SoiBiker Posted October 17, 2016 Share Posted October 17, 2016 I'd like to thank both candidates for providing such excellent entertainment for us outsiders. Best thing on TV this season by far. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Berkshire Posted October 17, 2016 Share Posted October 17, 2016 1 hour ago, stander said: Compared to Clinton, I do think Trump is honest, that is my opinion May I ask how you arrived at the "opinion?" Let's talk objectively, for example, using a completely objective, non-partisan website which does nothing but fact-check. Mrs. Clinton lies or says something mostly false or worse 27% of the time. http://www.politifact.com/personalities/hillary-clinton/ Mr. Trump lies or says something mostly false or worse 71% of the time. http://www.politifact.com/personalities/donald-trump/ So asking purely from an objective point of view, how can you view Trump as being more honest than Clinton? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
canuckamuck Posted October 17, 2016 Share Posted October 17, 2016 18 minutes ago, Publicus said: Your lifelong noid project is bust and you can thank Donald Trump for it with a big assist by the Republican Party of 2016. The Trump Fanboyz Section is going down with him. We can hear the support beams creaking as youse guyz continue to chant, cheer, stomp your feet. Perspective on my side is important too, however, cause it isn't really over till Trump insults the fat lady too. He's already penciled her in on his schedule. His complex schedule. Don't confuse me as Trump fanboy. Both candidates are a major embarrassment to humanity. But Hillary is entrenched in the war machine and possibly Donald isn't. It's a fine line, admittedly. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
amykat Posted October 17, 2016 Share Posted October 17, 2016 http://www.nytimes.com/2016/10/16/opinion/sunday/if-hillary-clinton-groped-men.html? Is there a double standard for women in politics? Imagine if it were Hillary Clinton who had had five children by three husbands, who had said it was fine to refer to her daughter as a “piece of ass,” who participated in a radio conversation about oral sex in a hot tub, who rated men based on their body parts, who showed up in Playboy soft porn videos. Imagine if 15 men had accused Clinton of assaulting or violating them, with more stepping forward each day. Imagine if Clinton had held a Mr. Teen USA pageant and then marched unannounced into the changing area to ogle the young bodies as some were naked and, after doing the same thing at a Mr. USA pageant, marveled on a radio show at what she was allowed to get away with. Imagine if in a primary election debate Clinton had boasted that there’s “no problem” with the size of her vagina. Imagine if Clinton had less experience in government or the military than any person who has ever become president? Imagine if she had said about a man running against her in the primaries, “Look at that face! Would anyone vote for that?” Imagine if it were Clinton who had boasted, “I could stand in the middle of Fifth Avenue and shoot somebody and I wouldn’t lose voters.” Imagine if it were Clinton who had been caught on a hot mike referring in a degrading way to men’s genitals and boasting that her prominence gave her license to grab men’s crotches. Imagine if she had bragged about her attempts to commit adultery — and later reportedly sought to have fired from his job the married man who resisted her seduction efforts. Imagine that it were Hillary Clinton who had been accused of assault by her first spouse (later recanted) and later of assault in a lawsuit by a business partner. Imagine if Clinton had defended herself from an accusation of molesting a young man by explaining, “He would not be my first choice, that I can tell you.” Imagine if Clinton had body shamed Donald Trump, saying that she had observed his rear end and concluded, “I’m not impressed, believe me.” See NYT for balance of article Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
SoiBiker Posted October 17, 2016 Share Posted October 17, 2016 21 minutes ago, Berkshire said: May I ask how you arrived at the "opinion?" Let's talk objectively, for example, using a completely objective, non-partisan website which does nothing but fact-check. Mrs. Clinton lies or says something mostly false or worse 27% of the time. http://www.politifact.com/personalities/hillary-clinton/ Mr. Trump lies or says something mostly false or worse 71% of the time. http://www.politifact.com/personalities/donald-trump/ So asking purely from an objective point of view, how can you view Trump as being more honest than Clinton? Because they want to believe what he's saying? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Jingthing Posted October 17, 2016 Share Posted October 17, 2016 7 minutes ago, canuckamuck said: Don't confuse me as Trump fanboy. Both candidates are a major embarrassment to humanity. But Hillary is entrenched in the war machine and possibly Donald isn't. It's a fine line, admittedly. trump may be more entrenched in the Russian war machine, but basically if you're voting for trump you're voting for INSANITY. This isn't right vs. left or republican vs. democrat, it's INSANITY vs. SANITY. Hillary may be a normal politician with all the negative baggage that implies but she's fits in the SANE bucket. trump doesn't. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Publicus Posted October 17, 2016 Share Posted October 17, 2016 Just now, canuckamuck said: Don't confuse me as Trump fanboy. Both candidates are a major embarrassment to humanity. But Hillary is entrenched in the war machine and possibly Donald isn't. It's a fine line, admittedly. Humanity izzit. Maybe someone should try coming down a notch or two because we're talking about an election in the USA -- it's very specific. All the same, some people are oblivious in addition to being lifelong political paranoids. It is in fact a very wide and thick line...a very bright one too... Washington Post: “He is preaching to the converted. He is lashing out at anyone who is not completely loyal. He is detaching himself from and delegitimizing the institutions of American political life. And he is proclaiming conspiracies everywhere — in polls (rigged), in debate moderators (biased) and in the election itself (soon to be stolen).” “In the presidential campaign’s home stretch, Donald Trump is fully inhabiting his own echo chamber. The Republican nominee has turned inward, increasingly isolated from the country’s mainstream and leaders of his own party, and determined to rouse his most fervent supporters with dire warnings that their populist movement could fall prey to dark and collusive forces.” Sort of like the military industrial complex and its CIA run complex global drugs racket all protected in secret complexity by HRC. Donald Trump hasn't increased his bottom line voter support base for the past four months. Neither have the "complex" people increased their support base -- over their lifetime. The bulb blew out long ago over there for Trump and those he's taking down with him in this gift of an election campaign. Trump and everyone like him are going to be officially certified by the Electoral College as losers. It meets in a joint session of Congress December 18th to make it official by casting the votes by state. I'll look you up when it begins (C-SPAN). Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Opl Posted October 17, 2016 Share Posted October 17, 2016 25 minutes ago, SoiBiker said: Because they want to believe what he's saying? also, because he says what they already think and believe , therefore, to them Trump = Truth , and all opponents are liars. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Publicus Posted October 17, 2016 Share Posted October 17, 2016 Fans. It's a true analysis that had been done shortly after Trump got his Rube Goldberg machine cranked up. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
canuckamuck Posted October 17, 2016 Share Posted October 17, 2016 21 minutes ago, Publicus said: Humanity izzit. Maybe someone should try coming down a notch or two because we're talking about an election in the USA -- it's very specific. I was giving them the benefit of the doubt that they are humans. But OK call them Americans if you find there is a difference. Quote All the same, some people are oblivious in addition to being lifelong political paranoids. It is in fact a very wide and thick line...a very bright one too... Washington Post: “He is preaching to the converted. He is lashing out at anyone who is not completely loyal. He is detaching himself from and delegitimizing the institutions of American political life. And he is proclaiming conspiracies everywhere — in polls (rigged), in debate moderators (biased) and in the election itself (soon to be stolen).” “In the presidential campaign’s home stretch, Donald Trump is fully inhabiting his own echo chamber. The Republican nominee has turned inward, increasingly isolated from the country’s mainstream and leaders of his own party, and determined to rouse his most fervent supporters with dire warnings that their populist movement could fall prey to dark and collusive forces.” The WP might as well just get their content from Hillary's foundation. Quote Sort of like the military industrial complex and its CIA run complex global drugs racket all protected in secret complexity by HRC. You really keep messing this part up. Hillary is only wanting to be the figurehead. But this is a real thing and it goes into much more than illegal drugs. But even this much makes you go into contortions, despite the connection between the CIA and drug smuggling has been discussed at length over the decades. Try a New York Times link Quote Donald Trump hasn't increased his bottom line voter support base for the past four months. Neither have the "complex" people increased their support base -- over their lifetime. The bulb blew out long ago over there for Trump and those he's taking down with him in this gift of an election campaign. Trump and everyone like him are going to be officially certified by the Electoral College as losers. It meets in a joint session of Congress December 18th to make it official by casting the votes by state. I'll look you up when it begins (C-SPAN). This part is boring. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
thaibeachlovers Posted October 17, 2016 Share Posted October 17, 2016 2 hours ago, Neurath said: One part xenophobia Two parts misogyny One part racism Three parts fear of difference One part fear of the future Two parts greed That's how. There you go again. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Publicus Posted October 17, 2016 Share Posted October 17, 2016 Could seem the rightwhinge is trying to convince others they have not politically expired. There are three weeks to the election so I'll give youse guyz several dayze to persuade me. The clock is now running... Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
SoiBiker Posted October 17, 2016 Share Posted October 17, 2016 1 hour ago, Publicus said: Humanity izzit. Maybe someone should try coming down a notch or two because we're talking about an election in the USA -- it's very specific. All the same, some people are oblivious in addition to being lifelong political paranoids. It is in fact a very wide and thick line...a very bright one too... Washington Post: “He is preaching to the converted. He is lashing out at anyone who is not completely loyal. He is detaching himself from and delegitimizing the institutions of American political life. And he is proclaiming conspiracies everywhere — in polls (rigged), in debate moderators (biased) and in the election itself (soon to be stolen).” “In the presidential campaign’s home stretch, Donald Trump is fully inhabiting his own echo chamber. The Republican nominee has turned inward, increasingly isolated from the country’s mainstream and leaders of his own party, and determined to rouse his most fervent supporters with dire warnings that their populist movement could fall prey to dark and collusive forces.” Sort of like the military industrial complex and its CIA run complex global drugs racket all protected in secret complexity by HRC. Donald Trump hasn't increased his bottom line voter support base for the past four months. Neither have the "complex" people increased their support base -- over their lifetime. The bulb blew out long ago over there for Trump and those he's taking down with him in this gift of an election campaign. Trump and everyone like him are going to be officially certified by the Electoral College as losers. It meets in a joint session of Congress December 18th to make it official by casting the votes by state. I'll look you up when it begins (C-SPAN). I think he's given up on the idea of winning the election, and is now looking to consolidate his position as leader of the supposedly disenfranchised right white males. Hence the ramping up of the 'rigged system' stuff. He wants to be some sort of opposition leader to a government he will claim is illegitimate - and doesn't care what damage he does to America's democracy in the process. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
thaibeachlovers Posted October 17, 2016 Share Posted October 17, 2016 7 minutes ago, SoiBiker said: I think he's given up on the idea of winning the election, and is now looking to consolidate his position as leader of the supposedly disenfranchised right white males. Hence the ramping up of the 'rigged system' stuff. He wants to be some sort of opposition leader to a government he will claim is illegitimate - and doesn't care what damage he does to America's democracy in the process. I'd agree, except IMO America hasn't had "democracy" since they stole the election from Al Gore. IMO, either Trump takes his toys and goes home to enjoy a life of unimaginable ( to most of us ) luxury, or he dedicates the rest of his life to the destruction of HRC and the Dems. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Neurath Posted October 17, 2016 Share Posted October 17, 2016 42 minutes ago, thaibeachlovers said: There you go again. That you said it, and that I understand it entails that we're both showing our age. Mind you, I was a precocious 3 year old. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Morch Posted October 17, 2016 Share Posted October 17, 2016 16 hours ago, Strange said: Yeah, I'm going on about nasty liberals. The nasty ones. The hate filled ones. Go back through my post history and see if I'm a trump supporter. Im in the "Not Hillary" camp. Does not mean that I am anything like what the nasty liberals say about people that don't want "Hill". Thats the thing about the Libs. If you are not on their side completely, you are a hate filled devil. You label liberals as nasty, making an incorrect generalized judgement call. Some liberals are, some aren't. Lashing out at all liberals is pretty much the same thing you riled against. Even within the context of these topics, not all posters express themselves in the same way or hold entirely similar opinions. For someone in the "Not Hillary" camp, you do spend a lot of words defending, excusing and minimizing some of Trump's comments - even when those are obviously out there, and even given that they are not the main reason why voters should thing twice before choosing the guy. The very same behavior you condemn can be found among supporters of Trump (on and off this forum)l it all depends on what one wishes to read and which topics nominally discuss what. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Neurath Posted October 17, 2016 Share Posted October 17, 2016 17 minutes ago, thaibeachlovers said: I'd agree, except IMO America hasn't had "democracy" since they stole the election from Al Gore. IMO, either Trump takes his toys and goes home to enjoy a life of unimaginable ( to most of us ) luxury, or he dedicates the rest of his life to the destruction of HRC and the Dems. No country has "democracy". We have better and worse realizations of it. It's a regulative ideal. The United States, in fact, has one of the great and greatest realizations of it, though imperfect, that has ever existed. This is a treasure - it's something to continue perfecting and refining. Another danger of this Trump craziness is the damage that he is now doing to this treasure. It is disgusting to behold. A loser who wants to burn down the house as his ass is being kicked out the door. Disgusting and dangerous. I imagine he behaves the same way when women deny him. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Morch Posted October 17, 2016 Share Posted October 17, 2016 8 hours ago, dcutman said: So you believe the accused should should be found guilty in the court of public opinion though a 24 hour a day 7 day a week media blitz with not one shred evidence, not even a character witness that all these women claim to have? A candidate's character and history ARE being subjected to the "court" of public opinion 24/7. That comes with the territory of being a presidential candidate. The above complaint would have more merit had Trump's own campaigns not been based on the very same style. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
thaibeachlovers Posted October 17, 2016 Share Posted October 17, 2016 7 minutes ago, Morch said: A candidate's character and history ARE being subjected to the "court" of public opinion 24/7. That comes with the territory of being a presidential candidate. The above complaint would have more merit had Trump's own campaigns not been based on the very same style. Can we just agree that BOTH candidates are behaving badly? IMO, HRC won because he said something years ago that allowed her to use the sexism card, and she played the low game well, better than him. To claim she is a good person ( not saying you do ) is patently ridiculous though. Certainly I wouldn't claim he has high principles, or is a polished man. The real losers in this contest are the people of the US, having the rest of the world mocking them as we are. I'm lovin' it. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
thaibeachlovers Posted October 17, 2016 Share Posted October 17, 2016 20 minutes ago, Neurath said: No country has "democracy". We have better and worse realizations of it. It's a regulative ideal. The United States, in fact, has one of the great and greatest realizations of it, though imperfect, that has ever existed. This is a treasure - it's something to continue perfecting and refining. Another danger of this Trump craziness is the damage that he is now doing to this treasure. It is disgusting to behold. A loser who wants to burn down the house as his ass is being kicked out the door. Disgusting and dangerous. I imagine he behaves the same way when women deny him. Hmmmm. I'd claim that Switzerland has the closest to real democracy, but never mind. Unfortunately, IMO, US democracy has been corrupted by big business and lobbyists. IMO it's time to start over, and if Trump makes that happen we'll all be the better for it. It's rather disturbing though, that some crude language that most men indulge in at some point in their life has had such a shocking effect on the future of the country. Perhaps American democracy isn't that strong after all. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
SoiBiker Posted October 17, 2016 Share Posted October 17, 2016 4 minutes ago, thaibeachlovers said: Hmmmm. I'd claim that Switzerland has the closest to real democracy, but never mind. Unfortunately, IMO, US democracy has been corrupted by big business and lobbyists. IMO it's time to start over, and if Trump makes that happen we'll all be the better for it. It's rather disturbing though, that some crude language that most men indulge in at some point in their life has had such a shocking effect on the future of the country. Perhaps American democracy isn't that strong after all. You still don't get it, do you? It's not the language he used that's the problem. It's the acts he described using it. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Chicog Posted October 17, 2016 Share Posted October 17, 2016 5 minutes ago, thaibeachlovers said: It's rather disturbing though, that some crude language that most men indulge in at some point in their life has had such a shocking effect on the future of the country. Perhaps American democracy isn't that strong after all. It is disturbing that one of a choice of two people for leader of one of the worlds superpowers boasts about "grabbing women by the pussy". It should really disturb anyone with any decency. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Publicus Posted October 17, 2016 Share Posted October 17, 2016 53 minutes ago, thaibeachlovers said: I'd agree, except IMO America hasn't had "democracy" since they stole the election from Al Gore. IMO, either Trump takes his toys and goes home to enjoy a life of unimaginable ( to most of us ) luxury, or he dedicates the rest of his life to the destruction of HRC and the Dems. Whatever Donald Trump does destroys everything he touches. Neither the Clintons nor the Democratic Party will allow Trump near 'em. Trump belongs to the rightwhinge nutcases and to the Republican Party or his rightwhinge media project, or whatever he may do in the short term or the long term future. Trump's mouth and mind are self-destructive or destructive of those he chooses to be with. Anyone who hasn't seen that is in a fog. Trump is busily electing Hillary Clinton Potus. He's an idiot thank you. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Strange Posted October 17, 2016 Share Posted October 17, 2016 43 minutes ago, Morch said: You label liberals as nasty, making an incorrect generalized judgement call. Some liberals are, some aren't. Lashing out at all liberals is pretty much the same thing you riled against. Even within the context of these topics, not all posters express themselves in the same way or hold entirely similar opinions. For someone in the "Not Hillary" camp, you do spend a lot of words defending, excusing and minimizing some of Trump's comments - even when those are obviously out there, and even given that they are not the main reason why voters should thing twice before choosing the guy. The very same behavior you condemn can be found among supporters of Trump (on and off this forum)l it all depends on what one wishes to read and which topics nominally discuss what. Ok if you aren't a nasty liberal then my post was not aimed at you. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Publicus Posted October 17, 2016 Share Posted October 17, 2016 13 minutes ago, thaibeachlovers said: Hmmmm. I'd claim that Switzerland has the closest to real democracy, but never mind. Unfortunately, IMO, US democracy has been corrupted by big business and lobbyists. IMO it's time to start over, and if Trump makes that happen we'll all be the better for it. It's rather disturbing though, that some crude language that most men indulge in at some point in their life has had such a shocking effect on the future of the country. Perhaps American democracy isn't that strong after all. Don't get too excited cause while the situation of the USA is hopeless it's not serious. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Publicus Posted October 17, 2016 Share Posted October 17, 2016 15 minutes ago, thaibeachlovers said: Hmmmm. I'd claim that Switzerland has the closest to real democracy, but never mind. Unfortunately, IMO, US democracy has been corrupted by big business and lobbyists. IMO it's time to start over, and if Trump makes that happen we'll all be the better for it. It's rather disturbing though, that some crude language that most men indulge in at some point in their life has had such a shocking effect on the future of the country. Perhaps American democracy isn't that strong after all. Julian Assange said at the outset of WiliLeaks that he focuses on the USA and the West because it's easier to change them than it is to change Russia or China. So we see what Assange's idea of change is and the direction in which it needs to move. And against which country to the benefit of which countries. According to Assange. And according to you, among others. By youse guyz Russia and China don't need to change, but the USA does need to be changed. Democracy and the western classical liberal idea are the target here, not dictatorship or tyrant leaders. In 2011 Assange said he had something coming against Putin until someone reminded Assange what happens to people who expose Putin. Very soon Assange had a tv show in Moscow courtesy of Vlad and there was no Putin news to report except that Putin is a wonderful father and leader of Russia. Sounds like the rightwhinge around here wants to see Putin doing Miss Universe instead. In Los Angeles. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Morch Posted October 17, 2016 Share Posted October 17, 2016 17 minutes ago, thaibeachlovers said: Can we just agree that BOTH candidates are behaving badly? IMO, HRC won because he said something years ago that allowed her to use the sexism card, and she played the low game well, better than him. To claim she is a good person ( not saying you do ) is patently ridiculous though. Certainly I wouldn't claim he has high principles, or is a polished man. The real losers in this contest are the people of the US, having the rest of the world mocking them as we are. I'm lovin' it. The post I was replying to attempted to cast Trump as a victim. He's not. Anyone who ever followed a presidential election campaign knows the ropes. The choice to take it down a few notches was Trump's. Whinging when it backfires is just being a sore loser. Or an entitled spoiled brat. Indeed, not claiming HRC is a "good person", not even that she's honest, trustworthy and whatnot. Being a "good person" is not a fundamental requirement for the job of POTUS. In all likelihood, some of the choices and decisions involved are not the ones a "good person" will intuitively make. That people want to see leaders as a projection of their ideals is all very fine, just got little to do with most being politicians (or entertainer, or generals). How is HRC behaving badly within the context of this topic (reminder: "Trump's shocking crude comments on women leave him reeling")? In a similar fashion, many of HRC campaign ads are simply things Trump said. Should her campaign ignore these things? Lovin' it would indicate an anti-US stance I'm not party to. The World will not be a better place with an embattled, weak POTUS, nor with a crass buffoon at the helm. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Morch Posted October 17, 2016 Share Posted October 17, 2016 12 minutes ago, Strange said: Ok if you aren't a nasty liberal then my post was not aimed at you. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
JLCrab Posted October 17, 2016 Share Posted October 17, 2016 1 hour ago, thaibeachlovers said: I'd agree, except IMO America hasn't had "democracy" since they stole the election from Al Gore. <snip> If Al Gore had carried his home state of Tennessee in the 2000 Presidential election he would have won the Presidency and what happened in Florida wouldn't have made any difference. https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/United_States_presidential_election_in_Tennessee,_2000 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Strange Posted October 17, 2016 Share Posted October 17, 2016 2 minutes ago, Morch said: 15 minutes ago, Strange said: Ok if you aren't a nasty liberal then my post was not aimed at you. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Recommended Posts
Archived
This topic is now archived and is closed to further replies.