you .Now look on the internet info and see how much money and military assistance was given to The UK this year..Do not worry we will keep you aflote

[MrTee]

I voted not a UK citizen but support the ban.

Why, you ask?

I want to read all the moaning and wailing from the Brits on this forum in a year or so after a ban comes up and bites them in the posterior.

We've bailed them out enough. Let them sort out the problems this causes all by themselves.

You have 'bailed us out enough' ! Can you let us know where you have done that? Please do not include any incidences which include stepping in at the last minute when it suited you as you were getting a bloody nose.

As for Trump, banning him is a ridiculous idea when we can't even ban clerics at the Finsbury Park Mosque in London who openly call for the beheading of our own soldiers.

In your only war since Burma The US loaned you the aircraft to transport the UKs helicopters to South America and we had the only aircraft to do in air refueling for you .Now look on the internet info and see how much money and military assistance was given to The UK this year..Do not worry we will keep you aflote

And this relevant to the Petition to "Block Donald J Trump from UK entry" for Unacceptable Behaviour, in which way?

Easy to forget the US has not won a single proper war without UK support.

Edited December 14, 2015 by MrTee

[chuckd]

I voted not a UK citizen but support the ban.

Why, you ask?

I want to read all the moaning and wailing from the Brits on this forum in a year or so after a ban comes up and bites them in the posterior.

We've bailed them out enough. Let them sort out the problems this causes all by themselves.

You have 'bailed us out enough' ! Can you let us know where you have done that? Please do not include any incidences which include stepping in at the last minute when it suited you as you were getting a bloody nose.

As for Trump, banning him is a ridiculous idea when we can't even ban clerics at the Finsbury Park Mosque in London who openly call for the beheading of our own soldiers.

"Can you let us know where you have done that?"

Europe...twice

[Shaunduhpostman]

If the hate speech refers to all of Trump's racist platforms yes, maybe the UK should ban him and that might finally get his attention and that of his minions of voters that they ought to consider that what they think, say and do in the toilet belongs there, not in the discourse of a global framework where the situation is already dire without Trump's sandbox level provocations.

That said, I fail to see how one of them, not wanting Muslim refugees is hate speech. It might be callous at worst, and it is clearly unfair to those Muslims who don't support the jihad, but perfectly understandable given the real possibility of Islamists aka Radical Islam coming into host countries and furthering the aims of creating European and and American fronts in the global jihad campaign. Saying we don't want you is a clear message to moderate Islam that there is a problem with the whole of their societies not just the Islamists (political Islam). It is not exactly hate speech to protest very real problems coming from the general direction of one set of societies clearly fully under sway of outmoded and hateful treatises for war and domination that like Trump have no place in world where most of us want to live in peace and have a future, namely the Quran. But there is likewise an equal share of the problem lying with America and what it has done to the Middle East and the whole world. Trump is merely one of the festering surface level symptoms, so perhaps that would be a well timed wake up slap in the face that America could use, that even their friends are fed up.

But, it is just as hateful if not more so of Obama to announce more bombing campaigns and continuing war fronts in the Middle East while using "lets welcome the refugees" as the froo froo window dressing to make bombing the crap out of the Syrian children look like it were an accident. If they were less hateful they would be speaking strongly about and acting on the urgency to find solutions and to how to end the middle east conflict. Instead they talk war abroad and hide their heads in the sand on the domestic front and call people Islamophobes who try and struggle to find the language and the perspective to articulate what they see and want done. Their pretending that Islamist attacks are random psycho gun freak acts to be addressed by getting rid of the 2nd amendment will only fly so long and they know it.

But, they should ban Trump for cynically appealing to those who have fallen a victim to complete idiocy and looking to get their vote, if he isn't actually so idiotic that he actually believes in his own preposterous notions and proposals. I would ban him for wreckless and irresponsible chaos mongering.

[Tchooptip]

Hate speech from whom ?

[zaphod reborn]

I fully support Trump's right to say what he wants and make a fool out of himself and his brandname. People and other companies have a right to boycott his brand. Americans have a right to support Trump and vote for him. The fact that 20-25% of Americans would vote for the fool speaks volumes for what has happened to America over the past two decades. A nation such as the UK which allegedly supports freedom of speech rights should not even consider such a petition. The fact that it does, speaks volumes about how far backwards the UK has gone in the past two decades to placate the PC police.

wait a second. So Trump gets freedom of speech but the citizens of the UK don't! That really doesn't make any sense. We have laws to counter hate speech (unfortunately not used effectively, so you're correct about the PC bit there) all the petition is doing is showing the government that citizens don't agree with this hate speech, maybe the USA could learn from that!

Maybe you can explain how what Trump has said constitutes hate speech. Hate speech is speech that incites people to commit violence against a protected group. It has nothing to do with political speech aimed at immigration policies. I guess you are a member of the new anti-FSM movement. How backwards thinking. And no, banning Trump from travel to the UK has nothing to do with UK immigration policy. I am amazed how far the UK has distanced itself from basic principles of its common law which would prohibit political actions aimed at specific individuals. It is abhorrent to a modern judicial system which requires equal application of the law.

Edited December 14, 2015 by zaphod reborn

[dcpo]

Anyone who thinks Trump 'tells the truth' clearly doesn't believe in fact checking.

That said I don't think he should be barred from entry. Better to let him in so he can hear us better as we tell him to <deleted> off.

Edited December 14, 2015 by dcpo

[MrTee]

I fully support Trump's right to say what he wants and make a fool out of himself and his brandname. People and other companies have a right to boycott his brand. Americans have a right to support Trump and vote for him. The fact that 20-25% of Americans would vote for the fool speaks volumes for what has happened to America over the past two decades. A nation such as the UK which allegedly supports freedom of speech rights should not even consider such a petition. The fact that it does, speaks volumes about how far backwards the UK has gone in the past two decades to placate the PC police.

wait a second. So Trump gets freedom of speech but the citizens of the UK don't! That really doesn't make any sense. We have laws to counter hate speech (unfortunately not used effectively, so you're correct about the PC bit there) all the petition is doing is showing the government that citizens don't agree with this hate speech, maybe the USA could learn from that!

Maybe you can explain how what Trump has said constitutes hate speech. Hate speech is speech that incites people to commit violence against a protected group. It has nothing to do with political speech aimed at immigration policies. I guess you are a member of the new anti-FSM movement. How backwards thinking. And no, banning Trump from travel to the UK has nothing to do with UK immigration policy. I am amazed how far the UK has distanced itself from basic principles of its common law which would prohibit political actions aimed at specific individuals. It is abhorrent to a modern judicial system which requires equal application of the law.

The Petition was started before Trump made his "ban all Muslims" outburst..

While I cannot answer for Suzanne Kelly, I'd imagine she felt that Trump's racist attacks, bullying of local businesses\people in Scotland, misogynistic outbursts, mocking the disabled, dangerous views on vaccines, his financial & moral support for terrorist organisations, etc, etc were grounds enough to not want him in the UK. I'd have to agree that Trump would not be conducive to good of the UK. Folk have been denied visa for a lot less.

http://aberdeenvoice.com/2015/12/campaigners-move-to-keep-trump-out-of-uk/

Edited December 14, 2015 by MrTee

[farcanell]

No!

Absolutely not... The man, just like you and I ( and the Brit geezer who got beaten up by ladyboys the other day, according to some readers) has the right of freedom of speech, but must face the repercussions.

Further, the more he says, the more we learn about what type of a president he would become... So imho, he should be encouraged to get all this out into the public domain, such that the public is properly informed, before the public go to the polls

[donnybay]

As attacks by ISIS grow around the world, and they will,dirty bombs, chemicals maybe.the war on them will grow and it will be necessity to intern and ban Muslims at some point in the future

We have no idea who has been radicalized or not as the recent attack in The US proves.

Watch Indonesia, time bomb waiting to go off

[SoiBiker]

I fully support Trump's right to say what he wants and make a fool out of himself and his brandname. People and other companies have a right to boycott his brand. Americans have a right to support Trump and vote for him. The fact that 20-25% of Americans would vote for the fool speaks volumes for what has happened to America over the past two decades. A nation such as the UK which allegedly supports freedom of speech rights should not even consider such a petition. The fact that it does, speaks volumes about how far backwards the UK has gone in the past two decades to placate the PC police.

wait a second. So Trump gets freedom of speech but the citizens of the UK don't! That really doesn't make any sense. We have laws to counter hate speech (unfortunately not used effectively, so you're correct about the PC bit there) all the petition is doing is showing the government that citizens don't agree with this hate speech, maybe the USA could learn from that!

Maybe you can explain how what Trump has said constitutes hate speech. Hate speech is speech that incites people to commit violence against a protected group. It has nothing to do with political speech aimed at immigration policies. I guess you are a member of the new anti-FSM movement. How backwards thinking. And no, banning Trump from travel to the UK has nothing to do with UK immigration policy. I am amazed how far the UK has distanced itself from basic principles of its common law which would prohibit political actions aimed at specific individuals. It is abhorrent to a modern judicial system which requires equal application of the law.

The Petition was started before Trump made his "ban all Muslims" outburst..

While I cannot answer for Suzanne Kelly, I'd imagine she felt that Trump's racist attacks, bullying of local businesses\people in Scotland, misogynistic outbursts, mocking the disabled, dangerous views on vaccines, his financial & moral support for terrorist organisations, etc, etc were grounds enough to not want him in the UK. I'd have to agree that Trump would not be conducive to good of the UK. Folk have been denied visa for a lot less.

http://aberdeenvoice.com/2015/12/campaigners-move-to-keep-trump-out-of-uk/

The petition appears to have been started on the same day trump made his comments.

[TrevorS]

Trump gave his opinion, Uk used to pride itself on feedom of speech, of course he should NOT be banned.. what is happening in the UK to even consider a ban?? for too much PC !!!!!

[MrTee]

The petition appears to have been started on the same day trump made his comments.

The article I posted is dated 3 December 2015 (see above).

The Petition was created on 28 November 2015 - according to the petition data.

I believe Trump made his Anti-Muslim speech on 7 December.

[SoiBiker]

The petition appears to have been started on the same day trump made his comments.

The article I posted is dated 3 December 2015 (see above).

The Petition was created on 28 November 2015 - according to the petition data.

I believe Trump made his Anti-Muslim speech on 7 December.

But the 'expiry date' suggests six months from December 8th, so most people probably assumed that date.

Still, the closing the border comments weren't exactly his first controversial utterance on the subject.

[MrTee]

The petition appears to have been started on the same day trump made his comments.

The article I posted is dated 3 December 2015 (see above).

The Petition was created on 28 November 2015 - according to the petition data.

I believe Trump made his Anti-Muslim speech on 7 December.

But the 'expiry date' suggests six months from December 8th, so most people probably assumed that date.

Still, the closing the border comments weren't exactly his first controversial utterance on the subject.

I think it takes some time to get the petition ratified and published - S. Kelly Submitted the petition to UK gov on 28 November @ 17:55:11.

yeah, my point is Trump's Anti-Muslim rant is just the latest in a long run of stupid statements that would not be conducive to general good of the UK.

I don't think he should or will be banned. Give him enough rope...

What the petition does do is give a message to World that many folk in the UK think that this man is not conducive to the common good. I am sure there are many posters on here that find Trump is congruent with their anti-Muslim agenda, but many good decent US citizens will agree with us "Brits" and hopefully he won't even make the nomination..

[mpa]

[elgordo38]

He is the only one telling the truth, unhindered by "political correctness"

Political correctness is only a cloak to hide and sugar coat the truth. Masking the truth is a political ploy that is taught in politics 101 soon after one enters "public" service. Politicians becoming virtual Jekyll and Hydes. It does not take them long to realize which side of the bread THEIR butter is on. We pay for the loaf of bread and the butter which they use to butter us up with. Try and think of the old shell game under which shell is the pea.

[elgordo38]

Le Pen and her FN went bust in yesterday's regional elections.

Didn't win a single region. She's talking about suing for a conspiracy against her and the FN. The fascist parties post WW2 are pretty well locked out of ever gaining power again, which is the whole idea. As bad as things are, they could be light years worse.

It's a definite foreshadowing of what's coming for Trump sooner or later.

I didn't vote yet.

It is of course up to UK what to do about allowing into their country a Benito Mussolini kind of guy from USA whose election campaigns will end in a heap at one point or another.

If UK wants to get severe about it then fine. Mussolini succeeded on the continent whereas he never would have had any success in the USA, so the experience of fascism on the respective sides of the pond are different.

Trump hasn't any actual and real sense of politics, law, diplomacy, elections or voting. Which is why among other factors in which Trump is profoundly deficient he will fail. The political center-middle has already congealed against him.

Do you really believe this ? And Center is the Middle.

Many times in life I have run into the term off center. As I age I wobble a bit I guess I am off center to some degree. I try to mentally plumb myself but it seems the plumb part is aging as well. Oh I guess I will have to start hanging on to railings. Dam the vanity of it all.

Edited December 14, 2015 by elgordo38

[elgordo38]

Le Pen and her FN went bust in yesterday's regional elections.

Didn't win a single region. She's talking about suing for a conspiracy against her and the FN. The fascist parties post WW2 are pretty well locked out of ever gaining power again, which is the whole idea. As bad as things are, they could be light years worse.

It's a definite foreshadowing of what's coming for Trump sooner or later.

I didn't vote yet.

It is of course up to UK what to do about allowing into their country a Benito Mussolini kind of guy from USA whose election campaigns will end in a heap at one point or another.

If UK wants to get severe about it then fine. Mussolini succeeded on the continent whereas he never would have had any success in the USA, so the experience of fascism on the respective sides of the pond are different.

Trump hasn't any actual and real sense of politics, law, diplomacy, elections or voting. Which is why among other factors in which Trump is profoundly deficient he will fail. The political center-middle has already congealed against him.

Busted? A party that had just a few % a couple of years ago is in the 40% range now. That is by no means busted. Just some people expected that they get even stronger.

As voters we flail right for a period of time and then as discouragement sets in we flail left. We voters in the end are flailed by both the right and the left. Voters are between a rock and a hard place. There is no cushion in sight on which we can rest our weary head. We must accept our position in life and soldier on. I always wonder what life would have been like if my sap had fallen from the hi-sap tree instead of the low-sap tree. I always think I was switched at birth because every time I pass a Mercedes Benz dealership I run over and press my nose to the glass.

[Neurath]

Pretty pathetic to try to ban him from entering the UK. Anyway, no need to ban the dude, just make him do one of the UKVI English tests as a condition of entry - It's not like he'd pass or anything.

[jesimps]

I voted not a UK citizen but support the ban.

Why, you ask?

I want to read all the moaning and wailing from the Brits on this forum in a year or so after a ban comes up and bites them in the posterior.

We've bailed them out enough. Let them sort out the problems this causes all by themselves.

Typical pants at half mast and big shiny shoes spam attitude. You didn't bail us out of anything chum, you just pitch in when it's all over bar the shouting.

You also sold us dowm the river over Suez and the Falklands.

In future I would ask you to do us a favour by not doing us any favours.

[Grouse]

No. He's an oaf and an offensive bigot but free speech is more important (unless there's a real risk of violence)

Actually, I would like to see the man eviscerated on Hard Talk or by Paxman. Or any Brit frankly speaking

[Grouse]

I voted not a UK citizen but support the ban.

Why, you ask?

I want to read all the moaning and wailing from the Brits on this forum in a year or so after a ban comes up and bites them in the posterior.

We've bailed them out enough. Let them sort out the problems this causes all by themselves.

Typical pants at half mast and big shiny shoes spam attitude. You didn't bail us out of anything chum, you just pitch in when it's all over bar the shouting.

You also sold us dowm the river over Suez and the Falklands.

In future I would ask you to do us a favour by not doing us any favours.

Tired of dealing with the "we saved your ass" Numb skulls. Went through all this on another thread and can't be bothered now

I guess many of these types got the same education as Trump!

[Grouse]

Stupid survey as the UK or the PM can not ban Donald Trump for his speech.Again STUPID

Yes they can!

Hundreds have been banned as they were judged to be a risk ( risk of violence)

[uptheos]

Why what's he done wrong?

If you want to know what 'hate speech' is go and listen to some of the Muslim clerics in the UK!

Edited December 14, 2015 by uptheos

[Scott]

Off-topic post and replies removed.

[Krataiboy]

The overwhelming support of ThaiVisa Forum posters for Donald Trump is in stark contrast to the condemnation heaped on his weirdly-coiffured head by the Press and politicians around the world. Who would have dreamed he would be so popular?

He is an unlikely hero, but a hero none-the-less in standing up for that increasingly rare commodity, free speech. And he has shown, in response to the predictable mass media reaction to his outspoken comments, that he can take the flak as well as dish it out.

I am reminded of an incident from my childhood when I arrived home from school one day in tears after some nasty verbal bullying from my playground peers. My old Mum, a Cockney of limited formal education but infinite wisdom, was totally unsympathetic.

She told me stop sniveling and, by way of advice, recited an old proverb, "Sticks and stones may break my bones, but calling never hurt me".From that day forth I resolved to grow a thicker skin and, as a quid pro quo, to insist on saying what I honestly believed about issues that really mattered to me, irrespective of the wrath this invoked.

It is getting less easy these days to speak as one finds. Slowly but surely, as the political and corporate oligarchy tightens its grip on all our lives, so-called "hate laws" are being used to stifle dissent and ensure that the silent majority stays that way - silent.

Preliminary results from the Forum poll show - literally graphically - what can happen when the gag is removed, as it urgently needs to be in all quarters.

The freedom to cause offence is a vital component of free speech and a privilege which should be enjoyed equally by citizens of all true democracies - be they Islamic immigrants voicing their public support for Islamic terrorists or a flamboyant wannabe Presidential candidate who says it is time to throw away the Muslims Welcome mat.

What’s sauce for the goose. . .

Edited December 14, 2015 by Krataiboy

[DM07]

For all I care, I want to ban him from breathing!

But I think, this petition is more of an symbolic act!

[uptheos]

Seems some people can't tell the difference between free speech and hate speech.

Yes there's a line, Trump hasn't crossed it he's just saying what millions of others would like to say, but are too fearful of the repercussions.