New Saudi guidelines curtail powers of religious police

[webfact]

New Saudi guidelines curtail powers of religious police
AYA BATRAWY, Associated Press

DUBAI, United Arab Emirates (AP) — Saudi Arabia has issued new guidelines to define and curtail powers of the country's religious police, instructing its members to be "gentle and kind" in dealing with the public.

The force, which is tasked with ensuring people observe the kingdom's ultraconservative Islamic codes, has been criticized at times for its intrusive, even deadly tactics.

The members of the religious police, known as Mutawas, are not allowed to chase people down the street or demand to see a person's ID or other documents. The directives also say the Mutawas are not to entrap or arrest people, specifying that this is exclusively the jurisdiction of the police and drug enforcement officials.

The semiautonomous Commission for the Promotion of Virtue and Prevention of Vice — as the force of roughly 5,000 is also known — patrols parks, streets and malls, combats drug use, bars unrelated men and women from mingling in public and ensures stores close for daily prayers. It is also one of several government agencies that monitor online activity in the kingdom.

Often, Mutawas have stopped men and women driving in cars or walking in public places, demanding to see proof they are married or directly related. The new directives appear to be an attempt to change that, though it is unclear how the measure will be implemented in practice.

The kingdom adheres to an ultraconservative interpretation of Islam. Women must wear long, loose robes known as abayas when in public and are not permitted to mingle with unrelated men or to drive cars. Most Saudi women additionally cover their faces with a veil known as the niqab when in public.

However, in recent years, online videos have gone viral of Saudi women talking back to members of the religious police when the Mutawas tried to kick them out of malls for wearing nail polish, showing their faces, wearing makeup — or even just for showing gloveless hands.

The new guidelines essentially codify the reach of the Mutawas, who do not have a procedural manual.

The directives say members of the religious police must wear visible identification badges with their name, work location and duration of work hours.

The Mutawas were also advised to be "gentle and kind" in their outreach with the public. The commission, which already reports directly to the king, will no longer be overseen by the Interior Ministry but exclusively by the monarch.

The directives also stipulate that men who work for the force "must be of good character and behavior, known for their good reputation" and must not have been sentenced to longer than one year in prison or have been convicted of crimes of dishonesty.

Though the force had been in the past told not to chase people, members were accused by the public of violating these orders when two brothers were killed in a high-speed chase for playing loud music on Saudi Arabia's National Day in 2013.

In 2002, the religious police were accused of preventing the rescue of girls trapped in a school fire because they were not wearing abayas and head coverings as they attempted to flee the all-female building. Fourteen girls died in the fire, though the director of the force at the time denied his staff had prevented rescuers from entering the school.

More recently in February, reports emerged that several members of the commission were arrested after they pursued two girls at a mall in the capital, Riyadh. One of the girls was filmed, apparently pushed to the ground, which exposed her leg as she fell.


-- (c) Associated Press 2016-04-14

[Steely Dan]

This is very significant news in my view, I suspect the Saudi Regime has calculated it will be to its advantage to distance itself from Wahabbism.

[johnatong]

I once worked in the Tabuk region of S.A.

The 'Mutawa' were tolerated but if any of them became a nuisance they were removed.

I was told that the local Governor would not condone or permit aggressive behaviour from the mutawa.

[chuckd]

I once worked in the Tabuk region of S.A.

The 'Mutawa' were tolerated but if any of them became a nuisance they were removed.

I was told that the local Governor would not condone or permit aggressive behaviour from the mutawa.

I spent a little over one year in Tabuk. Rather enjoyed it but I had great living accommodations and an enjoyable job.

Never got involved with the Mutawas there but used to enjoy watching them chase Saudi's in the shopping malls in the big cities to get them to prayer.

[Rancid]

This is very significant news in my view, I suspect the Saudi Regime has calculated it will be to its advantage to distance itself from Wahabbism.

I somewhat doubt the Saudis are stopping their institutional support for their very own version of radical perverted Islam. Their whole system, history and power is based on it.

It is the foundation of ISIS doctrine, whom they also support. Israel may be friendly with SA for its own political agenda, but that doesn't make them a less abhorrent regime. Just having Religion Police is a psychotic perversion.

[johnatong]

I once worked in the Tabuk region of S.A.

The 'Mutawa' were tolerated but if any of them became a nuisance they were removed.

I was told that the local Governor would not condone or permit aggressive behaviour from the mutawa.

I spent a little over one year in Tabuk. Rather enjoyed it but I had great living accommodations and an enjoyable job.

Never got involved with the Mutawas there but used to enjoy watching them chase Saudi's in the shopping malls in the big cities to get them to prayer.

Me as well !

Were you working for the RSAF or the Army ?

We often used to "escape" either to Jordan( Aquaba) or the beach at the W/E's

[chuckd]

I once worked in the Tabuk region of S.A.

The 'Mutawa' were tolerated but if any of them became a nuisance they were removed.

I was told that the local Governor would not condone or permit aggressive behaviour from the mutawa.

I spent a little over one year in Tabuk. Rather enjoyed it but I had great living accommodations and an enjoyable job.

Never got involved with the Mutawas there but used to enjoy watching them chase Saudi's in the shopping malls in the big cities to get them to prayer.

Me as well !

Were you working for the RSAF or the Army ?

We often used to "escape" either to Jordan( Aquaba) or the beach at the W/E's

RSAF.

I just spent my weekends in Tabuk, but I did spend a few years in Yanbu and did get my share of scuba diving and snorkeling on the Red Sea. My people had the old F-5 program there.

[Chicog]

This is very significant news in my view, I suspect the Saudi Regime has calculated it will be to its advantage to distance itself from Wahabbism.

I suspect it's more to do with the fact that several of their more extreme episodes, some of which involved the killing of innocent people, have been very well publicised on Twitter and other social media, and Saudis are fed up with their BS.

[Jonmarleesco]

'... men who work for the force "must be of good character and behavior, known for their good reputation" ... must not have been sentenced to longer than one year in prison ...' Something of an oxymoron, especially as it doesn't specify offences.

[Ulic]

This is very significant news in my view, I suspect the Saudi Regime has calculated it will be to its advantage to distance itself from Wahabbism.

While I do agree I wonder if there will be any change. After all corruption is against the

law in Thailand but it is rampant at all levels of government, the military and the

bureaucracy. Nothing changes. I doubt things will change in Saudi Arabia either.

[johnatong]

This is very significant news in my view, I suspect the Saudi Regime has calculated it will be to its advantage to distance itself from Wahabbism.

While I do agree I wonder if there will be any change. After all corruption is against the

law in Thailand but it is rampant at all levels of government, the military and the

bureaucracy. Nothing changes. I doubt things will change in Saudi Arabia either.

Do you have any EVIDENCE for that assertion ?

Take a look at what "corruption" looks like (in the link! )

http://conservativeamerica-online.com/the-top-7-pork-barrel-spending-boondoggles-of-2015/

Edited April 14, 2016 by johnatong

[ggt]

After centuries of trying to get it right...Muslims still can not agree on who should lose the head...who can drive a car...and how much skin showing is too much...

And they want to rule the world?

[Steely Dan]

This is very significant news in my view, I suspect the Saudi Regime has calculated it will be to its advantage to distance itself from Wahabbism.

While I do agree I wonder if there will be any change. After all corruption is against the

law in Thailand but it is rampant at all levels of government, the military and the

bureaucracy. Nothing changes. I doubt things will change in Saudi Arabia either.

Do you have any EVIDENCE for that assertion ?

Take a look at what "corruption" looks like (in the link! )

http://conservativeamerica-online.com/the-top-7-pork-barrel-spending-boondoggles-of-2015/

Evidence? Nothing concrete whatsoever. I would observe that since its birth Saudi Arabia has had a de facto power sharing arrangement between the ruling monarchy and the religious leaders. The Wahabbis have been useful in not only controlling the population but also in spreading influence throughout the Muslim world as a whole. When ISIS came along the religious conservatives became an existential threat to the monarchy if enough Saudis sharing their ideology sided with ISIS. It is this reason why I suspect the Saudi Monarchy wants to tackle its own hard liners as well as deal with ISIS.

Put it another way who is not going to be at all happy with this ruling and what have the Saudi rulers got to gain from taking this action?

[Chicog]

Put it another way who is not going to be at all happy with this ruling and what have the Saudi rulers got to gain from taking this action?

- Power mad mutawas

- slightly less motivation for civil unrest and insurrection

[jacko45k]

I once worked in the Tabuk region of S.A.

The 'Mutawa' were tolerated but if any of them became a nuisance they were removed.

I was told that the local Governor would not condone or permit aggressive behaviour from the mutawa.

There were rumours of them striking Western women with a cane in my early KSA days.

I had forgotten how prayer times could be rather inconvenient after many years away.

[GOLDBUGGY]

I once worked in the Tabuk region of S.A.

The 'Mutawa' were tolerated but if any of them became a nuisance they were removed.

I was told that the local Governor would not condone or permit aggressive behaviour from the mutawa.

The Mutawa I saw in Al-Jubail S.A. always had a Police Man with them, so the could make charges or arrests, or close up shops. Or cane women if too much was exposed or they were unattended by a male relative. The Police seemed to take instructions from them. So I don't see this making any difference.

The best one of all that I heard was a Mutawa approaching a white woman and caning her on the back of her legs as she was only wearing long shorts but didn't cover her lower legs. The next thing you knew a Gorilla came up from behind and to the Mutawa's surprise, one punched him out cold and flat to the ground and doing the chicken. Turns out this woman had Diplomatic Immunity, as did her Body Guard, so there was nothing they could do to them. The Mutawa just had to right this off as a bad day at the office. .