May ready for tough talks over Brexit

[Laughing Gravy]

33 minutes ago, AlexRich said:

 

I'm not implying anything, I'm stating it. Without the referendum and all the public hatred stirred up by the likes of UKIP, Jo Cox would be alive today. 

Well you are the all mighty, he who has a crystal ball. The title of Oracle is deserved.

[Laughing Gravy]

12 minutes ago, Orac said:

 

 

 

 

Surely not....

http://newsthump.com/2016/06/17/daily-mail-trying-hard-to-avoid-saying-thomas-mair-agreed-with-everything-they-write/

 

 

OK I read the article. All I have to say is . I am signing up for a subscription, to ensure I can keep laughing everyday.

[AlexRich]

3 minutes ago, Laughing Gravy said:

Well you are the all mighty, he who has a crystal ball. The title of Oracle is deserved.

 

Thank you.

[Laughing Gravy]

49 minutes ago, RuamRudy said:

 

So the BBC is biased but you are happy to accept the direction from the Express, which is owned by the pornographer Richard Desmond, who previously owned Channel 5 and a TV porn channel, and still owns such esteemed organs as Asian Babes and Horny Housewives?

You can actually go to the BBC and hear her say it. There is no argument that it wasn't said. I added the link as it had the quote. I could easily have put the BBC news with see x minute/second.  It is forum rules not to put quotes without sources.

[AlexRich]

1 minute ago, Laughing Gravy said:

OK I read the article. All I have to say is . I am signing up for a subscription, to ensure I can keep laughing everyday.

 

Jo Cox's family aren't laughing?

 

Sad truth is that the referendum brought out the angry and nasty in our society, who believed they had been given a 'pass' to make foul and racist abuse towards people ... and prodded a mentally unhinged man to take the life of a public servant.

 

 

 

[Laughing Gravy]

7 minutes ago, AlexRich said:

 

Jo Cox's family aren't laughing?

 

Sad truth is that the referendum brought out the angry and nasty in our society, who believed they had been given a 'pass' to make foul and racist abuse towards people ... and prodded a mentally unhinged man to take the life of a public servant.

 

 

 

The referendum didn't bring this killing out this man seems to have had the potential regardless. There have always been nasty people about. If you look at the things that were allegedly said at Jo Cox death, which nobody disagrees was a tragedy. Things like he shouted "Britain First". A total lie.  The mainstream media peddled this lie and the remain used it, as the very reason you are touting now. In court 2 days ago and also in non mainstream coverage at the time of the killing, he clearly said "This is for Britain". Something totally different and a complete distortion of the truth for a political end.

[Laughing Gravy]

59 minutes ago, AlexRich said:

 

I'm not implying anything, I'm stating it. Without the referendum and all the public hatred stirred up by the likes of UKIP, Jo Cox would be alive today. 

Well even though you are the Oracle and have stated you know. Jo Cox husband disagrees with you totally.

 

http://www.thetelegraphandargus.co.uk/news/local/spenvalley/14832168.Jo_Cox_s_widower_does_not_believe_wife_s_killing_was_caused_by_Leave_vote/

[Khun Han]

Like I said, remain have become political ambulance chasers, cynically playing the public's heart strings, and the internet is currently full of 'useful idiots' fervently pushing this nonsense.

[SheungWan]

Brexit won the referendum. No expressions of regret from those who voted for it will change the fact. However, the Brexiteers did not and have not won the terms of Brexit, nor the process. They haven't lost them either. Both are in motion. It is also the case that the process and terms of Brexit are not only in play but are broadly being argued about by jousting sides labelled Hard Brexit and Soft Brexit. The Hard Brexiteers have always claimed ownership of the whole campaign so for them Soft Brexit is considered Remain ver 2. Anything standing in the way of Hard Brexit: parliament, the courts, independence of the judiciary can be jettisoned. As their knickers are progressively exposed, their campaign is revealed less as a return of legal authority to the UK, but rather an outright nasty right nationalist campaign which has ridden Brexit as its horse. The contradictions within the two positions are being played out for us within the government. Listen and watch that debate and disregard the misdirection in this thread.

Edited November 16, 2016 by SheungWan

[sandyf]

5 hours ago, Laughing Gravy said:

This article below is exactly the problem. The BBC and other establishment media just won't accept the result and that leave meant leave the EU, single market and control its borders and have sovereignty to make its own laws.  It has been mentioned over and over again, that it was clear. The BBC again with the quote below, just keep showing the arrogance and out of touch with the people, they really are. a protest vote. The abysmal bias and reporting has made the BBC so less credible that they are becoming a laughing stock.

 

The sadness is their is no opt out for the UK people on paying the licence fee. The next referendum the UK people should have, is shall we opt out of paying the BBC licence fee, simply yes or no. I can tell you there is no need for a poll for that outcome.

 

“We did opinion polls afterwards that showed that, actually, if we were to hold the referendum again, Remain would win.

“There were people who came on the BBC who said, ‘You know what? I voted to leave but I didn't actually think we were going to leave.’ It was a protest vote."

 

http://www.express.co.uk/news/uk/732528/Katty-Kay-Brexit-BBC-presenter-regrets-NBC

" that leave meant leave the EU, single market and control its borders and have sovereignty to make its own laws. "

I didn't see all that on my ballot paper, was yours different?

[AlexRich]

23 minutes ago, Laughing Gravy said:

Well even though you are the Oracle and have stated you know. Jo Cox husband disagrees with you totally.

 

http://www.thetelegraphandargus.co.uk/news/local/spenvalley/14832168.Jo_Cox_s_widower_does_not_believe_wife_s_killing_was_caused_by_Leave_vote/

 

"Mr Cox was asked if he thought his wife's death was connected in any way to the EU referendum.

He said: "I think the referendum was clearly a moment of heightened tension and heightened debate and some of that sometimes got out of control but I think it has nothing to do with the 52 per cent of people that voted for Brexit".

 

The banner 'headline' doesn't back up his quote above. He answered diplomatically, but side stepped the question. The people who voted Brexit were not involved in his wife's death ... that's merely a statement of fact. He wasn't asked if the "heightened debate" and "tensions" that "sometimes got out of control" led an unhinged person to kill his wife. If the referendum had not taken place his wife would have been alive today.  

 

 

[sandyf]

Speaking of hate crimes more broadly, Nick Lowles, the director of anti-racism organisation Hope Not Hate, said the result of the referendum appeared to have “emboldened” people with prejudiced views.

 

He warned there could potentially be spikes in hate crimes if expectations of improved standards of living following the EU referendum result were not met. 

http://www.independent.co.uk/news/uk/politics/brexit-lgbt-hate-crime-rise-galop-home-affairs-youre-next-a7419111.html

[Khun Han]

16 minutes ago, sandyf said:

Speaking of hate crimes more broadly, Nick Lowles, the director of anti-racism organisation Hope Not Hate, said the result of the referendum appeared to have “emboldened” people with prejudiced views.

 

He warned there could potentially be spikes in hate crimes if expectations of improved standards of living following the EU referendum result were not met. 

http://www.independent.co.uk/news/uk/politics/brexit-lgbt-hate-crime-rise-galop-home-affairs-youre-next-a7419111.html

 

Nick Lowles from the above linked article:

 

“The referendum debate obviously gave a green light to people who wanted to express their prejudice but it didn’t change society as a whole.”

 

By the way, why have you started putting your posts in large font? They'll still get read in normal font.

[7by7]

On ‎15‎/‎11‎/‎2016 at 9:37 AM, AlexRich said:

One for the Brexit lovers: 

 

http://www.cityam.com/253648/no-plan-brexit-memo-companies-point-gun-governments-head

 

The memo, prepared for the Cabinet Office, also noted that the business world has come to two “unpleasant realisations”:

First, that the government’s priority remains its political survival, not the economy – second, that there will be no clear economic-Brexit strategy any time soon because it is being developed on a case-by-case basis as specific decisions are forced on government.

 

Humiliating climbdown for advisory firm Deloitte after leaked Brexit memo sparks row

Quote

Tonight Deloitte issued a statement admitting its report was not done at the behest of ministers and represents its personal view.

“This was a note intended primarily for internal audiences,” said a spokesperson for the firm, which is frequently contracted to undertake government work.

“It was not commissioned by the Cabinet Office, nor any other government department, and represents a view of the task facing Whitehall.

“This work was conducted without access to No10 or input from any other government departments.”

 

[AlexRich]

1 hour ago, 7by7 said:

 

Humiliating climbdown for advisory firm Deloitte after leaked Brexit memo sparks row

 

 

Where does it say the content is not true?

[Laughing Gravy]

17 hours ago, Khun Han said:

Like I said, remain have become political ambulance chasers, cynically playing the public's heart strings, and the internet is currently full of 'useful idiots' fervently pushing this nonsense.

I agree Han Also the other one media and papers are pushing, is that Brexit voters were uneducated people who were not aware of their actions. Once again blatant nonsense and trash. Out of all my friends and myself that voted for Brexit, 2 do not have at least one university degree, they served 4 years apprentices, way back in the day. The rest have a draw full which shows that those who voted Brexit are uneducated to be a fallacy, made up to represent that people didn't have the intelligence, to make a decision.

 

I also disagree with the fact that having a university degree makes you educated and that you can't understand politics and real life issues. I have met many with various university degrees and they are quite dim and clueless.

[Laughing Gravy]

17 hours ago, AlexRich said:

 

"Mr Cox was asked if he thought his wife's death was connected in any way to the EU referendum.

He said: "I think the referendum was clearly a moment of heightened tension and heightened debate and some of that sometimes got out of control but I think it has nothing to do with the 52 per cent of people that voted for Brexit".

 

The banner 'headline' doesn't back up his quote above. He answered diplomatically, but side stepped the question. The people who voted Brexit were not involved in his wife's death ... that's merely a statement of fact. He wasn't asked if the "heightened debate" and "tensions" that "sometimes got out of control" led an unhinged person to kill his wife. If the referendum had not taken place his wife would have been alive today.  

 

 

So which bit of the 'I think it has nothing to do with the 52 percent of the people that voted for Brexit' sidesteps that it was the referendum that killed his wife that you were 'stating' caused his wife's death. Was it the 48 percent of those who voted remain then? Obviously no. She was killed by a crazy. Stating it was the referendums fault shows naivety and without any true facts, only hearsay and your opinion.

 

It is also you showing prejudice the very thing that you are saying has happened because of brexit.

Edited November 17, 2016 by Laughing Gravy

[Laughing Gravy]

17 hours ago, sandyf said:

" that leave meant leave the EU, single market and control its borders and have sovereignty to make its own laws. "

I didn't see all that on my ballot paper, was yours different?

Please don't quote only half of what I said to try and justify your point, as if you had quoted my full answer, your statement would have been worthless.

 

Well it would seem many agree with me. My only issue with the article is they should stop messing around and get on with it, although I suppose the remoaners, who are purposely trying to derail the peoples majority choice, are hampering it.

 

"Seven out of 10 Brits demand strict migrant limits and a clean break from the EU"

 

http://www.express.co.uk/news/uk/733147/Britain-strict-migrant-limits-clean-break-EU-Article-50

[Khun Han]

17 hours ago, 7by7 said:

 

Humiliating climbdown for advisory firm Deloitte after leaked Brexit memo sparks row

 

 

But it had previously been stated that it was information taken from a memo prepared for the cabinet office. Now they're saying that bit isn't true, and that it's an assessment (speculation). Project Fear is still in full swing.

[AlexRich]

5 hours ago, Laughing Gravy said:

So which bit of the 'I think it has nothing to do with the 52 percent of the people that voted for Brexit' sidesteps that it was the referendum that killed his wife that you were 'stating' caused his wife's death. Was it the 48 percent of those who voted remain then? Obviously no. She was killed by a crazy. Stating it was the referendums fault shows naivety and without any true facts, only hearsay and your opinion.

 

It is also you showing prejudice the very thing that you are saying has happened because of brexit.

 

Did Thomas Mair vote in the referendum? I guess not, as he was in police custody. The ugly atmosphere created by this referendum tipped  an unhinged person over the edge ... and he sought out and killed the MP. True facts? There are few coincidences in life, and the nasty hate focused on immigrants, the 'free pass' some people thought they had been given to express their racism and xenophobia, provided the necessary encouragement to tip this idiot over the edge. 

 

Mr Cox was diplomatic, he simply swerved the question ... if they had asked - if there had been no referendum do you think your wife would still be alive? ... the answer would be yes. Because that is in fact the truth of the matter.  

 

 

[AlexRich]

Brexit polls got it wrong because they underestimated the way ‘uneducated’ would vote

http://www.express.co.uk/news/uk/733051/Brexit-polls-uneducated-vote-EU-referendum-underestimated-strength-of-leave

 

Revolt of the numpties! 

[AlexRich]

42 minutes ago, Khun Han said:

 

But it had previously been stated that it was information taken from a memo prepared for the cabinet office. Now they're saying that bit isn't true, and that it's an assessment (speculation). Project Fear is still in full swing.

 

A sad indictment of the "Mayhem" government ... filled with chancers on the make, more concerned with their political futures than the economic interests of the country.

 

The phrase "it's the economy stupid" was coined for a reason ... Governments that mess up in this area tend not to last ... and xenophobia is fine until it starts to hit your pocketbook. The phrase "a week is a long time in politics" was also coined for a reason.

 

All is not well in Brexit Towers. 

[dick dasterdly]

On 11/15/2016 at 3:26 PM, Orac said:

Sounds like the brexit planning isn't going well.

http://www.bbc.com/news/uk-politics-37983948

 

On 11/15/2016 at 4:37 PM, AlexRich said:

One for the Brexit lovers: 

 

http://www.cityam.com/253648/no-plan-brexit-memo-companies-point-gun-governments-head

 

The memo, prepared for the Cabinet Office, also noted that the business world has come to two “unpleasant realisations”:

First, that the government’s priority remains its political survival, not the economy – second, that there will be no clear economic-Brexit strategy any time soon because it is being developed on a case-by-case basis as specific decisions are forced on government.

 

2 minutes ago, AlexRich said:

 

A sad indictment of the "Mayhem" government ... filled with chancers on the make, more concerned with their political futures than the economic interests of the country.

 

The phrase "it's the economy stupid" was coined for a reason ... Governments that mess up in this area tend not to last ... and xenophobia is fine until it starts to hit your pocketbook. The phrase "a week is a long time in politics" was also coined for a reason.

 

All is not well in Brexit Towers. 

 

Is this last post as accurate as the previous posts endorsing the 'leaked Deloittes cabinet memo' - that turned out to be nothing of the sort?

 

Edit - Although to be fair I think SandyF posted this (eventually) discredited memo first, possibly in another thread.  I'd love to know how this memo - that Deloittes eventually said was prepared as an 'internal memo' - appeared as a major item in The Times....

Edited November 17, 2016 by dick dasterdly

[Laughing Gravy]

4 minutes ago, AlexRich said:

Brexit polls got it wrong because they underestimated the way ‘uneducated’ would vote

http://www.express.co.uk/news/uk/733051/Brexit-polls-uneducated-vote-EU-referendum-underestimated-strength-of-leave

 

Revolt of the numpties! 

I am glad you are using the express. It has some good articles in. What the article clearly shows how delusional (Prof Curtic) this man is. He should be called in for a hate crime. Basically unless you have a degree you can't think or understand politics. The man is a first class idiot and clearly out of touch with the people. I already commented on this before. Is Numpties your word or Grouse. Either way I am glad there are 17.4 million of them.

[Laughing Gravy]

19 minutes ago, AlexRich said:

Mr Cox was diplomatic, he simply swerved the question ... if they had asked - if there had been no referendum do you think your wife would still be alive? ... the answer would be yes. Because that is in fact the truth of the matter.  

So you are Mr. Cox now and know what he would say. Truly you are the oracle or talking

[jimmybkk]

There are really only 2 yes/no questions that should be asked of those debating this topic now:

 

1. Do you support a democratic system of governance?

2. Do you believe that the Brexit referendum was somehow rigged?

 

If you answered No to the first question then the UK is probably not the right place for you, and you can forget about question 2.

 

If you answered yes to the second question then please advise how you believe it was rigged?

 

If you answered Yes to the first question and No to the second question, then you really ought to be satisfied that the democratic process has been confirmed to be fully functional in the UK, and you should take some solace in that. Bemoaning the fact that more people had a preference that was not the same as yours than than those who had a preference that was the same as yours is pure selfishness and just makes you look like a childish, sore loser who hates the taste of sour grapes and who only favours the democratic process when the results go their way.

[AlexRich]

1 minute ago, dick dasterdly said:

 

 

 

Is this last post as accurate as the previous posts endorsing the 'leaked Deloittes cabinet memo' - that turned out to be nothing of the sort?

 

A publication by Deloittes? Who do you think they are? A student blog? They are one of the biggest audit and consultancy companies in the world, who have close links with and work extensively with Government and businesses in the UK. 

 

I was less interested in where it came from, more concerned with the content. The question you should be asking is the view expressed accurate? They have stated that business believes that the Government are more interested in staying in power and have no strategy on brexit ... given Deloitte's extensive links to both business and Government you might want to sit up and take notice. The report was not fake and the opinions expressed were very real. 

 

[jimmybkk]

12 minutes ago, AlexRich said:

 

A sad indictment of the "Mayhem" government ... filled with chancers on the make, more concerned with their political futures than the economic interests of the country.

 

The phrase "it's the economy stupid" was coined for a reason ... Governments that mess up in this area tend not to last ... and xenophobia is fine until it starts to hit your pocketbook. The phrase "a week is a long time in politics" was also coined for a reason.

 

All is not well in Brexit Towers. 

If all is not well it is because Cammo failed to live up to his responsibilities and was incapable of coming up with a gameplan for the flip side of a coin toss that he himself instigated... and yet this is the guy who you would want to be leading the country? Go figure...

[RuamRudy]

7 minutes ago, Laughing Gravy said:

So you are Mr. Cox now and know what he would say. Truly you are the oracle or talking

On 11/15/2016 at 4:08 PM, Laughing Gravy said:

Game, set and match.

 

You were confident enough to make the above statement when CrackHouseParty declared with complete certainty that there was no connection between Brexit and the murder of Jo Cox. Which particular Oracle told you that? 

[AlexRich]

10 minutes ago, Laughing Gravy said:

So you are Mr. Cox now and know what he would say. Truly you are the oracle or talking

 

And you are a typical deluded denier, who if it were your own family member would be singing a different tune. A nasty campaign led a nasty man to kill an innocent woman ... personal comments aimed at me doesn't change that. 

Edited November 17, 2016 by AlexRich