Police

[MadMac]

Ok .

[worgeordie]

@folkguitar

I wrote I'm happy if they take out idiots and make the roads safer. And I don't mind how they do it as long as they do it.

If you quote me, quote the full sentence. Thanks.

Glad to. Your full sentence was; "I can be happy with knowing there are corrupt police checkpoints and they catch some idiot drivers, make some pocket money and the same time make the streets safer for the rest of us."

Me? I couldn't be 'happy' with corrupt police checkpoints. No ethical person could, no matter how effective they may be.

However, we can be happy with with knowing there are police checkpoints and they catch some idiot drivers and make the streets safer for the rest of us.

And fortunately, all I've ever encountered in 15 years of driving in Thailand have been fair and honest police checkpoints.

FolkGuitar, are you saying there are NO corrupt police at check points,or that you have just not met any on your travels,

or no corrupt police here at all,or just not on the check points.

regards worgeordie

[garryjohns]

Ahh....that's a nice swing now. First you say there is no corruption, then you find a fellow pinkglassed ignorant and suddenly you blame people for acknowledging that there is corruption :-)

Sorry, play with your guitar.

Reading comprehension not your strong point, huh?

No one is blaming you for saying there IS corruption. You can say it all you want. We don't see it, we don't experience it. But you say you are happy with it.

I'm saying there is something wrong with anyone who is HAPPY with corruption... which is what YOU SAID!

Did you forget already? Your post #174... where you said, and I'll quote; "I can be happy with knowing there are corrupt police checkpoints"

Geeez..enough already, get down off your soapbox and stop shouting will you.

This is your common MO on TV all so frequently.

You prod and push and goad others into a BS keyboard fight time and time again.

You must be so bored with the "perfect lifestyle" that you frequently portray that you live, that you need to instigate such drivel all so often seen here from you.

[FolkGuitar]

FolkGuitar, are you saying there are NO corrupt police at check points,or that you have just not met any on your travels,

or no corrupt police here at all,or just not on the check points.

regards worgeordie

Since repeating it in my posts three or four times in this thread already, and you didn't seem to get it, I'll copy and paste all of those again. But next time, please just read the thread...:

------------------------

15 years driving every day in Thailand's north, south, and everything in between. In fact, just got back from a 4-day motorcycle ride through Isaan. Stopped many times by police at check points. Never once experienced ANY form of dishonesty or corruption, nor even had a nasty word from the police in 15 years.

--------------------------

I live here, drive here, and interact with the police at check points often.

In 15 years of doing so, I've never encountered any police corruption, nor have I ever met anyone who has.

------------------------

I've heard of it happening often,..... but ONLY here on ThaiVisa! Despite many road blocks, and even having an expired tax sticker once, I've never experienced any police corruption, nor have I ever heard of any directly from someone who has experienced it themselves.

------------------------

I'm on the road every day of the week. I've done so for 15 years. I ride all over Chiang Mai city and Chiang Mai province. I'm a farang. My face and my body shape are obviously foreign. I've been stopped many times in many different areas. I've been waved through many different check points. Sometimes the police are only stopping people who are not wearing helmets. Sometimes they are stopping everyone looking at documentation. In all these years, and in all these stops, I have NEVER seen any indication what so ever of targeting foreigners or license 'scams.'

--------------------------

That's what I said, word for word.

[FolkGuitar]

Reading comprehension not your strong point, huh?

No one is blaming you for saying there IS corruption. You can say it all you want. We don't see it, we don't experience it. But you say you are happy with it.

I'm saying there is something wrong with anyone who is HAPPY with corruption... which is what YOU SAID!

Did you forget already? Your post #174... where you said, and I'll quote; "I can be happy with knowing there are corrupt police checkpoints"

Geeez..enough already, get down off your soapbox and stop shouting will you.

This is your common MO on TV all so frequently.

You prod and push and goad others into a BS keyboard fight time and time again.

You must be so bored with the "perfect lifestyle" that you frequently portray that you live, that you need to instigate such drivel all so often seen here from you.

Ignore the subject and just attack the person. Direct, and in keeping with the finest ThaiVisa behavior. Good post, Garryjohns.

BTW, do you actually have something to add to the subject of the thread, or are you just here to talk about other people's actions?

[MadMac]

Certainly no corruption in this country

http://th.bribespot.com/

[novo58]

I just wish you all would take you little spat .........private.

Why do people need to continually post personal attacks ..................and answers aimed at specific individuals in open forum.

Why not take it to personal messages and leave the open forum for informative answers to the OP.

[Rob13]

Never once experienced ANY form of dishonesty or corruption, nor even had a nasty word from the police in 15 years.

This attitude is how corruption is perpetuated, same as all the pedo's in the catholic church.People closing their eyes rather than admitting there's a problem. and deal with it.It's a fact; Thai cops take money at road blocks, you not acknowledging it only tells everyone how sheltered you've kept yourself in 15 years in this country, not that it doesn't happen.

Edited January 19, 2016 by Rob13

[CMKiwi]

Well folks we will all have a little break, dont forget to stay tuned and we will be right back once we have a brief announcement from our sponsors......queue obnoxious jingle in the background.

[SKYpz]

Interessing topic, will follow this further.

[FolkGuitar]

Certainly no corruption in this country

http://th.bribespot.com/

You're in good company..... If there is a website, it must be true.

Here's a website for people who believe the earth is flat:

http://www.theflatearthsociety.org/forum/index.php?board=8.0

And here's one for people who believe Aliens from Space are living among us:

http://www.alien-earth.com/

Perhaps you'd prefer to read a website that insists that 11,000,000 people were never killed by the Nazis:

http://archive.adl.org/holocaust/introduction.html#.Vp4CoHtCh-8

Edited January 19, 2016 by FolkGuitar

[Rob13]

How bout a website saying thai cops aren't corupt?

[MadMac]

The funny thing is, one day they will catch you out of the blue. And they will rip you off. Guess who will be the one who complains loudest then? .

I don't mind to give an underpaid policeman 200B if I made a mistake. I like it if they take 200B from people driving without helmets, because that is the only way eventually people will use them. Now imagine you hit one of the guys without helmet. Who will be responsible?! Certainly not the guy on the bike. Biggest wins, as with everything here.

[FolkGuitar]

Never once experienced ANY form of dishonesty or corruption, nor even had a nasty word from the police in 15 years.

This attitude is how corruption is perpetuated, same as all the pedo's in the catholic church.People closing their eyes rather than admitting there's a problem. and deal with it.It's a fact; Thai cops take money at road blocks, you not acknowledging it only tells everyone how sheltered you've kept yourself in 15 years in this country, not that it doesn't happen.

Perhaps you could tell us in just what manner I've managed to be 'sheltered' all these years? Driving Thai roads every day for 15 years in both cars and on motorcycles, and from Surrat Thani to Mai Sai is somehow sheltered? Get real!

I know what I've experienced when I've been stopped by police roadblocks. I know what people have said to me about their experience with police and with police road checks. And so far, the ONLY ones I've heard saying anything negative have been posts made in ThaiVisa by brave anonymous posters!

Perhaps you could show some valid proof (i.e. not a newspaper or magazine article, a poster in ThaiVisa, or someone saying 'this happened to my friend.) You know... actual proof.

[MadMac]

There is a small but important difference between paranoia and being a realist. Anyway, you believe what you believe and may Allah hold his hand over you

[Rob13]

Perhaps you could show some valid proof (i.e. not a newspaper or magazine article, a poster in ThaiVisa, or someone saying 'this happened to my friend.) You know... actual proof.

Wouldn't waste my time, but feel free to prove me wrong.

[gbaybay]

I've been pulled over twice in the last week, both clearly because I was white. Both sets of cops were in a group calling people to the side. It was a check point.

The first one was at Changpuak Road and Highway 2041. I think he said my infraction was that I entered a turning lane without turning. I tried to note that other people did the same but he paid no attention, or perhaps did not understand. He was then very quick to make me a generous offer. 'Pay now or pay later?' He basically said I could give him 200 baht to save me the hassle of going to the police station where I would pay a larger indeterminate fine. What a gentleman. I paid the bribe and he insisted that I hand it to him under some papers - which indicated that he knew he was doing something wrong.

Today I was pulled over at Tha Phae Road and Wichananon Road. This guy was even more filthy. He saw me far away among a group of Thai drivers because I'm white. He signalled for me to pull over, pointing through the crowd at the caucasian. I gave him my license, which he said was invalid in Thailand even though the first cop had no problem with it, but still made the same offer as the last guy - 200 baht bribe or a big fine at police headquarters. Again he asked for it to be discreet and I handed him money under some papers.

Their requests for discretion makes me hopeful that there is some kind of oversight, somewhere. Anyone know where you can submit complaints?

It's pretty clear that the police are making a living off bribery. I would estimate that at a congested checkpoint they are are pulling in 200baht every ten minutes. Until something changes, I'm going to invest in a helmet that covers the face going forward.

[alanrchase]

Went through three checkpoints today on my motorbike. Waved through the first two stopped at the third. Showed my licence, had a chat, thanked me and off I went. Everyone being fined at all three were Thai.

[MadMac]

I just linked to bribespot a few postings above. That has a smartphone app as well.

About being paranoid, I have a dashcam in the car, with one cam pointing ahead and one to the side window. That can potentially safe your life if you hit someone or get hit.

Edited January 19, 2016 by MadMac

[Trujillo]

I was stopped riding my scooter to the bus station without a helmet (I was just going around the block, my bad) and was told I could go on my way if I gave him 500 baht. I said 200 (should have said 100, but was in a hurry) and he told me to walk with him, just about three shops down the way, wrote me an "air ticket" (ticket is there and pen floats over the ticket as if writing) and off I went.

Was that corruption?

In fact, just got back from a 4-day motorcycle ride through Isaan.

From CM through Issan and back in four days? So you don't mean Ubon I guess, or Mukdahan. Or you drive very fast indeed (and at night?).

[FolkGuitar]

I've been pulled over twice in the last week, both clearly because I was white. Both sets of cops were in a group calling people to the side. It was a check point.

The first one was at Changpuak Road and Highway 2041. I think he said my infraction was that I entered a turning lane without turning. I tried to note that other people did the same but he paid no attention, or perhaps did not understand. He was then very quick to make me a generous offer. 'Pay now or pay later?' He basically said I could give him 200 baht to save me the hassle of going to the police station where I would pay a larger indeterminate fine. What a gentleman. I paid the bribe and he insisted that I hand it to him under some papers - which indicated that he knew he was doing something wrong.

Today I was pulled over at Tha Phae Road and Wichananon Road. This guy was even more filthy. He saw me far away among a group of Thai drivers because I'm white. He signalled for me to pull over, pointing through the crowd at the caucasian. I gave him my license, which he said was invalid in Thailand even though the first cop had no problem with it, but still made the same offer as the last guy - 200 baht bribe or a big fine at police headquarters. Again he asked for it to be discreet and I handed him money under some papers.

Their requests for discretion makes me hopeful that there is some kind of oversight, somewhere. Anyone know where you can submit complaints?

It's pretty clear that the police are making a living off bribery. I would estimate that at a congested checkpoint they are are pulling in 200baht every ten minutes. Until something changes, I'm going to invest in a helmet that covers the face going forward.

TV member since 38 minutes ago... first post.... As I've said previously, I've heard of it happening often,..... but ONLY here on ThaiVisa by anonymous posters.

[FolkGuitar]

In fact, just got back from a 4-day motorcycle ride through Isaan.

From CM through Issan and back in four days? So you don't mean Ubon I guess, or Mukdahan. Or you drive very fast indeed (and at night?).

From Chiang Mai up Rt118, then back down through the mountains through Uttaradit to Phitsanoluk, up to Loei, and over to Udon Thani. Then south to Kohn Kaen and west back to Phitsanoluk. And yes, I do ride very fast sometimes. We'll see the rest of Isaan on the next ride. There's no need to see it all in one trip. We ride often.

EDIT: We don't ride at night. Usually we leave the hotels between 8-9am, and stop for the day between 4:30-5:00

Can't see much at night, and we do this for sightseeing.

Edited January 19, 2016 by FolkGuitar

[FolkGuitar]

Went through three checkpoints today on my motorbike. Waved through the first two stopped at the third. Showed my licence, had a chat, thanked me and off I went. Everyone being fined at all three were Thai.

The ONLY place I 'hear' anything different happening is right here in ThaiVisa, where the same 4-5 people complain about being persecuted because they are white.

Your experience is no different from the sort that I have, and the sort that people I speak with face to face have. It's normal.

I wear short pants and a short-sleeved shirt, and ride with my face shield open. I'm big, and very obviously white, yet somehow, I seem to either get waved through checkpoints without stopping, or at the most, waved on after showing my Thai driver's license.

If I ever see anything different happening at police checks, I'll be very happy to report that I was mistaken. But as it's never happened to me in 15 years, I don't expect it to happen anytime soon.

[MaeJoMTB]

The ONLY place I 'hear' anything different happening is right here in ThaiVisa, where the same 4-5 people complain about being persecuted because they are white.

Most of the tickets issued to my family are for brown people.

Name the 4-5 people claiming persecution cos they're white ......... c'mon!

Or is this the one time you refuse to list post numbers?

Edited January 19, 2016 by MaeJoMTB

[roo860]

I was stopped riding my scooter to the bus station without a helmet (I was just going around the block, my bad) and was told I could go on my way if I gave him 500 baht. I said 200 (should have said 100, but was in a hurry) and he told me to walk with him, just about three shops down the way, wrote me an "air ticket" (ticket is there and pen floats over the ticket as if writing) and off I went.

Was that corruption?

No, was your own fault mate for not wearing a helmet, doesn't matter how far you were going, people get involved in accidents everywhere.

[FolkGuitar]

Most of the tickets issued to my family are for brown people.

Name the 4-5 people claiming persecution cos they're white ......... c'mon!

What does one thing have to do with another? Your family is Thai. You've told us they get several tickets every year. (Which is absurd in its own right!) As far as we know, they don't post on ThaiVisa. So what does that have to do with the white (as far as we know because they say they are) ThaiVisa posters who repeatedly complain about unfair targeting of white drivers?

As far as naming them... there are eight previous pages of posts. If you want to see names, just scroll back through this thread alone? You can see half of them yourself.

[garryjohns]

Reading comprehension not your strong point, huh?

No one is blaming you for saying there IS corruption. You can say it all you want. We don't see it, we don't experience it. But you say you are happy with it.

I'm saying there is something wrong with anyone who is HAPPY with corruption... which is what YOU SAID!

Did you forget already? Your post #174... where you said, and I'll quote; "I can be happy with knowing there are corrupt police checkpoints"

Geeez..enough already, get down off your soapbox and stop shouting will you.

This is your common MO on TV all so frequently.

You prod and push and goad others into a BS keyboard fight time and time again.

You must be so bored with the "perfect lifestyle" that you frequently portray that you live, that you need to instigate such drivel all so often seen here from you.

Ignore the subject and just attack the person. Direct, and in keeping with the finest ThaiVisa behavior. Good post, Garryjohns.

BTW, do you actually have something to add to the subject of the thread, or are easily verified you just here to talk about other people's actions?

Firstly FG, i am not attacking you.

Simply pointing out easily verified facts.

You are an 'expert' at pushing the limits of being/not being classified a troll.

As for something to add? Actually, quite a few incidents regarding making payment in cash to a policee..[Examples..a couple "You are busy mister? You can pay me now and not go to station police", Another recent one "OK you can pay me, but you not tell people OK! " "Pay me but put money under my folder" etc etc

Not so easily verified but very factual and against your "experience" is 100% that it does happen and is quite common indeed.

I had broken the law, no doubt about that, [that's my issue and not for debate with you] but the contentious issue is whether or not the offer to pay money direct to individual cops instead of going to the police station exists is YES it does.

Maybe not to you, but to many others it has and still does, regularly.

[FolkGuitar]

Geeez..enough already, get down off your soapbox and stop shouting will you.

This is your common MO on TV all so frequently.

You prod and push and goad others into a BS keyboard fight time and time again.

1a. You must be so bored with the "perfect lifestyle" that you frequently portray that you live, that you need to instigate such drivel all so often seen here from you.

Ignore the subject and just attack the person. Direct, and in keeping with the finest ThaiVisa behavior. Good post, Garryjohns.

BTW, do you actually have something to add to the subject of the thread, or are easily verified you just here to talk about other people's actions?

1b. Firstly FG, i am not attacking you.

Simply pointing out easily verified facts.

You are an 'expert' at pushing the limits of being/not being classified a troll.

2. As for something to add? Actually, quite a few incidents regarding making payment in cash to a policee..[Examples..a couple "You are busy mister? You can pay me now and not go to station police", Another recent one "OK you can pay me, but you not tell people OK! " "Pay me but put money under my folder" etc etc

Not so easily verified but very factual and against your "experience" is 100% that it does happen and is quite common indeed.

I had broken the law, no doubt about that, [that's my issue and not for debate with you] but the contentious issue is whether or not the offer to pay money direct to individual cops instead of going to the police station exists is YES it does.

3. Maybe not to you, but to many others it has and still does, regularly.

OK... 1a shows that 1b is a not true. Did you forget that you wrote 1a?

2. As I've said before, we do hear it often in ThaiVisa from anonymous posters.

3. I've never said it didn't. I've said that it's never happened to me in 15 years of daily driving in Thailand, and it's never happened to anyone that I know.

I find it very odd that a few anonymous people post that it happens yet the real people I hear say it doesn't. And frankly, I'm inclined to believe real people and my own experience.

[garryjohns]

Geeez..enough already, get down off your soapbox and stop shouting will you.

This is your common MO on TV all so frequently.

You prod and push and goad others into a BS keyboard fight time and time again.

1a. You must be so bored with the "perfect lifestyle" that you frequently portray that you live, that you need to instigate such drivel all so often seen here from you.

Ignore the subject and just attack the person. Direct, and in keeping with the finest ThaiVisa behavior. Good post, Garryjohns.

BTW, do you actually have something to add to the subject of the thread, or are easily verified you just here to talk about other people's actions?

1b. Firstly FG, i am not attacking you.

Simply pointing out easily verified facts.

You are an 'expert' at pushing the limits of being/not being classified a troll.

2. As for something to add? Actually, quite a few incidents regarding making payment in cash to a policee..[Examples..a couple "You are busy mister? You can pay me now and not go to station police", Another recent one "OK you can pay me, but you not tell people OK! " "Pay me but put money under my folder" etc etc

Not so easily verified but very factual and against your "experience" is 100% that it does happen and is quite common indeed.

I had broken the law, no doubt about that, [that's my issue and not for debate with you] but the contentious issue is whether or not the offer to pay money direct to individual cops instead of going to the police station exists is YES it does.

3. Maybe not to you, but to many others it has and still does, regularly.

OK... 1a shows that 1b is a not true. Did you forget that you wrote 1a?

2. As I've said before, we do hear it often in ThaiVisa from anonymous posters.

3. I've never said it didn't. I've said that it's never happened to me in 15 years of daily driving in Thailand, and it's never happened to anyone that I know.

I find it very odd that a few anonymous people post that it happens yet the real people I hear say it doesn't. And frankly, I'm inclined to believe real people and my own experience.

You really are confused, and , wakey wakey,you are also an anonymous poster.

You are ,as i say, in other readers eyes, also just an anonymous poster, so your post has as little credence as ever to us.Yes?

Also it is suggested that birds of a feather flock together huh?

So if your "real" people [who, to us are just more anonymous people, using your logic]who you talk about, are as far out of touch with being "real" as you seem to be then again , you have absolutely no credence.

Edited January 19, 2016 by garryjohns

[happy Joe]

In Thailand for 6 years and I have never known special police handling farang. Often I drive on Chiang Mai Bangkok road with numerous checkpoints.

Never I was not asked for my papers or other hassle. Instead, they usually tell me to move when they see that I am Western smiling and quiet.

In this country I noticed that the attitude is paramount in all circumstances (Sanuk) It is likely that those who complain and snivel incessantly here and elsewhere on TV does not have this quality.