kennw Posted February 21, 2016 Share Posted February 21, 2016 It seems to me there is a principle involved here, the FBI wants to see what is on the phone of a mass killer. Should Apple put their commercial interests ahead of assisting in the fight against terrorism. Surely in a single case they can in-house access the data under court order and then destroy the means to do so. Or is Apple afraid that it cant control security within it's own organization. If so its only a matter of time that a rogue will work a way and then sell it to whoever. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Credo Posted February 21, 2016 Share Posted February 21, 2016 If the gov't can unlock the phone or access the data the process can't be an easy one. If Apple does it, it will no doubt involve a significant number of people and probably several different departments within Apple and may even require some outside resources. Does anyone think that all those people are going to keep this a secret? This is a clear case of the gov't being willing to sacrifice everyone's right to privacy for their own benefit. Even some of us liberal leaning folks can see this is one slippery slope we best not go down. There is much more to be lost than there is to be gained. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
JHolmesJr Posted February 21, 2016 Share Posted February 21, 2016 Despite the best security, Oscar screeners leak out ever year like clockwork….same will happen if this phone is cracked. Waiting for the 'told you so' video from ed snowden. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Andaman Al Posted February 21, 2016 Share Posted February 21, 2016 1) The software require has never been written. 2) Once it is written, it is sure to be 'copied' 3) Once 'copied' it will find it's way into the hands of all the "wrong" people! {That is assuming there are any 'right' people!] 4] The demands for Apple to repeat the task again, again, and again, will never end... End the end, they only person who wins would be all the people who should not be winning! Apple would be the ONLY ones with possession of the software. So who would "copy" it. What the FBI is wanting is basically a reversal of an operating system update that only allowed 10 entries on the password then they can use their own existing tech to force the security code. Apple are trying to imply that it is a great back door that will instantly unlock your phone. Which from what I have read is bullshit! "Which from what I have read is bullshit!" It only sounds to you as Bovine excrement because you don't understand a basic fact once infinite attempts are allowed, a simple algorithm would allow infinite password generation to be tried until the correct one is generated. How long do you think it would take a super computer to do that? A laptop will do it, no need for a super computer to hack an iphone. I know a system that can generate 60 000 passwords per second, so I am quite sure the National Security organizations in the worlds most powerful country have something more than slightly superior. So an iphone with 9999 combinations is going to take around 0.15 seconds once they remove the '10 strikes and the phone commits suicide' function. I do not understand how it has gone so openly public, there are smart people around that could hack in I am sure, why start a fight with a huge multi-national unless they really do want a more 'permanent access arrangement' , I don't get it. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
sirineou Posted February 21, 2016 Share Posted February 21, 2016 1) The software require has never been written. 2) Once it is written, it is sure to be 'copied' 3) Once 'copied' it will find it's way into the hands of all the "wrong" people! {That is assuming there are any 'right' people!] 4] The demands for Apple to repeat the task again, again, and again, will never end... End the end, they only person who wins would be all the people who should not be winning! Apple would be the ONLY ones with possession of the software. So who would "copy" it. What the FBI is wanting is basically a reversal of an operating system update that only allowed 10 entries on the password then they can use their own existing tech to force the security code. Apple are trying to imply that it is a great back door that will instantly unlock your phone. Which from what I have read is bullshit! "Which from what I have read is bullshit!" It only sounds to you as Bovine excrement because you don't understand a basic fact once infinite attempts are allowed, a simple algorithm would allow infinite password generation to be tried until the correct one is generated. How long do you think it would take a super computer to do that? A laptop will do it, no need for a super computer to hack an iphone. I know a system that can generate 60 000 passwords per second, so I am quite sure the National Security organizations in the worlds most powerful country have something more than slightly superior. So an iphone with 9999 combinations is going to take around 0.15 seconds once they remove the '10 strikes and the phone commits suicide' function. I do not understand how it has gone so openly public, there are smart people around that could hack in I am sure, why start a fight with a huge multi-national unless they really do want a more 'permanent access arrangement' , I don't get it. Any one that believes this is for one phone and one time is simply naive. once a precedent is set and a sours is available , no ones Iphone would be safe. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ThaiWest Posted February 21, 2016 Share Posted February 21, 2016 It is amazing to me that anyone might think that the US government would not demand a copy of the software should Apple go to the expense of writing it... This is not only an issue regarding the one case of this one investagation. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ThaiWest Posted February 21, 2016 Share Posted February 21, 2016 I encourage readers to check out: "Apple's encryption battle with the FBI has implications well past the iPhone" at http://www.theguardian.com/technology/2016/feb/19/apple-fbi-privacy-encryption-fight-san-bernardino-shooting-syed-farook-iphone Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
kamahele Posted February 21, 2016 Share Posted February 21, 2016 Yes, Apple has a better PR firm than does the Justice Dept. I believe the government has not asked Apple to assist with the encryption but only to unlock the phone without deleting the information stored on the phone. The phone belonged to terrorists that killed 14 people and injured more than 20. I understand the paranoia regarding privacy as Americans have given up so much of their right to privacy since 9-11 but certainly the Govt and Apple can strike a one time only deal which will help us to find out if others were involved in the killings . Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
sirineou Posted February 21, 2016 Share Posted February 21, 2016 Yes, Apple has a better PR firm than does the Justice Dept. I believe the government has not asked Apple to assist with the encryption but only to unlock the phone without deleting the information stored on the phone. The phone belonged to terrorists that killed 14 people and injured more than 20. I understand the paranoia regarding privacy as Americans have given up so much of their right to privacy since 9-11 but certainly the Govt and Apple can strike a one time only deal which will help us to find out if others were involved in the killings . " I believe the government has not asked Apple to assist with the encryption but only to unlock the phone without deleting the information stored on the phone." And then they will forget the capability exists and will never ask again Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ThaiWest Posted February 22, 2016 Share Posted February 22, 2016 Yes, Apple has a better PR firm than does the Justice Dept. I believe the government has not asked Apple to assist with the encryption but only to unlock the phone without deleting the information stored on the phone. The phone belonged to terrorists that killed 14 people and injured more than 20. I understand the paranoia regarding privacy as Americans have given up so much of their right to privacy since 9-11 but certainly the Govt and Apple can strike a one time only deal which will help us to find out if others were involved in the killings ." I believe the government has not asked Apple to assist with the encryption but only to unlock the phone without deleting the information stored on the phone."And then they will forget the capability exists and will never ask again In fact, what the FBI has asked Apple to do is two things:1) write an iOS for the iPhone that will not erase it after a given number of wrong attempts at the password 2) remove the delays between new password attempt that grow between each wrong attempt What the FBI has not asked Apple to do is extract any data from the iPhone. Nor to unlock the iPhone. What the US Department of Justice is asking for is that all makers of encrypted devices and software provide them with a "backdoor" to either the device or the software. And there have been attempts to pass laws to force this on companies and software developers, which has failed thus far. It needs to be perfectly clear here, the is no "American paranoia" regarding the loss of our privacy and constitutional rights. There cannot be a "paranoia" when the loss is real and in present danger as evidenced by partial losses already! Most of all, before passing judgment, a person ought to get the real facts straight. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
casualbiker Posted February 22, 2016 Share Posted February 22, 2016 Yes, Apple has a better PR firm than does the Justice Dept. I believe the government has not asked Apple to assist with the encryption but only to unlock the phone without deleting the information stored on the phone. The phone belonged to terrorists that killed 14 people and injured more than 20. I understand the paranoia regarding privacy as Americans have given up so much of their right to privacy since 9-11 but certainly the Govt and Apple can strike a one time only deal which will help us to find out if others were involved in the killings ." I believe the government has not asked Apple to assist with the encryption but only to unlock the phone without deleting the information stored on the phone."And then they will forget the capability exists and will never ask again of course they won't but like everything else they will require a court order.. No different than if they had to search your property or unlock your safe.. It's that simple! Americans are extremely paranoid! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
casualbiker Posted February 22, 2016 Share Posted February 22, 2016 Yes, Apple has a better PR firm than does the Justice Dept. I believe the government has not asked Apple to assist with the encryption but only to unlock the phone without deleting the information stored on the phone. The phone belonged to terrorists that killed 14 people and injured more than 20. I understand the paranoia regarding privacy as Americans have given up so much of their right to privacy since 9-11 but certainly the Govt and Apple can strike a one time only deal which will help us to find out if others were involved in the killings ." I believe the government has not asked Apple to assist with the encryption but only to unlock the phone without deleting the information stored on the phone."And then they will forget the capability exists and will never ask again In fact, what the FBI has asked Apple to do is two things:1) write an iOS for the iPhone that will not erase it after a given number of wrong attempts at the password 2) remove the delays between new password attempt that grow between each wrong attempt What the FBI has not asked Apple to do is extract any data from the iPhone. Nor to unlock the iPhone. What the US Department of Justice is asking for is that all makers of encrypted devices and software provide them with a "backdoor" to either the device or the software. And there have been attempts to pass laws to force this on companies and software developers, which has failed thus far. It needs to be perfectly clear here, the is no "American paranoia" regarding the loss of our privacy and constitutional rights. There cannot be a "paranoia" when the loss is real and in present danger as evidenced by partial losses already! Most of all, before passing judgment, a person ought to get the real facts straight. And the court order also allows Apple to give a counter offer! They can insist that it is done in-house! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
fredlaw Posted February 22, 2016 Share Posted February 22, 2016 I agree with privacy, however with what the FBI is asking I believe Apple should give it to them or take the phone, do it and give it back. I say this as there are 18 minutes missing from when they shot up MY DAUGHTERS building and the time they were killed. That 18 min might give enough information so another parent doesn't have to go through what my daughter have gone through for the past nearly 3 months and will be going through the rest of our lives. Hiding under desk is something that never goes away. A little privacy lost is better than what we are going through or having others being killed. Islamic terrorist should never have an advantage over freedom. Those protesting should ask the families about their feeling or have their families be held as we were. If you have nothing to hide you will have nothing to worry about. Just sayen Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Pinot Posted February 22, 2016 Share Posted February 22, 2016 Yesterday it was the Pope, today it's iPhones. Trump knows how to pick em, huh? The guy's brilliant. There is no subject Trump can't be on the wrong side of. Brilliant! What a strategy. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Credo Posted February 22, 2016 Share Posted February 22, 2016 Apple is not being asked to do something that they can do. They are being asked to develop a technology. I hope they don't as it jeopardizes all of us. The gov't already has wide ranging powers to invade the privacy of those on a watch list. The fact that they didn't get them on a list is sad, but I don't think everyone, everywhere should pay for this by knowing our privacy can be invaded. If Apple unlocks it and find nothing, then it's one of those situations like the WMD in Iraq. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
impulse Posted February 22, 2016 Share Posted February 22, 2016 I agree with privacy, however with what the FBI is asking I believe Apple should give it to them or take the phone, do it and give it back. I say this as there are 18 minutes missing from when they shot up MY DAUGHTERS building and the time they were killed. That 18 min might give enough information so another parent doesn't have to go through what my daughter have gone through for the past nearly 3 months and will be going through the rest of our lives. Hiding under desk is something that never goes away. A little privacy lost is better than what we are going through or having others being killed. Islamic terrorist should never have an advantage over freedom. Those protesting should ask the families about their feeling or have their families be held as we were. If you have nothing to hide you will have nothing to worry about. Just sayen You'd compromise the privacy rights of 350,000,000 people on the outside chance that they'll find something that points to someone besides the actual perpetrators? That's not to mention the privacy of the billions of others who don't live in the USA, whose privacy will be eroded if the back door hits the market. Those who would give up essential Liberty, to purchase a little temporary Safety, deserve neither Liberty nor Safety. Ben Franklin Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Credo Posted February 22, 2016 Share Posted February 22, 2016 The technology will jeopardize a lot more than just the users in the USA. There are a lot of i-Phones world wide. The Thai gov't I am sure would love to get its hands on this, not to mention the Chinese. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
helpisgood Posted February 22, 2016 Share Posted February 22, 2016 I encourage readers to check out: "Apple's encryption battle with the FBI has implications well past the iPhone" at http://www.theguardian.com/technology/2016/feb/19/apple-fbi-privacy-encryption-fight-san-bernardino-shooting-syed-farook-iphone Thanks! Interesting article. One link from this article is a letter from Apple's CEO, Tim Cook, to his customers regarding this matter: http://www.apple.com/customer-letter/ I think the following article, also linked from the original article, was even more informative: http://www.theguardian.com/technology/2016/feb/17/inside-the-fbis-encryption-battle-with-apple This could very well end up with an important precedent being handed down concerning searches involving cybersecurity. It'd be interesting to see how well each side can explain in educated layman's terms to a court how the relevant technology best supports its claims. And, of course, will this case make it to current US Supreme Court with its eight members? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ThaiWest Posted February 23, 2016 Share Posted February 23, 2016 (edited) Any one not willing to take my word... Okay, maybe the word of a former NSA Director will carry more weight: From: http://www.macobserver.com/tmo/article/former-director-of-cia-and-nsa-says-fbi-is-wrong-about-apples-encryption General Michael Hayden, former director of both the CIA (2006 to 2009) and the NSA (1999 to 2005) says FBI Director James Comey is wrong about encryption, and that America and the American people will be "more secure" with unbreakable, end-to-end encryption. Edited February 23, 2016 by ThaiWest Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ThaiWest Posted February 23, 2016 Share Posted February 23, 2016 Con't... General Michael Hayden, former director of both the CIA (2006 to 2009) and the NSA (1999 to 2005) General Hayden made the comments in an interview with The Wall Street Journal, some of which was posted to YouTube. "I think Jim Comey's wrong," General Hayden said. "Jim's belief is based on the belief that he remains the main body, and that you should accommodate your movements to the movements of him, which is the main body. I'm telling you, with regards to the cyber domain, he's not. You are." YouTube link: Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
casualbiker Posted February 23, 2016 Share Posted February 23, 2016 Apple is not being asked to do something that they can do. They are being asked to develop a technology. I hope they don't as it jeopardizes all of us. The gov't already has wide ranging powers to invade the privacy of those on a watch list. The fact that they didn't get them on a list is sad, but I don't think everyone, everywhere should pay for this by knowing our privacy can be invaded. If Apple unlocks it and find nothing, then it's one of those situations like the WMD in Iraq. Do you HONESTLY believe that the guys that built the encryption don't know how to remove it? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
.png.3b3332cc2256ad0edbc2fe9404feeef0.png)
.thumb.png.76be522b3b43e7458166b9dac9e422ed.png)
Recommended Posts
Create an account or sign in to comment
You need to be a member in order to leave a comment
Create an account
Sign up for a new account in our community. It's easy!
Register a new accountSign in
Already have an account? Sign in here.
Sign In Now