GF Looking for New Job

[hdkane]

First, thanks to anyone who has insight or experience into this or similar situations...

 

My gf has been working for a major Thai company for almost a decade.  The job pays well enough, but offers no room for promotion or additional responsibility.  To make herself more attractive, she spent the last 2 years obtaining an MBA.  Her company, which is national, has no new positions.  So...how does someone find a job in a related field?  I'm rather "old school" and from the USA.  There, when I went to university, you finish a degree and usually companies recruit graduates. Some professions (e.g., teaching) have a constant need for employees so people just walk in and get jobs. As you work and progress, you attend conferences and make connections or your professional organization has job announcements.  That doesn't seem to be the case in Thailand.No recruiters visited the university or contacted any students/professors. She has applied and interviewed for a couple of jobs she found online, but the job description does not match what the employer actually wants. Also, there are the usual open biases here regarding nepotism, bribes, age, and sex.

 

Her undergraduate study is in computer science, and the MBA has a specialty in marketing.  She speaks moderate English.  Lives in BKK.  Is open to moving elsewhere in Thailand.  Should she just canvas places she would like to work, contacting managers directly? Routinely visit company websites to see if employment is available? Should she immerse herself in the internet or social media, making random connections, until she finds a new position?  Contact professors for leads?  She has her present position because a friend recommended her.  She has very dew contacts in the field, and all are at her level and in the same company, as her work just places her in an office cubicle for 8 hours a day and people do not talk to each other.  The longer she stays there, the more she becomes unqualified for anything else.  Thailand has a real problem capitalizing on the intellectual talent of women.   

 

I'd like to see her realize more of her potential...does anyone have any ideas or resources that I might be overlooking?  She's looking for work as an entry level manager with some room for advancement, ideally in IT but other areas are certainly an option.  Thank you.

[Witblitz]

Not trying to be rude but 10 years work experience, an MBA and needs her farang BF to ask on a website filled mainly with  western retirees how she should persue finding a new job in Thailand ? 

 

As in most countries, in not what you know, its who you know that gets you ahead 

[BKKdreaming]

what range of pay  has she worked up to after 10 years ?  

and did her new MBA get her a big jump in pay ?

 

Just wondering as at least in the USA it seems so many people have Education up to MBAs -PHDs that do not increase their pay levels as much as you would think,

[FritsSikkink]

Have a look here:

 

http://th.jobsdb.com/TH/

[dbrenn]

2 minutes ago, FritsSikkink said:

Have a look here:

 

http://th.jobsdb.com/TH/

Right - JobsDB is one of the most popular places to find white collar work.

[Scotwight]

Networking with her friends who went to the same University for her BA or MBA.  That's how my wife's friends find all their new jobs.  

[AlexRich]

I guess in Thailand it helps to have connections. Failing that she really needs to grind it out by targeting organisations that she would like to work for and developing a professional CV that fits the type of character they are likely to want to employ, i.e. adapt it to fit each company.

 

I use the word 'grind', because that's really whats involved. If she sends her details to a named individual with a professional covering letter she may well succeed in finding a position with prospects. It's a numbers game, she will get many rejections, but if she perseveres I'm sure she will find something decent in the end. 

[smokie36]

She needs to apply for loads of jobs and network better outside of her immediate circle...as said above contacts are everything in Bangkok.

[malt25]

23 hours ago, Witblitz said:

Not trying to be rude but 10 years work experience, an MBA and needs her farang BF to ask on a website filled mainly with  western retirees how she should persue finding a new job in Thailand ? 

 

As in most countries, in not what you know, its who you know that gets you ahead 

I was thinking the same thing before I got to the end of the post.

Good for you, & her, that she wants to progress, but, I would have thought she would have far more idea & contacts to move up the ladder.

[AlexRich]

The OP's just asking for any ideas, any suggestions that might help. Some universities offer a great deal of support to students and others are clueless, they just want the fee and don't make any effort to help students. And not everyone is that clued up on career development. On balance, it was a fair request. Good luck to her.

[Witblitz]

6 minutes ago, AlexRich said:

The OP's just asking for any ideas, any suggestions that might help. Some universities offer a great deal of support to students and others are clueless, they just want the fee and don't make any effort to help students. And not everyone is that clued up on career development. On balance, it was a fair request. Good luck to her.

Er this is not a student fresh out of school we are talking about, this is some one who had already been working for 10 years, appears to have gained an MBA and is clueless on career development, and how to find a job in their own country ?...

 

well i know if i was hiring and knew the above, this would be 1 MBA who wouldnt be getting a job simply as i would question the value of the MBA to start with, A " Masters in Business Administration" who appears not even know the basics of human resource management, compounded by having 10 years work experience too boot 

[AlexRich]

10 minutes ago, Witblitz said:

Er this is not a student fresh out of school we are talking about, this is some one who had already been working for 10 years, appears to have gained an MBA and is clueless on career development, and how to find a job in their own country ?...

 

well i know if i was hiring and knew the above, this would be 1 MBA who wouldnt be getting a job simply as i would question the value of the MBA to start with, A " Masters in Business Administration" who appears not even know the basics of human resource management, compounded by having 10 years work experience too boot 

 

Then simply don't contribute, what's the point in tapping at a keyboard to criticise someone who is asking, very politely, for some advice? In what way does that help them, or indeed you? The OP didn't start a debate on a subject, he just asked for help from anyone that was willing to offer it. And if you're not willing or able to, then don't.

[Trembly]

There are plenty of Thai jobsites that are well patronised by Thais and Thai businesses. Just get your girlfriend to use Google in either Thai or English. 

The power of the personal network in Thailand, a country that has institutionalised the art of the possible, can be awesome. Sometimes though, it can only take you so far. Forgive me for stating the obvious, but your network is only as good as the horizons of the members in your network. If a Thai tries to tell you that it's the Thai way and we don't use the computer blah blah blah they're either out of date or talking out of their hoop.

I was casually browsing JobsDB this morning (my lady is also looking for a job) and noticed an opening for a deputy COO in Khon Kaen with a salary of 200,000 - 250,000 per month, so it's definitely not all about Bangkok.

HR departments of many blue chip companies are now getting a bit fed up with the MBA now, preferring specialised degrees unless the MBA is from a top-flight school with a proven track record of producing highly effective generalists. For Thai MBAs it is mostly a two-horse race between Thammasat and Sasin (the graduate business school of Chulalongkorn) with the edge going to the latter, probably because of the cooperation between Sasin, Kelogg and Wharton and because the course is conducted entirely in English. 

Other brands of MBA and graduate business degrees may still have some wow factor up-country, particularly those from Kasetsart, NIDA although Thammasat and Sasin continue to trump. Hiring managers aren't necessarily stupid to have brand bias. If nothing else, they know that with certain brands they're not only hiring the candidate sitting in front of them but also the alumni network that they might have. 

It is common currency among Thais of a certain age that you can just get any old masters degree, usually an MBA if you can't think of anything else, from any old institution in order to game the bureaucracy that gives an automatic pay rise for having a masters degree. This tends to only work in the sclerotic government agencies or their spiritual kin that are somehow still hanging on in the private sector. 

 

[jadee]

I read the OP's post and have a few observations. Firstly, the fact that ' No recruiters visited the university or contacted any students/professors.' isn't a great endorsement of whichever institution she studied at and is probably a big part of why securing a job has been problematic. Secondly, aside from classwork, most of what all MBA students do is networking and preparing for the interview gauntlet. It's extremely worrying that she either hasn't been doing this at all or not to any great extent. Graduating from even a top notch institution doesn't guarantee finding an internship or full-time offer; you'll have dozens of exceptional students competing for a limited number of coveted positions. 
In terms of practical advice, applying for 'a couple of jobs' simply won't cut it, she needs to market herself. All of the OP's suggestions are good ideas: contact professors, network, make connections, join LinkedIn if she hasn't already, search jobs boards and make many more applications. 

[Sayonarax]

On 8/17/2016 at 9:47 AM, hdkane said:

have a constant need for employees so people just walk in and get jobs.

 

You should email this comment to all the people who finished a degree in the US and are now working at Mcdonalds.. they'd get a laugh out of that.

[hdkane]

On 8/18/2016 at 8:25 PM, jadee said:

I read the OP's post and have a few observations. Firstly, the fact that ' No recruiters visited the university or contacted any students/professors.' isn't a great endorsement of whichever institution she studied at and is probably a big part of why securing a job has been problematic. Secondly, aside from classwork, most of what all MBA students do is networking and preparing for the interview gauntlet. It's extremely worrying that she either hasn't been doing this at all or not to any great extent. Graduating from even a top notch institution doesn't guarantee finding an internship or full-time offer; you'll have dozens of exceptional students competing for a limited number of coveted positions. 
In terms of practical advice, applying for 'a couple of jobs' simply won't cut it, she needs to market herself. All of the OP's suggestions are good ideas: contact professors, network, make connections, join LinkedIn if she hasn't already, search jobs boards and make many more applications. 

Thanks to everyone who offered helpful suggestions...you offered some insights that can better help me appreciate her situation, and perhaps find a way to help her, given the limitations...again, thanks, and I'll post at some point in the future to let you know how things turned out...but based on your feedback, it may be an uphill battle for her, in that she's been in a dead end job for nearly a decade...and although her program is one that was listed above, she wasn't a star in the program by any means...anyway, your comments offered some realistic suggestions, and that's always a good place to start...thanks and take care.

[hdkane]

On 8/18/2016 at 10:01 AM, Witblitz said:

Er this is not a student fresh out of school we are talking about, this is some one who had already been working for 10 years, appears to have gained an MBA and is clueless on career development, and how to find a job in their own country ?...

 

well i know if i was hiring and knew the above, this would be 1 MBA who wouldnt be getting a job simply as i would question the value of the MBA to start with, A " Masters in Business Administration" who appears not even know the basics of human resource management, compounded by having 10 years work experience too boot 

It's not difficult to find oneself in a dead end, even in the USA or UK...in Thailand, most people just consider themselves lucky to have a job...she recognized this limitation, and pursued an MBA as a means to extricate herself from the dead end...

 

she's just starting this process, and I thought I would ask people who may offer some suggestions...she didn't ask me to do this, I took it upon myself...

[hdkane]

On 8/18/2016 at 4:42 PM, Trembly said:

There are plenty of Thai jobsites that are well patronised by Thais and Thai businesses. Just get your girlfriend to use Google in either Thai or English. 

The power of the personal network in Thailand, a country that has institutionalised the art of the possible, can be awesome. Sometimes though, it can only take you so far. Forgive me for stating the obvious, but your network is only as good as the horizons of the members in your network. If a Thai tries to tell you that it's the Thai way and we don't use the computer blah blah blah they're either out of date or talking out of their hoop.

I was casually browsing JobsDB this morning (my lady is also looking for a job) and noticed an opening for a deputy COO in Khon Kaen with a salary of 200,000 - 250,000 per month, so it's definitely not all about Bangkok.

HR departments of many blue chip companies are now getting a bit fed up with the MBA now, preferring specialised degrees unless the MBA is from a top-flight school with a proven track record of producing highly effective generalists. For Thai MBAs it is mostly a two-horse race between Thammasat and Sasin (the graduate business school of Chulalongkorn) with the edge going to the latter, probably because of the cooperation between Sasin, Kelogg and Wharton and because the course is conducted entirely in English. 

Other brands of MBA and graduate business degrees may still have some wow factor up-country, particularly those from Kasetsart, NIDA although Thammasat and Sasin continue to trump. Hiring managers aren't necessarily stupid to have brand bias. If nothing else, they know that with certain brands they're not only hiring the candidate sitting in front of them but also the alumni network that they might have. 

It is common currency among Thais of a certain age that you can just get any old masters degree, usually an MBA if you can't think of anything else, from any old institution in order to game the bureaucracy that gives an automatic pay rise for having a masters degree. This tends to only work in the sclerotic government agencies or their spiritual kin that are somehow still hanging on in the private sector. 

 

Thank you for the insights into the Thai job market...it's more dynamic than I initially thought...

[hdkane]

On 8/17/2016 at 10:15 AM, BKKdreaming said:

what range of pay  has she worked up to after 10 years ?  

and did her new MBA get her a big jump in pay ?

 

Just wondering as at least in the USA it seems so many people have Education up to MBAs -PHDs that do not increase their pay levels as much as you would think,

At her present position, she makes about 35,000 THB...and no, the MBA is not recognized by her employer...the jobs that are available for promotion are given to outsiders, not from within the organization...as I am beginning to realize, the stark reality for many positions is that promotion depends on the network...for her, she found herself in a deadend job that paid the bills and afforded some comfort...after nearly six years, she found herself ready for new opportunities, and so pursued the MBA hoping that one might present itself...I"m from academia, far afield from business, so I was hoping some people more experienced could offer some suggestions...

 

thanks for contribution...

[Johnniey]

On 8/17/2016 at 0:49 PM, FritsSikkink said:

Have a look here:

 

http://th.jobsdb.com/TH/

Reminded me of the Thai regae band

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=yi6jw7EtryE

[Johnniey]

On 8/17/2016 at 10:04 AM, Witblitz said:

Not trying to be rude but 10 years work experience, an MBA and needs her farang BF to ask on a website filled mainly with  western retirees how she should persue finding a new job in Thailand ? 

 

As in most countries, in not what you know, its who you know that gets you ahead 

Probably getting a farang bf is part of the plan to progress.

[BKKdreaming]

28 minutes ago, hdkane said:

At her present position, she makes about 35,000 THB...

 

This seems to be what a "good office job"  is paid after a few years ,  

 

Hate to say it , but maybe she just needs to stay where she is ,  because how much extra will she need to take a chance at a new job ?

 

I think that is also why there are so many weekend / street markets with people selling stuff they made , it is one way to add 5k-10k baht a month and still keep your regular job

[thaibeachlovers]

14 hours ago, hdkane said:

It's not difficult to find oneself in a dead end, even in the USA or UK...in Thailand, most people just consider themselves lucky to have a job...she recognized this limitation, and pursued an MBA as a means to extricate herself from the dead end...

 

she's just starting this process, and I thought I would ask people who may offer some suggestions...she didn't ask me to do this, I took it upon myself...

in Thailand, most people just consider themselves lucky to have a job

Quite right too. Plenty of jobs for low level manual workers getting paid a pittance, but I'd expect that for managerial jobs, as another poster said, it's who you know.

[thaibeachlovers]

14 hours ago, hdkane said:

At her present position, she makes about 35,000 THB...and no, the MBA is not recognized by her employer...the jobs that are available for promotion are given to outsiders, not from within the organization...as I am beginning to realize, the stark reality for many positions is that promotion depends on the network...for her, she found herself in a deadend job that paid the bills and afforded some comfort...after nearly six years, she found herself ready for new opportunities, and so pursued the MBA hoping that one might present itself...I"m from academia, far afield from business, so I was hoping some people more experienced could offer some suggestions...

 

thanks for contribution...

35,000!!!!!!!

My wife could only dream about getting that much and I guarantee she works far, far harder than your wife.

 

She should stay where she is and start networking.

[JHolmesJr]

35,000!!! That is really taking the piss…..I knw some useless bingo layers who make more than that managing hookers in a gogo.

 

I reckon 80,000 seems like a fairer number to aim for.

 

[thaihome]

As others have said, just like in the US, graduates from top flight schools are recruited,  others not so much. In my 10+ years working for a MNC in Thailand, we usually hired through an agency or from connections to existing employees.

 

We often used Firecroft as the agency, again due to connections to former employee.  At one point we did ring adds in English language newspaper classifieds  (as we wanted English speaking candidates). Result was we got many applications, but did not hire any of them. The quality just did seem as high as previously vetted candidates from agency and even employee referrals.   

 

The process didn't seem any different then hiring process in the US.

 

TH 

 

 

[hdkane]

3 hours ago, thaibeachlovers said:

in Thailand, most people just consider themselves lucky to have a job

Quite right too. Plenty of jobs for low level manual workers getting paid a pittance, but I'd expect that for managerial jobs, as another poster said, it's who you know.

yes, i think that is the sentiment that keeps coming through...because she has spent a few years in a dead end job that did not allow much networking opportunity, i was hoping for some advice how to proceed...i guess the job search is the same process everywhere, even in third world countries...take care

[Trembly]

35,000 is what my gf made in an office job at the age of 23. 

The Thai job market is a lot more dynamic than a lot of people - including many Thais - are willing to give it credit for.

There are all kinds of businesses doing all kinds of things here. Indonesia may be the largest economy in ASEAN but that is only by dint of sheer size. After Singapore and Malaysia, Thailand is the most mature economy in ASEAN by quite a distance (stand fast Viet Nam). 

 

Edited August 20, 2016 by Trembly

[Trembly]

What's her field / expertise?

Is she able to join a professional network or association, such as those for accountants or translators?

[MyFrenU]

How about Robinsons,maybe she worked there before?