Belgium signs the CETA deal

[rooster59]

Belgium signs the CETA deal

Catherine Hardy

 

 

Belgium’s foreign minister finally signs the CETA deal on behalf of his country.

 

The troubled treaty has had a difficult journey.

 

It had been blocked by Belgium’s regional parliament in Wallonia, effectively meaning it could not be signed by the national government, nor by the EU as a whole.

 

Wallonia eventually voted in favour on Friday.

 

Didier Reynders said: “This is the best commercial treaty the EU has ever signed with one of its close collaborators, which shares the same values and same system of common rules.”

 

EU institutions got involved in persuading Wallonia to change its stance.

 

Once signed, the huge free-trade deal will remove the tariffs from the majority of goods traded between Canada and the 28 EU member states.

 

Opponents say it places too much power in the hands of multinational companies.

 

A second deal, the TTIP, is under negotiation to be signed with the US.

 

 

-- © Copyright Euronews 2016-10-30

 

[jaidam]

Great. Europe gains an extra marketplace of 35million people. Canada gains a marketplace of 500 million. Easy to see who this most benefits. Canada with its huge acreage has the potential to destroy the EU dairy industry. Oh well, the eurocrats clearly just don't care beyond getting their signatures on paper, acting busy to justify the gravy train upon which they ride.

[geriatrickid]

31 minutes ago, jaidam said:

Great. Europe gains an extra marketplace of 35million people. Canada gains a marketplace of 500 million. Easy to see who this most benefits. Canada with its huge acreage has the potential to destroy the EU dairy industry. Oh well, the eurocrats clearly just don't care beyond getting their signatures on paper, acting busy to justify the gravy train upon which they ride.

 

If you  are clueless on a subject please refrain from commenting. You obviously did not read the agreement, and you certainly  are ignorant of the agreement conditions in respect to agriculture. The EU dairy sector will not be  touched by the Canadian dairy industry. It was the other way around. The Canadian dairy farmers were worried about the potential for EU dumping. That is why the agreement was written to protect the dairy sector.

 

The EU will benefit in respect to the agriculture sector because the EU is a net importer of agricultural products. The EU has a shortage of both arable land and water. The agreement with Canada is environmentally beneficial to the EU as the water intensive crops, particularly  grain and  seed oils will cost less. Canada has abundant  fresh water. The EUwill also benefit economically because it will be able to use its limited fresh water resources  for more profitable crops.

 

Don't let actual facts get in the way of your spreading falsehoods and lies.

 

 

Edited October 30, 2016 by geriatrickid

[jaidam]

1 hour ago, geriatrickid said:

 

If you  are clueless on a subject please refrain from commenting. You obviously did not read the agreement, and you certainly  are ignorant of the agreement conditions in respect to agriculture. The EU dairy sector will not be  touched by the Canadian dairy industry. It was the other way around. The Canadian dairy farmers were worried about the potential for EU dumping. That is why the agreement was written to protect the dairy sector.

 

The EU will benefit in respect to the agriculture sector because the EU is a net importer of agricultural products. The EU has a shortage of both arable land and water. The agreement with Canada is environmentally beneficial to the EU as the water intensive crops, particularly  grain and  seed oils will cost less. Canada has abundant  fresh water. The EUwill also benefit economically because it will be able to use its limited fresh water resources  for more profitable crops.

 

Don't let actual facts get in the way of your spreading falsehoods and lies.

 

 

You are right because the Guardian says so? Public forums such as these are designed to allow diverse opinions and possibly the members will come to some sort of group agreement(as on terror related threads) - or not. Only allowing opinions that follow the Guardian line would be a bit pointless - although seeing as the commie rag in question does not allow comments should tell you all you need to know about their viewpoint. Indefensible tosh.

 

[Khun Han]

2 hours ago, geriatrickid said:

 

If you  are clueless on a subject please refrain from commenting. You obviously did not read the agreement, and you certainly  are ignorant of the agreement conditions in respect to agriculture. The EU dairy sector will not be  touched by the Canadian dairy industry. It was the other way around. The Canadian dairy farmers were worried about the potential for EU dumping. That is why the agreement was written to protect the dairy sector.

 

The EU will benefit in respect to the agriculture sector because the EU is a net importer of agricultural products. The EU has a shortage of both arable land and water. The agreement with Canada is environmentally beneficial to the EU as the water intensive crops, particularly  grain and  seed oils will cost less. Canada has abundant  fresh water. The EUwill also benefit economically because it will be able to use its limited fresh water resources  for more profitable crops.

 

Don't let actual facts get in the way of your spreading falsehoods and lies.

 

 

 

The main reason for the existence of the EU's Set Aside policy (paying farmers to leave arable land fallow) is to cut over-production of the very crops you say the EU struggles to produce.

[simple1]

Rule 2 applies in that TV does not permit to post any material which is knowingly or can be reasonably construed as false, inaccurate. e.g...

 

The Guardian does permit online comments and encourages readers to do so though the Guardian will block / ban repeat offenders of it's T&Cs which is long overdue for some members of TV. As an example  one of the may articles concerning the CEDA deal with so far 896 comments posted.

 

https://www.theguardian.com/business/2016/oct/29/britain-must-learn-from-the-eu-canada-ceta-trade-deal-saga

[Khun Han]

Does that Rule 2 apply to making a false claim about the EU's ability to produce grain and seed oil crops? Or are you just another one of those posters who plays games to try to get posters you disagree with into trouble?

[jaidam]

17 minutes ago, simple1 said:

Rule 2 applies in that TV does not permit to post any material which is knowingly or can be reasonably construed as false, inaccurate. e.g...

 

The Guardian does permit online comments and encourages readers to do so though the Guardian will block / ban repeat offenders of it's T&Cs which is long overdue for some members of TV. As an example  one of the may articles concerning the CEDA deal with so far 896 comments posted.

 

https://www.theguardian.com/business/2016/oct/29/britain-must-learn-from-the-eu-canada-ceta-trade-deal-saga

 

Sorry, I was mistaken. It was an honest mistake. Plenty of these extreme left wing rags do not allow comments

[geriatrickid]

50 minutes ago, Khun Han said:

 

The main reason for the existence of the EU's Set Aside policy (paying farmers to leave arable land fallow) is to cut over-production of the very crops you say the EU struggles to produce.

 

The self serving Belgian farm lobby, awash in the billions of euro subsidies certainly convinced you didn't it.  The EU does not  leave arable land fallow in respect to oil seed crops  or wheat, which are the two items that will mbe most impacted. In fact, the EU already has to import these commodities because it does not have  enough to satisfy its own market. The grain products that may be imported from Canada are already present in the market and do not compete with local producers. Nor does the EU grow the specialty products that would be most likely to be exported such as blueberries, or maple syrup or specialty apples etc. The EU doesn't  have the pulp and paper products that Canada  can provide. Where exactly are these large forests  to grow the trees in the EU?

 

Here's a reality check, of all the sectors to be impacted by the agreement, the agriculture sector will be least affected. Know why? €42 million a year in excise taxes are involved. That's it.  It's all about industrial commodities and opportunity.  It's about eliminating expensive and costly bureaucracy. The agreement allows for the recognition of professional credentials and eliminates double testing. EU products will not need to be tested to meet Canadian standards and Canadian products will not  need to be tested to meet EU standards. Know why? Because the agreement  means that they will use similar testing methods and standards. this will save consumers money. EU countries will now be able to sell their high end products into the Canadian market because their service personnel will be allowed to enter and service the products. Industial equipment manufacturers from Germany, France and Italy  were missing out on large chunks of the Canadian market because under NAFTA there was an advantage to  deal with the USA instead. Gone are the  excessive customs tariffs that penalized consumers and that made imports from  Asia more attractive. Now the EU auto and truck manufacturers have a more competitive position in the Canadian market market and the Japoanese and Koreans  won't have a cost advantage anymore. EU companies will now be able to bid on  Canadian infrastructure projects. This will hurt the USA  more than anyone else because the USA has restrictive tendering requirements and has done everything it  could to exploit loopholes in NAFTA to its benefit, CETA will bring competition to the high end  industrial equipment and high tech markets in Canada because it will no longer  be the exclusive domain of the USA and some Asian suppliers. Gone will be almost 500 million Euros in  tariffs on  EU exports that will make the EU more competitive.

 

Read the agreement. It's all about eliminating double taxation and extra costs. It allows for the free movement of professionals.

 

 

[Brer Fox]

The Belgians would sign a piece of used toilet paper if they thought it would make their trough any deeper and wider and fuller. Brussels being the gravy train capital of the world.

Edited October 30, 2016 by Brer Fox

[elgordo38]

6 hours ago, jaidam said:

Great. Europe gains an extra marketplace of 35million people. Canada gains a marketplace of 500 million. Easy to see who this most benefits. Canada with its huge acreage has the potential to destroy the EU dairy industry. Oh well, the eurocrats clearly just don't care beyond getting their signatures on paper, acting busy to justify the gravy train upon which they ride.

Fear not the water tankers are already filling up in Canada. I can hear the huge sucking sound. Maybe I am confused it could be jobs being sucked up. I must check the price of water is it on a par with oil or higher. Canada the water savior to the world in years to come. 

[Khun Han]

4 hours ago, geriatrickid said:

 

The self serving Belgian farm lobby, awash in the billions of euro subsidies certainly convinced you didn't it.  The EU does not  leave arable land fallow in respect to oil seed crops  or wheat, which are the two items that will mbe most impacted. In fact, the EU already has to import these commodities because it does not have  enough to satisfy its own market. The grain products that may be imported from Canada are already present in the market and do not compete with local producers. Nor does the EU grow the specialty products that would be most likely to be exported such as blueberries, or maple syrup or specialty apples etc. The EU doesn't  have the pulp and paper products that Canada  can provide. Where exactly are these large forests  to grow the trees in the EU?

 

Here's a reality check, of all the sectors to be impacted by the agreement, the agriculture sector will be least affected. Know why? €42 million a year in excise taxes are involved. That's it.  It's all about industrial commodities and opportunity.  It's about eliminating expensive and costly bureaucracy. The agreement allows for the recognition of professional credentials and eliminates double testing. EU products will not need to be tested to meet Canadian standards and Canadian products will not  need to be tested to meet EU standards. Know why? Because the agreement  means that they will use similar testing methods and standards. this will save consumers money. EU countries will now be able to sell their high end products into the Canadian market because their service personnel will be allowed to enter and service the products. Industial equipment manufacturers from Germany, France and Italy  were missing out on large chunks of the Canadian market because under NAFTA there was an advantage to  deal with the USA instead. Gone are the  excessive customs tariffs that penalized consumers and that made imports from  Asia more attractive. Now the EU auto and truck manufacturers have a more competitive position in the Canadian market market and the Japoanese and Koreans  won't have a cost advantage anymore. EU companies will now be able to bid on  Canadian infrastructure projects. This will hurt the USA  more than anyone else because the USA has restrictive tendering requirements and has done everything it  could to exploit loopholes in NAFTA to its benefit, CETA will bring competition to the high end  industrial equipment and high tech markets in Canada because it will no longer  be the exclusive domain of the USA and some Asian suppliers. Gone will be almost 500 million Euros in  tariffs on  EU exports that will make the EU more competitive.

 

Read the agreement. It's all about eliminating double taxation and extra costs. It allows for the free movement of professionals.

 

 

 

You were talking about grain and seed oil crops in your first 'rebuttal'. Now you've changed your tune to trees, pulp mills and the automotive industry (none of which I disagree with by the way)! Expand the discussion all you want. But you were just plain wrong about the EU farming industry.

 

http://www.ecifm.rdg.ac.uk/setaside.htm

 

http://www.bbc.co.uk/news/world-europe-11216061

 

And here's an amusing little anecdote from the early days of Set Aside:

 

http://www.independent.co.uk/news/uk/farmer-earns-pounds-19000-a-year-for-growing-nothing-for-five-years-the-only-crop-on-215-high-1429787.html

[Khun Han]

3 hours ago, Brer Fox said:

The Belgians would sign a piece of used toilet paper if they thought it would make their trough any deeper and wider and fuller. Brussels being the gravy train capital of the world.

 

Belgium has long had endemic corruption, a malaise that goes right to the heart of the state. Read the Mark Dutroux story to see how deeply  that sickness runs and powers the nation's state structure. The EU basing itself there could, rather generously at best, be described as naive.

[PeCeDe]

9 hours ago, jaidam said:

Great. Europe gains an extra marketplace of 35million people. Canada gains a marketplace of 500 million. Easy to see who this most benefits. Canada with its huge acreage has the potential to destroy the EU dairy industry. Oh well, the eurocrats clearly just don't care beyond getting their signatures on paper, acting busy to justify the gravy train upon which they ride.

Hmm last time I was in the UK milk cost 1GBP for 2 litres, all imported from the eastern EU countries, be a miracle if Canada could, or would be able to ship even totally empty milk containers to beat that price.

 

I'm actually hard pressed to think what Canada could import to the EU, obviously must be something otherwise they wouldn't have bothered.

Edited October 30, 2016 by PeCeDe
Last para. added

[bark]

14 hours ago, geriatrickid said:

 

If you  are clueless on a subject please refrain from commenting. You obviously did not read the agreement, and you certainly  are ignorant of the agreement conditions in respect to agriculture. The EU dairy sector will not be  touched by the Canadian dairy industry. It was the other way around. The Canadian dairy farmers were worried about the potential for EU dumping. That is why the agreement was written to protect the dairy sector.

 

The EU will benefit in respect to the agriculture sector because the EU is a net importer of agricultural products. The EU has a shortage of both arable land and water. The agreement with Canada is environmentally beneficial to the EU as the water intensive crops, particularly  grain and  seed oils will cost less. Canada has abundant  fresh water. The EUwill also benefit economically because it will be able to use its limited fresh water resources  for more profitable crops.

 

Don't let actual facts get in the way of your spreading falsehoods and lies.

 

 

Canada will sell Icebergs to the EU; for fresh water.

EU will send Terrorists for free.

 

[Ulic]

17 hours ago, jaidam said:

Great. Europe gains an extra marketplace of 35million people. Canada gains a marketplace of 500 million. Easy to see who this most benefits. Canada with its huge acreage has the potential to destroy the EU dairy industry. Oh well, the eurocrats clearly just don't care beyond getting their signatures on paper, acting busy to justify the gravy train upon which they ride.

Clearly you have no clue about the Canadian dairy industry which has a marketing board/production quotas

that cause Canadians to pay a great deal more for cheese and milk than we should. As I love cheese

I would love to see this marketing board close. Milk production in Canada has long ceased to be the domain

of family dairy farms and is controlled by big agribusiness which have bought up the milk quotas long ago.

When various trade deals open up import quotas, it is only the big dairy producers that get the import quota

for the dairy products. They do not pass any of the lower cost savings onto the consumers. Corruption of

the system is alive and well even in "saintly" Canada. Truly opening up the Canadian dairy industry to New Zealand

and Europe would save the average Canadian family $400 a year. (Not sure if that is accurate, but that is

what I have read. I am not sure who produced that number.) All I know is cheese in cheaper in Thailand

than Canada.

 

Edited October 30, 2016 by Ulic

[Thorgal]

Great. Europe gains an extra marketplace of 35million people. Canada gains a marketplace of 500 million. Easy to see who this most benefits. Canada with its huge acreage has the potential to destroy the EU dairy industry. Oh well, the eurocrats clearly just don't care beyond getting their signatures on paper, acting busy to justify the gravy train upon which they ride.

Exactly, Canada signed previously the NAFTA trade agreements with the US and Mexico.

It's known that ractopamine, chlorine and hormones are used in North America. Local European legislation who forbids such products in the food chain will now be overruled by the CETA.

Idem dito for the cloning industry and contamination of crops due to fracking.

Furthermore, the CETA deal was 'negotiated' through delegations of European technocrats and private representatives. From a pure democratic point of view it should have been negotiated by European elected members....




Sent from my iPad using Thaivisa Connect

[geriatrickid]

6 hours ago, Thorgal said:

 

Exactly, Canada signed previously the NAFTA trade agreements with the US and Mexico.

It's known that ractopamine, chlorine and hormones are used in North America. Local European legislation who forbids such products in the food chain will now be overruled by the CETA.

Idem dito for the cloning industry and contamination of crops due to fracking.

Furthermore, the CETA deal was 'negotiated' through delegations of European technocrats and private representatives. From a pure democratic point of view it should have been negotiated by European elected members....




Sent from my iPad using Thaivisa Connect

 

 

More lies. The EU rules and regulations remain. Show us where in the agreement  all of these imaginary activities will be allowed.

[SgtRock]

The Wallonians may well have been put back in their box, but the Dutch are now off and running

 

Quote

Activists in the Netherlands have gathered almost two-thirds of the signatures needed to lay the groundwork for a referendum on Europe’s free trade deal with Canada, which they say overly favours the interests of multinational companies.

 

Quote

The Dutch have twice voted down European Union initiatives in referendums, scuppering a proposed EU constitution in 2005 and in April throwing into disarray plans for closer EU relations with Ukraine.

 

https://www.theguardian.com/world/2016/nov/04/dutch-campaigners-eu-canada-trade-deal-referendum

 

One day the dipsticks at HQ Brussels will come to understand that what they want and what the people of the EU want are very often polar opposites.

 

By then it will be too late, they can fiddle whilst the EU burns.