U.S. stationing tanks and artillery in classified Norwegian caves

[Johpa]

Name one country that the US has taken over and annexed as its own. Russia has taken many.

Countries that within my lifetime the US has either invaded or taken over by putting into place a government friendly and beholden to the US interests include but not limited to Iran, Vietnam, Grenada, Chile, Iraq, Ukraine, and possible even Thailand. Of course having no contiguous boundaries it is much more difficult to annex a country but the US does have "territories" such as Puerto Rico and Guam.

Name one US citizen that the US has assassinated which opposes a sitting president. Russia has killed many.

I made no such claim. But I might argue that dark forces within the US government have assassinated some, including a sitting US president, who opposed the interests of the military-industrial complex. And no, I don't wear a tinfoil hat.

Name one country that Russia has freed.

Actually modern Russia has freed many of the former Soviet Socialist Republics since the demise of the USSR, e.g. Kazakhstan. Putin argues that they saved Russians from Ukrainian extremists. Again, I am not arguing that Putin is an angel. On the contrary I find him a very disagreeable person who reminds me of all the kids in school I use to "hate" before I matured enough to just ignore such folks. But he is acting in his own self-interest the same way that American leaders act in their own self-interest. And I don't want to have to go to war over such a-holes having a pissing contest. It is madness!

I wont respond anymore

So go fish.

[Publicus]

 

 

Nato is a defensive formal treaty organisation founded in 1949 to deter Stalin invading Europe while it was recovering from World War II. That is what it continued to do during the Cold War, to include missiles in Nato member country Turkey.

Nato hasn't invaded anyone at anytime anywhere, not for any reason besides. Nato isn't going to invade Russia for any reason. The Putin fanboyz need to get a grip.

There was no coup d'etat in Ukraine but there were little green Russian men/soldiers in eastern Ukraine. The vote in Crimea was without voter rolls of registered voters and held at polling stations where armed Russian soldiers were all over the place.

Putin wants the Baltics so Nato forces have been positioned there to immediately expel any new little green Russian men right back across the border and with dispatch, which is the only thing restraining Putin the mad Russian and Chekist supreme.

Russia's action in Ukraine is the first time since World War II that a leader has tried by force to change national borders in Europe-Eurasia. Norway wants the forward positioned Nato forces on its soil and so does all of Nato.

Get over it cause the Putin fanboyz and the USA haters are just going to have to live with it. It is fact. It is done. The armaments are there and there they will stay. For whatever period of time as necessary.

Is there any evidence that Putin wants Baltics? besides US and Baltics propaganda machines?

What does Baltics have that Russia needs? Salmon?

What Russian actions in Ukraine? The counter action to stop US from meddling on Russian borders?

Russia has not posed any threat to any neighbors in Europe, nor has Russia issued any ultimatums to anyone in Europe.

Little war mongering on US part, do not you think?

It bears reiteration the Putin fanboyz need to get a grip.

In particular, the stuff about having a point of view toward Russia and that the Chekist Putin is the result of propaganda is but a crutch for which the fanboyz have a desperate need.

Regardless, here is from the Baltic media in the Baltics...

"In an editorial, the Baltic Times urged the Atlantic Alliance to 'step up and offer Ukraine accelerated NATO membership,' which it said the Ukrainian prime minister had already requested in private meetings with NATO officials. 'Ukraine is a worthy and willing candidate for NATO,' the paper said. 'The NATO community needs to stand and rectify the wrongs of Yalta and Bucharest'.

"The latter reference is to the 2008 NATO summit in the Romanian capital in which France and Germany blocked an attempt by the Bush administration to offer fast-track membership to Georgia and Ukraine because of Putins objections. 'Ask the Poles, the Czechs, the Hungarians, the Baltic nations, and other East European recently admitted NATO members,' the editorial continued. 'Theyre willing to defend Ukraine if only to experience freedom from fear themselves;.

http://www.worldaffairsjournal.org/blog/roland-flamini/putins-landgrab-alarms-baltics

Putin is Russian irredentist. Putin is Soviet Union revanchist. Most descriptively, Putin is czarist-chekist. No Putin fanboy has addresed the three traits and characteristics; ideology. Not in any thread and not ever at this board. They can't.

I see many words and useless and baseless rhetoric but is there any real evidence?

Salmon surely is not cheap but hardly a reason to want Baltic states.

Let's see if you can do better

Another re-iteration:

Putin is Russian irredentist.

Putin is Soviet Union revanchist.

Putin is czarist-chekist.

No Putin fanboy has ever addressed this at a thread or at this board. It is because they cannot do it.

Cannot.

Nato nations know all of this and address it directly, Norway being one among 'em.

[PattayaAl]

Another re-iteration:

Putin is Russian irredentist.

Putin is Soviet Union revanchist.

Putin is czarist-chekist.

No Putin fanboy has ever addressed this at a thread or at this board. It is because they cannot do it.

Cannot.

Nato nations know all of this and address it directly, Norway being one among 'em.

Ok, nice to know what you think about Putin only this was not the question.

So do you have any evidence other than what you think ?

And yes you right , NATO never invaded any nation. Afghanistan invited NATO to destroy itself and Lybia wished to be bombed and Syria was begging for civil war. Should i go on ? Or you get the drift ?

Edited February 20, 2016 by PattayaAl

[Publicus]

The view of Putin as irredentist, revanchist, czarist-chekist is common and widespread. It is Nato's view besides.

So Norway and Nato know exactly the situation, circumstances, realities. Nato is a shared community participating in its common self-defense. Against Putin and Putin's Russia.

As noted...

"[F]rom a Russian irredentist perspective, Transnistria provides another example of 'Russian-speaking' territories being assigned to non-Russian union republics within the Soviet Union.

"That irredentist perspective is now Putins: 'The Russian people became [in 1991] one of the biggest, if not the biggest, divided nation in the world,' he declared in the March 18, 2015 speech. The view of Russia as a divided nation entitled to territorial acquisitions for its reunification was, until quite recently, the view of Russias nationalist circles, operating mostly outside the government, and often in opposition to it. Putin has now turned it into the Kremlins official view."

http://www.jamestown.org/regions/centralasia/single/?tx_ttnews[tt_news]=42144&tx_ttnews[backPid]=53&cHash=377ed0c543440239db55d887478f2c53

"Russia is a specific kind of actor: a revanchist state.

"By 'revanchist' I mean a state that experiences a rapid rise in power after a period of hefty decline. Putin knows that Russia faces a long slide in the future. It is caught in a pincer between a rising China and the transatlantic West, and will be a junior partner if it chooses either side. If Putin is indeed at the helm of a revanchist state, then half-measures may only embolden him."

http://www.lowyinterpreter.org/post/2014/03/19/russia-crimea-putin-revanchism.aspx

"The resurgence of a revanchist Russia poses new security challenges for the United States and its European partners, said Air Force General Philip Breedlove, commander of the U.S. European Command.

"ntent on regaining territory it lost when the Soviet Union broke up, Russia has engaged in hybrid warfare to illegally seize Crimea, Breedlove said. Russias actions have brought about a volatile and fragile situation in eastern Ukraine. These actions foment separatist fever in several sovereign nations and maintain frozen conflicts within its so-called sphere of influence'."

https://share.america.gov/revanchist-russia-is-growing-threat/

Putin the Chekist: a sacred calling

Putin the Chekist: a sacred calling

"From under the rubble of the dislocation, hardship, humiliation for some and liberation for others, of the collapse of the Soviet Union, there rose to power a group of intelligence officers, mainly from two of Russias various agencies: the KGB and the GRU, or military intelligence.

"Working from the Kremlin, a mediaeval fortress, Putin and this group have built a system thats an amalgam of the tsarist and Soviet institutions that made Russia a great empire. Its key features include: rule by a single individual; informal hierarchies of power but with no institutional division of powers; a powerful secret police accountable only to the ruler; and the concept that the people exists to serve the state, rather than the other way round."

http://www.aspistrategist.org.au/putin-the-chekist-a-sacred-calling/

Putin is irredentist.

Putin is revanchist.

Putin is czarist-chekist.

No Putin fanboy has addressed the issues. This is because they cannot.

Cannot.

[mopar71]

It strikes me as unnecessarily provocative. I have no idea what the purpose of storing equipment in Norway would be though it does not appear to fit any NATO/Russia conflict scenarios that I can imagine. This will be used by Putin to stir up Russian paranoia and justify an even more aggressive stance versus NATO .... all for something that is of dubious strategic value. This feels like something driven by the US military.

Russia made the move first a year ago...

Russian ships in old Arctic NATO base set alarms bells ringing

April 3, 2015

Oslo (AFP) - Russian ships docked at what was once a secret Norwegian naval base in the Arctic have prompted concern from the NATO country's former top military leaders, anxious about its resurgent eastern neighbour roaming nearby.

http://news.yahoo.com/russian-ships-old-arctic-nato-set-alarms-bells-050008186.html

[craigt3365]

The Baltics were taken over by Russia. Oppression of the local population was horrendous. Memories are still strong from that time in this region:

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Occupation_of_the_Baltic_states

This didn't help reduce fears:

http://www.dailymail.co.uk/news/article-3139933/Russia-rehearsed-invasion-SCANDINAVIA-carried-prevent-NATO-reinforcing-Baltic-states-claims-security-report.html

Tens of thousands of soldiers rehearsed a military takeover of Swedish and Norwegian territory near the Baltic Sea in March, security expert Edward Lucas said in a report for the US-based Center for European Policy Analysis (CEPA).

The exercise also simulated the invasion of other areas including the Danish island of Bornholm, Finland's Swedish-speaking Åland islands, and northern Norway, according to the report, The Coming Storm.

Unsubstantiated, but reported on from Germany:

http://www.telegraph.co.uk/news/worldnews/europe/russia/11106195/Putin-privately-threatened-to-invade-Poland-Romania-and-the-Baltic-states.html

But in the end, it's highly unlikely Russia would invade the Baltics. Sadly, like the article says, stranger things have happened. So it's not probable, but it is entirely possible.

https://www.washingtonpost.com/news/monkey-cage/wp/2015/11/12/6-reasons-not-to-worry-about-russia-invading-the-baltics/

And of course without freedom of the press, Russia media sites are free to spew whatever propaganda they desire. Doesn't help matters either:

http://www.bbc.com/news/world-europe-31759558

But the Baltic nations say they are already under attack from Russia by non-conventional means, such as cyber warfare and Russian propaganda, mainly on TV channels watched by the sizeable Russian-speaking minority in Latvia and Estonia.

[mopar71]

Ah, the neocons in the American government, you know, the folks who brought us the various wars and invasions in the Middle East, keep marching forward in their bizarre amalgam of "onward Christian soldier" and American exceptionalism. And all this despite that Russia is no longer a communist country advocating an opposing ideology. One must stop and ask why the US government has so demonized Russia. One must stop and ask who is profiting from this madness. And it is just madness.

Why has the US government demonized Russia? You must either be a Kremlin troll or have been brainwashed by them.

Edited February 20, 2016 by mopar71

[mopar71]

Nato is a defensive formal treaty organisation founded in 1949 to deter Stalin invading Europe while it was recovering from World War II. That is what it continued to do during the Cold War, to include missiles in Nato member country Turkey.

Nato hasn't invaded anyone at anytime anywhere, not for any reason besides. Nato isn't going to invade Russia for any reason. The Putin fanboyz need to get a grip.

There was no coup d'etat in Ukraine but there were little green Russian men/soldiers in eastern Ukraine. The vote in Crimea was without voter rolls of registered voters and held at polling stations where armed Russian soldiers were all over the place.

Putin wants the Baltics so Nato forces have been positioned there to immediately expel any new little green Russian men right back across the border and with dispatch, which is the only thing restraining Putin the mad Russian and Chekist supreme.

Russia's action in Ukraine is the first time since World War II that a leader has tried by force to change national borders in Europe-Eurasia. Norway wants the forward positioned Nato forces on its soil and so does all of Nato.

Get over it cause the Putin fanboyz and the USA haters are just going to have to live with it. It is fact. It is done. The armaments are there and there they will stay. For whatever period of time as necessary.

Is there any evidence that Putin wants Baltics? besides US and Baltics propaganda machines?

What does Baltics have that Russia needs? Salmon?

What Russian actions in Ukraine? The counter action to stop US from meddling on Russian borders?

Russia has not posed any threat to any neighbors in Europe, nor has Russia issued any ultimatums to anyone in Europe.

Little war mongering on US part, do not you think?

Russia would love to be connected to Kaliningrad and needs Baltic territory to accomplish.

Russian politicians have made numerous threats against European countries...including nuclear.

The only war-mongering going on is by Putin, who manufactured the crisis in Ukraine's Crimea and Donbas as a way of distracting Muscovites from the lesson of Ukraine's Maidan The lesson that the people can rise up and kick out their corrupt, mafia-like kleptocrat president.

Putin will not leave power quietly and he will not be removed by foreign forces. He will be dragged across Red Square by his own people and executed, Ceausescu-style.

[Publicus]

Putin fanboyz cannot respond to Putin's irredentism, his revanchism, his czarist-chekist bent along with his supporters in his dictatorship in the Kremlin.

Cannot.

Putin is stuck between a bigger and more powerful CCP China and the trans-Atlantic West. Whichever side he aligns with he and Russia are the junior underling. Very junior.

Russia's dayze of empire are ended. Soviet Russia was in fact the last empire of history. However, the czarist-chekist Putin and his czarist-chekist boyz in his government cannot accept the fact. Cannot. So Putin and his Chekist pals keep going for these sugar highs, such as Crimea, Ukraine, Syria etc.

Born losers lurching from one sugar high to the next one.

[Pakboong]

The Russian position on the use of nuclear weapons.

27. The Russian Federation reserves the right to use nuclear weapons in response to the use against her and (or) her allies of nuclear and other weapons of mass destruction, as well as in the case of aggression against the Russian Federation with the use of conventional weapons in a way which would threaten her very existence as a state. The decision to use nuclear weapons is taken by the President of the Russian Federation.

[derator01]

Please, links to credible news sources only. Apologies to the member with the appropriate reply.

[Publicus]

The Russian position on the use of nuclear weapons.

27. The Russian Federation reserves the right to use nuclear weapons in response to the use against her and (or) her allies of nuclear and other weapons of mass destruction, as well as in the case of aggression against the Russian Federation with the use of conventional weapons in a way which would threaten her very existence as a state. The decision to use nuclear weapons is taken by the President of the Russian Federation.

Talk of nuclear weapons in the present environment originates in Moscow where the czarist-chekists are in charge and have been in charge since Yeltsin left and Putin the Chekist and his czarist-chekist comrades took control of the government while extorting the well heeled corporate mafia that owns the economy.

Russia is headed toward bankruptcy as soon as 2017 same as the Soviet Union had experienced and for the same reasons, i.e., due to massive unaffordable military expenditures and adventures. Nato nations' sanctions are designed to promote the bankruptcy. (CCP Boyz in Beijing are getting the same treatment but without economic sanctions as CCP Boyz in Beijing are certain corporate America has decided to also take down the fast crumbling CCP economy.)

Yes, it is up to the President of the Russian Federation to determine their own fate one way or the other. Putin knows Nato is a defensive formal treaty organisation whose entire focus is defending Europe against Russia. This has been true since Soviet Russia, in 1949 when Nato was founded. Putin is stuck between a stronger CCP China and the trans-Atlantic West which leaves him as the minor player whichever side he chooses. Putin looks smaller every day.

CCP btw just grabbed back a dozen miles of the 120 million square miles of Russia CCP claims as its own due to history --CCP written history in the CCP China. Russians are all over the Internet hollering at Putin for "allowing it." Putin is getting squeezed on both sides. Which is because everyone sees his and Russia's widespread and manifest weaknesses. Moscow talking nuclear weapons confirms how the czarist-chekist Putin and his crew of same are on the ropes.

[Sattphalat]

I wold like to make a reply, but my English is so bad.

It is nothing new about US storing warfarematerial in Norway. As earlier stated this has going on from ww2. And is no big deal.

I think Norway has quite good relationship with Russia. Espessely in the north were we cooperate about the natural rescorces. Like fish And oil. A few years back Putin and the former prime minister settled a old border dispute over a glas of Vodka. Drawing the new border in the sea on a napkin. Russia have never occupied parts of Norway. They liberated the northern part at the end of ww2, and vent immediately back home.

Norway as a small country on the border to Russia and are depending on powerful friends like US and NATO for safety . And there are exercises in winterwarfare by US, British , French and so on every winter close to the Russian border. Not to opset the Russians , but for showoff power from NATO. With Russian observers.

I think that the Baltic situation is a little bit more complex. And in the backyard of the old Russian empire.