I have a quick question regarding visas that I haven't been able to find a clear answer to.

 

My wife and I are currently on a Non-immigrant O multientry visa. It expires Dec 15.

We are currently enrolled in a language school and plan to get an ED visa through them until we finish our time there.

Does our Non-immigrant O visa need to expire before we go (probably to Laos) to apply for a new ED visa? Or can we go before Dec 15 and get the ED visa and then the old non-O visa would get cancelled/invalidated?

We've heard that we could have to wait for one to expire before applying for the other. But that seems kind of ridiculous to me.

 

We aren't on any extensions at the moment and doubt they'd give us one as others we've known have asked for an ext and not receive it.

We also plan to travel out of the country on Dec 18 and it's not really flexible. So the answer to this question is pretty pertinent on how we proceed, seeing that there'll only be 3 days between our current visa expiring before we need to leave again.

 

Thoughts? Anyone done something similar before?

Edited September 29, 20169 yr by txbkk53

Usually, given valid reasons, you can apply for a new visa, and the consulate will cancel the old one. Unless you have a really good reason, though, I would not bother. You can study both on your existing entry based on the Non O, and any subsequent entries using tourist visas. How long are you planning to study?

We'll probably be studying for another 8 months or so. And I'd rather get the ED visa than coming on tourist visas. We plan to be here awhile so the latter doesn't seem like the best option given that were not really tourists?

 

Would we have to tell the consulate anything specific? Or would they just see that we're applying for a new visa and that our old one is expiring soon and go ahead and cancel the old one?

They might be a bit puzzled. Usually, people would wait until visa expiry, or until they needed to do something not permitted on their existing visa to apply. They are aware you could use the existing visa until March (final entry on the old visa) and wonder what you are doing. I cannot imagine they would ultimately object though: I think, at worst, a few questions.

Haha, got it. What do you mean by March being the final entry on the old visa?

My impression was that once the visa expires we can't leave unless it's to get a new one. But seeing that we have travel lined up for so soon afterwards, we'd have to get another one earlier.

We also have a trip at the end of the year so that means we'd be leaving and coming back twice w/out a longer visa if we don't get an ED prior to our current one expiring. Does that make sense?

 

Dec 15- O visa expires

Dec 18- leave

Dec 24ish - return

Dec 29 - leave again

Jan - return

 

So I suppose we could do 2 30-day tourist visas on arrival when we return on the 24th and another when we return in Jan, before going out to get the ED visa afterwards. But that seems more risky to me?

 

Thanks for your help BritTim, sorry for all the questions/scenarios! 

Timing could be awkward for you, but most would try to do this:

• Do a border hop December 14, get permission to stay in Thailand until 13 March 2017.
• Before leaving Thailand again after that date, get a re-entry permit

You can have good reasons for not doing this, but they are probably unusual ones.

Hmm...So by doing a border hop right before it expires I understand that we'd have another 3 months to stay in Thailand after that date, even with an expired visa. But I thought leaving the country any time after that (so any time after Dec 14 if we did a border hop then) would invalidate those 3 months thus us needing new visas.

If I'm reading what you said correctly though, it sounds like we could get a re-entry permit on those 3 months (until Mar) so even though our visa is expired we'd still be able to go in/out of the country until Mar. And then in Mar we'd have to get a new visa?

I thought the re-entry permits were just for visas themselves and not the stamps that come w/ them whenever you enter/exit the country. So even if we have a stamp allowing us to stay until Mar, if our visa expired in Dec then the re-entry permit wouldn't apply.

This seems risky to me since we know we're leaving the country a couple times after the expiration, so a lot would be riding on that re-entry permit being okay. 

I'm guessing you've done this before though? 

2 hours ago, txbkk53 said:

Hmm...So by doing a border hop right before it expires I understand that we'd have another 3 months to stay in Thailand after that date, even with an expired visa. But I thought leaving the country any time after that (so any time after Dec 14 if we did a border hop then) would invalidate those 3 months thus us needing new visas.

If I'm reading what you said correctly though, it sounds like we could get a re-entry permit on those 3 months (until Mar) so even though our visa is expired we'd still be able to go in/out of the country until Mar. And then in Mar we'd have to get a new visa?

I thought the re-entry permits were just for visas themselves and not the stamps that come w/ them whenever you enter/exit the country. So even if we have a stamp allowing us to stay until Mar, if our visa expired in Dec then the re-entry permit wouldn't apply.

This seems risky to me since we know we're leaving the country a couple times after the expiration, so a lot would be riding on that re-entry permit being okay. 

I'm guessing you've done this before though? 

" But I thought leaving the country any time after that (so any time after Dec 14 if we did a border hop then) would invalidate those 3 months thus us needing new visas. "

 

If you simply leave and return, yes, the remainder of your 90 day permission to stay would be cancelled.

 

But before leaving, you could get a re-entry permit. The re-entry permit would allow you to leave and return while keeping the balance of your permission to stay.

 

The re-entry permit is meant to keep your current permission to stay or extension of stay. It has no direct connection to the visa you used to enter the country. Visas are handled by embassies or consulates. Your legal presence in the country is based on your permission to stay or extension of stay granted by immigrations. A re-entry permit keeps either of those alive if you want to exit and return.

 

You could get a single re-entry permit for each time you travel or a multi-re-entry permit if you plan to travel in and out a number of times.

 

If you do have a re-entry permit, when you return to Thailand you would put the re-entry permit number in the space on the arrival card that asks for visa number. 

 

 

Edited September 30, 20169 yr by Suradit69

3 hours ago, txbkk53 said:

Hmm...So by doing a border hop right before it expires I understand that we'd have another 3 months to stay in Thailand after that date, even with an expired visa. But I thought leaving the country any time after that (so any time after Dec 14 if we did a border hop then) would invalidate those 3 months thus us needing new visas.

If I'm reading what you said correctly though, it sounds like we could get a re-entry permit on those 3 months (until Mar) so even though our visa is expired we'd still be able to go in/out of the country until Mar. And then in Mar we'd have to get a new visa?

I thought the re-entry permits were just for visas themselves and not the stamps that come w/ them whenever you enter/exit the country. So even if we have a stamp allowing us to stay until Mar, if our visa expired in Dec then the re-entry permit wouldn't apply.

This seems risky to me since we know we're leaving the country a couple times after the expiration, so a lot would be riding on that re-entry permit being okay. 

I'm guessing you've done this before though? 

 

People always get upset when I insist on correcting people when they use "visa" to mean "extension of stay" or "entry into Thailand". Your post illustrates, once again, how hard it is to explain the rules without using correct terminology.

 

Re-entry permits are never used when you can re-enter on an unexpired visa. They are explicitly design to allow you to re-enter with your current permission to stay intact when you would not have a valid visa. Re-entry permits are used instead of visas.

 

If you plan several trips out of Thailand between December 16 and March, you could get a multiple re-entry permit. This costs 3,800 baht. A single re-entry permit is only 1,000 baht, but I would go for a multi even for only two trips. It saves hassle and each re-entry permit takes up space in your passport, so using singles would be false economy.

Thanks for all the help and patience in explaining this to me. Really appreciate it.

So to make sure I'm understanding correctly. As long as we get a re-entry permit for the last 90 day permission to stay, we'll be good until Mar or so (assuming we do a border hop right before our current visa expires) even if our visa expires in the 90 days. And we'll be able to go get a new ED visa sometime in the first 3 months of 2017.

 

Would you guys recommend getting the re-entry permit at Suvarnabhumi or the immigration office?

 

I did some years ago get a double-entry tourist visas because i couldn't get a new multi-entry O. They didn't cancel my existing multi-entry, which still had a month to run. That helped because i was able to get a few months on that before moving to the tourist visas. But that may have been luck.

5 hours ago, txbkk53 said:

Thanks for all the help and patience in explaining this to me. Really appreciate it.

So to make sure I'm understanding correctly. As long as we get a re-entry permit for the last 90 day permission to stay, we'll be good until Mar or so (assuming we do a border hop right before our current visa expires) even if our visa expires in the 90 days. And we'll be able to go get a new ED visa sometime in the first 3 months of 2017.

 

Would you guys recommend getting the re-entry permit at Suvarnabhumi or the immigration office?

 

 

You understand correctly.

 

f flying out, I would personally always get the re-entry  permit at Suvanabhumi (just allow an extra half hour or so) as it is less hassle. Some feel more comfortable with the stamp in their passport in advance, though.