Using Credit Card

[wavemaster]

So mostly while here I've been using cash, but today in Rimping I used my card which has a zero rate fee for foreign currency transfers.

When the checkout lady put the card in the machine, on the screen it showed both the THB amount and also a GBP amount along with an awful exchange rate of 0.43 THB to the pound, (it's currently 0.47)... the receipt she gave my only showed the THB amount, which is what I want to be charged.

So my question, are these K Bank machines charging me in BHT or GBP?? I hope it's BHT, but why did the machine show what it did.

[taxout]

No guaranty, but then you should be charged baht. She and you should have punched some buttons if you were to be charged in sterling, so that you had a chance to accept the exchange to sterling. But I can't say for sure this always happens. You'll have to check your credit card statement, online if you can.

Edited June 28, 2016 by taxout

[ardokano]

Its DCC (Dynamic Currency Conversion).

So its mean in this is system get exchange rate and dedact from your account.

But in my experience it has always been high and rate than the rate of the bank issuing the card.

So I pay in domestic corency.

Edited June 28, 2016 by ardokano

[bubba1]

Exchange rate of .43 ? Do you mean 43?

[manarak]

Exchange rate of .43 ? Do you mean 43?

consequence of Brexit.

now you get less than 50 Satang for 1 Pound :-)

Seriously, OP, just forget about using credit cards abroad.

All card issuers and all banks of this world milk credit card transactions using defavorable forex rates, fees and/or commissions.

When they don't take commission, their rates is outrageous and when their rates are good, they take commission, which at least makes up 1.5% of the final price although I already saw additional costs in excess of 5% on a 100 USD purchase.

Charging you abroad in your home account currency, as a previous poster pointed out, is called DCC. This scam is about 10 years old, and in exchange of 2% additional costs, you get the advantage of knowing immediately how much your will be charged on your account.

Of course the price paid by consumers for this service is much higher than any benefit one could get, except under very special circumstances.

The worst thing is, credit card companies used to (I don't know if this info is still current) to give KICKBACKS to the vendors who are successful in finding suckers for their DCC scam...

[Mark123456]

If the receipt shows the amount in baht, you paid in baht. A camera shop once tried to use DCC without asking me, which is illegal anywhere else as far as I know, and should be here, and the receipt they gave me showed the amount in GBP.

I disagree that you should forget about using credit cards abroad. The issuers don't decide what the exchange rates are: If it's a Visa card they will use the rates set by Visa for the day, which are usually quite fair. They may, and often do, add a commission though, but even then, for me at least, it's cheaper to shop with a debit or credit card than it is to withdraw cash. Either way I end up paying 2% commission on the exchange but if I withdraw cash, I have to pay an extra 200 baht to the greedy local banks as well.

The protection offered by banks when buying higher value stuff is very useful too. Pay in cash and you will end up arguing with a local shop owner if the goods are faulty and you want a refund; pay with a credit or debit card and your bank will reverse the charges, leaving the shop owner having to argue his case to get the money back. I know which position I'd rather be in.

Edited June 29, 2016 by Mark123456

[stevenl]

If the receipt shows the amount in baht, you paid in baht. A camera shop once tried to use DCC without asking me, which is illegal anywhere else as far as I know, and should be here, and the receipt they gave me showed the amount in GBP.

I disagree that you should forget about using credit cards abroad. The issuers don't decide what the exchange rates are: If it's a Visa card they will use the rates set by Visa for the day, which are usually quite fair. They may, and often do, add a commission though, but even then, for me at least, it's cheaper to shop with a debit or credit card than it is to withdraw cash. Either way I end up paying 2% commission on the exchange but if I withdraw cash, I have to pay an extra 200 baht to the greedy local banks as well.

The protection offered by banks when buying higher value stuff is very useful too. Pay in cash and you will end up arguing with a local shop owner if the goods are faulty and you want a refund; pay with a credit or debit card and your bank will reverse the charges, leaving the shop owner having to argue his case to get the money back. I know which position I'd rather be in.

The receipt mentioned us probably the shop receipt, so no connection to the currency.

The cc slip though will show the currency. And in the OP's case it sounds like it will not be in Thai baht.

[55Jay]

If the slip showed Baht as the final total paid, then you're ok. We are proactive and tell the cashier "Thai Baht" when we had them our card. We watch closely and if they glance at us when the choice is prompted on screen, we say "Thai Baht" again.

On several occasions, I've noticed exchange rate information printed at the very top of the merchant slip. I believe it is SCB card swipe machines that do that, but not 100% sure.

[TerryLH]

"...but if I withdraw cash, I have to pay an extra 200 baht to the greedy local banks as well."

Not if you withdraw over the counter at a bank. Including mall banks.

[speedtripler]

"...but if I withdraw cash, I have to pay an extra 200 baht to the greedy local banks as well."

Not if you withdraw over the counter at a bank. Including mall banks.

io had a friend on holiday who tried this ,the banks were having none of it and told him to go outside and use the atms ..........

they used to be fine with it ,i use thai cards mainly so it doesnt affect me but i can see them going this way in future if

everyone is coming in to withdraw instead of using the atm to save 200 thb

[goldenbrwn1]

Exchange rate of .43 ? Do you mean 43?

consequence of Brexit.

now you get less than 50 Satang for 1 Pound :-)

Seriously, OP, just forget about using credit cards abroad.

All card issuers and all banks of this world milk credit card transactions using defavorable forex rates, fees and/or commissions.

When they don't take commission, their rates is outrageous and when their rates are good, they take commission, which at least makes up 1.5% of the final price although I already saw additional costs in excess of 5% on a 100 USD purchase.

Charging you abroad in your home account currency, as a previous poster pointed out, is called DCC. This scam is about 10 years old, and in exchange of 2% additional costs, you get the advantage of knowing immediately how much your will be charged on your account.

Of course the price paid by consumers for this service is much higher than any benefit one could get, except under very special circumstances.

The worst thing is, credit card companies used to (I don't know if this info is still current) to give KICKBACKS to the vendors who are successful in finding suckers for their DCC scam...

They do give kickbacks methinks. The amount of times I have to to state to pay my bill in Thai baht and not sterling and then they still do it in sterling. Even when my wife is with me and says in perfect Thai they still don't. I never had this oroblem in supermarkets etc it's mainly the shopping malls. The main culprit being reputable clothing outlets. When the cashier runs the card through ,it then ( for ukcards anyway) asks for a PIN number. Sometimes I don't even get past that and they say the card has been rejected because they ignore the PIN number and try to bypass it ,many times I have had to practically grab the card machine off them on occasions before they do that. They are just too shy to say they don't understand what the card reader is saying and this goes for when it's asks what currency you wish to pay for your goods in.

Sometimes you can see before if they understand or not and mostly it's not so I ask for the manager to come over and sort it as most of the staff are not well trained tbh. But as I said it's mostly in shopping malls with the currency purchase choice so if you think how many foreigners they deal with daily then surely there must be a kickback.

Edited June 30, 2016 by goldenbrwn1

[Jiu-Jitsu]

"...but if I withdraw cash, I have to pay an extra 200 baht to the greedy local banks as well."

Not if you withdraw over the counter at a bank. Including mall banks.

io had a friend on holiday who tried this ,the banks were having none of it and told him to go outside and use the atms ..........

they used to be fine with it ,i use thai cards mainly so it doesnt affect me but i can see them going this way in future if

everyone is coming in to withdraw instead of using the atm to save 200 thb

That is likely because he used a debit card. Credit cards are ok. But then you need the 'right' credit card.

[Jiu-Jitsu]

Exchange rate of .43 ? Do you mean 43?

consequence of Brexit.

now you get less than 50 Satang for 1 Pound :-)

Seriously, OP, just forget about using credit cards abroad.

All card issuers and all banks of this world milk credit card transactions using defavorable forex rates, fees and/or commissions.

When they don't take commission, their rates is outrageous and when their rates are good, they take commission, which at least makes up 1.5% of the final price although I already saw additional costs in excess of 5% on a 100 USD purchase.

Charging you abroad in your home account currency, as a previous poster pointed out, is called DCC. This scam is about 10 years old, and in exchange of 2% additional costs, you get the advantage of knowing immediately how much your will be charged on your account.

Of course the price paid by consumers for this service is much higher than any benefit one could get, except under very special circumstances.

The worst thing is, credit card companies used to (I don't know if this info is still current) to give KICKBACKS to the vendors who are successful in finding suckers for their DCC scam...

They do give kickbacks methinks. The amount of times I have to to state to pay my bill in Thai baht and not sterling and then they still do it in sterling. Even when my wife is with me and says in perfect Thai they still don't. I never had this oroblem in supermarkets etc it's mainly the shopping malls. The main culprit being reputable clothing outlets. When the cashier runs the card through ,it then ( for ukcards anyway) asks for a PIN number. Sometimes I don't even get past that and they say the card has been rejected because they ignore the PIN number and try to bypass it ,many times I have had to practically grab the card machine off them on occasions before they do that. They are just too shy to say they don't understand what the card reader is saying and this goes for when it's asks what currency you wish to pay for your goods in.

Sometimes you can see before if they understand or not and mostly it's not so I ask for the manager to come over and sort it as most of the staff are not well trained tbh. But as I said it's mostly in shopping malls with the currency purchase choice so if you think how many foreigners they deal with daily then surely there must be a kickback.

Then of course you get the dopey ones who insist that the GBP amount on the POS receipt is for "show". Idiots. I make them void it and do it properly.

[KamnanT]

Exchange rate of .43 ? Do you mean 43?

consequence of Brexit.

now you get less than 50 Satang for 1 Pound :-)

Seriously, OP, just forget about using credit cards abroad.

All card issuers and all banks of this world milk credit card transactions using defavorable forex rates, fees and/or commissions.

When they don't take commission, their rates is outrageous and when their rates are good, they take commission, which at least makes up 1.5% of the final price although I already saw additional costs in excess of 5% on a 100 USD purchase.

Charging you abroad in your home account currency, as a previous poster pointed out, is called DCC. This scam is about 10 years old, and in exchange of 2% additional costs, you get the advantage of knowing immediately how much your will be charged on your account.

Of course the price paid by consumers for this service is much higher than any benefit one could get, except under very special circumstances.

The worst thing is, credit card companies used to (I don't know if this info is still current) to give KICKBACKS to the vendors who are successful in finding suckers for their DCC scam...

They do give kickbacks methinks. The amount of times I have to to state to pay my bill in Thai baht and not sterling and then they still do it in sterling. Even when my wife is with me and says in perfect Thai they still don't. I never had this oroblem in supermarkets etc it's mainly the shopping malls. The main culprit being reputable clothing outlets. When the cashier runs the card through ,it then ( for ukcards anyway) asks for a PIN number. Sometimes I don't even get past that and they say the card has been rejected because they ignore the PIN number and try to bypass it ,many times I have had to practically grab the card machine off them on occasions before they do that. They are just too shy to say they don't understand what the card reader is saying and this goes for when it's asks what currency you wish to pay for your goods in.

Sometimes you can see before if they understand or not and mostly it's not so I ask for the manager to come over and sort it as most of the staff are not well trained tbh. But as I said it's mostly in shopping malls with the currency purchase choice so if you think how many foreigners they deal with daily then surely there must be a kickback.

Similar experiences which lead me to a similar conclusion: merchants are still getting kickbacks for DCC transactions. I've had a camera shop in Singapore blatantly ignore my request to be billed in SGD and hand me a transaction slip in baht - very nasty looks when I told him to void it and do it again. I've also had shops in Macau simply not ask, opt for DCC and hope I didn't notice. It is inevitably a bad deal. If the shop accepts it, I use American Express - they don't offer DCC. Yet.

[fxe1200]

No guaranty, but then you should be charged baht. She and you should have punched some buttons if you were to be charged in sterling, so that you had a chance to accept the exchange to sterling. But I can't say for sure this always happens. You'll have to check your credit card statement, online if you can.

It is commonplace today, that businesses or the Kasikorn bank try to make you pay in either EURO or GBP. Please always insist on paying in THB, as the exchange rate with your credit company is ALWAYS better, than the rates given to you by local businesses. It is just another scam, another rip off.

[wump]

"Forget about using credit cards abroad"

What a load of BS. I have several cards that charge zero conversion fees and use the exact VISA/MasterCard rate which is almost identical to the interbank rate.

Edited June 30, 2016 by wump

[fxe1200]

"Forget about using credit cards abroad"

What a load of BS. I have several cards that charge zero conversion fees and use the exact VISA/MasterCard rate which is almost identical to the interbank rate.

This is not the point the thread it talking about.

[Wake Up]

I use an American Capital One Visa that pays me back 2 percent of all purchases and use Thai baht with no commission and the exchange rate fluates but is always better than the super rich 100 dollar bill exchange rate. The credit card company makes it money on the charges I make by charging the store for allowing me to use my Visa card.

Some credit cards charge 3 percent foreign exchange fee and give a terrible exchange rate. Stay away from using these type cards.

If you use a debit card use a Charles Schwab free ATM debit card that refunds overseas ATM fees. Chase bank does also if you have at least 100k in their bank but Charles Schwab only requires 1,000 US dollars to open their account.

Can lose a lot of money or save a lot of money depending on how you understand credit cards and debit cards and search for the cards that cater to foreign expats. Good luck.

[manarak]

"Forget about using credit cards abroad"

What a load of BS. I have several cards that charge zero conversion fees and use the exact VISA/MasterCard rate which is almost identical to the interbank rate.

you might want to check these rates against the forex rate.

the standard method for determining the rates used by VISA and MC is to record the rates at five moments during the day and then to use the worst rate applicable to your transaction.

I know because I have been working for the bank doing the FX ops for VISA/MC

Of course there are exceptions and there are really good cards out there with very reasonable fees - but the general case is that CC transactions abroad remain a rip-off in most cases.

Edited June 30, 2016 by manarak

[Wake Up]

Just used my Capital One Visa at Tops Bangkok.

The exchange rate was 35.192 baht per dollar. I will be refunded 2 percent of my purchase by Capital One Visa charges Tops 2.5 percent or more for the purchase. So anyone who says do not use credit cards abroad does not use the correct type of credit or debit card or has never traveled the world for business. It would have costs me more to use converted Thai baht. Of course if I used a credit card that charged a foreign exchange fee or gave me a terrible exchange rate then it would have been better to pay cash.

[Nowisee]

I use my debit card from a US bank at Rimping and when I check it against the MasterCard rate for that day it's spot on. No Foreign Transaction Fee.

[The manic]

You are normally offered a choice of local currency or your home currency. Rat her counter intuitively - elect for local currency. You get a better rate. Also consoder the difference in using a credit card or a debit card.

[speedtripler]

You are normally offered a choice of local currency or your home currency. Rat her counter intuitively - elect for local currency. You get a better rate. Also consoder the difference in using a credit card or a debit card.

how wide is the differnce in rates between a kasikorn visa credit and kasikorn visa debit ?

i thought they would be the same but the credit card has obviously better rewards and protection .....

[Mark123456]

If the receipt shows the amount in baht, you paid in baht. A camera shop once tried to use DCC without asking me, which is illegal anywhere else as far as I know, and should be here, and the receipt they gave me showed the amount in GBP.

I disagree that you should forget about using credit cards abroad. The issuers don't decide what the exchange rates are: If it's a Visa card they will use the rates set by Visa for the day, which are usually quite fair. They may, and often do, add a commission though, but even then, for me at least, it's cheaper to shop with a debit or credit card than it is to withdraw cash. Either way I end up paying 2% commission on the exchange but if I withdraw cash, I have to pay an extra 200 baht to the greedy local banks as well.

The protection offered by banks when buying higher value stuff is very useful too. Pay in cash and you will end up arguing with a local shop owner if the goods are faulty and you want a refund; pay with a credit or debit card and your bank will reverse the charges, leaving the shop owner having to argue his case to get the money back. I know which position I'd rather be in.

The receipt mentioned us probably the shop receipt, so no connection to the currency.

The cc slip though will show the currency. And in the OP's case it sounds like it will not be in Thai baht.

On what evidence do you base this opinion? Rimping give you the shop and credit card receipt at the same time - were you there?

[Mark123456]

"...but if I withdraw cash, I have to pay an extra 200 baht to the greedy local banks as well."

Not if you withdraw over the counter at a bank. Including mall banks.

io had a friend on holiday who tried this ,the banks were having none of it and told him to go outside and use the atms ..........

they used to be fine with it ,i use thai cards mainly so it doesnt affect me but i can see them going this way in future if

everyone is coming in to withdraw instead of using the atm to save 200 thb

That is likely because he used a debit card. Credit cards are ok. But then you need the 'right' credit card.

What are you talking about? You can't withdraw money from a bank account with a credit card. If I use my credit card to make a cash withdrawal I will be paying interest on it from day 1. I'm talking about using the ATM/debit cards issued by my bank for use with my current accounts, to withdraw cash from those accounts.

[55Jay]

The OP's question was, why did the screen display both Baht and Pounds.

Card machines detect your card's base currency. At a DCC enabled transaction terminal, the clerk is presented with a currency decision point on the card machine's small screen - Thai Baht or Pounds (or the card's base currency). This is "our" decision to make, same as you would when presented with a DCC choice at an ATM using your foreign currency card. In the times we've been DCC'ed, the clerk never asked, and our first indication was the very long signature slip being printed from the card machine, containing all the extra DCC agreement verbiage and final price in foreign currency.

You can still reject DCC at that point, which can be a pain in the neck, which is why we've become proactive with the clerks to avoid it, rather unwinding it after the fact.

[wump]

"...but if I withdraw cash, I have to pay an extra 200 baht to the greedy local banks as well."

Not if you withdraw over the counter at a bank. Including mall banks.

io had a friend on holiday who tried this ,the banks were having none of it and told him to go outside and use the atms ..........

they used to be fine with it ,i use thai cards mainly so it doesnt affect me but i can see them going this way in future if

everyone is coming in to withdraw instead of using the atm to save 200 thb

That is likely because he used a debit card. Credit cards are ok. But then you need the 'right' credit card.

What are you talking about? You can't withdraw money from a bank account with a credit card. If I use my credit card to make a cash withdrawal I will be paying interest on it from day 1. I'm talking about using the ATM/debit cards issued by my bank for use with my current accounts, to withdraw cash from those accounts.

Of course you can withdraw with a credit card. Just because you have a crappy card doesn't mean other people can't. I can withdraw with credit card and get a bill once a month and only if I don't pay the bill within a certain time frame I'll get charged interest. So essentially, it is like a free loan for 1-2 months.

[Mark123456]

Of course you can withdraw with a credit card. Just because you have a crappy card doesn't mean other people can't. I can withdraw with credit card and get a bill once a month and only if I don't pay the bill within a certain time frame I'll get charged interest. So essentially, it is like a free loan for 1-2 months.

Can you actually read? I know one can withdraw cash with a credit card but it doesn't come from your current account, it's credit - hence the name. No idea where you are from but withdraw cash from a UK bank issued credit card and you are charged interest from day 1, not at the end of the billing card.

[taxout]

I thought most banks charge a service fee at the time you take a cash advance on a credit card. Mine do. Interest is extra to this.

[Mark123456]

Of course you can withdraw with a credit card. Just because you have a crappy card doesn't mean other people can't. I can withdraw with credit card and get a bill once a month and only if I don't pay the bill within a certain time frame I'll get charged interest. So essentially, it is like a free loan for 1-2 months.

Can you actually read? I know one can withdraw cash with a credit card but it doesn't come from your current account, it's credit - hence the name. No idea where you are from but withdraw cash from a UK bank issued credit card and you are charged interest from day 1, not at the end of the billing card.

Should have said "billing period" of course.