So what did the Brexit supporters gain?

[AlexRich]

11 minutes ago, dick dasterdly said:

Re. the emboldened part (my emboldening), I disagree insofar as its not that he just thought he knew better than the British public - he tried to BULLY them with his 'promised' budget that he would enact in the event of a brexit vote .

 

Dumb move on his part, granted. But what will Hammond come up with? More debt I suspect, and more need for foreign investment ... not his fault of course, he's just having to pick up the pieces of an even dumber result.

[Khun Han]

4 hours ago, cumgranosalum said:

what would you do if Canada joined the EU???

 

I'd have another look at my world atlas.

[AlexRich]

He has an olde worlde atlas of the British Empire ... we're going back you know, taking back control for England and St George! 

 

Guardian? No mention of the Daily Mail article on financial jobs ... surprisingly negative given the source! ... 

[Khun Han]

3 hours ago, cumgranosalum said:

Han & Rock - peas in a pogrom - your concerns seem mainly Xenophobic or it it simply Teutophobia?...i don't really see any other rational in your prolific if rather blinkered postings. Whoops! forgot islamophobia too?

 

Wouldn't your Islamophobia comments be better directed at the eastern European member states that have threatened to break the rules to avoid such immigration?

[Khun Han]

He thinks that the Mail reporting on some finance industry a$$-cheek clenching (caused by Project Fear scaremongering) is some kind of killer debating blow. I don't know if the Mail also reported on the subsequent August rise in job vacancy figures, because he didn't provide a link for the article. Maybe he didn't want us to know?

[SgtRock]

11 minutes ago, Khun Han said:

 

Wouldn't your Islamophobia comments be better directed at the eastern European member states that have threatened to break the rules to avoid such immigration?

 

Too much for a single brain cell to compute.

 

Either that or the V4 are correct in what they are doing, even though it is going against EU policy, which makes a totally mockery of anyone who decries the UK for also trying to control immigration.

 

Anyway, as I posted on Friday

 

On 9/23/2016 at 9:44 AM, SgtRock said:

The V4 are making making serious noises about the EU, they are only interested in the money that they are receiving from the EU, when that dry's up OR the EU force migrant quota's on them, the V4 will become a totally different animal.

 

I believe Hungary is having a National referendum on 02 October. I also believe that it will be an overwhelming victory for no to EU immigrant quota's, which is going to lead to a massive fallout within the EU.

 

3 events that are going to cause massive problems in the EU in 2017.

 

1. The end of the ineffective euro 1.9 Trillion QE in March.

 

2. Hollande gets the boot

 

3. Merkel gets the boot.

 

The little events are too numerous and widespread to even attempt to try and list.

[AlexRich]

Another one for the "have your cake and eat it" brigade ... from Brexit supporting Telegraph ... bless. 

 

... apart from the inevitable job and tax losses, everything's awesome. Or perhaps they are just scaremongering, talking the country down, too lazy to trade with Outer Mongolia ... 

 

... Daily Mail not accessible in Thailand, so no links ... but you can access the full article via the company app. 

 

http://www.telegraph.co.uk/news/2016/09/24/brexit-warning-us-bank-bosses-from-goldman-sachs-morgan-stanley/

[AlexRich]

Looks like project Brexit ... where you can have your cake and eat it, is going horribly wrong? 

 

" ... several of America’s biggest banks and corporations have warned Theresa May they will pre-emptively shift operations into Europe unless she can provide early clarity on the future shape of EU-UK relations, The Telegraph has learned".

 

“The message was clear from at least some of those present: if Theresa May cannot provide some early clarity about where the negotiations will end up, the only way to avoid that uncertainty would be a move towards Europe – there will not be time to wait,” said the City source with knowledge of the meeting".

 

"Financial services generate more than £60bn pounds a year in tax, a quarter of which comes from foreign-owned banks, revenues that the Treasury fears will now be put in jeopardy".

 

"The move piles pressure on Mrs May whose determination to “take back control” of Britain’s borders after Brexit, it is now widely assumed, will make it impossible to retain the City’s current “passporting” rights that enable UK-based financial services companies to trade freely in Europe.

"A separate source in Whitehall said that Philip Hammond, the Chancellor, has walked back his initially optimistic predictions for the City post-Brexit, cautioning banks that the retention of “passporting” is highly unlikely given Mrs May’s stance on ending EU free movement".

The Telegraph understands that Mr Hammond has already cautioned bank bosses that delaying taking back control of borders for three years would be politically impossible, a position that would leave British negotiators ultimately reliant on EU goodwill.

“Financial services is very complicated and asking the EU to concede transitional arrangements is fixing one key piece of the negotiation before it has even started,” Prof Winters said, “We’d be asking them to give away one of their biggest pieces of leverage.”

In Brussels the current mood is defiant. Asked by The Telegraph recently about possible transitional controls, a senior EU official shrugged and smiled, adding: “Why would we? What’s in it for us?”

 

[Khun Han]

"said the city source with knowledge of the meeting"

 

Well that's that, then. More conclusive proof provided by Alex. 

[Khun Han]

In Brussels the current mood is defiant. Asked by The Telegraph recently about possible transitional controls, a senior EU official shrugged and smiled, adding: “Why would we? What’s in it for us?”

Another EU clown with his head in the sand (or should that be an ivory tower?). What's in it for him is the possibility of keeping his cushy job when all the supportive sitting governments have been voted out and replaced by governments pushing restricted immigration agendas.

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Quote this

 

[AlexRich]

Chancellor Philip Hammond must come up with a convincing new long-term plan to cut the budget deficit or risk losing the faith of markets, credit ratings agency Moody’s has warned.

 

Sunday Telegraph

[AlexRich]

Whatever proof is provided, even if provided in a Tory Brexit loving rag, the forum hypocrite will continue his denial of the evidence ... that Brexit is not going to be great for the UK and the so-called scare-mongering is about to become reality. 

 

Time is not the friend of deluded people that are in denial. 

[Khun Han]

15 minutes ago, AlexRich said:

Chancellor Philip Hammond must come up with a convincing new long-term plan to cut the budget deficit or risk losing the faith of markets, credit ratings agency Moody’s has warned.

 

Sunday Telegraph

 

And this is connected to brexit in what way?

[Khun Han]

Someone thinks that posting articles  based on rumour and using unnamed sources (quite often invented by the journalist) is "proof". My word, some people are gullible.

[dick dasterdly]

35 minutes ago, AlexRich said:

Looks like project Brexit ... where you can have your cake and eat it, is going horribly wrong? 

 

" ... several of America’s biggest banks and corporations have warned Theresa May they will pre-emptively shift operations into Europe unless she can provide early clarity on the future shape of EU-UK relations, The Telegraph has learned".

 

“The message was clear from at least some of those present: if Theresa May cannot provide some early clarity about where the negotiations will end up, the only way to avoid that uncertainty would be a move towards Europe – there will not be time to wait,” said the City source with knowledge of the meeting".

 

"Financial services generate more than £60bn pounds a year in tax, a quarter of which comes from foreign-owned banks, revenues that the Treasury fears will now be put in jeopardy".

 

"The move piles pressure on Mrs May whose determination to “take back control” of Britain’s borders after Brexit, it is now widely assumed, will make it impossible to retain the City’s current “passporting” rights that enable UK-based financial services companies to trade freely in Europe.

"A separate source in Whitehall said that Philip Hammond, the Chancellor, has walked back his initially optimistic predictions for the City post-Brexit, cautioning banks that the retention of “passporting” is highly unlikely given Mrs May’s stance on ending EU free movement".

The Telegraph understands that Mr Hammond has already cautioned bank bosses that delaying taking back control of borders for three years would be politically impossible, a position that would leave British negotiators ultimately reliant on EU goodwill.

“Financial services is very complicated and asking the EU to concede transitional arrangements is fixing one key piece of the negotiation before it has even started,” Prof Winters said, “We’d be asking them to give away one of their biggest pieces of leverage.”

In Brussels the current mood is defiant. Asked by The Telegraph recently about possible transitional controls, a senior EU official shrugged and smiled, adding: “Why would we? What’s in it for us?”

 

Sorry to be so simplistic - but who cares what the 'experts' are now saying having already having been proven so wrong after their campaign of fear to prevent a brexit vote in the referendum? 

 

They failed and are now trying the same thing - but in the future.....

 

The EU is now in a very difficult situation as the population of member countries realise that the promised UK armageddon has not happened - and are similarly unhappy about various EU policies/costs etc. etc.  EU politicians (particularly those in EU countries) are feeling the heat.

 

Who knows the eventual result?  Certainly not me!

 

Politicians and 'experts' though keep trying to convince everyone that they know what will happen....  Excuse me, but bulls' manure - they have no idea either - but they have a vested interest in their own campaign for power and personal wealth.

[dick dasterdly]

39 minutes ago, Khun Han said:

In Brussels the current mood is defiant. Asked by The Telegraph recently about possible transitional controls, a senior EU official shrugged and smiled, adding: “Why would we? What’s in it for us?”

Another EU clown with his head in the sand (or should that be an ivory tower?). What's in it for him is the possibility of keeping his cushy job when all the supportive sitting governments have been voted out and replaced by governments pushing restricted immigration agendas.

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Much as I agree with the sentiments expressed in your post (which has gone horribly wrong for some reason) - I'd point out that the politicians in EU countries are also benefiting one way or another from the EU 'largess' - or hoping to do so in the future with the ridiculous EMP salaries etc.

Edited September 25, 2016 by dick dasterdly

[Khun Han]

"Sorry to be so simplistic - but who cares what the 'experts' are now saying having already having been proven so wrong after their campaign of fear to prevent a brexit vote in the referendum? 

 

They failed and are now trying the same thing - but in the future....."

 

Exactly dick. It's the same people who told us that armageddon would start immediately after a 'leave' vote (such as Xavier Rolet). And that turned out to be a load of codswallop.

 

It's my view that most of the main proponents of 'remain' have big vested interests in Europe, and they're really far more concerned about what will happen to Europe post-brexit than what will happen to the UK.

Edited September 25, 2016 by Khun Han

[rockingrobin]

8 minutes ago, dick dasterdly said:

Sorry to be so simplistic - but who cares what the 'experts' are now saying having already having been proven so wrong after their campaign of fear to prevent a brexit vote in the referendum? 

 

They failed and are now trying the same thing - but in the future.....

 

The EU is now in a very difficult situation as the population of member countries realise that the promised UK armageddon has not happened - and are similarly unhappy about various EU policies/costs etc. etc.  EU politicians (particularly those in EU countries) are feeling the heat.

 

Who knows the eventual result?  Certainly not me!

 

Politicians and 'experts' though keep trying to convince everyone that they know what will happen....  Excuse me, but bulls' manure - they have no idea either - but they have a vested interest in their own campaign for power and personal wealth.

I would be surprised if the banks did not seek clarity, and make contingency arrangements if none was forthcoming

[Khun Han]

1 minute ago, rockingrobin said:

I would be surprised if the banks did not seek clarity, and make contingency arrangements if none was forthcoming

 

And I would be surprised if they did not get some.

[AlexRich]

The major American Banks have fired a warning shot across the bows of HMS Great Britain ... but they don't really mean it ... they're just bluffing ... more expert/journalist  hearsay ... they're talking down the country ... blah blah blah ...same old nonsense being wheeled out on this thread.

 

We are talking about quotes from the Daily Telegraph ... a brexit supporting newspaper ... I'll credit them with one thing, they didn't try to deny or discredit the report of the meeting. Reality bites, and more to come.

 

The warning was serious, has implications for jobs and tax revenues, another example of the "denial" of the consequences of Brexit. It's only just starting chaps ... we haven't even invoked Article 50 yet ... but quite right, best to get your excuses in early.  

[Khun Han]

Looks like PM May could have been a brexiter on the quiet all along:

 

http://www.bbc.co.uk/news/uk-politics-37465452

[Khun Han]

The boy who cried wolf, with his endless unnamed sources and discredited voices of doom.

[dick dasterdly]

2 minutes ago, rockingrobin said:

I would be surprised if the banks did not seek clarity, and make contingency arrangements if none was forthcoming

 

8 minutes ago, Khun Han said:

"Sorry to be so simplistic - but who cares what the 'experts' are now saying having already having been proven so wrong after their campaign of fear to prevent a brexit vote in the referendum? 

 

They failed and are now trying the same thing - but in the future....."

 

Exactly dick. It's the same people who told us that armageddon would start immediately after a 'leave' vote (such as Xavier Rolet). And that turned out to be a load of codswallop.

 

It's my view that most of the main proponents of 'remain' have big vested interests in Europe, and they're really far more concerned about what will happen to Europe post-brexit than what will happen to the UK.

I agree to a certain extent, but also fear that the (likely) collapse of the EU would lead to another world recession.

 

Unfortunately those 'running' the EU are likely to give up their way over-paid jobs, and therefore likely to deny any change that compromises their financial position and positions of power.

 

Similarly, politicians in EU countries who either have a feeling of power from being part of the EU, or hope to get well-paid jobs within the EU once they lose their jobs in their own country - are also unlikely to admit that many things about the EU needs to change.

[Khun Han]

3 minutes ago, dick dasterdly said:

 

I agree to a certain extent, but also fear that the (likely) collapse of the EU would lead to another world recession.

 

Unfortunately those 'running' the EU are likely to give up their way over-paid jobs, and therefore likely to deny any change that compromises their financial position and positions of power.

 

Similarly, politicians in EU countries who either have a feeling of power from being part of the EU, or hope to get well-paid jobs within the EU once they lose their jobs in their own country - are also unlikely to admit that many things about the EU needs to change.

 

I think the issue for governing politicians in some of the wealthiest EU countries is that a lot of them are probably going to be out of a job soon. And they will have been replaced by politicians on an EU reform (particularly on free movement) ticket, on which they will be expected to deliver. At that point, the EU is going to be stuck between a rock and a hard place.

[AlexRich]

Unnamed sources? Voices of doom?

 

... denial has turned into delusion ... sourced from a Brexit loving newspaper .... links attached ... 

[rockingrobin]

Is Boris Johnson correct about elections next year

 

http://www.huffingtonpost.co.uk/entry/boris-johnson-sets-another-article-50-date-despite-theresa-may-slapping-him-down-for-doing-this-last-time_uk_57e78573e4b0e81629a9ee08?ir=UK+Politics&utm_hp_ref=uk-politics

 

If may 2017 is the date ,it would be nearly one since  the referendum

 

[rockingrobin]

http://uk.reuters.com/article/uk-britain-eu-fox-idUKKCN11V0C7?il=0

 

 

[Khun Han]

31 minutes ago, rockingrobin said:

http://uk.reuters.com/article/uk-britain-eu-fox-idUKKCN11V0C7?il=0

 

 

 

Interesting. Unknown source though.

[rockingrobin]

49 minutes ago, rockingrobin said:

http://uk.reuters.com/article/uk-britain-eu-fox-idUKKCN11V0C7?il=0

 

 

 

17 minutes ago, Khun Han said:

 

Interesting. Unknown source though.

Coming out of the customs union is a no brainer, it has to happen to be able to conduct your own FTA

What is curious  is the timing, considering a new post of international trade secretary I would have thought it was a given.It is not re assuring if this is being confirmed now  that the government is  anywhere close to start  its negotation

 

On the same theme I wonder how the  Irish border will be kept soft and non eu goods prevented from  entering

[cumgranosalum]

So far just about all the short-term predictions about Brexit have been proved correct - It seems obvious, but it appears that some Brexiteers need to be reminded that the mid and long-term issues won't manifest themselves until their respective mid and long .terms.

 

Eventually Brexit will fail because of the basic nature of Brexit  - People’s ideas of what Brexit actually means are very different, and therein lies the problem.

Brexit was a poorly defined concept encompassing vague ideas that everyone interprets differently, so until there is some agreement as to what it is we are trying to achieve means that it is more or less impossible to work towards a common goal even as everyone is working on their own agenda. That will be the downfall of Brexit; it is really just a loose affiliation of disparate ideologies and misconceptions..

Edited September 25, 2016 by cumgranosalum