Koh Tao debacle: Shoddy work from beginning to end

[stephenterry]

With just 11 days left to file an appeal against the court's decision on Christmas eve that handed down the death sentence on the two Myanmar worker's convicted of murdering the Koh Tao backpacker's, Myanmar sends a team of lawyers to Thailand to prepare the appeals case.

http://m.irrawaddy.com/burma/burmese-team-to-thailand-amid-preparations-for-koh-tao-appeal.html

Excellent. Now it's been escalated to government level, and at last some Burmese forensic pros (presumably) are on the job. About time, too. I only hope they will provide a 'dummies' understanding of what DNA evidence needs to be provided in court to be acceptable, as even today (according to BKP) the RTP are still asserting their tests met international standards.

[dru2]

Nothing in today's Nation online, a small reference - but certainly not given the prominence it deserves - in today's BKP.

Swept under the carpet?

I can't even see an article on the BKP for it.

Such a shame that the junta gagging order has now reached them.

There are two articles in the BKP - one on page 2 and the other before the sports pages. I suggest both of you open your eyes before posting misleading information, and conjecture.

Nothing conjectural or misleading about it - I was clearly referring to the online versions.

[stephenterry]

Nothing in today's Nation online, a small reference - but certainly not given the prominence it deserves - in today's BKP.

Swept under the carpet?

I can't even see an article on the BKP for it.

Such a shame that the junta gagging order has now reached them.

There are two articles in the BKP - one on page 2 and the other before the sports pages. I suggest both of you open your eyes before posting misleading information, and conjecture.

Nothing conjectural or misleading about it - I was clearly referring to the online versions.

Well more fool you for relying on the online version. and to make a point, your statement only grammatically refers to the Nation online, not the BKP, which is how i read it.. Buy and read the paper, unless of course you can't fork out 30 baht. Some people just can't accept they've ever get it wrong.

So readers, rely on my above post as the accurate version of events. And at least for today it hasn't been 'swept under the carpet'.

No hard feelings, dru2. I'm sure we're both happy that it hasn't been 'forgotten'.

[tukkytuktuk]

Anonymous attack on Thai court websites. Breaking news.

http://www.khaosodenglish.com/detail.php?newsid=1452675024&section=12&typecate=06

[mrrizzla]

Anonymous attack on Thai court websites. Breaking news.

http://www.khaosodenglish.com/detail.php?newsid=1452675024&section=12&typecate=06

Police spokesperson Dechnarong Suticharnbancha on Jan. 5 said the Technology Crime Suppression Division would track down the hackers.

“Even if the source of attack was from abroad, they will be convicted eventually,” he said. “It’s not a problem. Thai police are excellent.”

Anonymous a massive to you guys. Let us keep this going indefinately. Let us cause more corrupt and wicked officials and mafia more sleepless nights until the truth is told!

[taony]

Love these guys!

Would love to see the list of corrupt officials too. the man who thinks he's prime minister says he's been tackling corruption but has actually done jack shat.

[NCFC]

Love these guys!

Would love to see the list of corrupt officials too. the man who thinks he's prime minister says he's been tackling corruption but has actually done jack shat.

Hacking is illegal all around the world. You wouldn't be so happy if Anonymous were hacking into your porn collection

[tukkytuktuk]

Love these guys!

Would love to see the list of corrupt officials too. the man who thinks he's prime minister says he's been tackling corruption but has actually done jack shat.

Hacking is illegal all around the world. You wouldn't be so happy if Anonymous were hacking into your porn collection

Three things to say:- Occupy wall street, Edward Snowden and Rupert Murdoch.

[GeorgesAbitbol]

And now the Thai police threaten to sue Laura Witheridge

[mark131v]

And now the Thai police threaten to sue Laura Witheridge

Just goes to show the level to which the pond life in charge will sink..

There are some truly sick and morally bankrupt people here and not all are Thai, there seems to be a certain section taking great pleasure in this travesty and I cannot work out if they are trolls craving attention, nasty vindictive old gits or just completely blinkered and drunk on the juntas kool aid...sad either way

[berybert]

And now the Thai police threaten to sue Laura Witheridge

This is great news. One they will need to extradite her from the U.K. I look forward to the papers that will be handed into the British courts from the Thai authorities.

Reason to extradite ? She told the truth about our police investigation and we are upset. Yes we know we are corrupt liars but what right does she have to call us that ?

The joy of having childish idiots in charge of your biggest institutions is that they don't know when they are being laughed at. And the world can now laugh along.

[Squeegee]

Anonymous attack on Thai court websites. Breaking news.

http://www.khaosodenglish.com/detail.php?newsid=1452675024&section=12&typecate=06

"Anonymous has vowed to release information about corrupt members of the Thai judiciary..."

I really hope Anonymous go to town on the Thai establishment.

"Anonymous is supporting the campaign to ask tourists to boycott Thailand “until such time changes are made with the way Thai police handle investigations involving foreign tourists."

Let's just hope Anonymous stick to it.

"Police spokesperson Dechnarong Suticharnbancha on Jan. 5 said the Technology Crime Suppression Division would track down the hackers.

“Even if the source of attack was from abroad, they will be convicted eventually,” he said. “It’s not a problem. Thai police are excellent.”

Cue the obligatory official Thai buffoon and the predictable statement that can be reversed to get to the truth: they will never be convicted and the Thai police are generally inept, unprofessional and often times corrupt.

-

Roll on the appeal, and let's see the Thai authorities' train of injustice go further off the rails in the eyes of the world. The Land Of Smiles is dead and Teflon Thailand's life support is now wasting electricity.

[dru2]

From Today's The Nation:

'Meanwhile, police chief Chakthip Chaijinda yesterday ordered his legal team to investigate Hannah’s sister Laura’s Facebook post, in which she slammed the police investigation as being "bungled". Her post was removed yesterday. He said he would decide later whether to file a lawsuit against her'.

Read more here: http://www.nationmultimedia.com/national/Anonymous-hacks-Thai-court-websites-over-Koh-Tao-v-30276844.html

Edited January 14, 2016 by metisdead
Link added as per fair use policy.

[mrrizzla]

From Today's The Nation:

'Meanwhile, police chief Chakthip Chaijinda yesterday ordered his legal team to investigate Hannah’s sister Laura’s Facebook post, in which she slammed the police investigation as being "bungled". Her post was removed yesterday. He said he would decide later whether to file a lawsuit against her'.

Read more here: http://www.nationmultimedia.com/national/Anonymous-hacks-Thai-court-websites-over-Koh-Tao-v-30276844.html

Thai offcialdom is absolutely shameless.

[MorristheRunt]

Police chief Chakthip Chaijinda​ if I were you "chief" I would keep my mouth shut before launching an investigation to why your officers insulted the family of the murder victims on your patch.

[Squeegee]

Idiot is playing with fire. He better have world class anti-hacking abilities and a whiter than white history himself.

[Khun Han]

They are jumped-up (or rather bought their way up), self-important prigs who rarely, if ever, get criticised. They just don't realise how stupid and immature they look when they behave like this in the glare of international media. And neither do they realise the damage they themselves do to Thailand's international reputation. Pea brains.

[MorristheRunt]

When the hell will this country learn? Stop looking through your Chinese made Xenephobic red rimmed specticles and hire a quality U.S.A or European PR company to advise you on all maters ferrang!

A certain ex Thai PM does the same...Robert Amsterdam, very unpleasant man, but he sure gets his client plenty of pro western publicity.

[Tingtau]

Actually, rockin Robin, I vaguely remember there being pictures of them at the border.

Mon was cleared on 25th September

http://englishnews.thaipbs.or.th/police-now-rule-koh-tao-headmans-son-murder-suspect-turn-foreign-tourists-probe

As for the phone according to the BP (which I cant link to ), the police explained how they found the phone , evidently after their arrest the police asked about the phone and the Burmese told them it was left with a friend

One of the Burmese was arrested on a ferry , supposedly going to a new job

Greenchair I do know you have changed your mind and feel very upset,

I dont know if they are guilty or innocent but one of the stumbling blocks for me is that I fail to understand how MM did not retrieve his guitar.

There as been very little told with regards MM testimony yet it seems so crucial

[taony]

From Today's The Nation:

'Meanwhile, police chief Chakthip Chaijinda yesterday ordered his legal team to investigate Hannah’s sister Laura’s Facebook post, in which she slammed the police investigation as being "bungled". Her post was removed yesterday. He said he would decide later whether to file a lawsuit against her'.

Read more here: http://www.nationmultimedia.com/national/Anonymous-hacks-Thai-court-websites-over-Koh-Tao-v-30276844.html

This can't be real life.

If they want to sue everyone who's disparaged the Buffoons in Brown, they'd have to sue the entire planet!

Its disappointing she removed the (already edited) post.

Edited January 14, 2016 by taony

[boomerangutang]

From Today's The Nation:

'Meanwhile, police chief Chakthip Chaijinda yesterday ordered his legal team to investigate Hannah’s sister Laura’s Facebook post, in which she slammed the police investigation as being "bungled". Her post was removed yesterday. He said he would decide later whether to file a lawsuit against her'.

Read more here: http://www.nationmultimedia.com/national/Anonymous-hacks-Thai-court-websites-over-Koh-Tao-v-30276844.html

Idiot is playing with fire. He better have world class anti-hacking abilities and a whiter than white history himself.

Jaktip was involved in the bungled KT investigation. He was named by Sondhi several times as being corrupt. He and several other top brass should be investigated to gauge whether there were pay-offs involved in the KT case. But wait a moment, how can police investigate a money-trail involving the botched investigation? If it were shown payoffs were make, the top bananas aren't going to indict themselves, are they? The tiger doesn't eat his own tail when he's hungry.

[Squeegee]

Well if he didn't have something to hide he could happily ignore or counter rather than attempt to silence. Then again, he's Thai inside Thailand and thus in 'splendid isolation,' ie. divorced from the reality of the rest of the world that sees his behaviour as anything but innocent or professional.

[greenchair]

Hopefully it will make it into all the papers. Thank God she has spoken out at last. Now we need to hear some news that the murderers have been arrested.

....or at least some of the most likely murderers put in jail with with no bail, pending trial. They know who they are. Most of us posting here plus most of the islanders have a very good idea who they are. Even Thai officials know who they are. The reasons they're not charged and slapped in jail, are grist for most of the thousands of posts on this topic in the past 16 months. Ronald Reagan (not one of my heroes btw) famously stood in Berlin and called out, "Mr. Gobachov, tear down this wall!" What Thailand needs is at least one influential person (or better: a large crowd of concerned citizens) to stand up in Bangkok and declare: "Thai officialdom, tear down this wall of silence!"

Apologies? That would be the people that sway like a feather on the wind, vilifying the Witheridges when they supported the strength of the case then praising them when Hannah's sister says otherwise; and this after spending a couple weeks going after the Millers.

Greenchair is right, the Witheridge family was the target of abusive commentary and hatred, even on this forum, the moment they endorsed the investigation a year ago; I have no doubt the death threats happened in that context, I don't recall the same group that now claim them as their own stepping up to their defense back then.

Laura Witheridge is entitled to her own opinions, on the other hand I know her family has been heavily lobbied by activists to change their view of the case, which they considered extremely damaging to their cause.

I wondered how AleG would respond to Laurie's recent post on FB. I'm underwhelmed but not surprised. P.S. not one poster has ever 'vilified' the Witheridge family (AleG's assertion). Everyone has been decent and civil toward the victims' families. Quit trying to fan flames - based on lies. Plus, there are two other victims' families: related to the B2.

What is a penalty for tampering with the evidence? What is the penalty for false statements? Does police should be worried?

This is Thailand. All those sorts of legal questions are predicated on a person's social status and how much they pay to key/important people. There's nothing objective about how the law is meted out in Thailand.

Greenchair asks: "Why were they (B2) swimming in the rain at 1 o'clock in the morning."

1 am was 4 hours before the crime ended at around 5 am (probably started about 12 minutes earlier). If they plopped in the water at 1 am, who gives a rat's ass?

According to andy hall the time of death was estimated between 1am and 6am. Both Wei Phyo by their own testimony were at the place hannah would have needed to pass to go to her room. Then they were both back at the scene to retrieve belongings at 5am . At which time Wei Phyo claims to have found David's phone. It is not established if the swimming is after the murders or before. But I think it is a fair question as to why they were swimming at around 1am while it (according to their testimony )was raining. I imagine that many of the time frames are estimates.

But we know that there were some unusual goings on for these b3 between 1am and 5am.

Which coincided with a double murder between 1am and 5am.

[boomerangutang]

from Greenchair: According to andy hall the time of death was estimated between 1am and 6am. Both Wei Phyo by their own testimony were at the place hannah would have needed to pass to go to her room. Then they were both back at the scene to retrieve belongings at 5am . At which time Wei Phyo claims to have found David's phone. It is not established if the swimming is after the murders or before. But I think it is a fair question as to why they were swimming at around 1am while it (according to their testimony )was raining. I imagine that many of the time frames are estimates. But we know that there were some unusual goings on for these b3 between 1am and 5am. Which coincided with a double murder between 1am and 5am.

1 am is hours early for the crime-time. David was shown entering AC bar on CCTV after 1 am. The Thai coroner estimated crime time at 5:30 am. I estimate it happened in the 15 minutes before 5 am. The reason: 5 am is the 3rd running man video.

As for the B2 going in the water. That, to me, implicates them in some way to the crime. Asians don't go swimming in the sea at night. Extremely rare, if ever. If they did go in the water, it was probably to try and wash off some blood. Plus, their claim that their clothes were taken bolster that theory. However, though the B2 may have had some peripheral involvement with the crime scene (opportunistically looking for a few things to steal, for example), I seriously doubt they instigated it. Evidence and knowledge of human nature (how easily Thais get offended, and how ballistic their retribution) points to local Thai tough guy wanna-be's. The type of guys who pose with guns and wear weaponized shark-tooth rings. The type of guys with reputations for date-rapes. In sum; the type of guys who are buddies with (or related to) Mon. That's why Mon was busy altering the crime scene and why Mon (and Big-Ear cop) fingered Sean. All the puzzle pieces fit together for whodunit when you put Mon in the middle of the picture. He's the linchpin to solving the crime. Edited January 15, 2016 by boomerangutang

[boomerangutang]

Interesting to note that in December 2015, during the arraignment of the B2, the judge asked them, "If you didn't do the crime, do you know who did?"

Yet, when Mon was on the stand at the trial last July as a witness, no judge asked him the same. Yet further proof of a cover-up by authorities in cahoots with the Toovichian clan.

[KunMatt]

from Greenchair: According to andy hall the time of death was estimated between 1am and 6am. Both Wei Phyo by their own testimony were at the place hannah would have needed to pass to go to her room. Then they were both back at the scene to retrieve belongings at 5am . At which time Wei Phyo claims to have found David's phone. It is not established if the swimming is after the murders or before. But I think it is a fair question as to why they were swimming at around 1am while it (according to their testimony )was raining. I imagine that many of the time frames are estimates. But we know that there were some unusual goings on for these b3 between 1am and 5am. Which coincided with a double murder between 1am and 5am.

1 am is hours early for the crime-time. David was shown entering AC bar on CCTV after 1 am. The Thai coroner estimated crime time at 5:30 am. I estimate it happened in the 15 minutes before 5 am. The reason: 5 am is the 3rd running man video.

As for the B2 going in the water. That, to me, implicates them in some way to the crime. Asians don't go swimming in the sea at night. Extremely rare, if ever. If they did go in the water, it was probably to try and wash off some blood. Plus, their claim that their clothes were taken bolster that theory. However, though the B2 may have had some peripheral involvement with the crime scene (opportunistically looking for a few things to steal, for example), I seriously doubt they instigated it. Evidence and knowledge of human nature (how easily Thais get offended, and how ballistic their retribution) points to local Thai tough guy wanna-be's. The type of guys who pose with guns and wear weaponized shark-tooth rings. The type of guys with reputations for date-rapes. In sum; the type of guys who are buddies with (or related to) Mon. That's why Mon was busy altering the crime scene and why Mon (and Big-Ear cop) fingered Sean. All the puzzle pieces fit together for whodunit when you put Mon in the middle of the picture. He's the linchpin to solving the crime.

Agreed. He is the owner of the bar the victims were last at, the boss of the B2, the uncle of the 2nd suspect, the owner of the property where the bodies were found, the person who tried to frame another expat immediately after the crime, the person who called the cops and was already at the crime scene moving evidence and one of the murder weapons around, he was captured on CCTV at the crime scene and arrested as one of the first real suspects with evidence which definitely implicated him in the crime.

Am I forgetting anything else? And yet, being wealthy and from a powerful family on the island, he was immediately forgotten about as soon as the police investigator was changed and never mentioned again.

Does anyone really believe that the B2 murdered 2 customers from their boss's bar and left the bodies and one of the murder weapons in their bosses back garden and then just carried on with their lives like nothing had happened?

The only scenario that works if the B2 are actually involved is that they witnessed or helped their coworkers in the crime.

[mrrizzla]

I'd go with the B2 working on clean up duty. David was certainly dragged into the Ocean. The B2 subduing Hannah and then fending off David at the same time? Nope, not having it.

[greenchair]

As boomerangutang says, swimming at 1am (estimated time ) when it is raining is a very unusual thing for Asian. Then having clothes stolen is also an unusual event. Guitar yes, phones yes, but clothes? ??hmmm.

What is also extremely unusual is Muang Muang getting up at 4.30 in the morning leaving his girlfriend and going to wake up b2 at 5am. He says he left his guitar with his friends, why would he be so worried about it , that would cause him to get out of bed so early. We all know island life. Most people workers and tourist sleep at 2 or 3 am. Especially bar workers get up anywhere from 10 oclock to midday ready to work through the night. I think it is very unusual that Muang Muang was up so early. I'm just not buying the mon theory sorry, there is absolutely nothing on him. He was arrested because of sean, but around about the same time the friend came forward with David's phone. that's why the investigation turned. Before the discovery of the phone, the police were grabbing at straws every where. Altogether there were 5 burmese. Each one of them by their own testimony has some connection to the victims. Nobody else has been shown to have a connection in any way.

[Eirene]

To be clear....Zaw Win worked at Brother's Bar and Wai Phyo worked at the Safety Stop restaurant. Maung Maung worked at the AC2 bar/restaurant. I understood the victims were found in front of the resort they stayed at... the Ocean View which is owned by Narong Det Kanchana Pen.

Agreed. He is the owner of the bar the victims were last at, the boss of the B2, the uncle of the 2nd suspect, the owner of the property where the bodies were found, the person who tried to frame another expat immediately after the crime, the person who called the cops and was already at the crime scene moving evidence and one of the murder weapons around, he was captured on CCTV at the crime scene and arrested as one of the first real suspects with evidence which definitely implicated him in the crime.

Am I forgetting anything else? And yet, being wealthy and from a powerful family on the island, he was immediately forgotten about as soon as the police investigator was changed and never mentioned again.

Does anyone really believe that the B2 murdered 2 customers from their boss's bar and left the bodies and one of the murder weapons in their bosses back garden and then just carried on with their lives like nothing had happened?

The only scenario that works if the B2 are actually involved is that they witnessed or helped their coworkers in the crime.

[boomerangutang]

As boomerangutang says, swimming at 1am (estimated time ) when it is raining is a very unusual thing for Asian. Then having clothes stolen is also an unusual event. Guitar yes, phones yes, but clothes? ??hmmm.

What is also extremely unusual is Muang Muang getting up at 4.30 in the morning leaving his girlfriend and going to wake up b2 at 5am. He says he left his guitar with his friends, why would he be so worried about it , that would cause him to get out of bed so early. We all know island life. Most people workers and tourist sleep at 2 or 3 am. Especially bar workers get up anywhere from 10 oclock to midday ready to work through the night. I think it is very unusual that Muang Muang was up so early. I'm just not buying the mon theory sorry, there is absolutely nothing on him. He was arrested because of sean, but around about the same time the friend came forward with David's phone. that's why the investigation turned. Before the discovery of the phone, the police were grabbing at straws every where. Altogether there were 5 burmese. Each one of them by their own testimony has some connection to the victims. Nobody else has been shown to have a connection in any way.

Mon is implicated because his nephew is implicated (Running Man videos) and Mon tried to shield his nephew in various ways. Mon was a prime suspect early on. He was questioned for 3 hours - but none of that questioning will ever be known outside the insiders. It's ironic that police are eager to record all sorts of things - did you see how many recording devices were at the farcical reenactment? Yet they don't seen to have any audio or video of Mon's questioning nor one second of the 'safe-house' with the B3 (before they became the B2). Mon purportedly also would not hand over potentially crucial CCTV (to cops) from his bar, and likely barred CCTV from other bars and places where he has strong influence. In a western country, that would be called, 'withholding evidence' and could carry legal ramifications. In Thailand it's a yawning 'mai pen rai' because everything legal is predicated on a person's social status and degree of wealth. If any of that hidden/destroyed CCTV implicated the B2, you can be sure it would be shown and touted. Mon may have also meddled in other things in his attempts to shield his nephew. A phone call or visit to Nok Air top staff would be useful. Similarly, a visit to the fast boat driver who was found by cops the day after the crime, sleeping in a cave. Cops said the driver was too drugged to talk, and then permanently left him alone. Then, perhaps the biggest factor of all in the cover-up: transfer of money. None of us know for sure whether there were under-the-table favors paid for covering up the crime, but both Mon and his brother are very rich, and very influential on the island. Connect the dots.

P.S. and the mysterious deaths of young backpackers that keep happening on the tiny island. Are they just unfortunate coincidences, or.....?