Turkey is sending Syrian refugees back to war zone claims Amnesty

[wabothai]

-snip-

I hope you realize there have to be some kind of rules for things and you cannot just allow any number of people into your country, when there is no stop to the supply. It's not going to help anyone.

Take a look here how I see things: https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=LPjzfGChGlE

Let's post that YouTube vid and hope that people watch it.

Governments seem not to be willing with: "let us help them there". That is where the problem lies, they, individuals in governments, are not willing to stick their necks out, their lives are safe and too comfortable.

[geriatrickid]

So far as I'm aware members do not support illegal immigration or 'throwing out the rule books' for migrants. However, your response is the usual drivel from neo-Nazi supporters.

Whoa . Easy there Mr. political correctness. The Turks have denied the allegations. AI hasn't substantiated their allegations have they? You should be more respectful of your Turkish friends and be willing to accept their statements. After all you willingly embraced their statements in respect to the flotilla that was sent to breach the security zone off of Gaza. Did you forget that you supported the Turkish statements at the time? Now all of a sudden, the Turks are horrible liars.

Goodness me. Can you try for some consistency please.

Personally,m I don't care. The migrants had a safe place in Turkey, but chose to move on. The rules and agreements on refugees were violated. If these migrants were truly concerned about safety they would have remained in Turkey. Instead they wanted greater benefits and headed west. They didn't go to other arab countries like Tunisia, Algeria or Morocco, did they? Why's that? They didn't fleet to Iran or Pakistan or Russia or China did they? Why's that?

[geriatrickid]

Where do you think that the money comes from that allows the UNHCR to operate ?

It comes from Governments, via the taxpayer. The biggest contributors are Western Governments. This does not include the money that Western Governments give to other Countries in direct aid.

We can agree to disagree, but as a UK taxpayer, I find it somewhat annoying that the UK Government is coerced into handing out £ Billions annually in aid that does very little to help and assist those in most need, whilst it has to borrow £ Billions on a monthly basis just to keep the lights on in the UK.

If the UNHCR has such a serious funding shortfall, I am pretty certain that there is whole Brigade of shiny bums on over inflated salaries that can be shown the door.

Or ask the Chinese, Pakistanis, Iranians, Cubans, Bolivians and Russians to pay their dues.

China is one of the cheapest when it comes to foreign aid.

[Foexie]

i don't wanna sound harsh but they should have stopped this emigration already a long time ago.

I don't find it normal that from the refugees 80% or more are man and the rest are children and women. It has to be the other way around.

Many inhere over 40 had at least one grandfather who was involved in WW1 or WW2. They didn't run away. They faught for their country and families.

And if a new war would start here we have no choice then to fight again. Or can we run and hide in the east and ask them to fight for us?!

What is the use of an refugee engineer or a doctor in Europe when their country needs to be build up?

I was a little shocked to read last week that they wanna build up Palmyra in 6 months and that then Russia offered/said they will build up Palmyra again.

Those peoples there all are cripples now? Can not pick up a stone or a hammer ??? Or maybe they are all in Europe now demanding their own house, car, and money?!

And why Palmyra? For the tourists who will come to spend all their money to help the peoples there?

Maybe, just maybe it is a little more important to have water wells, hospitals, homes, schools, ...

Why European countries together with the USA and Russia need to fight their battle alone?

Those many of thousands of men hanging around here could make a very big difference in their war.

Give the women and children a safe habour with food, education and all they need. Give the men battle training to fight against their enemies.

I saw the video too and he is so right. If they all leave their country, most of the money will stay here. Never reaches the eldery couple who stayed behind in Palmyra because it is still their home. Never reaches the wifes and children left behind, somewhere, without food or water.

And then their is still the issue of those countries you never hear from. Not any word or responce from other islamic countries. Some of them are the weathiest from the world. Ever seen one soldier from them in Syria or Iraque lately? Or heared they send in a plane with food and meds?

They spend more money to keep this war going then to make it stop. Keeping their boarders closed and turn their heads the other way.

One thing is very sure: this is not going away easy and fast!

[SgtRock]

Nice try to implement a bubble gum theory which covers most extreme right rhetoric. Should make it all perhaps more intellectually 'consumable'...

I find it absolutely telling that you managed to identify extreme right rhetoric in this video.

It was a fairly simple explanation, with props, of the problems that the worlds growing population poses and that immigration is going to do nothing to solve it.

[Scott]

Neversure, it's an interesting video, but I can't quite agree with all of it.

Countries take people because those that they take (immigrants) provide something that is needed by the country.

-snip-

And just what would it be that the receiving country needs that wouldn't be needed even more by the abandoned countries? Are you talking about skill sets or education or something else they can contribute? Like IT people or doctors from India which is an impoverished country?

India needs the skills of its IT people and its doctors a lot more than the West does. Those people should stay and help their own country grow.

I see few immigrants who aren't actually economic opportunists in the mix going into Europe.

Did you watch the video?

Cheers.

We are beginning to stray off the topic, but being a little selfish, I will have to say that between having professionals stay in a 3rd world country or coming to my country to help, I'll go with allowing them in. Some countries, notably the Philippines, exist on exporting labor, including highly educated people. I believe the UK's NHS is one. I worked with a nurse who was a teacher in Thailand, but eventually went to Ireland to practice nursing. Her income was sufficient enough to ensure her 8 younger siblings will all graduate from University. Something that would not have happened had she remained in the Philippines.

The biggest one that jumps to mind is in the area of research. Many of the developing countries simply cannot or will not provide the research facilities for some of the world's best and brightest minds to conduct cutting edge research.

Even in the area of IT, do you want the people living and earning a small salary in their own country or should they be allowed to immigrate to the country's that need them. It is the business sector that keeps asking for more work visas in this area.

Immigration is not designed to help the country of origin. It is designed to help the host country.

With regard to this topic, a lot of people have made the assumption that all the people heading to Europe are doing so for the freebies. There is no doubt that this is a big pull factor, but I worked with refugees in Turkey and the Turkish gov't was very clear that many of the people in the country at that time, would be resettled or they would be repatriated. All of those people were genuine, screened political refugees and return would have meant death for some and prison for most.

North Koreans heading through China and Laos and into Thailand have no desire to settle in Thailand. It is there hope to get to the S. Korean embassy where they have a chance of being resettled. God knows how many have been returned.

The uncertainty in Turkey will do nothing to stem the flow of people trying to reach Europe.

[simple1]

So far as I'm aware members do not support illegal immigration or 'throwing out the rule books' for migrants. However, your response is the usual drivel from neo-Nazi supporters.

Whoa . Easy there Mr. political correctness. The Turks have denied the allegations. <snip>

If you view objecting to supporting Turkey's (OK possible) breach of international law regards non-refoulement as PC, so be it. As to the rest of your post I've ignored the blah, blah.

[NeverSure]

And just what would it be that the receiving country needs that wouldn't be needed even more by the abandoned countries? Are you talking about skill sets or education or something else they can contribute? Like IT people or doctors from India which is an impoverished country?

India needs the skills of its IT people and its doctors a lot more than the West does. Those people should stay and help their own country grow.

I see few immigrants who aren't actually economic opportunists in the mix going into Europe.

Did you watch the video?

Cheers.

We are beginning to stray off the topic, but being a little selfish, I will have to say that between having professionals stay in a 3rd world country or coming to my country to help, I'll go with allowing them in. Some countries, notably the Philippines, exist on exporting labor, including highly educated people. I believe the UK's NHS is one. I worked with a nurse who was a teacher in Thailand, but eventually went to Ireland to practice nursing. Her income was sufficient enough to ensure her 8 younger siblings will all graduate from University. Something that would not have happened had she remained in the Philippines.

The biggest one that jumps to mind is in the area of research. Many of the developing countries simply cannot or will not provide the research facilities for some of the world's best and brightest minds to conduct cutting edge research.

Even in the area of IT, do you want the people living and earning a small salary in their own country or should they be allowed to immigrate to the country's that need them. It is the business sector that keeps asking for more work visas in this area.

Immigration is not designed to help the country of origin. It is designed to help the host country.

With regard to this topic, a lot of people have made the assumption that all the people heading to Europe are doing so for the freebies. There is no doubt that this is a big pull factor, but I worked with refugees in Turkey and the Turkish gov't was very clear that many of the people in the country at that time, would be resettled or they would be repatriated. All of those people were genuine, screened political refugees and return would have meant death for some and prison for most.

North Koreans heading through China and Laos and into Thailand have no desire to settle in Thailand. It is there hope to get to the S. Korean embassy where they have a chance of being resettled. God knows how many have been returned.

The uncertainty in Turkey will do nothing to stem the flow of people trying to reach Europe.

It seems to me that you are talking about the top echelon of immigrants. That's not what I see on the news when I see hordes of young men migrating into W. Europe countries. I don't see refugees, I see economic opportunists and I don't think they are astrophysicists.

These people are going to out breed and overwhelm the hosts and they will not assimilate. Their religion won't allow it. Islam is a political system as much as a religion and they want their own laws and their own culture. They will divide and then they will conquer Europe. When that happens Europe will be another shit hole like most of the ME because the invaders are mental barbarians, choosing to live in the 15th century.

Cheers.

[NeverSure]

-snip- However, your response is the usual drivel from neo-Nazi supporters.

It's so nice that you finally learned the term "neo-Nazi". How would you possible make a post without that term?

You don't like neo-Nazi's but you do like the coming genocide of Western Europeans. Nice.

[boomerangutang]

As much as anything else, the human crisis in the dune countries stems from runaway overpopulation. By any yardstick, it just can't keep happening, and only bad things will ensue as long as humans in that region breed like rabbits. There are ways to lessen the trend, but all of them are unpopular, particularly with religionists who are told to "multiply and conquer the world." The average Palestinian woman popped out 9 babies each a few decades ago. Perhaps the number is a bit lower now, but it's insanity personified. The carrying capacity of the entire M.East is about 3% of its current population.

[Scott]

And just what would it be that the receiving country needs that wouldn't be needed even more by the abandoned countries? Are you talking about skill sets or education or something else they can contribute? Like IT people or doctors from India which is an impoverished country?

India needs the skills of its IT people and its doctors a lot more than the West does. Those people should stay and help their own country grow.

I see few immigrants who aren't actually economic opportunists in the mix going into Europe.

Did you watch the video?

Cheers.

We are beginning to stray off the topic, but being a little selfish, I will have to say that between having professionals stay in a 3rd world country or coming to my country to help, I'll go with allowing them in. Some countries, notably the Philippines, exist on exporting labor, including highly educated people. I believe the UK's NHS is one. I worked with a nurse who was a teacher in Thailand, but eventually went to Ireland to practice nursing. Her income was sufficient enough to ensure her 8 younger siblings will all graduate from University. Something that would not have happened had she remained in the Philippines.

The biggest one that jumps to mind is in the area of research. Many of the developing countries simply cannot or will not provide the research facilities for some of the world's best and brightest minds to conduct cutting edge research.

Even in the area of IT, do you want the people living and earning a small salary in their own country or should they be allowed to immigrate to the country's that need them. It is the business sector that keeps asking for more work visas in this area.

Immigration is not designed to help the country of origin. It is designed to help the host country.

With regard to this topic, a lot of people have made the assumption that all the people heading to Europe are doing so for the freebies. There is no doubt that this is a big pull factor, but I worked with refugees in Turkey and the Turkish gov't was very clear that many of the people in the country at that time, would be resettled or they would be repatriated. All of those people were genuine, screened political refugees and return would have meant death for some and prison for most.

North Koreans heading through China and Laos and into Thailand have no desire to settle in Thailand. It is there hope to get to the S. Korean embassy where they have a chance of being resettled. God knows how many have been returned.

The uncertainty in Turkey will do nothing to stem the flow of people trying to reach Europe.

It seems to me that you are talking about the top echelon of immigrants. That's not what I see on the news when I see hordes of young men migrating into W. Europe countries. I don't see refugees, I see economic opportunists and I don't think they are astrophysicists.

These people are going to out breed and overwhelm the hosts and they will not assimilate. Their religion won't allow it. Islam is a political system as much as a religion and they want their own laws and their own culture. They will divide and then they will conquer Europe. When that happens Europe will be another shit hole like most of the ME because the invaders are mental barbarians, choosing to live in the 15th century.

Cheers.

I think perhaps we are splitting hairs and probably numbers on the actual topic of legal immigrants, but that would be a worthy topic for another discussion.

Europe is most certainly in a difficult situation. There also doesn't seem to be much agreement on who should do what and there is little unity or direction.

The situation in Turkey, and the idea of returning people to an active war zone is not a feasible solution. If they don't feel safe in Turkey, it is likely they are going to head to Europe.

Turkey is receiving a fair amount of money and a lot of political concessions. They need to live up to their obligations.

[boomerangutang]

-snip-

I hope you realize there have to be some kind of rules for things and you cannot just allow any number of people into your country, when there is no stop to the supply. It's not going to help anyone.

Take a look here how I see things: https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=LPjzfGChGlE

Let's post that YouTube vid and hope that people watch it.

I found that a most interesting video and I realise that I had no idea of the size of the problem until now. Thank you.

The gumball analogy is ok, and entertaining, but it doesn't mention or address the most important issue: overpopulation.

Similarly, no politician today (that I'm aware of) is seriously addressing the issue. It would be as though we lived in a village in a valley. Further up the valley there's a large dam holding back an immense amount of muddy water. The villagers are concerned about the dam and its cracks. But they're not talking about how it could collapse and wash away the village. Instead, they're talking about plastering the cracks and painting murals on the dam wall.

[Saradoc1972]

I found that a most interesting video and I realise that I had no idea of the size of the problem until now. Thank you.

The gumball analogy is ok, and entertaining, but it doesn't mention or address the most important issue: overpopulation.

Similarly, no politician today (that I'm aware of) is seriously addressing the issue. It would be as though we lived in a village in a valley. Further up the valley there's a large dam holding back an immense amount of muddy water. The villagers are concerned about the dam and its cracks. But they're not talking about how it could collapse and wash away the village. Instead, they're talking about plastering the cracks and painting murals on the dam wall.

But it is about overpopulation. Both those incredible stacks of gumballs representing the impoverished population of the planet and the spillage at the end are about overpopulation, aside from the main topic how immigration could help here.

Overpopulation is the reason why those 5.2 billion people are living in that abject poverty and have to live on a small bowl of rice with some okra pods a day because they have some five children (which were supposed to provide for them in their old age, lacking any social system) but only have so much land to grow food on. And the land to farm on is getting smaller with pollution, desertification and raising sea levels. So surprisingly, they draw the conclusion they need to make it to the land of affluence, by hook or by crook. Or a civil war, plus or minus Islam, breaks out over those scarce resources, same result.

The Syrians themselves, which are fleeing a real war, are only half of the people banging on Europe's door. The rest was already on their way over from Africa for above reason or have seen the Syrians being welcomed heartily in September, thanks to Angie, and decided then that if those Syrian could make it to the promised land, so could they. And believed the lies of smugglers they'd even be welcomed and wined and dined on, facilitated by those pictures of welcome-clappers.

Overpopulation has been on the agenda of first world countries since at least the seventies, just they did little to really tackle it or where not effective on doing so. Lots of lamentation about contraceptives and the Catholic Church and fair trade, to no avail. Back then world population was around 5.5 billion, Africa had a third of the population of today. 40 years, population grows by a factor of 3. You do see where this is leading, bringing us back to the topic?

The only thing Merkel got right so far is that what we are experiencing now is just a taste of what's going to come over the next decades. It will be tens of millions of people on the move to Europe, trying to storm borders by force if necessary. If we can't even proceed those people in Turkey and Greece, or already in the main EU in an orderly fashion, because we are allowing ourselves to be overrun, how is that going to work out?

[ChimeIn]

Turkey is the last country to blame here, they are already hosting 3m refugees, more than their fair share. SJWS at amnesty international need to get in touch with reality, Turkey does not have deep pockets like the gulf states, its a developing country.

[Johnpound46]

Neversure, it's an interesting video, but I can't quite agree with all of it.

Countries take people because those that they take (immigrants) provide something that is needed by the country.

-snip-

And just what would it be that the receiving country needs that wouldn't be needed even more by the abandoned countries? Are you talking about skill sets or education or something else they can contribute? Like IT people or doctors from India which is an impoverished country?

India needs the skills of its IT people and its doctors a lot more than the West does. Those people should stay and help their own country grow.

I see few immigrants who aren't actually economic opportunists in the mix going into Europe.

Did you watch the video?

Cheers.

"Those people should stay and help their own country grow." So all those immigrants that came to the USA (your beloved home country, I gather) over the last 200 years to make a better life for themselves were just economic opportunists, didn't contribute a whole lot and should have stayed in their own country and help it grow? If you were poor and were given the choice to make 500 dollars a month in your own country, or the chance of making 5000 dollars a month somewhere else, you would take the high road and stay, is that what you're trying to say?

[Saradoc1972]

If you can be bothered do some some research into the years of policy complacency, underlined by insufficient funding and resources, by Western governments and in source countries the endemic corruption that has led to the current emergency.

Insufficient funding and resources by Western Governments ? That is a joke, right ? The amount of taxpayers money poured into these banana republics great democracies is nothing short of criminal. And all for what. To fill the pockets of corrupt wonderful dictators leaving scraps for those that actually deserve aid.

I agree with your comment on endemic corruption, However, as an example of funding shortfall for UNHCR and others, together with the outcomes, have a read of the content at the URL below.

http://www.theguardian.com/world/2015/sep/06/refugee-crisis-un-agencies-broke-failing

You both got it right, you are just talking about two different things.

The one thing is development aid which in too many cases goes to nothing. Or, rather, some sort of ruling clan and its cronies. Which is why all the talk about removing causes for economic migration is mostly, not exclusively, wishful thinking. Would otherwise be a good thing, money spent on schools and everything is likely to pay off in every respect. And even if that is that any refugee actually making it and will more likely than not be staying in a western host country has at least some education to build on.

The other thing is providing adequate funding for existing refugee camps, i.e. in Lebanon or Jordan. I really wonder what Europe has been doing over the last 5 years just watching the situation in those camps get worse and worse, to the point there is no food there. Including Germany and saintly Merkel. If she is so fond of helping people and being celebrated for it the world over, what was she doing back then, when she was already chancellor in the same grand coalition government? So Germany will now be spending an estimated 12 billion Euro on "integrating" refugees (it should rather be called: housing, feeding, treating them medically, and processing them legally, hoping they behave and somehow learn German, which is all this out of hand situation is allowing us to do for the time being) this year alone, if it even stays at that figure, when that money is half the UN humanitarian budget. Could have done great things with that then and there, things are a tad more costly in Germany than in Turkey or Jordan.

And shelling out that money for the camps around Syria is a prerequisite for getting things under control. Against certain death of hunger, running a risk of drowning or even being shot at some border, if it comes to that, is a clear choice. And the money for Turkey is the right thing, they have been shouldering a lot of the burden, in all fairness. Which brings us back to corruption as German and EU politicians have publicly mused they don't trust Erdowahn and his clique with it.

[Saradoc1972]

"Those people should stay and help their own country grow." So all those immigrants that came to the USA (your beloved home country, I gather) over the last 200 years to make a better life for themselves were just economic opportunists, didn't contribute a whole lot and should have stayed in their own country and help it grow? If you were poor and were given the choice to make 500 dollars a month in your own country, or the chance of making 5000 dollars a month somewhere else, you would take the high road and stay, is that what you're trying to say?

A lot of third-world countries actually ban their academics from leaving, a bit like the eastern-bloc countries in cold.war times. These people are their countries' gold, they churn out precious few students capable of pursuing an academic career and can't afford to let too many of them study, especially on grants. It's a fair deal, as in: we let you study and you will have a relatively good life, but you can't just take that and go away, you are needed here.

That is the main caveat nobody wanted to see when Merkel went on a rampage 6 months ago. She and her cronies (mostly from the more leftist parties, her own party was mostly shocked) even tried winning everybody over arguing Germany would solve its demographic problem with those people and hugely profit because Syrians were so educated people, mostly doctors and rocket-scientists. Or at least they sounded like that, and right-wing blogs were full of sarcasm about it, and got duly denounced as racist and what not. And it was a flagrant lie, sounded too god to be true anyway, but at the time the papers were cautiously letting on half of what was coming in had some three years of schooling, the rest was only marginally better, and it would take some 5-7 years on average until they might find a job, it didn't actually matter because at that point everybody was either too enraptured to take note or railing against the whole business anyway. Well, OK, the Syrians are doing better than most Africans. Big whoop.

And if Syria were to get on its feet again, they would need their engineers, doctors, and even the craftsmen back to rebuild things, wouldn't they? Well, I agree, if I were a Syrian academic with at least the prospect of finding a job in Germany or where-ever I would not want back there, unless I was feeling patriotic or had other more important ties. Unless, of course, there were policies in force saying, sorry, can't do, ulterior goods at stake here. Such as stability in the region or nobody wanting to go back because there is nothing to go to, including doctors, buildings and electricity.

Btw the German Foreign Office is posting adds and billboards in Afghanistan pleading for people to stay there to build up the country, so is the Afghan government.

[simple1]

-snip- However, your response is the usual drivel from neo-Nazi supporters.

It's so nice that you finally learned the term "neo-Nazi". How would you possible make a post without that term?

You don't like neo-Nazi's but you do like the coming genocide of Western Europeans. Nice.

Europeans are well aware of neo-Nazis in their midst for years past. I'm sure you're are equally aware of their existence in your society for years and well as the legal presence of the Nazi Party in the US.

Don't know about you personally, but what's up with you guys, why post support for neo-Nazism & then deny you do so? Many 'like' Jaidam's & other similar posts so I assume they have read very clearly communicated support for neo-Nazism and in one post actually proposed EU would be better off if the Nazis of WW11 were in power today.

As for your last sentence, I repeat I believe you enjoy being a troll on subjects related to the EU. I have on a few occasions posted I am of the opinion Merkel made a significant political error with 'inviting' refugees and I'm in alignment with Scott's views on this issue.

Earlier last year Merkel announced about 40% of refugees reaching Germany were from Balkan countries, vetted as economic and refused asylum. Later in 2015, estimates vary between 40 - 70%, of refugees applying for asylum were or will be refused asylum. The great challenge for EU countries is to co-ordinate policy, further secure external facing borders, progress is being made, Put in-place government to government agreements so those rejected can be sent back to their home countries. Some agreements have now been ratified, obviously the challenge is to detain and deport. At the same time, as an example, Iran currently refuses to accept economic refugees return. All of above as well as sufficiently support the millions of refugees in the host countries, including education facilities for the millions of refugee children.

You and others from the right seem to consider yourselves as subject matter experts on migration / refugee matters, but come across as ill-informed; only really interested in promoting right wing, sometimes extreme, political views.

Edited April 3, 2016 by simple1

[DM07]

I see: the "humane"- elite of TV is on it already, advocating war-crimes for the sake of their own well-being!

What war crimes ?

Try understanding what a war crime is.

Well...sending refugees back where they came from - in this case a war- torn country- pretty much covers it for me, thank you very much!

Try to understand "empathy", will you?!

[NeverSure]

"Those people should stay and help their own country grow." So all those immigrants that came to the USA (your beloved home country, I gather) over the last 200 years to make a better life for themselves were just economic opportunists, didn't contribute a whole lot and should have stayed in their own country and help it grow? If you were poor and were given the choice to make 500 dollars a month in your own country, or the chance of making 5000 dollars a month somewhere else, you would take the high road and stay, is that what you're trying to say?

The people you discuss came to an undeveloped land and had to carve it out for themselves. There was no existing infrastructure a certainly no "benefits" as it was fend or starve. There was lots of land and each had to get busy and hunt, fish, grow, etc.

This is a far cry from the economic opportunists who are rocking up to what someone already developed and saying "gimme".

Cheers.

[SgtRock]

I see: the "humane"- elite of TV is on it already, advocating war-crimes for the sake of their own well-being!

What war crimes ?

Try understanding what a war crime is.

Well...sending refugees back where they came from - in this case a war- torn country- pretty much covers it for me, thank you very much!

Try to understand "empathy", will you?!

Fantastic understanding of a war crime. A 10 year old could probably come up with a better definition.

Empathy ?

Yes, I have plenty of empathy and sympathy for genuine refugees who are currently holed up in various refugee camps. Empathy and sympathy are in short supply for those that flout the law by paying people traffickers to get them to a destination of their choice.

It may also help you if you try and understand why such a large % are being refused asylum / refugee status, before assaulting your keyboard.

[geriatrickid]

Why is Turkey blasted, but Iran which forcibly blocked refugees given a free pass? Jordan has suffered terribly by the presence of the Syrians. There is ongoing civil strive between the Palestinian Arabs who exploit and abuse the Syrians, but again, not much coverage of the issue. The Russians have attacked and bombed non combatants and not one word of protest from the TVF extreme left wing, blame the west contingent

The takeaway message is that anything associated with the west is bad and the western social assistance policies are not good enough, while everything from the Persian, and Arab world is ok.

[SgtRock]

Why is Turkey blasted, but Iran which forcibly blocked refugees given a free pass? Jordan has suffered terribly by the presence of the Syrians. There is ongoing civil strive between the Palestinian Arabs who exploit and abuse the Syrians, but again, not much coverage of the issue. The Russians have attacked and bombed non combatants and not one word of protest from the TVF extreme left wing, blame the west contingent

The takeaway message is that anything associated with the west is bad and the western social assistance policies are not good enough, while everything from the Persian, and Arab world is ok.

Cannot criticise the brotherhood

[Saradoc1972]

I see: the "humane"- elite of TV is on it already, advocating war-crimes for the sake of their own well-being!

What war crimes ?

Try understanding what a war crime is.

Well...sending refugees back where they came from - in this case a war- torn country- pretty much covers it for me, thank you very much!

Try to understand "empathy", will you?!

So far nobody on this thread has condoned Turkey sending people back to Syria, allegedly that is, or even commented on that being allowable.

Which is the only war-torn country around, large parts of it anyway, Turkey is not if you stay clear of the Kurdish areas. Everything discussed so far was if that should be an obstacle to setting that return-and-exchange mechanism agreed to with Turkey in motion and the merits of doing so to get the situation under control.

The whole issue is a last-ditch attempt of those bleeding-heart do-gooders mentioned in the OP anyway, to force anyone else to do what they pretend to think is the right thing, to inflate their own importance and keep busy.

It would be incredibly be stupid of Turkey to do what these are implying might be happening because it would obviously wreck the whole deal, and Turkey wants that deal. Would be quite a distance to Syria, too, and why the heck have they taken in between 2 and 3 million refugees (the term applies here) in the first place when they would kick just those people in question out?

Sad to see you don't even want to inform yourself what the buzz-word you so desperately want to use is. But there is always empathy. It's what I am hearing from my two favourite German parties, Greens and The Left, all the time when establishing moral air-superiority without any constructive or workable contributions. In long, whining wails.

[i claudius]

Neversure, it's an interesting video, but I can't quite agree with all of it.

Countries take people because those that they take (immigrants) provide something that is needed by the country.

-snip-

And just what would it be that the receiving country needs that wouldn't be needed even more by the abandoned countries? Are you talking about skill sets or education or something else they can contribute? Like IT people or doctors from India which is an impoverished country?

India needs the skills of its IT people and its doctors a lot more than the West does. Those people should stay and help their own country grow.

I see few immigrants who aren't actually economic opportunists in the mix going into Europe.

Did you watch the video?

Cheers.

"Those people should stay and help their own country grow." So all those immigrants that came to the USA (your beloved home country, I gather) over the last 200 years to make a better life for themselves were just economic opportunists, didn't contribute a whole lot and should have stayed in their own country and help it grow? If you were poor and were given the choice to make 500 dollars a month in your own country, or the chance of making 5000 dollars a month somewhere else, you would take the high road and stay, is that what you're trying to say?

Yes and help it grow they did , but now that it has grown and become a superpower ,are the doors still wide open for the poor of the world to come and share in what they did not build? of course not , so your post is at the best irrelevant and silly .

[NeverSure]

Angela Merkel describes multiculturalism as 'a living lie' as she promises to 'significantly reduce' the number of migrants entering Germany

Angela Merkel yesterday described the concept of multiculturalism as 'living a lie' and finally admitted it was time to end the relentless flow of refugees into Europe.

The German Chancellor confessed her country would be ‘overwhelmed’ unless she took action as the number of asylum-seekers arriving there this year topped one million.

Since she dramatically opened Germany’s doors to refugees in August, the continent has been besieged with hundreds of thousands of people wanting to get there.

But ahead of an EU summit on Thursday, she restated her long-term opposition to multi-culturalism, saying: ‘Multi-kulti leads to parallel societies and is a living lie. Integration is the opposite.’

http://www.dailymail.co.uk/news/article-3359331/Angela-Merkel-promises-significantly-reduce-number-migrants-entering-Germany-response-growing-resentment-asylum-policies.html

[NeverSure]

Why is Turkey blasted, but Iran which forcibly blocked refugees given a free pass? Jordan has suffered terribly by the presence of the Syrians. There is ongoing civil strive between the Palestinian Arabs who exploit and abuse the Syrians, but again, not much coverage of the issue. The Russians have attacked and bombed non combatants and not one word of protest from the TVF extreme left wing, blame the west contingent

The takeaway message is that anything associated with the west is bad and the western social assistance policies are not good enough, while everything from the Persian, and Arab world is ok.

The takeaway message is that anything associated with the west civilized West is bad and the western social assistance policies are not good enough, while everything from the Persian, and Arab world barbaric Muslims is ok.

[DM07]

I see: the "humane"- elite of TV is on it already, advocating war-crimes for the sake of their own well-being!

What war crimes ?

Try understanding what a war crime is.

Well...sending refugees back where they came from - in this case a war- torn country- pretty much covers it for me, thank you very much!

Try to understand "empathy", will you?!

Fantastic understanding of a war crime. A 10 year old could probably come up with a better definition.

Empathy ?

Yes, I have plenty of empathy and sympathy for genuine refugees who are currently holed up in various refugee camps. Empathy and sympathy are in short supply for those that flout the law by paying people traffickers to get them to a destination of their choice.

It may also help you if you try and understand why such a large % are being refused asylum / refugee status, before assaulting your keyboard.

You mean a 10 year old, who takes a dictionary and cites the exact text, written down?

Like you? (Not implying you are a 10 year old, but you obviously have a very narrow definition!)

[Saradoc1972]

Fantastic understanding of a war crime. A 10 year old could probably come up with a better definition.

You mean a 10 year old, who takes a dictionary and cites the exact text, written down?

Like you?

(Not implying you are a 10 year old, but you obviously have a very narrow definition!)

That would really depend on your 10-year-old.

There are bright, gifted children who could read an abstract text and subsume a given real-world situation under the provisions in that text correctly. Then there are reasonably talented 10-year-olds able and willing to read said text and cite it. And, of course, there will always be "special needs" cases that would just go "War crime! War crime!" if you were to ask them to do that, which you don't want to do because it would just be an embarrassment for everyone involved.

It's all really dependent on your 10-year-old.

[simple1]

I see: the "humane"- elite of TV is on it already, advocating war-crimes for the sake of their own well-being!

What war crimes ?

Try understanding what a war crime is.

Well...sending refugees back where they came from - in this case a war- torn country- pretty much covers it for me, thank you very much!

Try to understand "empathy", will you?!

So far nobody on this thread has condoned Turkey sending people back to Syria, allegedly that is, or even commented on that being allowable.

<snip>

The whole issue is a last-ditch attempt of those bleeding-heart do-gooders mentioned in the OP anyway, to force anyone else to do what they pretend to think is the right thing, to inflate their own importance and keep busy.

It would be incredibly be stupid of Turkey to do what these are implying might be happening because it would obviously wreck the whole deal, and Turkey wants that deal. Would be quite a distance to Syria, too, and why the heck have they taken in between 2 and 3 million refugees (the term applies here) in the first place when they would kick just those people in question out?

<snip>

From your post...

So far nobody on this thread has condoned Turkey sending people back to Syria.

A paraphrase from the first member response to the OP "send them back", the rest of the posts from certain members are in similar political vein.

To belittle the likes of AI & UNHCR suggests to me you're unfamiliar with what they have achieved with disaster areas / conflict zones / political oppression etc etc. Turkey only very recently permitted, at least Syrians, to work to try and support themselves. UNHCR had reported many Syrians who until then were supporting themselves from their saving for food, rent etc (most are not in UNHCR camps) were running out of funds, plus add the fact Turkey did not / does not currently have the legal framework in place to process refugees - all adds to the reasons some started heading to the EU.

Members / media who have hands on experience in the M.E. often call out the duplicitous nature of the dictatorships / governments, god only knows the true game being played by Turkey. One thing I'm reasonably certain of & I'm sure the Turkish government, Turkey won't acheive EU membership anytime soon.

You raise an excellent question as to why Turkey has permitted the huge numbers of refugees on it's territory, the same must be asked of Jordan, Lebanon, Iran and Pakistan and so on. What's your opinion?

Edited April 4, 2016 by simple1