Trump blames 'both Democrats and Republicans' for allegations

[tx22cb]

8 hours ago, boomerangutang said:

I just watched Trump's acceptance speech in its boring entirety.  Yes, I sound like a masochist.  It was tepid.  He had many pauses where he expected applause, and there was scant little.   It sounded like a Jr. High School football coach (whose team is 10 points behind) telling his team that they're the greatest team the world has ever known, and the other team is rotten.   Trump talked about divine blessings .....what a BS'er.

Normally I would blame his speech-writer .... but Trump says he wrote his speech himself ...

[Morch]

9 hours ago, craigt3365 said:

Excellent video.  Very informative!

 

If only her presentation, tone and mannerisms weren't so annoying...

Edited January 21, 2017 by Morch

[boomerangutang]

Ulysses opines; " Personally I could care less about seeing his tax returns. He is a billionaire and very successful. Those are the FACTS."

 

According to who, Breitbart? 

 

It's much more likely that he's been cheating on taxes for the past 30 to 40 years. If you've been paying attention, you'll see Trump leaves a 5 mile oil slick of cheating and scamming.  He cheats, lies and scams every day.  

 

      That's why he will absolutely not release his tax returns - not for 2016 or any year prior.  The one year which the general public saw, was not released by him - and it showed cheating on a grande scale.

 

       He may be worth 1 billion tops.  Show me any facts (not counting the pap that comes out of his mouth) which proves otherwise.  

 

       P.S. in his recent press conference, he said he has no financial or business involvements with Russia.  Earlier, his son said the Trump Organization had mega involvements with Russia (in so many words).  If Trump has zero money involvements in Russia, then I'm Catherine the Great.

[Ulysses G.]

10 hours ago, boomerangutang said:

Ulysses opines; " Personally I could care less about seeing his tax returns. He is a billionaire and very successful. Those are the FACTS."

 

According to who, Breitbart? 

 

 

According to Forbes and numerous other experts. How can anyone posting about this subject not realize that after all this time? The man is a multi-bilionaire and that is a FACT.

 

http://www.forbes.com/donald-trump/#6f6f8876790b

 

 

http://www.investopedia.com/updates/donald-trump-net-worth/

[LarryBird]

10 hours ago, boomerangutang said:

Ulysses opines; " Personally I could care less about seeing his tax returns. He is a billionaire and very successful. Those are the FACTS."

 

According to who, Breitbart? 

 

It's much more likely that he's been cheating on taxes for the past 30 to 40 years. If you've been paying attention, you'll see Trump leaves a 5 mile oil slick of cheating and scamming.  He cheats, lies and scams every day.  

 

      That's why he will absolutely not release his tax returns - not for 2016 or any year prior.  The one year which the general public saw, was not released by him - and it showed cheating on a grande scale.

 

       He may be worth 1 billion tops.  Show me any facts (not counting the pap that comes out of his mouth) which proves otherwise.  

 

       P.S. in his recent press conference, he said he has no financial or business involvements with Russia.  Earlier, his son said the Trump Organization had mega involvements with Russia (in so many words).  If Trump has zero money involvements in Russia, then I'm Catherine the Great.

 

You do realize the IRS can scrutinize his tax returns?

[heybruce]

8 minutes ago, LarryBird said:

 

You do realize the IRS can scrutinize his tax returns?

 

You do realize that the IRS is scrutinizing his tax returns?  Or so Trump claims, though he has yet to release the standard form letter telling him he is being audited. 

 

So what's your point?  He could be running major scams and deducting golden showers as business expenses, so long as he declares properly the IRS doesn't care.  The IRS only looks for tax fraud.

[heybruce]

53 minutes ago, Ulysses G. said:

 

According to Forbes and numerous other experts. How can anyone posting about this subject not realize that after all this time? The man is a multi-bilionaire and that is a FACT.

 

http://www.forbes.com/donald-trump/#6f6f8876790b

 

 

http://www.investopedia.com/updates/donald-trump-net-worth/

 

I didn't bother with the investopedia link, I stuck with Forbes.  It showed that most of his wealth is tied up in New York real estate, and it could only estimate how much is borrowed against this real estate.  Add to this the fact that Trump will publicly state his holdings are worth more than ten times what he will tell the tax man they are worth  https://www.washingtonpost.com/politics/how-much-does-trump-claim-his-golf-courses-are-worth-it-depends-who-needs-to-know/2016/08/21/71828f3a-5f3c-11e6-9d2f-b1a3564181a1_story.html?utm_term=.b025be0cb98f   and we are left with reason to doubt any claims he makes about what he is worth.

 

Too bad we can't get those tax returns and detailed, independently audited statements of net worth.

[Ulysses G.]

2 minutes ago, heybruce said:

I didn't bother with the investopedia link

 

The lowest estimate is 3 billion from anumber of experts -including Forbes -  and the article says that he is "certainly a billionaire". Pretending otherwise is ridiculous political rhetoric 

[Ulysses G.]

36 minutes ago, heybruce said:

 

You do realize that the IRS is scrutinizing his tax returns?  Or so Trump claims, though he has yet to release the standard form letter telling him he is being audited. 

 

So what's your point?  He could be running major scams and deducting golden showers as business expenses, so long as he declares properly the IRS doesn't care.  The IRS only looks for tax fraud.

 

Not according to tax attorneys and other experts who deal with the IRS. Whether strictly legal, or not, information about illegal activities gets shared: "The IRS would certainly report it to law enforcement."

 

http://money.cnn.com/2013/02/28/news/economy/illegal-income-tax/

Edited January 21, 2017 by Ulysses G.

[heybruce]

18 minutes ago, Ulysses G. said:

 

The lowest estimate is 3 billion from anumber of experts -including Forbes -  and the article says that he is "certainly a billionaire". Pretending otherwise is ridiculous political rhetoric 

 

I see, estimates, used because Trump is secretive about his wealth, are ok when they support your claim, but not estimates that show he would be worth much more if he had put his inherited wealth in an S&P index fund.

[heybruce]

30 minutes ago, heybruce said:

 

I didn't bother with the investopedia link, I stuck with Forbes.  It showed that most of his wealth is tied up in New York real estate, and it could only estimate how much is borrowed against this real estate.  Add to this the fact that Trump will publicly state his holdings are worth more than ten times what he will tell the tax man they are worth  https://www.washingtonpost.com/politics/how-much-does-trump-claim-his-golf-courses-are-worth-it-depends-who-needs-to-know/2016/08/21/71828f3a-5f3c-11e6-9d2f-b1a3564181a1_story.html?utm_term=.b025be0cb98f   and we are left with reason to doubt any claims he makes about what he is worth.

 

Too bad we can't get those tax returns and detailed, independently audited statements of net worth.

 

12 minutes ago, Ulysses G. said:

 

Not according to tax attorneys and other experts who deal with the IRS. Whether strictly legal, or not, information about illegal activities gets shared: "The IRS would certainly report it to law enforcement."

 

http://money.cnn.com/2013/02/28/news/economy/illegal-income-tax/

 

From your link:

 

"If you tell the IRS you made $1 million from stealing money or dealing drugs, does the agency tip off the cops?

Legally, it can't, unless a law-enforcement agency gets a court order granting it access to a specific taxpayer's return. The IRS isn't supposed to proactively alert other agencies about misdeeds unless terrorism is involved. In that case, it still needs a court order to disclose anything, but the IRS can initiate the legal process on its own."

 

The brief quote you used is speculation by someone not in the IRS.

 

Thanks for supporting my post.

[Ulysses G.]

12 minutes ago, heybruce said:

 

 

The brief quote you used is speculation by someone not in the IRS.

 

Tax attorneys and other experts and no claims otherwise. The IRS refused to comment on the issue. The article does not support your post.

Edited January 22, 2017 by Ulysses G.

[Scott]

I had an uncle who worked for the IRS.   He did audits, including forensic audits of tax returns.   According to him, they were interested in undeclared assets and wealth and not necessarily how it was earned.   The tax people want their money; they are less concerned about the morality, ethics or how it was earned.   They were interested in money gained and taxes paid.  

 

If you squat on a piece of land illegally, build a hotel, a resort, a brothel or a meth lab and pay your taxes, the IRS won't be after you.   The police will, though and when the law is done with you, then the tax guy comes along and wants their share of your ill-gotten gains, provided that the gov't hasn't confiscated all of it.  

[SaintLouisBlues]

9 minutes ago, Scott said:

I had an uncle who worked for the IRS.   He did audits, including forensic audits of tax returns.   According to him, they were interested in undeclared assets and wealth and not necessarily how it was earned.   The tax people want their money; they are less concerned about the morality, ethics or how it was earned.   They were interested in money gained and taxes paid.  

 

If you squat on a piece of land illegally, build a hotel, a resort, a brothel or a meth lab and pay your taxes, the IRS won't be after you.   The police will, though and when the law is done with you, then the tax guy comes along and wants their share of your ill-gotten gains, provided that the gov't hasn't confiscated all of it.  

As we know from the Al Capone episode, it may be that using the IRS is the most surefire way of convicting the perp.

[Scott]

Yes,  the IRS is one agency that you do not want to have a problem with.   Once you sign that return, anything wrong can be considered fraud and it starts accruing interest and penalties.  

 

One of the smartest people I ever met was an attorney in a small town.   He had never filed income tax and when they caught up with him many years later, they could not nail him much, since he had never signed a tax return.   No fraud.   No lies.   He just got a big, big tax bill with penalties and had to reconstruct many years of taxes.   He didn't even lose his license to practice law.  He got a nice payment plan that probably  

 

Someone such as Trump will have some problems with his tax just because of the enormity and complexity of the taxes.   There are a bevy of tax attorneys handling them for him.   He may owe money; he may not.   I doubt that any of them would permit fraud.   The ones who prepare the taxes also have to sign.  

 

His business dealings would be of great interest to his adversaries, but the actual tax records, although interesting, would probably not provide the public with the smoking gun many would like to have.  

[heybruce]

1 hour ago, heybruce said:

 

 

From your link:

 

"If you tell the IRS you made $1 million from stealing money or dealing drugs, does the agency tip off the cops?

Legally, it can't, unless a law-enforcement agency gets a court order granting it access to a specific taxpayer's return. The IRS isn't supposed to proactively alert other agencies about misdeeds unless terrorism is involved. In that case, it still needs a court order to disclose anything, but the IRS can initiate the legal process on its own."

 

The brief quote you used is speculation by someone not in the IRS.

 

Thanks for supporting my post.

 

56 minutes ago, Ulysses G. said:

 

Tax attorneys and other experts and no claims otherwise. The IRS refused to comment on the issue. The article does not support your post.

 

Tax attorneys giving opinions are more credible to you than clear statements of law?

[boomerangutang]

2 hours ago, Ulysses G. said:

According to Forbes and numerous other experts. How can anyone posting about this subject not realize that after all this time? The man is a multi-bilionaire and that is a FACT.

 

2 hours ago, LarryBird said:

 

You do realize the IRS can scrutinize his tax returns?

 

1 hour ago, Ulysses G. said:

The lowest estimate is 3 billion from anumber of experts -including Forbes -  and the article says that he is "certainly a billionaire". Pretending otherwise is ridiculous political rhetoric 

 

Whether or not he's a billionaire is not important to me. Being a billionaire basically means a person inherited lots and/or is crafty, is very selfish/greedy, and likely cheats.  many people have those characteristics.  It doesn't show one iota of wisdom, compassion or decency. 

 

 What's important is whether he has massively cheated on his taxes. In other words, he avoided paying them.  There are many indications he has cheated.  If so, that shows clearly, even to his sheeple fans, what a blatant BS'er he is.  Additionally, tax statements will show how deeply invested he is in foreign countries.  He won't release tax statements because he knows it will prove his many lies.

[boomerangutang]

         When Trump was told he bankrupted 5 or so companies, he shot back; "those were companies, those weren't me personally."   

 

       What a cad.  He will likely say the same pap smear when it's shown he's deeply invested in Russia, China, and (who knows what) other countries that are not friendly with the US.  He will simply wave it away as either 'fake news' or, if that doesn't work, he'll say it's his corporations, not him personally.  Either way, you can be sure he will viciously attack the messengers.

[boomerangutang]

A person who lies and cheats, makes bad decisions (and bankrupts companies) is going to do the same regarding the US of A.  He's 70 years old. He's not going to miraculously change his character and become decent.  He is who he is, and Americans will suffer for it.

[Ulysses G.]

11 minutes ago, boomerangutang said:

 

 What's important is whether he has massively cheated on his taxes. In other words, he avoided paying them.

 

Wrong. If he avoided paying his taxes legally, it is not cheating.

 

http://fortune.com/2016/10/01/donald-trump-tax-records/

[heybruce]

1 hour ago, Ulysses G. said:

 

Wrong. If he avoided paying his taxes legally, it is not cheating.

 

http://fortune.com/2016/10/01/donald-trump-tax-records/

 

However your link proves nothing, other than the possibility that one year's losses, in 1995, might have been sufficient to avoid future taxes for many years.  It tells us nothing about recent behavior.  It also raises the question of true net worth again--in how many years has he lost this much money?

 

Why have you decided to defend Trump against all posts?  Do you really want to do this?  The job will only get harder as his lies and incompetence become more apparent.

Edited January 22, 2017 by heybruce

[Ulysses G.]

47 minutes ago, heybruce said:

 

Why have you decided to defend Trump against all posts?  

 

Not all posts. Mainly ones that make little sense written by posters who have no intention of impartiality. They have no intention of anything other than trying to discredit him and mostly unfairly.

[LarryBird]

I find it strange that people use his inherited wealth as a knock against him.  I think one of his strongest points is that he didn't  just sit on a lump sum... that he went out there and tried to build something with it.  How is that not respectable?  

[heybruce]

2 hours ago, Ulysses G. said:

 

Not all posts. Mainly ones that make little sense written by posters who have no intention of impartiality. They have no intention of anything other than trying to discredit him and mostly unfairly.

 

Why is it unfair to expect the country's first billionaire president to release his tax returns?  The practice has been in place since Richard Nixon, and Trump criticized Romney for not releasing his returns quickly enough in the 2012 election.  Also, there is ample reason to suspect the job will present serious conflicts of interest for someone with assets and liabilities scattered around the world.

[heybruce]

1 hour ago, LarryBird said:

I find it strange that people use his inherited wealth as a knock against him.  I think one of his strongest points is that he didn't  just sit on a lump sum... that he went out there and tried to build something with it.  How is that not respectable?  

 

What we criticize is his ceaseless bragging about how rich he is, and his claims of business skills that the numbers don't support.

 

How would you feel about an a**hole with the attitude that he was a superior person because he was born rich?

[yardrunner]

2 hours ago, Ulysses G. said:

 

Not all posts. Mainly ones that make little sense written by posters who have no intention of impartiality. They have no intention of anything other than trying to discredit him and mostly unfairly.

Most people who post have no need to discredit Donald Trump, he does a good enough job without any help

[heybruce]

This is interesting; Donald Trump made a big deal about returning power to the people in his inaugural speech.  While he was doing that, an on-line petition calling on him to release his tax returns quickly exceeded 100,000. 

 

https://www.yahoo.com/news/whitehouse-gov-petition-for-trump-to-release-tax-returns-hits-100000-threshold-163143542.html

 

Under Obama, that would have resulted in a mandated response.  Under Trump, I'm sure it will be ignored.  So much for returning power to the people.

[boomerangutang]

2 hours ago, LarryBird said:

I find it strange that people use his inherited wealth as a knock against him.  I think one of his strongest points is that he didn't  just sit on a lump sum... that he went out there and tried to build something with it.  How is that not respectable?  

 

You're missing the point.  Trump is not respectable for numerous reasons, not least the way he does business.  If you've done some research you'll see that he's left a long wake of unpaid contractors & workers (even dish washers!), bilked investors behind him. He is incapable of saying he's sorry.   He paid $25 million to settle his fake U case.  He has over 3,000 other lawsuits against him, but they're not as prominent (not as big class-actions), so he can continue to have his lawyers file continuances, and drag them out forever.

 

Now multiply his under-handed activities by 10,000, and you get an idea of how he will shaft America.

[Jingthing]

Yep, as Bloomberg said, if trump runs the country like he's run his business ...

 

GOD HELP US!

 

Conman in chief.

Hail!

 

Edited January 22, 2017 by Jingthing

[LarryBird]

3 hours ago, heybruce said:

 

 

How would you feel about an a**hole with the attitude that he was a superior person because he was born rich?

 

It's the same way I would be.