Andaman Al Posted June 26, 2016 Share Posted June 26, 2016 Just out of curiosity, how many do overs do you get before it goes into the rock-paper-scissors round? Exactly! So if there is a revote and we remain, then does that mean 1 each and no referendum has actually taken place. Do we have best of 3? or I guess if Bremain doesnt win then it will be best of 5! The people have spoken, Britain must suck it up and make the best of it now. I guess if Trump or Clinton wins 51% to 49% (which is what the count will be), the winning side will say its ok to have another election because the losers are not happy? Welcome to Democracy everyone. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest Posted June 26, 2016 Share Posted June 26, 2016 The petition has 2,700,000 signatures and the number is increasing. https://petition.parliament.uk/petitions/131215 This would be the face saving way for Britain to get out of this mess. First vote was the angry, drunken vote. Now, when even non-politically tuned Brits are realising what the brexit really means, its time to have second, the sober vote. http://skepticalphilosopher.blogspot.ca/2009/09/persian-strategy-deliberating-while.html The "I didn't know what I was doing" excuse. I'm thinking that "do overs" aren't should not be allowed. Now, what is the real downside of having a re-vote? If people really want to leave the EU, they will run to the polls and say so. If, after sleeping the hangover off, folks thinking clearly once again, want to stay.. then that's what the people actually want. The 350M/week for NHS was sold as a known lie, which was simple enough to anger many people against the EU. The second vote is to eliminate the angry votes, the feeling based votes and make people to think before they actually place votes. The second vote is the vote when the populists lies have been proven wrong. A chance. But hey, this is up to the UK people what they want to do. Second vote would have been one easy way out to cut the losses. For us EU citizens it's quite the same what do you decide to do. So do whatever you want and please do it fast so that we can make realistic plans for the future. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
alanrchase Posted June 26, 2016 Share Posted June 26, 2016 Just out of curiosity, how many do overs do you get before it goes into the rock-paper-scissors round? Exactly! So if there is a revote and we remain, then does that mean 1 each and no referendum has actually taken place. Do we have best of 3? or I guess if Bremain doesnt win then it will be best of 5! The people have spoken, Britain must suck it up and make the best of it now. I guess if Trump or Clinton wins 51% to 49% (which is what the count will be), the winning side will say its ok to have another election because the losers are not happy? Welcome to Democracy everyone. You are believing newspaper talk. Not going to happen. Rupert Murdock (sorry for the spelling) is probably enjoying a cocktail on his yaught at the moment. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Thaiwine Posted June 26, 2016 Share Posted June 26, 2016 The petition has 2,700,000 signatures and the number is increasing. https://petition.parliament.uk/petitions/131215 This would be the face saving way for Britain to get out of this mess. First vote was the angry, drunken vote. Now, when even non-politically tuned Brits are realising what the brexit really means, its time to have second, the sober vote. http://skepticalphilosopher.blogspot.ca/2009/09/persian-strategy-deliberating-while.html The "I didn't know what I was doing" excuse. I'm thinking that "do overs" aren't should not be allowed. Now, what is the real downside of having a re-vote? If people really want to leave the EU, they will run to the polls and say so. If, after sleeping the hangover off, folks thinking clearly once again, want to stay.. then that's what the people actually want. The 350M/week for NHS was sold as a known lie, which was simple enough to anger many people against the EU. The second vote is to eliminate the angry votes, the feeling based votes and make people to think before they actually place votes. The second vote is the vote when the populists lies have been proven wrong. A chance. But hey, this is up to the UK people what they want to do. Second vote would have been one easy way out to cut the losses. For us EU citizens it's quite the same what do you decide to do. So do whatever you want and please do it fast so that we can make realistic plans for the future. Thats like saying we run each general election twice just to see what the diffrence is and we go with the most popular, thats not how it works in the UK Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
mopar71 Posted June 26, 2016 Share Posted June 26, 2016 In this Brexit case it has been obvious the majority of (a lot of obviously uninformed) voters made their decision with their heart and NOT with their brain. The demand for a new refendum confirms this. 16 million voted Remain. How many have demanded a new referendum? 2-3 million from around the planet? That is hardly confirmation. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Andreas2 Posted June 26, 2016 Share Posted June 26, 2016 Stupid is as stupid does... The creator of the petition for a 2nd EU vote is a Leave campaigner who thought Remain would win Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest Posted June 26, 2016 Share Posted June 26, 2016 Now, what is the real downside of having a re-vote? If people really want to leave the EU, they will run to the polls and say so. If, after sleeping the hangover off, folks thinking clearly once again, want to stay.. then that's what the people actually want. The 350M/week for NHS was sold as a known lie, which was simple enough to anger many people against the EU. The second vote is to eliminate the angry votes, the feeling based votes and make people to think before they actually place votes. The second vote is the vote when the populists lies have been proven wrong. A chance. But hey, this is up to the UK people what they want to do. Second vote would have been one easy way out to cut the losses. For us EU citizens it's quite the same what do you decide to do. So do whatever you want and please do it fast so that we can make realistic plans for the future. Thats like saying we run each general election twice just to see what the diffrence is and we go with the most popular, thats not how it works in the UK No. It's like saying: Fine, you got your steam out, we understand, we all want and need to vent every now and then. There is a high possibility that your poll result didn't really represent what the most of Brits actually want, but it was more of an statement of anger. So why not to make an confirmation run. Most of the votes don't really deserve another chance. This decision is in the highest possible magnitude and therefore deserves a second chance. It's just a second vote, nothing more. People's frustration has been noted, even at the centre of the EU. More importantly at the UK, which on your part controls what happens in the EU. So far UK already lost a lot. This is to cut the losses and secure the future. Wether the be inside of the EU or not. Current result will divide the UK to the point it will break apart. Not something anybody wishes. I think it would be unwise not to let people to vote again. Each UK-citizen have the same voting right as they did before. If the UK folks still wish to exit, we'll shake hands and say goodbye for decades of co-operation. I think that is fair for both UK and EU. What do you think? Fair, not fair? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest Posted June 26, 2016 Share Posted June 26, 2016 Stupid is as stupid does... The creator of the petition for a 2nd EU vote is a Leave campaigner who thought Remain would win I can only assume that math is not your strong suit. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
mopar71 Posted June 26, 2016 Share Posted June 26, 2016 If Parliament negates the will of the people (the ones who actually turned up to vote Leave) there will be some changes come next election. If the new members disregard the will of the people, they will be voted out again. If it keeps happening, you are in for a world of trouble. Perhaps the best way for Remain to become victorious in the end and without MPs angering the voter is for the EU to take the Brexit vote as a wake up call and make some major changes in how they do things. That could give MPs a reason to ignore the referendum and remain in the EU. However, based on how the EU has already responded none of that looks likely. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Oceanbat Posted June 26, 2016 Share Posted June 26, 2016 It's being reported as a 4chan hoax. Bots have been Signing it OB Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
jeab1980 Posted June 26, 2016 Share Posted June 26, 2016 (edited) Double post] Edited June 26, 2016 by jeab1980 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Thaiwine Posted June 26, 2016 Share Posted June 26, 2016 Now, what is the real downside of having a re-vote? If people really want to leave the EU, they will run to the polls and say so. If, after sleeping the hangover off, folks thinking clearly once again, want to stay.. then that's what the people actually want. The 350M/week for NHS was sold as a known lie, which was simple enough to anger many people against the EU. The second vote is to eliminate the angry votes, the feeling based votes and make people to think before they actually place votes. The second vote is the vote when the populists lies have been proven wrong. A chance. But hey, this is up to the UK people what they want to do. Second vote would have been one easy way out to cut the losses. For us EU citizens it's quite the same what do you decide to do. So do whatever you want and please do it fast so that we can make realistic plans for the future. Thats like saying we run each general election twice just to see what the diffrence is and we go with the most popular, thats not how it works in the UK No. It's like saying: Fine, you got your steam out, we understand, we all want and need to vent every now and then. There is a high possibility that your poll result didn't really represent what the most of Brits actually want, but it was more of an statement of anger. So why not to make an confirmation run. Most of the votes don't really deserve another chance. This decision is in the highest possible magnitude and therefore deserves a second chance. It's just a second vote, nothing more. People's frustration has been noted, even at the centre of the EU. More importantly at the UK, which on your part controls what happens in the EU. So far UK already lost a lot. This is to cut the losses and secure the future. Wether the be inside of the EU or not. Current result will divide the UK to the point it will break apart. Not something anybody wishes. I think it would be unwise not to let people to vote again. Each UK-citizen have the same voting right as they did before. If the UK folks still wish to exit, we'll shake hands and say goodbye for decades of co-operation. I think that is fair for both UK and EU. What do you think? Fair, not fair? The UK will break apart anyway, the scottish nationalists will find any and every excuse until they can get a majority in Scotland to leave the UK, I am not for rerunning elections / referendums. people were told you have one chance use it, they failed to use it knowing the risks they made their choice. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
jeab1980 Posted June 26, 2016 Share Posted June 26, 2016 As I predicted http://www.bbc.com/news/uk-politics-eu-referendum-36634407?SThisFB Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest Posted June 26, 2016 Share Posted June 26, 2016 Now, what is the real downside of having a re-vote? If people really want to leave the EU, they will run to the polls and say so. If, after sleeping the hangover off, folks thinking clearly once again, want to stay.. then that's what the people actually want. The 350M/week for NHS was sold as a known lie, which was simple enough to anger many people against the EU. The second vote is to eliminate the angry votes, the feeling based votes and make people to think before they actually place votes. The second vote is the vote when the populists lies have been proven wrong. A chance. But hey, this is up to the UK people what they want to do. Second vote would have been one easy way out to cut the losses. For us EU citizens it's quite the same what do you decide to do. So do whatever you want and please do it fast so that we can make realistic plans for the future. Thats like saying we run each general election twice just to see what the diffrence is and we go with the most popular, thats not how it works in the UK It's saying, on this occasion, you should be allowed to have the second chance, on this important occasion. If the majority of people of UK folks still want to say "But I'm Thai/Brit, you don't understand Thainess/Being a British", then it's quite clear that UK should be out of the EU. Primadonnas can and should do their own acts as they wish. They just might loose their audience once they get too tiresome. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Dumbastheycome Posted June 26, 2016 Share Posted June 26, 2016 It is interesting that although "referendum" results are usually a guage of public opinion which Govts. use to formulate policy this result is taken asa verbatim conclusion. Electoral votes are a different issue. The Uk adheres to a "first past the winning post" electoral system without compulsory voting. Thus a Govt. can be elected on the basis of a minority of population votes in total. Apathetic and/or dissuaded voters are the key to a win in such a system. Hardly the mark of an honest representative democracy. By the way...did a referendum result take the UK "into" the EU originally? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
sujoop Posted June 26, 2016 Share Posted June 26, 2016 Scottish Parliament could veto Brexit: Can you imagine the fury of the British people if you stopped them leaving Europe? asked the presenter. Ms Sturgeon replied: I can, but its perhaps similar to the fury of many of the people in Scotland right now as we face the prospect of being taken out of the European Union against our will. http://www.independent.co.uk/news/uk/politics/nicola-sturgeon-veto-brexit-scottish-parliament-eu-referendum-scotland-latest-a7104046.html Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Andreas2 Posted June 26, 2016 Share Posted June 26, 2016 I downloaded the data myself with this result... Looks a little bit different than in the article I referred to. Thailand is on rank 29 with 561 votes 2nd_vote.pdf Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
wooloomooloo Posted June 26, 2016 Share Posted June 26, 2016 I think it would be unwise not to let people to vote again. Each UK-citizen have the same voting right as they did before. If the UK folks still wish to exit, we'll shake hands and say goodbye for decades of co-operation. I think that is fair for both UK and EU. What do you think? Fair, not fair? What do I think? I think your idea is bonkers. We've had four months of campaigning and a referendum. The majority of 52% prevailed. It's not hard to understand, is it? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
jeab1980 Posted June 26, 2016 Share Posted June 26, 2016 I downloaded the data myself with this result... Looks a little bit different than in the article I referred to. Thailand is on rank 29 with 561 votes At least 4 of those are fake with fake names and postcodesso easy to do its a pathetic petition and is now being investigated for fraud Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
tw25rw Posted June 26, 2016 Share Posted June 26, 2016 Stupid is as stupid does... The creator of the petition for a 2nd EU vote is a Leave campaigner who thought Remain would win I can only assume that math is not your strong suit. It's true. It was initiated by a leave campaigner. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest Posted June 26, 2016 Share Posted June 26, 2016 (edited) I think it would be unwise not to let people to vote again. Each UK-citizen have the same voting right as they did before. If the UK folks still wish to exit, we'll shake hands and say goodbye for decades of co-operation. I think that is fair for both UK and EU. What do you think? Fair, not fair? What do I think? I think your idea is bonkers. We've had four months of campaigning and a referendum. The majority of 52% prevailed. It's not hard to understand, is it? I really don't care about you old geezers. I don't. You are the reason I wish EU would eject the UK from our map as soon as possible. Old geezers have nothing to offer to the EU. However there are plenty of smarter folks in UK, the ones who wish to stay and who wish to make EU a community for us all, which functions better in the future. These people are the majority in UK as we all know. These, smarter folks, were sleeping during the election day and have awoken since. I'm a lazy person and tend to react to events, only when it's really necessary. I don't like to participate to discussions, which I feel that are just a silly talk. Most of the discussions are like that. The younger generations are even less interested to participate to the hideous voting polls, than I am. If the vote is going to be a done deal, they and I would not bother to go to the polls and place a vote. Why bother the effort? Now, if anyone would have predicted that the Leave EU would have won, there would have been plenty of reactivated youngsters who have gotten to the polls. They would have made the difference. So, what is more important? To win this poll or to represent what people actually want? I wish the real voice of people to be heard. What they really think. Edit: Grammar etc. Edited June 26, 2016 by Guest Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
bkkcanuck8 Posted June 26, 2016 Share Posted June 26, 2016 As I predicted http://www.bbc.com/news/uk-politics-eu-referendum-36634407?SThisFB My nom de plume was on there -- not because I was trying to support it but just to show how stupid online unverified petitions are .... Big Bad Wolf... Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
wooloomooloo Posted June 26, 2016 Share Posted June 26, 2016 They were sleeping during the election day and have awoken since. Don't lie. All your clever friends turned out in their millions (16mm+) but were outvoted fair and square by the leavers. Not hard to understand, is it? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
wooloomooloo Posted June 26, 2016 Share Posted June 26, 2016 As I predicted http://www.bbc.com/news/uk-politics-eu-referendum-36634407?SThisFB My nom de plume was on there -- not because I was trying to support it but just to show how stupid online unverified petitions are .... Big Bad Wolf... Thanks for that. I might kick the VPN on on an Albanian server. You'll see my name in a few hours and know I've signed as I have quite an unusual name, Bob Buttocks. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest Posted June 26, 2016 Share Posted June 26, 2016 I have no reason to lie. I prefer the truth, what ever it is. Not the face value. Truth is the building block to go forward. Not the face value. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Krataiboy Posted June 26, 2016 Share Posted June 26, 2016 (edited) How sad that a minority of bad-sport Brits cannot accept the democratic will of the majority. Has mass immigration so diluted our famed sense of fair play? Strange. I don't remember petitions flying around when the Tories were swept into power despite nearly two-thirds of the electorate not voting for them. As for Tsar Nicola, her bid to overturn the result of the last Scottish referendum is doomed to failure. If she does what the second-Brexit-referendum petitioners are trying to do, and manages to impose a new referendum which reversed the result of the first Scottish poll, Scotland would have to re-apply to join the EU as a separate sovereign nation. Even assuming such a bid were successful (no gimme if the price of oil remains depressed) Scotland would a consequence immediately lose its handsome subsidy from the Westminster exchequer and have to adopt the toxic Euro. How much independence does Ms Sturgeon believe would come Scotland's way as one of the poorest relations in a dysfunctional family of 26 nations facing bankruptcy and more messy divorces? A major but little-publicised reason to celebrate the Brexit vote is that it enables Britain to opt out of the disastrous TTIP "free trade" deal now being negotiated - in conditions of unparalleled secrecy - between the EU. Among other horrors, the TTIP would open up our NHS and other vital public services and utilities to takeovers by US-based corporations. Any future British government seeking to regulate their activities would risk being sued for billions of dollars - not in the UK, but via an international kangaroo court. This is the real reason Barack Obama - TTIP's cheerleader - came scuttling over last week to beg us to remain in Europe - the equivalent of asking turkeys to vote for Christmas. Mercifully, we had more sense. Any British citizen who doubts the damage TTIP would do to our economic independence and national sovereignty needs to do some digging - and then join the growing chorus of dissent against this pernicious bid to rob the British people of our most priceless and irreplaceable national assets. Edited June 26, 2016 by Krataiboy Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
bkkcanuck8 Posted June 26, 2016 Share Posted June 26, 2016 (edited) As for Tsar Nicola, her bid to overturn the result of the last Scottish referendum is doomed to failure. If she does what the second-Brexit-referendum petitioners are trying to do, and manages to impose a new referendum which reversed the result of the first Scottish poll, Scotland would have to re-apply to join the EU as a separate sovereign nation. So lets see the UK referendum results should be respected, but the Scottish referendum results should not be. Scotland barely voted to stay in the UK based partially on promises (not kept), partially on being in the EU (out if separated). Scotland voted overwhelmingly to stay in the EU (larger majority than UK won in it's referendum). Based on the results of those two referendum and how you cannot have both.... it seems very naturally that a referendum should ask the Scottish to chose which of the two they prefer. That is of course if you truly believe in democracy... and fair play... Edited June 26, 2016 by bkkcanuck8 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest Posted June 26, 2016 Share Posted June 26, 2016 How sad that a minority of bad-sport Brits cannot accept the democratic will of the majority. ... Ah, our old friend Kratayboy. We haven't seen you for an while at the Phuket Forum. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
evadgib Posted June 26, 2016 Share Posted June 26, 2016 (edited) Before lulu or is it wee jimmy cranky starts that old chestnut she should be reminded that the English should also have their say as per any other divorce! Edited June 26, 2016 by evadgib Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
wooloomooloo Posted June 26, 2016 Share Posted June 26, 2016 I have no reason to lie. I prefer the truth, what ever it is. Not the face value. Truth is the building block to go forward. Not the face value. Good luck with the second referendum. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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