Laos position about child born out of wedlock to foreigner....

[4evermaat]

I have an associate from the USA who was a bit nervous about going to Laos because he has a son that was born in Thailand from a Laos ex-girlfriend. So the child is not Thai citizen, but he said that he never got a Laos birth certificate (report of birth abroad or whatever they call it) either, largely on the advice of his Laos gf. He ended up getting US citizenship at the USA embassy in bangkok. But I still had a few questions:

- Is the child entitled to Laos citizenship?

- What steps would he or the baby's mother have to take to secure Laos citizenship?

- Is there any negative feelings from Laos gov't towards Laos mixing with western (or any foreigners), particularly US Nationals?

Any related info would be helpful.

Edited April 10, 2016 by 4evermaat

[tomwct]

US Citizenship is enough. No need Laos Citizenship!

[Paul944]

Depends where the boy lives. If he lives in Laos a lao id would be handy for him.

[4evermaat]

Depends where the boy lives. If he lives in Laos a lao id would be handy for him.

He stays in thailand now. Part of the issue was getting the kid into Laos and his entitlement to a Laos ID/citizenship. Would the mother do it alone? Can the foreign father assist? what would actually have to be done?

[laolover88]

If born in Thailand must have/be entitled to Thai Birth Certificate.

Father's name must be on certificate

On that basis you get certification of nationality from US embassy

If child is now living in Thailand...On what basis, with whom.

Lao Citizenship:
BY DESCENT: Child born of a Laotian mother or father, regardless of the child's country of birth.

[hgma]

www.vientianetimes.la

open the constitution (n top line)......Lao Law on Nationality

Lao nationals are NOT allowed dual nationality article 3 one Nationality only.

Parents of Children born out of wedlock could be subject to harsh penalties and even imprisonment unless the couple weds after a reasonable time of courtship/engagement ceremony!!

Your child carries the US nationality and the mother is ex,

why mention? Nobody knows....keep it that way.

source: LLC (Lao Law Consultancy) Vientiane in a written statement to me when i hired them to seek loopholes in the Law.

There wern't any to proceed.

Take Care

HGMA

[brewsterbudgen]

I have a son, Lao mother, born and living in Thailand. He has a UK passport, but his Lao documentation doesn't show me as the father and uses his mother's last name. There's really no requirement for him to get a Lao passport as young children (he's only 1) can come and go between Laos and Thailand, by land, without a passport. I have no wish to draw attention to him being born out of wedlock to a foreign father while in Laos.

Edited April 19, 2016 by brewsterbudgen

[Smokin Joe]

Here is the link to the page with the Lao laws (In English). Nationality is #7

http://www.vientianetimes.org.la/Lao_Eng_laws.htm

[4evermaat]

www.vientianetimes.la

open the constitution (n top line)......Lao Law on Nationality

Lao nationals are NOT allowed dual nationality article 3 one Nationality only.

Parents of Children born out of wedlock could be subject to harsh penalties and even imprisonment unless the couple weds after a reasonable time of courtship/engagement ceremony!!

Your child carries the US nationality and the mother is ex,

why mention? Nobody knows....keep it that way.

source: LLC (Lao Law Consultancy) Vientiane in a written statement to me when i hired them to seek loopholes in the Law.

There wern't any to proceed.

Take Care

HGMA

Here is the link to the page with the Lao laws (In English). Nationality is #7

http://www.vientianetimes.org.la/Lao_Eng_laws.htm

All the links on http://www.vientianetimes.la/Lao_Eng_laws.htm seem to be broken. I keep getting 404 error messages. If someone could attach the relevant pdfs here, that would be great.

I am aware of Laos not officially recognizing dual citizenship. But how would they know if the kid has more than 1 citizenship? I would presume you would first secure the Laos nationality paperwork first, then seek additional nationalities if you qualify?

I have a son, Lao mother, born and living in Thailand. He has a UK passport, but his Lao documentation doesn't show me as the father and uses his mother's last name. There's really no requirement for him to get a Lao passport as young children (he's only 1) can come and go between Laos and Thailand, by land, without a passport. I have no wish to draw attention to him being born out of wedlock to a foreign father while in Laos.

Where did he get his Lao birth/citizenship documentation? Who did the Laos mother state as the father on the Lao documentation?

[Smokin Joe]

My link doesn't work for me today either although it was fine yesterday when I posted. No idea what happened.

Here is another link. It is a Singapore government website but it looks like it the same as the one I looked at yesterday. Just go down the list to the "Law on Lao Nationality"

http://www.mfa.gov.sg/content/mfa/overseasmission/vientiane/lao_laws.html

I don't know how to attach a pdf file but if the link doesn't work I can e-mail it to you if you send me a PM.

[brewsterbudgen]

www.vientianetimes.la

open the constitution (n top line)......Lao Law on Nationality

Lao nationals are NOT allowed dual nationality article 3 one Nationality only.

Parents of Children born out of wedlock could be subject to harsh penalties and even imprisonment unless the couple weds after a reasonable time of courtship/engagement ceremony!!

Your child carries the US nationality and the mother is ex,

why mention? Nobody knows....keep it that way.

source: LLC (Lao Law Consultancy) Vientiane in a written statement to me when i hired them to seek loopholes in the Law.

There wern't any to proceed.

Take Care

HGMA

Here is the link to the page with the Lao laws (In English). Nationality is #7

http://www.vientianetimes.org.la/Lao_Eng_laws.htm

All the links on http://www.vientianetimes.la/Lao_Eng_laws.htm seem to be broken. I keep getting 404 error messages. If someone could attach the relevant pdfs here, that would be great.

I am aware of Laos not officially recognizing dual citizenship. But how would they know if the kid has more than 1 citizenship? I would presume you would first secure the Laos nationality paperwork first, then seek additional nationalities if you qualify?

I have a son, Lao mother, born and living in Thailand. He has a UK passport, but his Lao documentation doesn't show me as the father and uses his mother's last name. There's really no requirement for him to get a Lao passport as young children (he's only 1) can come and go between Laos and Thailand, by land, without a passport. I have no wish to draw attention to him being born out of wedlock to a foreign father while in Laos.

Where did he get his Lao birth/citizenship documentation? Who did the Laos mother state as the father on the Lao documentation?

His grandmother sorted it all out in Laos. The father's name is just shown as "unknown". We have a document issued in Laos but I don't really know what is says as it's in Lao!

[Tywais]

All the links on http://www.vientianetimes.la/Lao_Eng_laws.htm seem to be broken. I keep getting 404 error messages. If someone could attach the relevant pdfs here, that would be great.

I am aware of Laos not officially recognizing dual citizenship. But how would they know if the kid has more than 1 citizenship? I would presume you would first secure the Laos nationality paperwork first, then seek additional nationalities if you qualify?

I was able to access it through a VPN and all the pdf links work that way. The actual link on that page is #10, Law on Lao Nationality. Attached it here.

10. Law on Lao Nationality (2004) Eng.pdf

Another one that may be of use:

65. Law on the Protection of the Rights of Children (2006) Eng.pdf

[hgma]

Please note that i express my personal opinion on this matter.

When Lao people certify a birth certificated they need 3 witnesses.

Any fraudelent action will effect them as well

Any foreigner apply for foreign passport needs certified birth certificates and must be aware of prohibition of dual Nationality in Laos

Having the spouse sign in fraudelent procedures is a criminal offence (in Laos)

Having a child out of wedlock is considered a criminal offence in Laos (source LLC Vientiane Law office)

The dual passports and out of wedlock babies are well known in Laos.....recently a change in leadership has taken place and first priority is restore enforcement of the law, according to the Vientiane Times quoting the new President

My assumption is that a correction procedure will take place this or next year.

You better be prepared in case it applies to you.

Oh and the old exuses as......will they jail the children doesn't apply any more, it never did......it will cost a huge amount of money when detected (source LLC VTT)

[ilikethai]

I somewhat have the same question. I have a friend (Lao American US Citizen) who just had a child with a Lao woman. Now, the US Embassy just issued the child a US Passport.

My question is this what is the procedure to bring the child to the States? Example, at the airport, if the child were to show the airport official on exit there needs to be an "entry" stamp on the child's passport.

Anybody confused yet? So how can the child exit the airport if the child's passport doesn't have an arrival stamp? Anybody with me?

thankyou in advance.

[brewsterbudgen]

I somewhat have the same question. I have a friend (Lao American US Citizen) who just had a child with a Lao woman. Now, the US Embassy just issued the child a US Passport.

My question is this what is the procedure to bring the child to the States? Example, at the airport, if the child were to show the airport official on exit there needs to be an "entry" stamp on the child's passport.

Anybody confused yet? So how can the child exit the airport if the child's passport doesn't have an arrival stamp? Anybody with me?

thankyou in advance.

You just need to show the birth certificate at passport control. Then they will give you an Arrival card to complete for the child which you give back to them, and a note (in Thai) is made in the passport.

[Ulic]

US Citizenship is enough. No need Laos Citizenship!

He should collect as many citizenships/passports as he is entitled to.

Keep his options as wide and open as possible.

[ozyjon]

Parents of Children born out of wedlock could be subject to harsh penalties and even imprisonment

While in Vientiane one time, a lady asked me, why so many red flags, what do they mean..

i told her Laos is a communist country and they take it very seriously, she went quiet.

Be very very cautious, don't muck around in this country.

[Mudcrab]

From what I understand a foreigner having a sexual relationship with a Lao national...let alone having a child is very much frowned upon by the Laos Government.

Tread carefully with this one if your "associate" intends returning to Laos to formalise anything.

Do it all out country if that is possible.

Edited April 26, 2016 by Mudcrab

[ilikethai]

I somewhat have the same question. I have a friend (Lao American US Citizen) who just had a child with a Lao woman. Now, the US Embassy just issued the child a US Passport.

My question is this what is the procedure to bring the child to the States? Example, at the airport, if the child were to show the airport official on exit there needs to be an "entry" stamp on the child's passport.

Anybody confused yet? So how can the child exit the airport if the child's passport doesn't have an arrival stamp? Anybody with me?

thankyou in advance.

You just need to show the birth certificate at passport control. Then they will give you an Arrival card to complete for the child which you give back to them, and a note (in Thai) is made in the passport.

but the child is not arriving, he/she is going out of the airport with a fresh passport (unstamped) given by the US Embassy in Laos.

[aronp1]

From what I understand a foreigner having a sexual relationship with a Lao national...let alone having a child is very much frowned upon by the Laos Government.

Tread carefully with this one if your "associate" intends returning to Laos to formalise anything.

Do it all out country if that is possible.

That's sexual relations period without being married, I heard is unlawful.

[aronp1]

US Citizenship is enough. No need Laos Citizenship!

I would be more supportive on him just having a Laos citizenship which he has.There's no need to be connected to the US. Edited April 26, 2016 by aronp1

[brewsterbudgen]

I somewhat have the same question. I have a friend (Lao American US Citizen) who just had a child with a Lao woman. Now, the US Embassy just issued the child a US Passport.

My question is this what is the procedure to bring the child to the States? Example, at the airport, if the child were to show the airport official on exit there needs to be an "entry" stamp on the child's passport.

Anybody confused yet? So how can the child exit the airport if the child's passport doesn't have an arrival stamp? Anybody with me?

thankyou in advance.

You just need to show the birth certificate at passport control. Then they will give you an Arrival card to complete for the child which you give back to them, and a note (in Thai) is made in the passport.

but the child is not arriving, he/she is going out of the airport with a fresh passport (unstamped) given by the US Embassy in Laos.

Yes, I know. My child was in exactly the same position when we left Bangkok for the UK 2 weeks ago. Thai Immigration still require an Arrival/Departure card to be completed, even though the child 'arrived' at a hospital in Thailand when he was born! I completed it at the passport desk and handed it straight over with the baby's birth certificate. A note in Thai was written in his brand new, unused, UK passport and he was stamped out.

In regard to relationships with Lao girls, having been in one for 6 years and now with a 13 month old baby, I, like many others, am well aware of the laws in Laos, but fortunately we don't plan to spend much time there. On the few occasions we have visited the Laos village, the Headman has sanctioned my stay and he is well aware that I am the father of the baby. We will be married (in the UK) in a few months time, but that won't change anything regarding the situation in Laos. However, the marriage will be recognised in the UK and Thailand, which is what is important for us.

Edited April 26, 2016 by brewsterbudgen

[sgtsabai]

My Lao mia noi put "father deceased". No more details forthcoming.

[simon43]

From what I understand a foreigner having a sexual relationship with a Lao national...let alone having a child is very much frowned upon by the Laos Government.

When I worked in Luang Prabang a couple of years ago, I was well aware of this law. However, it was absolutely no problem to find 'ladies' for a very temporary 'marriage'. (say about 1 hour or so). It was all a question of being polite and discrete. The locals didn't bat an eyelid - it was a common situation for them to find a single foreign man in need of 'company'.