Zaw Lin and Wai Phyo – innocent in the 'trial by social media'

[Moonsterk]

The alibi given by the B2 said that WP Swapped shirts with MM as he was cold then MM took there motorbike to see his g/f.

But in cctv footage MM can be seen walking streets at 2:00am in WP shirt and no motorbike !

In this clip it shows police stating the B2 left scene of crime on motorbike

THE crime Somyot states... This, above all ( IMO ) is what is wrong with the police case against Wai and Zaw- and why has no one has seized upon it in their defense?

Who allowed both men to be tried as one unit and simultaneously for all four crimes? It was malpractice.

Three crimes, not one, maybe four crimes depending if Hannah was alive prior to her horrible bludgeoning- aggravated assault.

A murder ( David) a sexual assault ( Hannah) aggravated assault and another murder (Hannah.) And not necessarily in that order.

[sidboy]

http://www.independent.co.uk/news/world/asia/thailand-beach-murders-dna-investigation-death-of-british-backpackers-hannah-witteridge-and-david-a7002421.html

International legal and DNA forensics experts have advised Zaw Lin and Wai Phyo - the two Burmese immigrants sentenced to death over the killings - to make a formal complaint and demand a retrial.

Laura Witheridge: ...."You probably haven’t heard of them, as not all were British nationals. The deaths, where possible, are covered up as suicides and accidents.

“This would have happened with Hannah, if it had not been for the hideous brutality of her passing.”

[sidboy]

http://www.news.com.au/world/asia/thai-backpacker-killers-could-sue-police-over-bungled-investigation/news-story/48cc1890c7fded93349cfa15b401fb62

Thai backpacker killers could sue police over bungled investigation

Laura Witheridge:

“the vast majority of Thai police” were corrupt, making the country a “dangerous trap” for tourists.

[Moonsterk]

Moonsterk

Where is it stated Mon was deputized

It isn't. That's an explanation offered for Mon's proximity to the scene.

" Deputized" is my western word for what a village headman can do with whomever he wishes- appoint them to act as police. Limited police presence at that time meant civilians were needed to act as police.

Shall I link to nameless experts quoted by an anonymous article in a publication, say - The State Rag.

[sidboy]

Moonsterk

Where is it stated Mon was deputized

It isn't. That's an explanation offered for Mon's proximity to the scene.

" Deputized" is my western word for what a village headman can do with whomever he wishes- appoint them to act as police. Limited police presence at that time meant civilians were needed to act as police.

Shall I link to nameless experts quoted by an anonymous article in a publication, say - The State Rag.

[Moonsterk]

http://www.news.com.au/world/asia/thai-backpacker-killers-could-sue-police-over-bungled-investigation/news-story/48cc1890c7fded93349cfa15b401fb62

Thai backpacker killers could sue police over bungled investigation

Laura Witheridge:

“the vast majority of Thai police” were corrupt, making the country a “dangerous trap” for tourists.

Well anyone can sue anyone over anything.

And Laura was spoon fed the crap leading to her statements.

We need an analogy here...

I think everyone would agree: " Cobras are very very venomous."

However, I have had cobras slither by me just a meter away but I never suffered from the venom, I did not get bit. So the reality is cobras are venomous only when they bite you. They don't bite everyone. They don't bite all the time.

It doesn't make the first statement untrue, but it just does not pertain to whether or not you suffer from their venom.

I've had several horrible experiences with police here, one was so unbelievable, I was ridiculed for it and it was deleted from, er... a forum by admins.

Laura had a horrible experience, too. The photographers allowed to attack en masse on the family come to collect Hannah. And then she was massaged and manipulated by certain individuals, those emotionally involved ones...the same ones I bet that give crap legal advice to the convicted.

Those men would be getting out in a year or so if they'd just admitted to the rape.Now they will spend a decade fighting charges.

[rockingrobin]

Moonsterk

Where is it stated Mon was deputized

It isn't. That's an explanation offered for Mon's proximity to the scene.

" Deputized" is my western word for what a village headman can do with whomever he wishes- appoint them to act as police. Limited police presence at that time meant civilians were needed to act as police.

Shall I link to nameless experts quoted by an anonymous article in a publication, say - The State Rag.

But thats not the explanation given by Mon

As for the legality of your statement I will have to get back

[Moonsterk]

Moonsterk

Where is it stated Mon was deputized

It isn't. That's an explanation offered for Mon's proximity to the scene.

" Deputized" is my western word for what a village headman can do with whomever he wishes- appoint them to act as police. Limited police presence at that time meant civilians were needed to act as police.

Shall I link to nameless experts quoted by an anonymous article in a publication, say - The State Rag.

But thats not the explanation given by Mon

As for the legality of your statement I will have to get back

OK. So what was Mon's explanation and where was it given?

[JLCrab]

http://www.independent.co.uk/news/world/asia/thailand-beach-murders-dna-investigation-death-of-british-backpackers-hannah-witteridge-and-david-a7002421.html

International legal and DNA forensics experts have advised Zaw Lin and Wai Phyo - the two Burmese immigrants sentenced to death over the killings - to make a formal complaint and demand a retrial.

<snip>

So the defense team experts -- who have asked for and received 4 30-day extensions to submit an Appeal -- are now saying what they really want is a retrial or do-over or what the golfers would call a Mulligan.

[Moonsterk]

http://www.independent.co.uk/news/world/asia/thailand-beach-murders-dna-investigation-death-of-british-backpackers-hannah-witteridge-and-david-a7002421.html

International legal and DNA forensics experts have advised Zaw Lin and Wai Phyo - the two Burmese immigrants sentenced to death over the killings - to make a formal complaint and demand a retrial.

<snip>

So the defense team experts -- who have asked for and received 4 30-day extensions to submit an Appeal -- are now saying what they really want is a retrial or do-over or what the golfers would call a Mulligan.

So they can admit the rape.. and the second degree murder of David, and be out in a year on time served. Hallelujah!!

Note the " experts" are still not named, must be killing her to miss out on the publicity!! So which publication ripped off who ? Independent or the Brit Isle State Rag?

[007cableguy]

"Another police source said the three men had been monitored secretly after police detected signs of suspicious behaviour after interviewing staff at AC Pub and all shops and restaurants. One of the men, who police did name, had dyed his hair from gold to black after the crime took place."

http://news.asiaone.com/news/asia/koh-tao-murders-burmese-rape-suspects-not-scapegoats-says-police-chief

Except that none of the three had gold hair in the CCTV footage from the night of the murders, as pointed out about a million times before .

On the subject of millions, I see the the Tuvichien family Thai Visa spokeswoman has been flood-spamming the two open threads extensively since my last visit . Can't the mods just give her her own thread ?

You would of she should be spending time sorting the chickens out instead of trying to Miss-inform people based on her own unbelievable theories, Mon being deputised pure fantasy!

[Moonsterk]

"Another police source said the three men had been monitored secretly after police detected signs of suspicious behaviour after interviewing staff at AC Pub and all shops and restaurants. One of the men, who police did name, had dyed his hair from gold to black after the crime took place."

http://news.asiaone.com/news/asia/koh-tao-murders-burmese-rape-suspects-not-scapegoats-says-police-chief

Except that none of the three had gold hair in the CCTV footage from the night of the murders, as pointed out about a million times before .

On the subject of millions, I see the the Tuvichien family Thai Visa spokeswoman has been flood-spamming the two open threads extensively since my last visit . Can't the mods just give her her own thread ?

This is a problem with relying on crap publications that rip off unverified quotes from other crap publications that never verify facts- rumours are regurgitated endlessly and from sheer force of repetitiveness, become facts.

[rockingrobin]

Moonsterk

Apologies fot harping on about Mon, however after speaking to a colleague he did not confirm or deny if it wss possible for the village headman to deputize in such circumstances.

My colleague made a request if you could clarify the deputisation of Mon is from an official or unofficial source

[Moonsterk]

Moonsterk

Apologies fot harping on about Mon, however after speaking to a colleague he did not confirm or deny if it wss possible for the village headman to deputize in such circumstances.

My colleague made a request if you could clarify the deputisation of Mon is from an official or unofficial source

That is my explanation for his proximity as already stated, you can believe it or not.

I asked you to clarify his explanation, curious as to how it would void mine.

[carmine]

"Another police source said the three men had been monitored secretly after police detected signs of suspicious behaviour after interviewing staff at AC Pub and all shops and restaurants. One of the men, who police did name, had dyed his hair from gold to black after the crime took place."

http://news.asiaone.com/news/asia/koh-tao-murders-burmese-rape-suspects-not-scapegoats-says-police-chief

Except that none of the three had gold hair in the CCTV footage from the night of the murders, as pointed out about a million times before .

On the subject of millions, I see the the Tuvichien family Thai Visa spokeswoman has been flood-spamming the two open threads extensively since my last visit . Can't the mods just give her her own thread ?

This is a problem with relying on crap publications that rip off unverified quotes from other crap publications that never verify facts- rumours are regurgitated endlessly and from sheer force of repetitiveness, become facts.

You quite obviously have all the facts available to you and see everything in crystal clarity. So, in the interests of everyone would please furnish with the "facts" as to why this was apparently the "perfect case" by the local law enforcement and explain why the newspapers in countries all over the world would appear to be printing scurrilous lies that seem to contradict you.

Of course, as someone that knows nothing really about this i will be Devils Advocate, but there really does seem to be a differing of opinions of a truly monumental scale here!

[Moonsterk]

http://www.independent.co.uk/news/world/asia/thailand-beach-murders-dna-investigation-death-of-british-backpackers-hannah-witteridge-and-david-a7002421.html

International legal and DNA forensics experts have advised Zaw Lin and Wai Phyo - the two Burmese immigrants sentenced to death over the killings - to make a formal complaint and demand a retrial.

Laura Witheridge: ...."You probably haven’t heard of them, as not all were British nationals. The deaths, where possible, are covered up as suicides and accidents.

“This would have happened with Hannah, if it had not been for the hideous brutality of her passing.”

Bu this is just more of the rumour mill, it proves nothing, it's just text of an opinion- All other deaths covered up murders? No.....

[rockingrobin]

Moonsterk

Apologies fot harping on about Mon, however after speaking to a colleague he did not confirm or deny if it wss possible for the village headman to deputize in such circumstances.

My colleague made a request if you could clarify the deputisation of Mon is from an official or unofficial source

That is my explanation for his proximity as already stated, you can believe it or not.

I asked you to clarify his explanation, curious as to how it would void mine.

Mòonsterk

I am not evading your question, Mons explanation is in the pulic doman and would appear to differ from yours.

In order to maintain some independance it would be prudent if this was located yourself so as to allow you to make an independant judgement.

On the issue of Mon deputuzation would I be correct in saying you have no sources formally or otherwise to this fact ,and it is your own personal summarisation of his presence at the scene

[Moonsterk]

"Another police source said the three men had been monitored secretly after police detected signs of suspicious behaviour after interviewing staff at AC Pub and all shops and restaurants. One of the men, who police did name, had dyed his hair from gold to black after the crime took place."

http://news.asiaone.com/news/asia/koh-tao-murders-burmese-rape-suspects-not-scapegoats-says-police-chief

Except that none of the three had gold hair in the CCTV footage from the night of the murders, as pointed out about a million times before .

On the subject of millions, I see the the Tuvichien family Thai Visa spokeswoman has been flood-spamming the two open threads extensively since my last visit . Can't the mods just give her her own thread ?

This is a problem with relying on crap publications that rip off unverified quotes from other crap publications that never verify facts- rumours are regurgitated endlessly and from sheer force of repetitiveness, become facts.

You quite obviously have all the facts available to you and see everything in crystal clarity. So, in the interests of everyone would please furnish with the "facts" as to why this was apparently the "perfect case" by the local law enforcement and explain why the newspapers in countries all over the world would appear to be printing scurrilous lies that seem to contradict you.

Of course, as someone that knows nothing really about this i will be Devils Advocate, but there really does seem to be a differing of opinions of a truly monumental scale here!

Sarcasm has never made for good discourse, it isn't here either.

Unnamed police source quotes from articles scavenged from other articles is what I object to when posting up "facts" as facts.

How I view it is a lot of lies, innuendo and BS being touted as fact in defending those men of a crime. I see emotionally unstable, emotionally involved people, being suckered by a innocent looking face and putting out a lot of same, that is being endlessly re posted as fact. And a lot of it is on this thread.

I see perfectly reasonable explanations for things, such as Mon's proximity to the bodies, being twisted to suit a narrative.

When crap articles, with no authors and unamed " experts" are trotted out.... it has to be countered.

[carmine]

Well i'm offering you a guilt edged opportunity to explain why it is that all the press seem to have got it woefully wrong. You seem utterly convinced of this so please to to balance an argument turning us with all your relevant information as to why they seem to have drawn conclusions appearing to be the polar opposite to yours. Surely they don't all have an axe to grind. Or do they? I don't know, you tell me, please.

[Moonsterk]

Moonsterk

Apologies fot harping on about Mon, however after speaking to a colleague he did not confirm or deny if it wss possible for the village headman to deputize in such circumstances.

My colleague made a request if you could clarify the deputisation of Mon is from an official or unofficial source

That is my explanation for his proximity as already stated, you can believe it or not.

I asked you to clarify his explanation, curious as to how it would void mine.

Mòonsterk

I am not evading your question, Mons explanation is in the pulic doman and would appear to differ from yours.

In order to maintain some independance it would be prudent if this was located yourself so as to allow you to make an independant judgement.

On the issue of Mon deputuzation would I be correct in saying you have no sources formally or otherwise to this fact ,and it is your own personal summarisation of his presence at the scene

OK so you won't share his explanation, is that correct? I'd have to think it does not exist then. But perhaps putting that aside, would you be able to explain how it voids mine?

and yes as stated twice already that is my explanation for his proximity- Is there some reason to doubt it? Has your colleague refuted it in some way?

[Moonsterk]

Well i'm offering you a guilt edged opportunity to explain why it is that all the press seem to have got it woefully wrong. You seem utterly convinced of this so please to to balance an argument turning us with all your relevant information as to why they seem to have drawn conclusions appearing to be the polar opposite to yours. Surely they don't all have an axe to grind. Or do they? I don't know, you tell me, please.

Well i'm offering you a guilt edged opportunity..

This is a public forum, not yours to offer guilt [sic] edged opportunity..

And I think you mean gilt. Almost merits an eye rolling smiley

Your post is known as the straw man argument .

" all the press.." ? Nope, not what I have written. They... Nope not everyone agrees with the claim Wai and Zaw are innocent

What I have written is; unsourced quotes, un-authored articles endlessly reposted do not a fact make.

What I notice is when I post up links that prove my claims they are not acknowledged, the counter arguments turn to;

straw men,

ad hominem,

refusal to post info using to counter my claim,

and good o'l jus plain insult.

None of it will work.

[smedly]

Moonsterk

Apologies fot harping on about Mon, however after speaking to a colleague he did not confirm or deny if it wss possible for the village headman to deputize in such circumstances.

My colleague made a request if you could clarify the deputisation of Mon is from an official or unofficial source

his wig wearing DJ cop pal allowed him to enter the crime scene contaminating everything when in actual fact neither of them should have been in there especially a civilian, the police who arrived at the scene first should have secured the area and allowed nobody to enter (including themselves) until such times as crime scene experts arrived to carry out a proper investigation

[sidboy]

Moonsterk

Apologies fot harping on about Mon, however after speaking to a colleague he did not confirm or deny if it wss possible for the village headman to deputize in such circumstances.

My colleague made a request if you could clarify the deputisation of Mon is from an official or unofficial source

That is my explanation for his proximity as already stated, you can believe it or not.

I asked you to clarify his explanation, curious as to how it would void mine.

Mòonsterk

I am not evading your question, Mons explanation is in the pulic doman and would appear to differ from yours.

In order to maintain some independance it would be prudent if this was located yourself so as to allow you to make an independant judgement.

On the issue of Mon deputuzation would I be correct in saying you have no sources formally or otherwise to this fact ,and it is your own personal summarisation of his presence at the scene

From the mouth of Mon in the documentary following the revelation by the speaker that Mon is seen in a restricted area as the police gather evidence:

'I didn't touch anything at all. I don't see anything wrong about this. It is because the Director of Investigation flew all the way to Koh Tao. And they approached me as I was the first person who saw the dead bodies. Therefore I would definitely be involved in this case'.

The problem here is that Mon was not the first person to see the dead bodies. He is lying. Cleaners discovered the bodies and alerted him. So the cleaners were the first people to see the dead bodies and therefore the cleaners should have been in court to deliver their testimonies. Only they weren't. Just like Maung Maung was not called to testify at the main trial. Join the dots. Only a complete retrial will deliver the truth with original witnesses on the stand (if they can be found to be alive) along with the friends of Hannah and David who are aware of their final movements.

[Moonsterk]

Moonsterk

Apologies fot harping on about Mon, however after speaking to a colleague he did not confirm or deny if it wss possible for the village headman to deputize in such circumstances.

My colleague made a request if you could clarify the deputisation of Mon is from an official or unofficial source

his wig wearing DJ cop pal allowed him to enter the crime scene contaminating everything when in actual fact neither of them should have been in there especially a civilian, the police who arrived at the scene first should have secured the area and allowed nobody to enter (including themselves) until such times as crime scene experts arrived to carry out a proper investigation

You're so wrong, so misinformed, so eager to believe any pile of crap that fits into the scenario Mon was responsible- you're exhibiting signs that you've been brainwashed.

Can I send you a pm? I would like to know who you are- would you answer- truthfully?

[rockingrobin]

Moonsterk

Apologies fot harping on about Mon, however after speaking to a colleague he did not confirm or deny if it wss possible for the village headman to deputize in such circumstances.

My colleague made a request if you could clarify the deputisation of Mon is from an official or unofficial source

That is my explanation for his proximity as already stated, you can believe it or not.

I asked you to clarify his explanation, curious as to how it would void mine.

Mòonsterk

I am not evading your question, Mons explanation is in the pulic doman and would appear to differ from yours.

In order to maintain some independance it would be prudent if this was located yourself so as to allow you to make an independant judgement.

On the issue of Mon deputuzation would I be correct in saying you have no sources formally or otherwise to this fact ,and it is your own personal summarisation of his presence at the scene

OK so you won't share his explanation, is that correct? I'd have to think it does not exist then. But perhaps putting that aside, would you be able to explain how it voids mine?

and yes as stated twice already that is my explanation for his proximity- Is there some reason to doubt it? Has your colleague refuted it in some way?

Moonsterk

I am somewhat suprised by your response, you lambast posters for re-gurgating myth,innuendo,rumours and speculation and post them as fact.Yet here you are stating Mon was deputized as an explanation for his presence at the crime scene , yet cannot back this up with a source, it is only a speculative judgement, it maybe correct or not

As for Mons explanation , as i have stated it is in the public domain , it would be unwise of me to spoonfeed you, as it is not mine or my colleagues intention to influence yourself by asking leading question on this matter.

To the interest of my colleague the deputization of Mon which you alluded to is of some importance

[Moonsterk]

Moonsterk

Apologies fot harping on about Mon, however after speaking to a colleague he did not confirm or deny if it wss possible for the village headman to deputize in such circumstances.

My colleague made a request if you could clarify the deputisation of Mon is from an official or unofficial source

That is my explanation for his proximity as already stated, you can believe it or not.

I asked you to clarify his explanation, curious as to how it would void mine.

Mòonsterk

I am not evading your question, Mons explanation is in the pulic doman and would appear to differ from yours.

In order to maintain some independance it would be prudent if this was located yourself so as to allow you to make an independant judgement.

On the issue of Mon deputuzation would I be correct in saying you have no sources formally or otherwise to this fact ,and it is your own personal summarisation of his presence at the scene

From the mouth of Mon in the documentary following the revelation by the speaker that Mon is seen in a restricted area as the police gather evidence:

'I didn't touch anything at all. I don't see anything wrong about this. It is because the Director of Investigation flew all the way to Koh Tao. And they approached me as I was the first person who saw the dead bodies. Therefore I would definitely be involved in this case'.

The problem here is that Mon was not the first person to see the dead bodies. He is lying. Cleaners discovered the bodies and alerted him. So the cleaners were the first people to see the dead bodies and therefore the cleaners should have been in court to deliver their testimonies. Only they weren't. Just like Maung Maung was not called to testify at the main trial. Join the dots. Only a complete retrial will deliver the truth with original witnesses on the stand (if they can be found to be alive) along with the friends of Hannah and David who are aware of their final movements.

COME ON

Where's the link? Was he speaking in English, or Thai? Was it translated? How many times?

And sorry it does not contradict my claim- he was permitted to be there.

[Moonsterk]

That is my explanation for his proximity as already stated, you can believe it or not.

I asked you to clarify his explanation, curious as to how it would void mine.

Mòonsterk

I am not evading your question, Mons explanation is in the pulic doman and would appear to differ from yours.

In order to maintain some independance it would be prudent if this was located yourself so as to allow you to make an independant judgement.

On the issue of Mon deputuzation would I be correct in saying you have no sources formally or otherwise to this fact ,and it is your own personal summarisation of his presence at the scene

OK so you won't share his explanation, is that correct? I'd have to think it does not exist then. But perhaps putting that aside, would you be able to explain how it voids mine?

and yes as stated twice already that is my explanation for his proximity- Is there some reason to doubt it? Has your colleague refuted it in some way?

Moonsterk

I am somewhat suprised by your response, you lambast posters for re-gurgating myth,innuendo,rumours and speculation and post them as fact.Yet here you are stating Mon was deputized as an explanation for his presence at the crime scene , yet cannot back this up with a source, it is only a speculative judgement, it maybe correct or not

As for Mons explanation , as i have stated it is in the public domain , it would be unwise of me to spoonfeed you, as it is not mine or my colleagues intention to influence yourself by asking leading question on this matter.

To the interest of my colleague the deputization of Mon which you alluded to is of some importance

I lambast them for re-gurgating [sic] opinion gleaned off anonymous articles and social media as fact.

I have stated several times now this is my explanation of his presence.

I think it is well established by now you do not believe it and I cannot convince you.

[smedly]

DNA investigation in murder case of UK backpackers ‘incompetent’

Police in Thailand may be reported to an international regulator over the investigation of two Burmese men convicted of murdering British backpackers Hannah Witheridge and David Miller. International legal and DNA forensic scientists have advised the defence team of the two Burmese, who were sentenced to death, to make a formal complaint and demand a retrial.

The bodies of Ms Witheridge, 23, and Mr Miller, 24, were found on the island of Koh Tao in September 2014.

The experts say at best the DNA investigation by the Thai Police Forensics Laboratory was incompetent with no chain of evidence or proper disclosure to the defence. The worst scenario is Zaw Lin and Wai Phyo were framed.

http://www.standard.co.uk/news/world/dna-investigation-in-murder-case-of-uk-backpackers-incompetent-a3233786.html

well like I have been stating here for months, the DNA evidence used to convict the B2 was not reliable primarily because no original samples were ever produced, meaning it doesn't exist and there is no way to prove it ever did, DNA evidence is physical evidence just like a murder weapon, you cannot claim the bullet matched the gun if you cannot produce the gun, it really is that simple

I know..? Let see what the Police have under there sleeves now.. its going to be interesting few weeks ahead of us now and you never know they may not see court ...

nothing will happen until the appeal reaches the supreme court where you have people that actually know what they are doing, under advisement of scientists the supreme court will order the police to produce "original DNA samples" and when they fail to produce them the case will be dismissed.

[Moonsterk]

DNA investigation in murder case of UK backpackers ‘incompetent’

Police in Thailand may be reported to an international regulator over the investigation of two Burmese men convicted of murdering British backpackers Hannah Witheridge and David Miller. International legal and DNA forensic scientists have advised the defence team of the two Burmese, who were sentenced to death, to make a formal complaint and demand a retrial.

The bodies of Ms Witheridge, 23, and Mr Miller, 24, were found on the island of Koh Tao in September 2014.

The experts say at best the DNA investigation by the Thai Police Forensics Laboratory was incompetent with no chain of evidence or proper disclosure to the defence. The worst scenario is Zaw Lin and Wai Phyo were framed.

http://www.standard.co.uk/news/world/dna-investigation-in-murder-case-of-uk-backpackers-incompetent-a3233786.html

well like I have been stating here for months, the DNA evidence used to convict the B2 was not reliable primarily because no original samples were ever produced, meaning it doesn't exist and there is no way to prove it ever did, DNA evidence is physical evidence just like a murder weapon, you cannot claim the bullet matched the gun if you cannot produce the gun, it really is that simple

I know..? Let see what the Police have under there sleeves now.. its going to be interesting few weeks ahead of us now and you never know they may not see court ...

nothing will happen until the appeal reaches the supreme court where you have people that actually know what they are doing, under advisement of scientists the supreme court will order the police to produce "original DNA samples" and when they fail to produce them the case will be dismissed.

In your dreams....

Who told them to not admit the rape? Who allowed the prosecutor to merge all the crimes as one so they were unable to admit to just rape? That's who are responsible for the mess they are in.

[rockingrobin]

That is my explanation for his proximity as already stated, you can believe it or not.

I asked you to clarify his explanation, curious as to how it would void mine.

Mòonsterk
I am not evading your question, Mons explanation is in the pulic doman and would appear to differ from yours.
In order to maintain some independance it would be prudent if this was located yourself so as to allow you to make an independant judgement.

On the issue of Mon deputuzation would I be correct in saying you have no sources formally or otherwise to this fact ,and it is your own personal summarisation of his presence at the scene

OK so you won't share his explanation, is that correct? I'd have to think it does not exist then. But perhaps putting that aside, would you be able to explain how it voids mine?

and yes as stated twice already that is my explanation for his proximity- Is there some reason to doubt it? Has your colleague refuted it in some way?

Moonsterk
I am somewhat suprised by your response, you lambast posters for re-gurgating myth,innuendo,rumours and speculation and post them as fact.Yet here you are stating Mon was deputized as an explanation for his presence at the crime scene , yet cannot back this up with a source, it is only a speculative judgement, it maybe correct or not
As for Mons explanation , as i have stated it is in the public domain , it would be unwise of me to spoonfeed you, as it is not mine or my colleagues intention to influence yourself by asking leading question on this matter.

To the interest of my colleague the deputization of Mon which you alluded to is of some importance

I lambast them for re-gurgating [sic] opinion gleaned off anonymous articles and social media as fact.
I have stated several times now this is my explanation of his presence.

I think it is well established by now you do not believe it and I cannot convince you.

On the contrary Moonsterk , I have no opinion , the only fact that I can establish is Mon was at the crime scend