Wing flap found in Tanzania confirmed to be part of MH370

[webfact]

Wing flap found in Tanzania confirmed to be part of MH370 
KRISTEN GELINEAU, Associated Press

 

SYDNEY (AP) — A wing flap that washed ashore on an island off Tanzania has been identified as belonging to missing Malaysia Airlines Flight 370, Australian officials said Thursday.

 

The flap was found in June by residents on Pemba Island off the coast of Tanzania, and officials had previously said it was highly likely to have come from the missing Boeing 777. An analysis by experts at the Australian Transport Safety Bureau, which is heading up the search for the plane, subsequently confirmed the part was indeed from the aircraft, the agency said in a statement.

 

Several pieces of wreckage suspected to have come from the plane have washed ashore on coastlines around the Indian Ocean since the aircraft vanished with 239 people on board during a flight from Kuala Lumpur, Malaysia, to Beijing on March 8, 2014.

 

The wing flap brings to five the number of pieces of debris the Australian Transport Safety Bureau has determined are almost certainly, or are definitely, from Flight 370. Another piece of wing found a year ago on La Reunion Island, near Madagascar, was positively identified by French officials.

 

Search officials expect more wreckage to wash up in the months ahead. But so far, none of the debris has helped narrow down the precise location of the main underwater wreckage.

 

The Australian Transport Safety Bureau anticipates search crews will complete their sweep of the 120,000-square kilometer (46,000-square mile) search zone in the Indian Ocean off Australia's west coast by December.

 

Meanwhile, oceanographers have been analyzing the wing flaps from La Reunion and Tanzania in the hope of identifying a possible new search area through drift modeling. But a new search would require a new funding commitment, with Malaysia, Australia and China agreeing in July that the $160 million hunt will be suspended once the current stretch of ocean is exhausted unless new evidence emerges that would pinpoint a specific location of the aircraft.

 

Earlier this week, relatives of some of the passengers on board the plane met with officials from the transport bureau and asked that more potential debris found around the Indian Ocean be examined. The families believe those items may help provide clues to the plane's location.

 

-- © Associated Press 2016-09-16

[ddavidovsky]

The news coverage doesn't draw an important conclusion: the fact that they missed this thing floating around - flat, white, and the size of a small boat - clearly means they were searching in the wrong place the whole time.

[Missing Troll]

There is something strange with this aircrafts disappearance, have been items found from Seychelles to Madagascar. Both US and France have military operations on Islands in that area and monitor all sea and air movement. the whole thing does not ad up and smell rotten. 

[ddavidovsky]

I don't know why they didn't get high resolution satellite images of that whole area of ocean immediately after the crash. A computer could analyse the images and spot every white piece of flotsam - definitely something this big - within seconds.

 

Sending all those planes and ships all that way to trawl the area manually was absurd. Heck, they could have sent up a special satellite just for this job and it would probably have been cheaper...

[manfredtillmann]

7 minutes ago, ddavidovsky said:

I don't know why they didn't get high resolution satellite images of that whole area of ocean immediately after the crash. A computer could analyse the images and spot every white piece of flotsam - definitely something this big - within seconds.

 

Sending all those planes and ships all that way to trawl the area manually was absurd. Heck, they could have sent up a special satellite just for this job and it would probably have been cheaper...

we are all being brain - washed by our 'governments'.

you do not need to wear a foil - hat to know that.

 

[williamgeorgeallen]

would be interesting to know how many pieces were confirmed as being 370 and how they were identified. seeing them on a map would be good as well.

[ddavidovsky]

53 minutes ago, manfredtillmann said:

we are all being brain - washed by our 'governments'.

you do not need to wear a foil - hat to know that.

 

 

Who is being brain-washed, and how, regarding this plane?

Personally, I'm brain-wash resistant, they can't pervert my cynicism of all things human - it's a kind of enlightenment.

[mike324]

1 hour ago, ddavidovsky said:

I don't know why they didn't get high resolution satellite images of that whole area of ocean immediately after the crash. A computer could analyse the images and spot every white piece of flotsam - definitely something this big - within seconds.

 

Sending all those planes and ships all that way to trawl the area manually was absurd. Heck, they could have sent up a special satellite just for this job and it would probably have been cheaper...

 

I would say that its easier said then done... satellite images would need to zoom in to close enough to take detail snap shots, that takes up most of the time. Follow by combing through the millions of pictures.

[manfredtillmann]

3 minutes ago, ddavidovsky said:

 

Who is being brain-washed, and how, regarding this plane?

Personally, I'm brain-wash resistant, they can't pervert my cynicism of all things human - it's a kind of enlightenment.

i grew up in the '70''s cold-war scenario. we were all told this and that, just bs, really, because we were needed to be kept quiet.

the us had technology even then to take photos from their u2's  to capture the engine number of a soviet tractor.

there is no such thing smaller than the size of a moped - or even less - that can disappear on this planet without someone knowing - particularly not if it is an aeroplane of a muslim nation!

i am not a foil - hatter, but i know we are ALL being crapped on.

did you observe the recent discussions on scientifically renowned websites about the demise of the world trade centre?

start from there, please...

[Clamhua]

The word on the ground in Malaysia, is the government does not want it found....implications for the country are not good at all 

[ddavidovsky]

33 minutes ago, mike324 said:

 

I would say that its easier said then done... satellite images would need to zoom in to close enough to take detail snap shots, that takes up most of the time. Follow by combing through the millions of pictures.

 

Well, they can do it for Pluto...

Resolution-wise, this piece of wing could even be spotted with ordinary Google Earth images and surely higher resolutions are possible. I guess it would take many passes of the satellite but I don't think it's beyond human ingenuity. Once they have the digital pictures, it would only take some simple computer algorithm to quickly identify all the extraneous objects. Even Photoshop can do something of that nature. Once a piece is identified, they could chart the speed of its drift and pretty much home in on the crash site.

Perhaps it just never occurred to them and they're slapping their heads as they read this.

[F4UCorsair]

9 hours ago, ddavidovsky said:

The news coverage doesn't draw an important conclusion: the fact that they missed this thing floating around - flat, white, and the size of a small boat - clearly means they were searching in the wrong place the whole time.

I don't think It means that at all.  I recall many years ago when flying on a surveillance contract off the north coast of Australia, and visually searching for things for which we KNEW the position, and not sighting them.  Ine was a guy paddling a kayak around the Australian coastline, and he was seldom sighted, and that was from 500 feet.

The kayak was 18 feet long, and colored safety/signal yellow!!  he was wearing a bright orange buoysncy vest.

 

Unable to edit typos.

 One

buoyancy vest

[DavisH]

5 hours ago, Missing Troll said:

There is something strange with this aircrafts disappearance, have been items found from Seychelles to Madagascar. Both US and France have military operations on Islands in that area and monitor all sea and air movement. the whole thing does not ad up and smell rotten. 

The plane didn't crash in that area. The modelling I saw suggested it would take 18 months to two years from debris to drift from the current search site to the west coast of Africa, along the Indian Ocean Gyre, and that's when it was found. Debris from the search area would drift anti-clockwise towards Africa along this gyre. https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Indian_Ocean_Gyre

[JDGRUEN]

I just read recently that Malaysian authorities found Flight Simulator models on the Pilots home PC.  The Flights modeled by the pilot took the general flight path of the stricken aircraft.  The modeled flight plans ended up in the Indian Ocean it was reported... So it seems - if this report was true - we know what happened -- just not exactly WHERE. 

 

[tropo]

5 hours ago, mike324 said:

 

I would say that its easier said then done... satellite images would need to zoom in to close enough to take detail snap shots, that takes up most of the time. Follow by combing through the millions of pictures.

Not to mention it's taken about 3 months, in a lab, to determine that this particular piece is "highly likely", "almost certainly" or "are definitely" from the missing aircraft. There's still uncertainty. People who suggest they should have done this or that to easily find pieces of wreckage don't comprehend the difficulties - it's like trying to pin point a needle in a field much bigger than China, Australia, Russia and the US combined. The Indian Ocean is nearly the size of the continent of Africa. There's nothing easy about that. 

[tropo]

4 hours ago, ddavidovsky said:

 

Well, they can do it for Pluto...

Resolution-wise, this piece of wing could even be spotted with ordinary Google Earth images and surely higher resolutions are possible. I guess it would take many passes of the satellite but I don't think it's beyond human ingenuity. Once they have the digital pictures, it would only take some simple computer algorithm to quickly identify all the extraneous objects. Even Photoshop can do something of that nature. Once a piece is identified, they could chart the speed of its drift and pretty much home in on the crash site.

Perhaps it just never occurred to them and they're slapping their heads as they read this.

Amazing! They spent $167 million to search for the wreck, and you've come up with a better method? An easy one? One all those trained scientists never thought of?

 

I doubt they'd have the resources to scoop up every bit of flotsom that could be spotted on satellite images, and they would never be able to get to it before it had floated to somewhere else.

 

Think about this for a minute. They see some floating whatever on a satellite image some 5000 km out to sea in the middle of the Indian Ocean... how are they going to retrieve that? They can't send out a helicopter - too far. A ship would take too long to reach it. It is impossible. Maybe the X-Men or Superman can do it, but us humans cannot. It's no surprise that most of the Indian Ocean has not yet been chartered. The task is monumental.

Edited September 16, 2016 by tropo

[tifino]

 

I remember jumping in to help do my little square search for 370, on TomNod

 

 

My eyes were scrabbled, and bouncing, for weeks after that!!

 

 

30 years before that, several groups of us RAAFies, were seconded, to peer out a window, each, in a Caribou over the Timor Sea,

- for a missing Mirage.

 

One's posterior will never forget, just how long a Caribou can keep in the air!!!

 

 

That was just a small Sea, and the fighter jet was never found

 

 

 

 

[tropo]

23 minutes ago, tifino said:

 

I remember jumping in to help do my little square search for 370, on TomNod

 

 

My eyes were scrabbled, and bouncing, for weeks after that!!

 

 

30 years before that, several groups of us RAAFies, were seconded, to peer out a window, each, in a Caribou over the Timor Sea,

- for a missing Mirage.

 

One's posterior will never forget, just how long a Caribou can keep in the air!!!

 

 

That was just a small Sea, and the fighter jet was never found

A recent movie: USS Indianapolis: Men of Courage, highlighted the difficulty of spotting anything from the air in the open ocean. There were hundreds of sailors in the water, on rafts, and they nearly flew over them.

[Andaman Al]

I think the Australians (and Chinese) should be commended for the way they have continued a arduous and resource intensive search for so long. They have footed the bill and should be compensated by IATA, UN, whoever. Thank you Australia.

[Mosha]

I just read recently that Malaysian authorities found Flight Simulator models on the Pilots home PC.  The Flights modeled by the pilot took the general flight path of the stricken aircraft.  The modeled flight plans ended up in the Indian Ocean it was reported... So it seems - if this report was true - we know what happened -- just not exactly WHERE. 

 

IIRC that info first appeared not long after 370 disappeared.

Sent from my SMART_4G_Speedy_5inch using Tapatalk

[ddavidovsky]

14 hours ago, F4UCorsair said:

I don't think It means that at all.  I recall many years ago when flying on a surveillance contract off the north coast of Australia, and visually searching for things for which we KNEW the position, and not sighting them.  Ine was a guy paddling a kayak around the Australian coastline, and he was seldom sighted, and that was from 500 feet.

The kayak was 18 feet long, and colored safety/signal yellow!!  he was wearing a bright orange buoysncy vest.

 

Unable to edit typos.

 One

buoyancy vest

 

Okay, I guess it's not a guaranteed thing. If it's big, white and flat though... surely harder to miss than to see.

[ddavidovsky]

10 hours ago, tifino said:

 

I remember jumping in to help do my little square search for 370, on TomNod

My eyes were scrabbled, and bouncing, for weeks after that!!

30 years before that, several groups of us RAAFies, were seconded, to peer out a window, each, in a Caribou over the Timor Sea,

- for a missing Mirage.

One's posterior will never forget, just how long a Caribou can keep in the air!!!

That was just a small Sea, and the fighter jet was never found

 

TomNod... so the images were all actually available at the time? And the public were crowdsourced to randomly search it? I kept a close eye on the story but didn't hear about this, which in itself shows that it's a ramshackle approach. Those  images needed to be analysied systematically and comprehensively by computer. Easy enough to produce a map of ocean objects and identify likely concentrations of flotsam - there's a lot of junk in the ocean, but there can't be too many large flat white panels. This particular piece of wing would definitely have been spotted that way. And even without actually retrieving and identifying those pieces, it would have prioritised areas for them to focus on for the search.

 

If this happens again, they should be on stand-by with a supercomputer and image analysis program.

[ddavidovsky]

11 hours ago, tropo said:

Amazing! They spent $167 million to search for the wreck, and you've come up with a better method?

 

Yep.

[tifino]

6 hours ago, ddavidovsky said:

 

TomNod... so the images were all actually available at the time? And the public were crowdsourced to randomly search it? I kept a close eye on the story but didn't hear about this, which in itself shows that it's a ramshackle approach. Those  images needed to be analysied systematically and comprehensively by computer. Easy enough to produce a map of ocean objects and identify likely concentrations of flotsam - there's a lot of junk in the ocean, but there can't be too many large flat white panels. This particular piece of wing would definitely have been spotted that way. And even without actually retrieving and identifying those pieces, it would have prioritised areas for them to focus on for the search.

 

If this happens again, they should be on stand-by with a supercomputer and image analysis program.

 

TomNod's supercomputer is the comibination of all those volunteer, albeit untrained eyes and brains. 

If you see a matrix selection which you feel is worthy of following up, you flag it

Your selection is then tallied around a number of your peers, and voted, then heads off to be added to the now-much-smaller number of grid selections that expert peoples have to trawl through...

 

 

...a sort of organic SETI search

 

[pieeyed]

So does it help in the least to know where the plane went down? Maybe it will help scientists figure out the ocean currents.  

[tropo]

8 hours ago, ddavidovsky said:

 

TomNod... so the images were all actually available at the time? And the public were crowdsourced to randomly search it? I kept a close eye on the story but didn't hear about this, which in itself shows that it's a ramshackle approach. Those  images needed to be analysied systematically and comprehensively by computer. Easy enough to produce a map of ocean objects and identify likely concentrations of flotsam - there's a lot of junk in the ocean, but there can't be too many large flat white panels. This particular piece of wing would definitely have been spotted that way. And even without actually retrieving and identifying those pieces, it would have prioritised areas for them to focus on for the search.

 

If this happens again, they should be on stand-by with a supercomputer and image analysis program.

Why to you think they didn't search satellite images for clumps of "white panels"? I'll bet that's one of the first things they did when they first realised it went down in the Indian Ocean. I'll also bet there are/were many of people on the recovery team a lot smarter than you or I.

Edited September 17, 2016 by tropo

[radiochaser]

On 9/16/2016 at 4:12 PM, manfredtillmann said:

i grew up in the '70''s cold-war scenario. we were all told this and that, just bs, really, because we were needed to be kept quiet.

the us had technology even then to take photos from their u2's  to capture the engine number of a soviet tractor.

there is no such thing smaller than the size of a moped - or even less - that can disappear on this planet without someone knowing - particularly not if it is an aeroplane of a muslim nation!

i am not a foil - hatter, but i know we are ALL being crapped on.

did you observe the recent discussions on scientifically renowned websites about the demise of the world trade centre?

start from there, please...

The SR-71 had photographic capabilities that were better than the U-2 and it flew higher than the U-2.  

But, you could not see an engine number on any type of vehicle in the photos.  Pretty damn good photos of what was on the ground, but not that good. 

Not having seen intell photos of current technology, I can't say it is not possible now.

[radiochaser]

On 9/16/2016 at 4:12 PM, manfredtillmann said:

 

Double post.  

Edited September 27, 2016 by radiochaser

[balo]

This is still a mystery. Some people claims it is a cover-up .  

[gk10002000]

On ‎9‎/‎16‎/‎2016 at 0:48 AM, ddavidovsky said:

I don't know why they didn't get high resolution satellite images of that whole area of ocean immediately after the crash. A computer could analyse the images and spot every white piece of flotsam - definitely something this big - within seconds.

 

Sending all those planes and ships all that way to trawl the area manually was absurd. Heck, they could have sent up a special satellite just for this job and it would probably have been cheaper...

I happen to work in the large Unmanned Air Vehicle engineering world.  While I can't comment on the precise capabilities, there are vehicles such as the Global Hawk and Triton version that are capable of doing large scale ocean surveillance in both visual, Infra Red and RF (radar).  I did not hear anybody offering or suggesting they be used.