Police and electrical engineers dead in Kabinburi U-Turn pile up

[lvr181]

Jeez, even the Police do not understand safe driving! How will the local drivers ever learn?

RIP and condolences to families and friends.

[cumgranosalum]

Just another day in THE most dangerous country to drive in in the WORLD,forget the bogus statistics that it is second or third,it is FIRST.

There are more dangerous places to drive than Thailand despite what statistics say

Yes there is Saudi Arabia but not many more and I have driven in many. This forum is about Thailand. I always wondered who designed the roads here and why? I have been given many answers and none of them are flattering.

Nothing wrong with the roads, it's the gibbering nutmonkeys driving on them that's the problem.

absolutely incorrect - the amount of idiots on the world's roads is pretty much a constant..it is how they are managed that differs a constant. Multiple other factors in this case especially the road engineering and design in Thailand is appalling and contributed to these deaths to a great extent.

Every time there is a discussion on road safety some ill-informed person tries to put the blame on "stupid" drivers which basically shows they have no understanding of the issues involved, but because they drive a car, think they know all about road safety......the shear fact that the majority of those at risk aren't even in cars has never occurred to them. They also have no idea of how much they are managed themselves by road safety systems they are blithely unaware so come to really ill thought out and un analytical conclusions about how they themselves drive.

May I suggest the before you comment further you get up to speed on the basics of road safety?

[fasteddie]

There are much safer options for u-turns.

In the diagram below (for USA where they drive on the right) the type B jug-handle adds minimal cost to road construction, filters traffic off from the slow lane instead of the fast lane (so any tailback in excess of the waiting lane capacity is also in the slow lane or in a filter lane or the hard shoulder) allows vehicles waiting to cross to wait in safety off the road, gives good visibility in both directions, and can be coupled with traffic lights with a heavy bias to the main highway to permit safe crossing on very busy roads.

The central crossing would need to be configured as shown (to make a direct turn from the fast lane impossible to prevent impatient drivers from trying to jump the queue) and could have waiting space for 1 or 2 cars and a filter lane to make joining the fast lane on the far side safer.

A huge number of road accidents on highways are connected with u-turns as the paint on the road around them indicates.

Another alternative is to start using what we call in the UK roundabouts. (wong kom in Thai I think) However this would necessitate a huge amount of training as the system is dependent on driver discipline so is bound to fail initially.

Jughandles? jugheads more like, just make the turn when the road is clear, simple.

Not simple enough for many drivers here!

Its not so much you making the turn, its the 18 wheeler that pushes out into fast moving traffic blocking all 3/4 lanes and relying totally on other drivers survival instincts to complete the manouvre. Or groups of tour buses nose to tail doing the same thing as cars screech to a halt and try to avoid hitting the one in front of them.

If you are always going to be sharing the roads with jugheads then safer to design jughead friendly roads.

And do you think Thai drivers would understand never mind respect any of those ideas? I don't!

[gyrosman]

Old saying SPEED KILLS, with extra help of cell phones now and loud conversation and eyes elsewhere, sad.

[fasteddie]

There are more dangerous places to drive than Thailand despite what statistics say

Yes there is Saudi Arabia but not many more and I have driven in many. This forum is about Thailand. I always wondered who designed the roads here and why? I have been given many answers and none of them are flattering.

Nothing wrong with the roads, it's the gibbering nutmonkeys driving on them that's the problem.

absolutely incorrect - the amount of idiots on the world's roads is pretty much a constant..it is how they are managed that differs a constant. Multiple other factors in this case especially the road engineering and design in Thailand is appalling and contributed to these deaths to a great extent.

Every time there is a discussion on road safety some ill-informed person tries to put the blame on "stupid" drivers which basically shows they have no understanding of the issues involved, but because they drive a car, think they know all about road safety......the shear fact that the majority of those at risk aren't even in cars has never occurred to them. They also have no idea of how much they are managed themselves by road safety systems they are blithely unaware so come to really ill thought out and un analytical conclusions about how they themselves drive.

May I suggest the before you comment further you get up to speed on the basics of road safety?

Absolutely incorrect, the amount of idiots on the world's roads are not a constant and anybody who says different obviously hasn't traveled much. There is nothing wrong with the road engineering and design in Thailand, it's pretty much the same as the UK system and the UK have some of the safest roads in the world.

It's all down to driving skills and the enforcement of traffic laws of which Thailand has neither.

p.s. I got 100% on the road safety exams at school (a fair while ago I confess).

[tuanku]

There are much safer options for u-turns.

In the diagram below (for USA where they drive on the right) the type B jug-handle adds minimal cost to road construction, filters traffic off from the slow lane instead of the fast lane (so any tailback in excess of the waiting lane capacity is also in the slow lane or in a filter lane or the hard shoulder) allows vehicles waiting to cross to wait in safety off the road, gives good visibility in both directions, and can be coupled with traffic lights with a heavy bias to the main highway to permit safe crossing on very busy roads.

The central crossing would need to be configured as shown (to make a direct turn from the fast lane impossible to prevent impatient drivers from trying to jump the queue) and could have waiting space for 1 or 2 cars and a filter lane to make joining the fast lane on the far side safer.

A huge number of road accidents on highways are connected with u-turns as the paint on the road around them indicates.

Another alternative is to start using what we call in the UK roundabouts. (wong kom in Thai I think) However this would necessitate a huge amount of training as the system is dependent on driver discipline so is bound to fail initially.

Jughandles? jugheads more like, just make the turn when the road is clear, simple.

Not simple enough for many drivers here!

Its not so much you making the turn, its the 18 wheeler that pushes out into fast moving traffic blocking all 3/4 lanes and relying totally on other drivers survival instincts to complete the manouvre. Or groups of tour buses nose to tail doing the same thing as cars screech to a halt and try to avoid hitting the one in front of them.

If you are always going to be sharing the roads with jugheads then safer to design jughead friendly roads.

And do you think Thai drivers would understand never mind respect any of those ideas? I don't!

That's where the civil engineering and design come in. You don't provide choices to enable doing things the Thai way - its my way [on] the highway. Not that it's likely to happen anyway. Foreign ideas don't get far in Thailand unless you can convince someone important that they thought of it first.

[IamNoone88]

Its not the U-turns that cause accidents. Its the people + unroadworthy vehicles (buses, trucks, vans) = fatal accidents.

[williet98248]

Let me see if I have this right.

A pickup was turning right.

A 10-wheel truck crashes into the pickup, killing one or more people.

A police pickup, presumably on it's way to the crash site, finds the crash site and crashes into it.

Did I get that right? I've got a headache now.

W

Uh, no. You didn't get it right. Read it again.

[Winniedapu]

Just another day in THE most dangerous country to drive in in the WORLD,forget the bogus statistics that it is second or third,it is FIRST.

There are more dangerous places to drive than Thailand despite what statistics say

Indeed. Well, one place, Libya. But then people will sometimes believe what they want to believe despite what statistics say. The problem is that beliefs are a lot less reliable than statistics. Otherwise, people would just go out and ask people what they believe instead of doing tedious statistical analyses. Wouldn't they?

Be a lot easier but I don't think it will catch on. Statistics, more than anything else, drives the world.

W

[MickGC]

There are much safer options for u-turns.

In the diagram below (for USA where they drive on the right) the type B jug-handle adds minimal cost to road construction, filters traffic off from the slow lane instead of the fast lane (so any tailback in excess of the waiting lane capacity is also in the slow lane or in a filter lane or the hard shoulder) allows vehicles waiting to cross to wait in safety off the road, gives good visibility in both directions, and can be coupled with traffic lights with a heavy bias to the main highway to permit safe crossing on very busy roads.

The central crossing would need to be configured as shown (to make a direct turn from the fast lane impossible to prevent impatient drivers from trying to jump the queue) and could have waiting space for 1 or 2 cars and a filter lane to make joining the fast lane on the far side safer.

A huge number of road accidents on highways are connected with u-turns as the paint on the road around them indicates.

Another alternative is to start using what we call in the UK roundabouts. (wong kom in Thai I think) However this would necessitate a huge amount of training as the system is dependent on driver discipline so is bound to fail initially.

Any one of those designs would be extremely dangerous here. Every movement would result in a head on collision.

[ozyjon]

I was reading an article on machines, machinery etc,

in an interview with a famous car builder he let it slip

when he said,, ''if cars were invented today, no way

would people be allowed to drive them''

i wonder ?

[Winniedapu]

Let me see if I have this right.

A pickup was turning right.

A 10-wheel truck crashes into the pickup, killing one or more people.

A police pickup, presumably on it's way to the crash site, finds the crash site and crashes into it.

Did I get that right? I've got a headache now.

W

Uh, no. You didn't get it right. Read it again.

Nah. I read it already. I got it right. Thanks anyway.

W

[jesimps]

Just another day in THE most dangerous country to drive in in the WORLD,forget the bogus statistics that it is second or third,it is FIRST.

There are more dangerous places to drive than Thailand despite what statistics say

Name one.

I haven't driven in every country in the world obviously, but have done in a lot. Some countries the driving is very bad but not aggresive. Others are so snarled up, and the roads so bad that you can't get a decent speed up so not so many bad accidents. Thailand is by FAR the most dangerous: fast cars, reasonable roads, face, complete disregard for other people and blatant flouting of the the traffic laws.

[oldlakey]

Just another day in THE most dangerous country to drive in in the WORLD,forget the bogus statistics that it is second or third,it is FIRST.

There are more dangerous places to drive than Thailand despite what statistics say

Yes there is Saudi Arabia but not many more and I have driven in many. This forum is about Thailand. I always wondered who designed the roads here and why? I have been given many answers and none of them are flattering.

I totally agree with you that is why I never mentioned any such as Saudi. When a statement like "Just another day in THE most dangerous country to drive in in the WORLD" is made you have to make the point that there are worse.

Oh thankyou for that information thats makes me feel very much better as my next visit to Thailand draws closer

[Chalard]

Just another day in THE most dangerous country to drive in in the WORLD,forget the bogus statistics that it is second or third,it is FIRST.

There are more dangerous places to drive than Thailand despite what statistics say

Name one.

I haven't driven in every country in the world obviously, but have done in a lot. Some countries the driving is very bad but not aggresive. Others are so snarled up, and the roads so bad that you can't get a decent speed up so not so many bad accidents. Thailand is by FAR the most dangerous: fast cars, reasonable roads, face, complete disregard for other people and blatant flouting of the the traffic laws.

Have you lived or driven in EGYPT..!!!

[tuanku]

There are much safer options for u-turns.

In the diagram below (for USA where they drive on the right) the type B jug-handle adds minimal cost to road construction, filters traffic off from the slow lane instead of the fast lane (so any tailback in excess of the waiting lane capacity is also in the slow lane or in a filter lane or the hard shoulder) allows vehicles waiting to cross to wait in safety off the road, gives good visibility in both directions, and can be coupled with traffic lights with a heavy bias to the main highway to permit safe crossing on very busy roads.

The central crossing would need to be configured as shown (to make a direct turn from the fast lane impossible to prevent impatient drivers from trying to jump the queue) and could have waiting space for 1 or 2 cars and a filter lane to make joining the fast lane on the far side safer.

A huge number of road accidents on highways are connected with u-turns as the paint on the road around them indicates.

Another alternative is to start using what we call in the UK roundabouts. (wong kom in Thai I think) However this would necessitate a huge amount of training as the system is dependent on driver discipline so is bound to fail initially.

Any one of those designs would be extremely dangerous here. Every movement would result in a head on collision.

Well you have to take into account these are drawn for a right hand drive country. Of course in Thailand the diagrams would be a mirror image. Sorry, thought that was obvious.

[drbill]

One more never ending tragedy on the roads. I agree with what most have said in replies. After living in the Kingdom on and off since the early 1970’s I honestly believe that Thai ways cannot change. This and even worse tragedies will never end.

[Winniedapu]

One more never ending tragedy on the roads. I agree with what most have said in replies. After living in the Kingdom on and off since the early 1970’s I honestly believe that Thai ways cannot change. This and even worse tragedies will never end.

I'm sure you're right, though many would disagree, I believe that those who understand Thailand have given up trying to help Thais.

I certainly do and I certainly have.

W

Edited May 27, 2016 by Winniedapu

[northernphil]

,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,he thought it was a problem with a broken axle. So if no broken axle I wonder what the problem was , I wait to find out.

[SOTIRIOS]

....'axle failure'.....what a pathetic life form...had to run away and call someone on that....

[diehard60]

A turning lane has one lane, but Thais like to make it into 2, 3, 4 or more lanes. Thai drivers have no respect for the other drivers on the road. They have NO driving etiquette.

[mesterm]

Just another day in THE most dangerous country to drive in in the WORLD,forget the bogus statistics that it is second or third,it is FIRST.

There are more dangerous places to drive than Thailand despite what statistics say

Like where?

[Crossy]

A number of U turns in our area are now "controlled" by traffic lights.

I put the word "controlled" in quotes as the lights are usually ignored during quiet hours, they do however appear to achieve their goal during the busy periods.

A step in the right direction.

Like where?

I would suggest anywhere on the sub-continent and most Arab countries (where many employed drivers are from, the sub-continent).

[billd766]

There are usually one or both of these common denominators, Speed and alcohol, generally either one is enough in LOS !!

Don't forget things like over tiredness and the fact that many Thai drivers also drink stuff like M150 or Red Bull to help them stay awake as well.

I think many drivers like this one own the truck and get paid per delivery, so if they can stay awake, the truck doesn't break down or crash, they get paid more money.

The problem with driver fatigue is that it sort of creeps up on you and when you finally give in you end up trashed for a day or so before you start all over again.

[selftaopath]

RIP to the deceased , U-turns kils and should be banned . I am terrified every time I have to use one. I watch out for trucks and just hope for the best.

But Thais will make their own U turns, as they do already if official U turns are a few hundred meters down the road. Banning U turns will not stop the accidents...better driving skills will!

Seems to me that the typical Thai believes they are exempt of following ANY rule of law. This is "Free Land" right? And they also "know" they have every "right" to operate any vehicle on any road any way they wish.

[kannot]

Thai U turns , road planning at its finest, the things are just a death trap on a road where stationary traffic has to merge with other traffic at speed.

[kannot]

Old saying SPEED KILLS, with extra help of cell phones now and loud conversation and eyes elsewhere, sad.

Yet planes fly at 600mph and we orbit at 67,000 mph one involves training the others pure chance though it hasnt always been that way especially during the "heavy bombardment"

[cumgranosalum]

it's a classic example of how poor road engineering/design kills people.

Yes, it's one of the aggravating factors.

Look at some of the lane markings and you can see a "design" that doesn't make any sense, even if one were to drive at slow speed.

absolutely, most people don't even consider road design whilst driving they just assume that everyone else is an idiot.

Unless Thailand addresses all 5 Es of road safety they will NEVER see a dramatic improvement.

[Rimmer]

A post has been removed:

11) You will not post slurs, degrading or overly negative comments directed towards Thailand, specific locations, Thai institutions such as the judicial or law enforcement system, Thai culture, Thai people or any other group on the basis of race, nationality, religion, gender or sexual orientation.

[Winniedapu]

A post has been removed:

11) You will not post slurs, degrading or overly negative comments directed towards Thailand, specific locations, Thai institutions such as the judicial or law enforcement system, Thai culture, Thai people or any other group on the basis of race, nationality, religion, gender or sexual orientation.

It would help me (and I suspect others), if you would kindly ask management to define the word 'overly' in the rules to make it less subjective.

W