Validity of re-entry permits

[KittenKong]

I've always assumed that a multiple re-entry permit is valid for one year from the date of issue but the recent experience of a friend seems to imply that it is only valid until the underlying visa or extension is renewed, and that it lives or dies with that underlying visa or extension. The reason being that my friend renewed his retirement extension one month before it expired but did not renew his re-entry permit which was still valid for many months. He then left Thailand briefly and when he returned to BKK he was only given leave to stay up until the expiry date of his old extension (just a few days), and was told that his re-entry permit was not valid beyond that even though his new retirement extension was valid for another year and the permit itself was only 6 months old.

 

As a result of this his new retirement extension was cancelled and he had to apply for another extension at his local immigration office (though in the end this was "expedited" without paperwork for a cash payment of 5000B).

Personally I dont leave the country very often and I always get a single re-entry permit a few weeks before it's needed, so the issue never arises, but I'm just wondering what experiences other people may have had with these permits. Also wondering whether a single re-entry permit obtained, say, in March for an underlying extension that expires, say, in June would still be valid in August once the underlying extension has been renewed for another year. This sort of thing could catch a lot of people out as it is not properly explained anywhere that I have seen, and certainly no one at his local immigration office explained to my friend that his permit was no longer valid when he renewed his extension, though the permit was clearly visible on the same page as the old extension.

 

Or maybe immigration at the airport just got it wrong for my friend.

[ubonjoe]

A re-entry permit is issued to keep a permit to stay valid when you enter the country.

If the permit to stay date it was issued for changes it is no longer valid. When an extension is applied for and granted a new re-entry permit is required.

If you look at your re-entry permits you will note the expire on the date your extension ends.

[KittenKong]

6 minutes ago, ubonjoe said:

If you look at your re-entry permits you will note the expire on the date your extension ends.

 

I haven't actually seen my friend's passport and stamps but his point was that his re-entry permit was valid for at least several more days (and possibly several more months) and no one had explained to him that renewing the underlying extension a month early would cancel this. The renewed extension was valid for one year beyond the expiry date of the previous extension, so it's not as if the entire period had been shortened by one month.

 

My own single permits do indeed show the same expiry date as the underlying extension, but again it isnt clear that if you renew the underlying extension early the permit is no longer valid at all. So I could quite easily have the same problem, as could others. It would be nice if immigration agents at departures pointed this out to people in this position as they still have the opportunity there to get a new re-entry permit that would be valid for the entire period.

[ubonjoe]

I cannot see how the old re-entry permit could be valid for much more than 30 days much less months since immigration will not accept an application for a an extension until the last 30 or 45 days of the current extension or entry.

If you got a new extension and then were able to use an old re-entry permit the date you would be stamped in for would be for the old extension which would invalidate your new extension.

It would be better if immigration voided old re-entry permits when a new extension is granted so people would realize they are no longer valid.

[wpcoe]

@KittenKong:

The reason being that my friend renewed his retirement extension one month before it expired but did not renew his re-entry permit which was still valid for many months.

 

That part that seems incongruent.  If his extension was expiring in one month, how was the re-entry permit valid beyond that one month?  A re-entry permit expires on the same date as the extension's permission to stay does.

 

But, beyond that I can see how it could cause confusion since they do not void old re-entry permits when a new extension is issued.  As ubonjoe said, it would be better if they did.

[Suradit69]

As said above, if he had a re-entry permit that was valid for one month, when he used it to re-enter the country, he would be given permission to stay for one month.

 

If he had already obtained a new extension of stay for an additional year, wouldn't he want to have a re-entry permit that would give him permission to stay until the new extension expired?

 

5 hours ago, KittenKong said:

no one had explained to him that renewing the underlying extension a month early would cancel this.

 

While I can understand his confusion to some extent, it really comes down to us taking the initiative to get information about the terms of our immigration status and related issues rather than expecting to be tutored on the ins and outs without asking any questions.

 

Reading through many threads on TV should make it clear how many of us haven't bothered to grasp the fundamentals that govern our stay here and quite often seem intent on resisting enlightenment. 

[KittenKong]

9 hours ago, ubonjoe said:

I cannot see how the old re-entry permit could be valid for much more than 30 days much less months since immigration will not accept an application for a an extension until the last 30 or 45 days of the current extension or entry.

 

Even if one ignores whether the validity extended for months or not (it's not my passport and I didn't see the details with my own eyes, but he said it did) my friend had the greater inconvenience of only being given permission to stay until the expiration of his old cancelled extension (a handful of days) and not permission to stay until the end of his new entirely valid extension (one year). And as a result of that he had to repeat his entire extension application (or pay the "service charge" of 5000B which he opted for) just to get back the year he had already paid for. This is what annoyed him and it would annoy me too.

 

 

9 hours ago, ubonjoe said:

It would be better if immigration voided old re-entry permits when a new extension is granted so people would realize they are no longer valid.

 

Well yes, and that was my point.

[KittenKong]

4 hours ago, Suradit69 said:

While I can understand his confusion to some extent, it really comes down to us taking the initiative to get information about the terms of our immigration status and related issues rather than expecting to be tutored on the ins and outs without asking any questions.

 

I disagree. Most countries explain very carefully and precisely exactly what their immigration rules are and how they should be followed. Thailand is an exception to this. Many rules are very unclear, or are applied erratically depending on where you are, or are simply ignored. In this particular case I see no reason why my friend should have had to quiz immigration officers about his re-entry stamp: they should have spotted the potential problem and warned him about it. After all, checking the validity of visas and extensions and permits is their only task and is what they are paid to do.

[Deepinthailand]

Seems a bit of comon sense would have been used by immigration on his entry. But why was his new extension cancelled? 

I can see where his confusion came into it re the multi entry permit it's not really made clear that it's for the life of the extension only (yes I know thee dates are on there but can easily be missed judged if you get re entry permit a couple of months after the extension)

But I would love to know why his new extension was cancelled?

Re immigration warning you about possible problems they issue what you ask for so if you go in for a extension for a year it's up to you to apply for a re entry permit surley it's not there job to hold your hand and ask if you want this that and the other.

Edited January 15, 2017 by Deepinthailand

[ubonjoe]

22 minutes ago, Deepinthailand said:

Seems a bit of comon sense would have been used by immigration on his entry. But why was his new extension cancelled? 

The immigration officer on entry was not at fault. He gave the permit to stay that was allowed by the re-entry permit.

The extension became invalid because a new permit to stay date was given which voided the extension. It is the same as entering without a re-entry permit.

[mrjohn]

To clarify the situation then, because I was going to start a similar topic.

The re-entry permit is valid as long as your visa extension, is that correct?

So, therefore, if I go for my annual extension (retirement) next week and apply for a single re-entry permit I will be able to use it at any time before the end of that extension, i.e. January 2018.

Is this correct or not?

[tgeezer]

Correct. If you look for the Act it is rule 39. It says that. If you have an "extension of stay" and you leave the country then the extension ends then. However if you apply for a "re-entry. permit" you can leave the country and return until the "extension of stay" expires.
You must apply for this formally and pay the fee as laid down by the ministry.

Logically, the multi re-entry is created for convenience and costs more. The 'valid until' date on the 're-entry permit' should be the same date as 'the permitted to stay up to' date on your 'extension of stay' stamp in your passport. If not, then 'The multi re-entry permit' is something beyond the logic of the Immigration Act.
So just take a look at your passport.


Sent from my iPad using Thaivisa Connect

[phetchy]

I have a dilemma along the same lines as the originator of this thread.  Can anyone advise if a re-entry permit can be renewed prior to the expiry of a current one?  Situation as follows - I am on a annual retirement extension expiring on 7 January each year but applied for about a month early as is the usual practice.  I always get a multi re-entry on the same day as, or soon after, the re-entry stamp and retirement extension are up (7 January), therefore ensuring I have a full years worth of use from the re-entry stamp and I can leave the country at short notice without the need to get a visa at the airport.  I do this because my elderly mother lives on her own and has no other relatives around should the need arise. Therefore I want to be able to get on the next plane out if I have to.

 

This works fine unless I have to go to the UK near to the end of my retirement extension and re-entry stamp and cannot return before return before they've expired.  Say for example this is the scenario - I renew my retirement extension in early December this year, so they overlap and I will have a valid retirement extension through to 7 January 2020.  My re-entry stamp is due to expire on 7 January 2019 with my old retirement extension.  Say I then get the dreaded phone call in the middle of December.  I leave for the UK immediately in the knowledge that my retirement extension is fine for 13 months or so, but I anticipate staying in the UK for three or four months, by which time my re-entry stamp has long expired and consequently voiding my retirement extension when I return to Thailand.

 

Therefore, is it possible to get a new re-entry stamp (preferably at immigration soon after the new retirement extension is applied for, or on the day of departure at BKK if necessary) prior to the old one expiring with a date of expiry of a new retirement extension (7/1/2020) that has been granted, but has not yet started?         

 

Thanks for any advice.

[ubonjoe]

18 minutes ago, phetchy said:

I have a dilemma along the same lines as the originator of this thread.  Can anyone advise if a re-entry permit can be renewed prior to the expiry of a current one? 

As soon as your new one year extension is stamped in your passport your current re-entry permit is no longer valid since you have a new permit to stay date.

You can apply for a new re-entry permit on the day your new extension is completed.