Teacher Licensing, Culture Testing, TCT

[Neeranam]

Does the 'University of KSR' give transcripts?

Scottish ones don't.

[Moonhunteruk]

Just a quick post, i have paid my fee and have my bill which i cant read but i can see that the 500 baht is on there.

Anyway i was told on Sunday by the head teacher at Songkhala University this test is very similar to a tofel test.

So just another bit of information to confuse everybody

Mike

[Ijustwannateach]

Oh, great- a TOEFL test- even though I don't teach English. I was joking with my colleagues the other day that we would all wind up in TEFL classes before this was over- this was in a room full of teachers of subjects other than English- and I was only half-joking.

On a slightly more positive but ever-more-confusing note, a rumour has it that given the singular failure of this new "policy," they may re-admit the teachers who have received their Thai teacher's licenses already even if after the June 2003 cutoff date previously set.

That means they can probably wait another few months before scrapping the whole plan as unworkable anyway, considering the tiny number of new teachers with Ed.'s likely to be coming in the next 6 months.

"S"

[Scott]

Important question; is this applicable to government teachers only, or private language school teachers too??

I am thinking that as it is the word from the ministry it might only apply to their schools. I mean, if a language school wants to hire a rebate that should be their prerogative.

I think the thing to remember is that the teacher's license is necessary to get a work permit (to teach). I don't think the language schools really care, if they can hire someone who has a work permit in another field, so be it. They will have an even more extreme turnover rate with people who go out to renew visas, since they can only last 90 days.

[The Dan Sai Kid]

Does the 'University of KSR' give transcripts?

Scottish ones don't.

I think that they do nowadays.

[Rumpole]

When I first came to Thailand, I was required by the college at which I was employed to endure one 10-hour teacher training session per month (usually Saturdays). Since it was my first year, my Thai languge skills were next to nil. Of course the entire training sessions were in Thai

Insanity. Just one more example of why the Thais cannot attract teachers, and how they so very quickly manage to alienate the few that they do entice. With respect, however, why did you agree to this in the first place? I'm not having a go at you, but if farang were a little more assertive in refusing to comply with some of the nonesense demanded by Thai schools, the Thais might eventually get the message and stop trying to impose it. Show a little backbone people. It's an employees' market. There are plenty of other countries which will either treat you better, or at least offer a higher rate of remuneration for putting up with all the BS.

Edited December 3, 2006 by Rumpole

[otherstuff1957]

I haven't heard anything about this at school. Just here on the forum. The 28 November deadline has come and gone and maybe my teaching license has been revoked without my knowing about it!

I do admit that I worry a bit about a test generated by the MOE here. A year or so ago I was asked to write an English sentence for some certificates being presented to some Thai English teachers. As I was not sure whether they would all be women or not, I included the phrase '...their participation..', using their as a gender neutral pronoun in place of his or her. Naturally the Thai teachers were eager to point out my 'grammatical error'.

I've been in Thailand too long to do anything but smile and say 'Of course, why don't we just say 'her participation'.

I just hope that any test we have to take will be written by Thais who have a better command of the English Language than those teachers!

[jingjingna]

I had my teaching license renewed in November through my school. There was no mention of the MOE test...??

Edited December 3, 2006 by jingjingna

[The Dan Sai Kid]

My school has been equally clueless. I seem to know more than anybody!

[Scott]

For those of you who are wondering about the license, you should have been asked for 500 Baht to renew the license, unless the school is paying for it. They submit it along with the papers and you should be notified when the "test" date is or seminars.

The thing that galls me is that everything has to be so over-the-top. Nothing wrong with a seminar and some orientation, but a whole production?!! Enough is enough.

[PeaceBlondie]

On other forums about teaching in Thailand, the furor seems to have died down since this set of requirements was first mentioned. Work permits, teacher's licenses, Thai culture course, no more visa runs, etc. - the panic stage has died down, and nothing seems to be happening. Both groups were partially right: the mai bpen rai brigade who said, "Don't sweat it, this is Thailand, they'll never clamp down" and the willy-nilly scaremongers who had evidence that the sky was actually falling (and ThaiVisa is not the only such forum that has some Chicken Littles screaming).

The sky hasn't fallen; only a few scattered stratus clouds way up high. What has happened, apparently, is that many teachers left, including very well qualified, fairly well qualified, barely qualified, barely breathing, and just bare. Apparently Filipinos are taking the place of true native speaking English, math and science teachers, even in bilingual programs. If you can't find a White math teacher for 35K, get a Filipino for 17K. Wow, half price.

So, to repeat the old question that usually was answered "No": how many actual first-hand cases do you know of someone losing their job simply because they didn't have a degree, or refused a work permit when they used to have one? And how many who had work permits, etc., have left anyway?

[mikeinminburi]

structure of thai society

thais' way of life

thai politics and government

environment

thai local wisdom

in a nut shell....

my answers will be....

structure of thai society --> ITS F**KED UP

thais' way of life --> completly arrogant and pointless

thai politics and government --> do you remember taxin?

environment --> well lets see... bangkok is sinking.... pollution kills thousands a year....

thai local wisdom--> no such thing.

sorry to be rude about it, but if they expect us to take an exam on this, then i really will laugh

[Loaded]

structure of thai society

thais' way of life

thai politics and government

environment

thai local wisdom

in a nut shell....

my answers will be....

structure of thai society --> ITS F**KED UP

thais' way of life --> completly arrogant and pointless

thai politics and government --> do you remember taxin?

environment --> well lets see... bangkok is sinking.... pollution kills thousands a year....

thai local wisdom--> no such thing.

sorry to be rude about it, but if they expect us to take an exam on this, then i really will laugh

My answers:

Thailand is beautiful

Thais are wonderful

I love the King

I love shopping malls

Mai pen rai

[rods]

I think we need to have a serious and detailed discussion about the new teacher's requirements and regulations that may or may not be in place now. On some other websites, bits and pieces of the rules have already been posted. Does anyone have the whole slew of them, and could you please link to them or post them here?

I will "control" posts that take us unduly in the direction of "do you have to have a degree to bake a cake?" but it isn't my desire to stifle debate. Any information that is genuinely helpful in interpreting details of the new policy is welcome.

"Steven"

May I just add that if anyone thinks the MoE would do anything that made sense then they obviously either haven't been in Thailand very long, or really don't have the intellect to be a teacher! (or much else). I'm not trying to insult anyone here, just want to save people who are looking for explanations a bit of time - because they won't find any!

Despite 9 years' experience in Thai classrooms, my lack of a degree in Zulu needlepoint apparently makes me unfit to teach here. So yes, I am bitter!!!!

Edited December 21, 2006 by rods

[PeaceBlondie]

Despite 9 years' experience in Thai classrooms, my lack of a degree in Zulu needlepoint apparently makes me unfit to teach here. So yes, I am bitter!!!!

Quote of the week!

But in keeping with the request by Ijustwannateach that we keep this discussion serious, perhaps that would be a degree in EDUCATION of Zulu needlepoint. "....then you speak slowly in Bantu language to Xishosha and Buglada, knit one, loop over the green bead, knit one.."

[AlmightyGumbo]

Hello

from reding some of this thread it does seem a little confusing or i could be having a dopy moment

i'm looking into the idea of teaching in thai world, ideally bangkok and what i gathered from reading some of the stuff in these threads you have to take some test which does'nt seem that hard btu i'm sure there was something somewhere else saying that you need to be a quaified teacher in the uk first.

i've got a degree, hav'nt done any teaching but have done trainning as part of my jobs so far. i believe i could get one of these tefl things if i put my mind to it so my question is, well questions

what exact qualifications do i need? (is what i have enough)

and is is best to get the teaching qualifications in thailand or england?

any help will be gladly recieved

thanks all

[Casanundra]

Hello

from reding some of this thread it does seem a little confusing or i could be having a dopy moment

i'm looking into the idea of teaching in thai world, ideally bangkok and what i gathered from reading some of the stuff in these threads you have to take some test which does'nt seem that hard btu i'm sure there was something somewhere else saying that you need to be a quaified teacher in the uk first.

i've got a degree, hav'nt done any teaching but have done trainning as part of my jobs so far. i believe i could get one of these tefl things if i put my mind to it so my question is, well questions

what exact qualifications do i need? (is what i have enough)

and is is best to get the teaching qualifications in thailand or england?

any help will be gladly recieved

thanks all

What you have is enough and doing a TEFL would be best for you **IF** you are happy to be here earning circa 30 to 35k working at a government type school with Admin who give you the run-a-round and with many kids simply not interested due to HUGE class sizes which are inapprorpiate to teaching ESL.

However, if you want the chance of working in an international school earning decent a decent salary then if you can, I suggest you sit it out and go and get a BEd or an MEd first and give yourself some wider options for your Thailand future.

OR you can pitch yourself at the University market instead where life is a whole lot more interesting.

[rods]

Despite 9 years' experience in Thai classrooms, my lack of a degree in Zulu needlepoint apparently makes me unfit to teach here. So yes, I am bitter!!!!

Quote of the week!

But in keeping with the request by Ijustwannateach that we keep this discussion serious, perhaps that would be a degree in EDUCATION of Zulu needlepoint. "....then you speak slowly in Bantu language to Xishosha and Buglada, knit one, loop over the green bead, knit one.."

Thanks, PeaceB. I'm glad somebody appreciates me!!!!!

[AlmightyGumbo]

Thanks for the advice casa

what do you mean about pitching to the university market?

also is it best to study for the tfel in england or possibly in thailand?

ta in advance again

[Uli]

IIS is the international program of Ramkhamhaeng University, located on the main campus in Huamark, Bangkapi. We are currently putting the elements for a Graduate Diploma in Teaching Profession together and ask for support of those to who it's offered. The program starts from November this year. Please find the details at (deleted).

The Graduate Diploma is a 24 semester-credit program for holders of any recognized Bachelor degree. Graduates are eligible to receive the Licence for Practicing Teaching at Thai Schools.

Due to IIS' modular system, the program can be studied full-time four months (four class days per week, 9 am to 4 pm) or part-time 8 months (Saturday and Sunday). Another idea is a sandwich model with 4 courses in March and April, followed by two evening classes per week and the rest in October. In all cases, tuition fee is about 52,000 Baht and includes the full program, all textbooks and handouts.

Which program (or all three) in fact will be offered in November depends much on the number of students registering for it (it needs at least 20 students).

To make it simpler and to come closer to our target group, I would like to ask you to take part in the integrated poll - if you are a potential candidate for this Graduate Diploma, wich schedule would you prefer?

Many thanks for your cooperation! For any questions, suggestions, or critics, please e-mail me!

Best regards,

Ulrich Werner

Edited August 4, 2007 by PeaceBlondie
Title and subtitle modified to reflect they are only claims. URL deleted.

[richard10365]

If any BA degree qualifies a person to take this course then it is nothing more than a TEFL program with a different name.

Why would anyone with a BA and TEFL waste their time and money with another course thats not required by the Thai government to teach.

Most regular teachers in Thailand with BA degrees and TEFL already have a teaching license.

[Uli]

If any BA degree qualifies a person to take this course then it is nothing more than a TEFL program with a different name.

Why would anyone with a BA and TEFL waste their time and money with another course thats not required by the Thai government to teach.

Most regular teachers in Thailand with BA degrees and TEFL already have a teaching license.

Hi!

Law changes, and according to the publications from MOE, Teacher Council of Thailand, and others, these regular teachers will learn about the changes when trying to renew their teacher licence.

I don't put any information on the IIS Web site that is not proven. I guess, the sheer existence of the program announced would be quite astonishing if nobody will need it.

Best regards,

Uli

[PeaceBlondie]

The standard for TEFL courses is 120 classroom hours, which can be covered in four weeks. Back home, that might have been 6 to 9 semester hours' credit. This is 24 semester hours' credit. This is a Graduate Diploma. Hopefully, it is far more than a mere TEFL course, most of which don't actually require a BA.

Congratulations to Ramkhamhaeng for offering a graduate program like this.

[griser]

Am I mistaken or is Ramkhamhaeng trying to use scare tactics to get people to take this course?

First they start a teaching sweatshop like the Nonthaburi project and now this!

Its amazing what lengths this uni will go through to aquire more money.

The day that the MoE requires a 20+ semester post grad course to teach in thailand is the day that most foreign teachers will leave thailand!

It is simple math! why should a person take the same length courses required for a teaching license in our home countries to make 40k dollars a year to come to Thailand and make 15k dollars a year?

Again if i've mis-interpreted what he said I apologize but it sure does look like that to me!

Greg

[garro]

This sounds like a very interesting course.

[richard10365]

With most paychecks for teaching being what they are in Thailand it will be difficult for many to afford the course. Is there any financial aid avaliable to help foreign teachers pay for this course?

After someone finishes the course, will the school help place them in teaching positions where they can earn a salery commensurate with their newly aquired skill?

[anthonyaus]

This would be more for Uni and other tertiary instructors in my opinion although it is somehat transferrable to other fields of study.

This would be a teaching qualification and evidence of formal training of pedagogy in my opinion either beyond or covering something different then TEFL. If someone did have it and another did not the person who had it might get the interview.

I'll bet its a tough sell though. Its more like icing on the cake.

[Ijustwannateach]

With all due respect to Ramkhamhaeng University -

The Thai government- to my knowledge- has not yet released a clear schedule of requirements for foreign teachers in Thailand. That is, the requirements are vague, self-contradictory, and from what can be determined, unreasonable (I *still* don't see why I need to know the names of parts of Thai musical instruments in Thai). If those former self-contradictory requirements are not what is currently required- and no one really knows if they are or not- then no one knows what is required, because no further subsequent announcements have been made or details released. Presumably the Ministry of Education still outranks Ramkhamhaeng University in determining what the requirements for teachers are, even if it has never and will never clearly share them with us.

Perhaps some Immigration officials or even Labour officials or even Education officials have actually been working with Ramkhamhaeng on this new program. However, without an announcement from the central government to give an official direction to foreign teachers seeking to somehow become legal, I rather suspect the future of this program at Ramkhamhaeng- after all, perhaps some of the officials were not involved, or will not be receiving kickbacks; or perhaps they don't really regard Ramkhamhaeng's ability to grant a postgrad degree to permit eligibility for application for a license from one of the three involved ministries to supercede their right to make arbitrary and nonsensical edicts. Remember, these "pseudo-courses" have been available at various locations for several years now, and precious few foreigners have either benefited from taking them or been penalised for not having them (as far as I know).

If the various Ministries involved would be so kind as to make their intentions and requirements a bit clearer, and to indicate specifically that the Ramkhamhaeng course would totally, finally, absolutely, and completely clear foreigners who took it now and forever through all paperwork hurdles at the Ministry of Education, then I will happily stand first in line to participate. But please forgive me if, having seen the way these things go before, I can regard it at this moment as nothing more than a probable money-spinner for the university and perhaps, the Ministry of Education- and most likely a big waste of time for anyone with at least one college degree....

But best of luck, let us know how things go, and all that.

"Steven"

[mopenyang]

Sounds like an interesting program that will benefit many teachers and prepare them as professionals. Thailand needs more courses like this and I suspect you will be seeing more become available as time goes on.

Finally, I seriously doubt that RU would be going down this path were not the handwriting on the wall when it comes to tightening up of teacher qualifications here.

Does this mean it will happen over a 24 hour period? No.

Does this mean it has not been happening or will not continue to happen? No.

[richard10365]

I think Thailand would have to raise the pay and entitlements for it's foreign staff before teachers would consider paying for a course like this. The raise would have to be similiar to other countries such as Japan or Korea.

If Thailand is really serious about increasing the quality of it's teachers, they should offer a course like this for free. Teachers could take it during the summer vacation here in Thailand.

The writing may be on the wall but there is a little footnote next to it that says it's only wishful thinking. Thailand can't afford to pay a salary that will attract quality teachers.

When I say quality, I'm not saying the teachers here are not excellent teachers. I am implying that Thailand cannot afford to pay for teachers possessing the education credentials that they would like in all their schools across Thailand.

At present, they can only afford a salary that attracts a large quantity teachers with various BA degrees from auto mechanics to underwater basket weaving.

In the end, chances are only a small group of foreign teachers across Thailand will take this course. It kinda reminds me of the Thailand Elite Card. It's not for everyone.