Dual U.K Thai passports/overstay/flying to U.K

[Meatwadism]

Hi to all Thai visa members,

 

I know these type of questions comes up quite frequently on these forums, especially with the halfies like myself. I apologise in advance to add to the heaps of questions and answers about this topic. I would also appreciate/prefer if members who have had first hand experiences or who are knowledgable about these topics to post. So that we can prevent contributors posting too much confusion as like some other threads, also this could be helpful to anyone who lands themselves in a similar situation.

 

Soo iv'e got myself in a very tricky situation (unintentionally) and with the bad advice of immigration officials.

 

I have dual British Thai citizenships, when I have arrived here four years ago I had to enter with my British passport, before I got my Thai citizenship.  7 months in waiting sorting out my house registration, Thai i.d card etc. Once I received my Thai passport I decided to fly out to Myanmar with my British passport and come back in to Thailand with my Thai Passport. The only problem was, the immigration official at BKK airport refused my entry with my Thai passport and said I had to exit with my British passport because of the entry stamp. This was probably protocol and maybe the official was unsure on what to do, plus I have two different names. I tried my best trying to exit with my Thai and in the end I decided to give up, official then said never to use my British passport in the country, so I did.

 

Some members (previous posts) have said that immigration cannot refuse there own citizen into the country, regardless of the stamp. Is this true?

 

Also now, having forgotten about this and that it is time to leave the country and mostly using my Thai passport, I have a HUGE problem. I have a 3 years of overstay with my British passport!

 

I contacted a Thai lawyer, a friend of a friend and they said. I had to report to a police station immediately, hand myself in. Get finger printed, blacklisted for 5 years and fined the 20k. Otherwise the consequences would be severe if I arrived at the airport. She also mentioned that Thailand does not recognise dual citizenship and I had to choose my nationality.  This was also confirmed by an immigration official that I called in Chaeng Wattana. Personally I don't believe this part and i'm hoping that they are just mis-informed.

 

Point being, I may have jeopardized my dual nationality or i'm just worrying.

 

So what should I do.

 

1, Go to the police, pay the fine and get black listed on my UK Passport, have my Thai passport confiscated. Use my U.K passport.

 

2, do the same at the airport, 

 

3, Book my flight name in my Thai passport and hope the immigration does not see the 3 year over stay stamp.

 

4, Fly to Singapore with my Thai passport and use my uk passport to enter U.K

 

5, Apply for a British visa on my Thai passport, So I don't pay the fine. possibly refused.

 

6, Travel by land

 

7, stowaway in a cargo ship for 3 months and hope for the best.

 

Hopefully someone has been in a similar situation or who knows  the law better than I do. Thank you in advance for any helpful suggestions

 

Meatwad.

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

[Arkady]

There is another thread on TV where someone was in a similar situation and had to pay a fine on leaving Thailand but that was before they introduced more strict rules for overstayers. Still I think the worst they could do is fine you the maximum fine, which I think is still B20,000 and blacklist you for 5 years on your British passport.  I wouldn't advise reporting yourself to police beforehand as that would be more likely to lead complications and possible demands for bribes.  Immigration at Suwarnabhumi deal with overstayers every day of the week and usually deal with the cases swiftly on the spot, whereas for local police, or even Immigration at CW, it would be a novelty they might want to milk it as much as possible.

 

Legally there is nothing in the Nationality Act that specifically prohibits or supports dual nationality.  There are only provisions for revoking Thai nationality from naturalised Thais and those who obtained Thai nationality through birth in the Kingdom to alien parents. (You haven't said but it sounds like you got Thai nationality through birth to a Thai parent).  The new constitution has a clause that will make it unconstitutional to revoke the nationality of anyone who is Thai through birth.  Anyway, assuming you have a Thai parent there is no legal way that your Thai nationality could be revoked without your consent, whatever you may have been told by lawyers or immigration officers.  You should ask them to support their theories by citing from the Nationality Act and cases from the Royal Gazette where nationality has actually been revoked from someone who was Thai from birth. I guarantee they will not be able to find any examples under the current 1965 Nationality Act. Actually you have stayed in Thailand indefinitely on your British passport with free one year extensions under a provision designed to facilitate former Thai citizens who have renounced their Thai nationality but the wording doesn't distinguish between former and current Thais with foreign passports. It is possible that you could get one even retroactively at CW but I would ask someone to enquire on your behalf, rather than go in person, preferably not the idiot lawyer that you consulted.

 

The last few constitutions and the forthcoming one also have a clause that says that Thais may not be denied entry into the Kingdom and are free to reside in any part of it.  It was clearly unlawful for the Immigration officer to deny you entry on your Thai passport.  Others who have had that problem have been admitted on their Thai passports after demanding to see the supervisor.  A thread in Pantip Plaza in Thai on the topic advised dual passport holders to carry a copy of the constitution with them to show the Immigration officer.  The case normally arises with Thais who have gone abroad and acquired another nationality, then return to Thailand with a blank Thai passport obtained from a Thai embassy abroad.

 

You will not be issued with a British visa in your Thai passport, if their records show you have a valid British passport.  It is not illegal for a British dual national to have a British visa in a foreign passport but you have to prove that your British passport has expired and not been renewed or that you have never applied for one.

 

Travelling overland only makes things harder as immigration officials on land borders in the region normally insist on stamping the same passport that was stamped at the other border.you

 

If you are Thai through birth to a Thai parent, you should have little to fear apart from a B20,000 fine and a bit of hassle from Immigration officials.  Make sure you never allow them to intimidate you into entering on your British passport again.

[Meatwadism]

Thanks for your reply Arkady, I currently have limited internet at the moment. But really appreciate your helpful advice.

 

I believe your right on this, I definitely won't be going to the police as that would arise complications. Better to sort it out at the airport then. Hopefully with luck on my side I might get some leniency on the fine and hopefully not being blacklisted on my UK passport. If immigration decide to make an issue of my overstay and stamp, I may mention that it was unlawful for the immigration officer (3 year ago) to refuse me entry on my Thai passport. Whether that will help i'm not sure.

 

Also a copy of nationality act in both English and Thai if they question my citizenship. You are right! I just read the nationality act and there is nothing there that says prohibits or supports dual nationality. It mostly mentions having "Alien" parents and obtaining Thai citizenship that way. To answer your question my mum is Thai and by blood (jus sanguinis) regardless of not being born in the country. I'm entitled to Thai citizenship as well as having dual.

 

What would now be the wise course of action?

 

1,Book a flight in my British passport name, check in with airline and use my Thai passport while going through the immigration counter.

 

2, Book the flight in my Thai name and passport, if airline asks me questions just show show them proof that  I am a UK citizen and don't need a visa. I won't have any problems landing in the UK.

 

3, Fly to Singapore or another country with my Thai passport, not crossing overland. And use my British passport to fly back to the UK. However I have the entry stamp on my UK passport, so they may ask questions on how I got to Singapore.

 

 

 

I would prefer to avoid paying a fine, if possible. 

 

Cheers

 

Meatwad

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

[JackThompson]

20 hours ago, Meatwadism said:

Once I received my Thai passport I decided to fly out to Myanmar with my British passport and come back in to Thailand with my Thai Passport. The only problem was, the immigration official at BKK airport refused my entry with my Thai passport and said I had to exit with my British passport because of the entry stamp. This was probably protocol and maybe the official was unsure on what to do, plus I have two different names. I tried my best trying to exit with my Thai and in the end I decided to give up, official then said never to use my British passport in the country, so I did.

I think I am missing something here.  You left on your Brit-passport to Myanmar, because that was the passport you had used to enter - this is normal.  You said, " I tried my best trying to exit with my Thai ...,"  but you cannot enter on one passport and leave on another.  At this point, Immigration was acting normally.

 

You arrived in Myanmar - at which point you entered that country on which passport (could have used either, depending on visa arrangements)?  Then you stamped out of Myanmar on the same passport you used to enter.  Then flew back to Thailand, and tried to enter using your Thai passport - and immigration said no? 

 

Did they look you up with your Thai Passport info, then discover you had another passport in their system? 

[Arkady]

20 hours ago, Meatwadism said:

Thanks for your reply Arkady, I currently have limited internet at the moment. But really appreciate your helpful advice.

 

I believe your right on this, I definitely won't be going to the police as that would arise complications. Better to sort it out at the airport then. Hopefully with luck on my side I might get some leniency on the fine and hopefully not being blacklisted on my UK passport. If immigration decide to make an issue of my overstay and stamp, I may mention that it was unlawful for the immigration officer (3 year ago) to refuse me entry on my Thai passport. Whether that will help i'm not sure.

 

Also a copy of nationality act in both English and Thai if they question my citizenship. You are right! I just read the nationality act and there is nothing there that says prohibits or supports dual nationality. It mostly mentions having "Alien" parents and obtaining Thai citizenship that way. To answer your question my mum is Thai and by blood (jus sanguinis) regardless of not being born in the country. I'm entitled to Thai citizenship as well as having dual.

 

What would now be the wise course of action?

 

1,Book a flight in my British passport name, check in with airline and use my Thai passport while going through the immigration counter.

 

2, Book the flight in my Thai name and passport, if airline asks me questions just show show them proof that  I am a UK citizen and don't need a visa. I won't have any problems landing in the UK.

 

3, Fly to Singapore or another country with my Thai passport, not crossing overland. And use my British passport to fly back to the UK. However I have the entry stamp on my UK passport, so they may ask questions on how I got to Singapore.

 

 

 

I would prefer to avoid paying a fine, if possible. 

 

Cheers

 

Meatwad

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

In the other thread I mentioned the dual national overstayer protested at Immigration that they had no right to make him pay a fine because he was a Thai citizen and entitled to reside in the Kingdom indefinitely.  It cut no ice with them, as they just argued they were obliged to fine him by law since he had entered the Kingdom as a foreigner.  The same argument is certainly worth a try but they have a strong card up their sleeve in that they can just make you miss your flight. I think it might be possible to get redress by suing them in the Administrative Court, if they fine you, but legal fees would certainly be more than the fine you would get reimbursed, if you won and it would take years of hassle.   Personally, I would arrive early at the airport and give it my best shot arguing the absurdity of fining a Thai for overstaying in the Kingdom but be prepared to pay the fine and move on.  I would argue a bit more about being blacklisted as it would be ridiculous to try to blacklist a Thai but they may insist they have no option. I don't think it would have any repercussions, apart from preventing you from using you British passport to enter Thailand.

 

I am not sure, if I would argue strongly that the officer was at fault for denying you entry on your Thai passport because it will be only your word against his.  He would claim he never forced a Thai to do that, so you must have voluntarily used your British passport.  No harm in explaining that the officer might have been mistaken in telling you to do that but I would avoid being confrontational about it. 

 

I don't have any experience of using different names, so I can only guess here.  You want to be leaving Thailand and re-entering on your Thai passport.  You will also show only your Thai passport to the airline in the UK when you check in, as they don't care about your UK immigration status when you are leaving.  So it seems to make most sense to book the ticket in your Thai name. You only need the British passport to show the airline at Bkk that you are entitled to enter the UK without visa and for entering the UK itself.  I haven't heard of anyone having a problem with this but some documentation to affirm you are one and the same person might be a good idea, just in case.  I knew an American dual national with different names who obtained an affidavit to that end from the US Embassy. I can't say, if the British Embassy would provide a similar document but it might be worth asking them. 

 

Use the auto gates at Swampy, if they are working, to avoid the third degree from the Immigration officer on departure about why you have two nationalities etc, when he sees no UK visa in your Thai passport. Better to have your Thai name on the boarding card in both directions, even if you use the auto gates, so the boarding card details they collect when you return match up with your passport.

 

This is my best advise but I am not a lawyer.  Unfortunately, you have found that Thai lawyers are often just steep bills for hot air.  Best of luck.

[Meatwadism]

On 1/27/2017 at 6:23 PM, JackThompson said:

I think I am missing something here.  You left on your Brit-passport to Myanmar, because that was the passport you had used to enter - this is normal.  You said, " I tried my best trying to exit with my Thai ...,"  but you cannot enter on one passport and leave on another.  At this point, Immigration was acting normally.

 

You arrived in Myanmar - at which point you entered that country on which passport (could have used either, depending on visa arrangements)?  Then you stamped out of Myanmar on the same passport you used to enter.  Then flew back to Thailand, and tried to enter using your Thai passport - and immigration said no? 

 

Did they look you up with your Thai Passport info, then discover you had another passport in their system? 

Yes, thats correct I left with my British passport as at the time it seemed like to the only solution to get out of my visa. While entering in my Thai would seem to sort this issue out. But Arkady has said it was unlawful for the immigration officer to refuse me entry to my country, regardless of not having a stamp. It would be the same if British immigration officers would refuse my entry to U.K. But I wouldn't have that problem, as they don't use stamps anymore.

 

Yes, the whole point of switching passports was to cancel the visa.

 

They didn't look up the passport info, I showed them both of my passports. I don't the systems has that information.

 

 

[Meatwadism]

On 1/28/2017 at 0:41 PM, Arkady said:

 

In the other thread I mentioned the dual national overstayer protested at Immigration that they had no right to make him pay a fine because he was a Thai citizen and entitled to reside in the Kingdom indefinitely.  It cut no ice with them, as they just argued they were obliged to fine him by law since he had entered the Kingdom as a foreigner.  The same argument is certainly worth a try but they have a strong card up their sleeve in that they can just make you miss your flight. I think it might be possible to get redress by suing them in the Administrative Court, if they fine you, but legal fees would certainly be more than the fine you would get reimbursed, if you won and it would take years of hassle.   Personally, I would arrive early at the airport and give it my best shot arguing the absurdity of fining a Thai for overstaying in the Kingdom but be prepared to pay the fine and move on.  I would argue a bit more about being blacklisted as it would be ridiculous to try to blacklist a Thai but they may insist they have no option. I don't think it would have any repercussions, apart from preventing you from using you British passport to enter Thailand.

 

I am not sure, if I would argue strongly that the officer was at fault for denying you entry on your Thai passport because it will be only your word against his.  He would claim he never forced a Thai to do that, so you must have voluntarily used your British passport.  No harm in explaining that the officer might have been mistaken in telling you to do that but I would avoid being confrontational about it. 

 

I don't have any experience of using different names, so I can only guess here.  You want to be leaving Thailand and re-entering on your Thai passport.  You will also show only your Thai passport to the airline in the UK when you check in, as they don't care about your UK immigration status when you are leaving.  So it seems to make most sense to book the ticket in your Thai name. You only need the British passport to show the airline at Bkk that you are entitled to enter the UK without visa and for entering the UK itself.  I haven't heard of anyone having a problem with this but some documentation to affirm you are one and the same person might be a good idea, just in case.  I knew an American dual national with different names who obtained an affidavit to that end from the US Embassy. I can't say, if the British Embassy would provide a similar document but it might be worth asking them. 

 

Use the auto gates at Swampy, if they are working, to avoid the third degree from the Immigration officer on departure about why you have two nationalities etc, when he sees no UK visa in your Thai passport. Better to have your Thai name on the boarding card in both directions, even if you use the auto gates, so the boarding card details they collect when you return match up with your passport.

 

This is my best advise but I am not a lawyer.  Unfortunately, you have found that Thai lawyers are often just steep bills for hot air.  Best of luck.

Thanks Arkady, I think you have answered all my questions here. It looks like i'm getting paranoid and over complicating things. I will be flying out in about a week, so i'll keep you updated on what happens.

 

I think at this point i'm reassured that the worst scenario is a hefty fine 

 

Thanks again for your sound advice and I appreciate the time you spent on writing on this thread.

 

Cheers!

[JackThompson]

6 hours ago, Meatwadism said:

Yes, thats correct I left with my British passport as at the time it seemed like to the only solution to get out of my visa. While entering in my Thai would seem to sort this issue out. But Arkady has said it was unlawful for the immigration officer to refuse me entry to my country, regardless of not having a stamp. It would be the same if British immigration officers would refuse my entry to U.K. But I wouldn't have that problem, as they don't use stamps anymore.

 

Yes, the whole point of switching passports was to cancel the visa.

 

They didn't look up the passport info, I showed them both of my passports. I don't the systems has that information.

Yes, they are reportedly not happy to see 2 passports from Thais.  Best advise seems to be, when flying back in, only show them the Thai one.

 

Some Americans also resent that their peers have more than one nationality, but immigration there doesn't care.  It's  just a travel document that provides options to work - does not mean one is not "loyal" or something.

[huawei]

My daughter came in on a British passport under the age of 18. Exited on her Thai passport using the automatic gates. There were a number of years between entry and exit, but follow the advice above and exit using the automated system.

[darrendsd]

I really can't answer your question but if your Lawyer has advised you to hand yourself into the Police then I would suggest that you get a new Lawyer

 

Handing yourself in would mean you spending time at the IDC (at least a few days) whereas turning up at the Airport and sorting your overstay there (assuming there is no chance of you getting yourself sorted) means no time in the IDC

 

Good luck

[Crossy]

2 hours ago, JackThompson said:

Yes, they are reportedly not happy to see 2 passports from Thais.  Best advise seems to be, when flying back in, only show them the Thai one.

 

Indeed, Rule-1 of holding multiple passports "Never show or give more than one to an immigration officer (or for that matter any official)".

[houstoniron]

On 1/28/2017 at 0:41 PM, Arkady said:

 

In the other thread I mentioned the dual national overstayer protested at Immigration that they had no right to make him pay a fine because he was a Thai citizen and entitled to reside in the Kingdom indefinitely.  It cut no ice with them, as they just argued they were obliged to fine him by law since he had entered the Kingdom as a foreigner.  The same argument is certainly worth a try but they have a strong card up their sleeve in that they can just make you miss your flight. I think it might be possible to get redress by suing them in the Administrative Court, if they fine you, but legal fees would certainly be more than the fine you would get reimbursed, if you won and it would take years of hassle.   Personally, I would arrive early at the airport and give it my best shot arguing the absurdity of fining a Thai for overstaying in the Kingdom but be prepared to pay the fine and move on.  I would argue a bit more about being blacklisted as it would be ridiculous to try to blacklist a Thai but they may insist they have no option. I don't think it would have any repercussions, apart from preventing you from using you British passport to enter Thailand.

 

I am not sure, if I would argue strongly that the officer was at fault for denying you entry on your Thai passport because it will be only your word against his.  He would claim he never forced a Thai to do that, so you must have voluntarily used your British passport.  No harm in explaining that the officer might have been mistaken in telling you to do that but I would avoid being confrontational about it. 

 

I don't have any experience of using different names, so I can only guess here.  You want to be leaving Thailand and re-entering on your Thai passport.  You will also show only your Thai passport to the airline in the UK when you check in, as they don't care about your UK immigration status when you are leaving.  So it seems to make most sense to book the ticket in your Thai name. You only need the British passport to show the airline at Bkk that you are entitled to enter the UK without visa and for entering the UK itself.  I haven't heard of anyone having a problem with this but some documentation to affirm you are one and the same person might be a good idea, just in case.  I knew an American dual national with different names who obtained an affidavit to that end from the US Embassy. I can't say, if the British Embassy would provide a similar document but it might be worth asking them. 

 

Use the auto gates at Swampy, if they are working, to avoid the third degree from the Immigration officer on departure about why you have two nationalities etc, when he sees no UK visa in your Thai passport. Better to have your Thai name on the boarding card in both directions, even if you use the auto gates, so the boarding card details they collect when you return match up with your passport.

 

This is my best advise but I am not a lawyer.  Unfortunately, you have found that Thai lawyers are often just steep bills for hot air.  Best of luck.

What is the Auto-gate at Swampy, I have only seen immigration officers and and no auto-entry which I assume is similar to that in U?K airports.

[ubonjoe]

12 minutes ago, houstoniron said:

What is the Auto-gate at Swampy, I have only seen immigration officers and and no auto-entry which I assume is similar to that in U?K airports.

Here is a picture of them.

Source: http://suvarnabhumiairport.com/en/99-international-arrival-procedures

[houstoniron]

1 hour ago, ubonjoe said:

Here is a picture of them.

Source: http://suvarnabhumiairport.com/en/99-international-arrival-procedures

Well you live and learn, when I go into the immigration area, i get sent to the left booths for foreigners, I have never seen these gates. Are they avaialble for foreigners? can you guide me where to look when I enter next time.

 

Thank you for the info...

 

[SaintLouisBlues]

4 minutes ago, houstoniron said:

Are they avaialble for foreigners?

No

 

I'm guessing (but TiT) that one of the drivers for online visas will be to extend the use of these gates to other nationalities. They're in use in Singapore, New Zealand and Australia for holders of ePassports ie. passports with a chip in them, from a list of countries approved by their government. I used my US passport in one last time I went to Sydney

[ubonjoe]

14 minutes ago, houstoniron said:

Are they avaialble for foreigners?

The only foreigners that can use them are those with  permanent residency in Thailand.

[chickenrunCM]

from the moment you become thai citizen, you can´t get fined for overstay! 

you can leave thailand to laos, cambodia or myamar with your thai ID card and then fly from there to England.

Or you leave on your thai passport. As there a 2 differnet names, how you ever get problem with matching your british and thai passport? And for sure you could solve it even at any IMO in the country. On what base you want to detain somebody for overstay, if he has Thai ID card? No way!

[Arkady]

17 hours ago, chickenrunCM said:

from the moment you become thai citizen, you can´t get fined for overstay! 

you can leave thailand to laos, cambodia or myamar with your thai ID card and then fly from there to England.

Or you leave on your thai passport. As there a 2 differnet names, how you ever get problem with matching your british and thai passport? And for sure you could solve it even at any IMO in the country. On what base you want to detain somebody for overstay, if he has Thai ID card? No way!

This is a point that could be argued in the Administrative Court after the event but Immigration has fined Thais for overstaying in these circumstances. In that case which was written up in another TV thread, the overstayer had a new Thai passport in a different name and Immigration was still able to match his entry on a farang passport in a different name. That was before there were auto gates.

 

It's certainly worth trying to exit through the auto gates at Swampy with the Thai passport and hope that the gates don't set off an alarm when they process your passport and send you to be checked manually.  In the worst case, you just get sent to a live Immigration officer to check your passport.  If you  pull it off, you will rack up indefinite overstay on the British passport but can't be arrested in a spot check because you just show your Thai ID card.

[nickcar]

On 27/01/2017 at 6:23 PM, JackThompson said:

I think I am missing something here.  You left on your Brit-passport to Myanmar, because that was the passport you had used to enter - this is normal.  You said, " I tried my best trying to exit with my Thai ...,"  but you cannot enter on one passport and leave on another.  At this point, Immigration was acting normally.

I dont understand this. I have recently received my Thai passport. I intend to leave on my next trip using my new blank Thai passport. I will be like any Thai leaving for the  first time on a new Thai passport. If they demand to see my NZ passport that i entered on i have no problem as i had a resident visa so there is no question of an overstay. 

[JackThompson]

26 minutes ago, nickcar said:

I dont understand this. I have recently received my Thai passport. I intend to leave on my next trip using my new blank Thai passport. I will be like any Thai leaving for the  first time on a new Thai passport. If they demand to see my NZ passport that i entered on i have no problem as i had a resident visa so there is no question of an overstay. 

My understanding (and I could be wrong) is that you would need to "stamp out" on the same passport you used to enter.  You can "switch passports in the air" and use a different passport when you "stamp in" to the next country.

[nickcar]

38 minutes ago, JackThompson said:

My understanding (and I could be wrong) is that you would need to "stamp out" on the same passport you used to enter.  You can "switch passports in the air" and use a different passport when you "stamp in" to the next country.

I was intending to leave on my Thai passport, enter th next country on my NZ passport, exit that country on the NZ passport and reenter thailand on my Thai passport. A practise I always usee with my NZ passport ans UK passport. 

[Arkady]

Normally you have to exit on the same passport on which you entered. The exception to this is some one who is naturalised as a Thai.  In this case, you can get the visa in your foreign passport cancelled and close that loop. Entering or leaving Thailand at a land border you will not be given the option of switching passports by either side but for air travellers this is usually not a problem.

 

For those who are not overstayers on their foreign passports but obtained a new Thai passport in Thailand other than by naturalisation, the recommended course of action is to leave on the foreign passport and re-enter by air on the Thai passport. Then only use the Thai passport to enter Thailand.  Using the auto gates, you should have no problem entering with a blank Thai passport.  If you have to go past a live Immigration officer who tries to give you a BS opinion that you can't use the blank Thai passport to enter Thailand, stand by your rights as a Thai citizen and politely demand to see a supervisor.  Normally that will swiftly resolve the matter, as the supervisors know the law, even though they seem to allow their staff to intimidate dual citizens out of jealousy, or because they feel the law is inadequate, or for whatever mysterious reason they do this ridiculous stuff.  If not, ask the supervisor to cite the clause in the Nationality Act and/or the Constitution that gives him the right to deny entry to the Kingdom to a Thai citizen.  If absolutely necessary pull out your own copies.

[Arkady]

On 1/30/2017 at 9:25 AM, darrendsd said:

I really can't answer your question but if your Lawyer has advised you to hand yourself into the Police then I would suggest that you get a new Lawyer

 

Handing yourself in would mean you spending time at the IDC (at least a few days) whereas turning up at the Airport and sorting your overstay there (assuming there is no chance of you getting yourself sorted) means no time in the IDC

 

Good luck

 

I can only guess that the lawyer was hoping that the OP would be imprisoned and that he could earn mega fees bailing him out and defending a frivolous court action.

 

My gripe about Thai lawyers in the past re business has always been that they just read out the Thai law to you, which I can do for myself, but I am asking how to structure things to avoid prosecution, not what the law is.  This guy seemingly didn't even bother to waste his time finding out what the Thai law actually said.  He just gave his own stupid opinion of what he thought it should be and held out his hand.

[kirstymelb101]

I'm currently in the same pickle as the OP. Also a dual national Thai and Australian.. Came here 4 yrs ago on my Aus PP, which at this point in time I didn't have Thai credentials.  While being here I got my Tabian-barn sorted and was issued a Thai I.D card and passport.... I called a legal adviser (mind this was 4 yrs ago) He informed me not to worry, since I'm Thai by birth, once I can prove citizenship it won't matter.... TURNS out now this was false information .. GRrRrRrRR...

I tend to return home in a few months for my brothers wedding. My question is, will I be blacklisted and fined the 20k bht when I leave?  EVEN though I have a Thai I.D card and passport....

Please help me

[ubonjoe]

45 minutes ago, kirstymelb101 said:

I tend to return home in a few months for my brothers wedding. My question is, will I be blacklisted and fined the 20k bht when I leave?  EVEN though I have a Thai I.D card and passport....

You could try leaving by using your Thai passport. There have been a few reports of being able to do it even though a Thai entered on a foreign passport.

I suggest though you be prepared to pay a 20k baht fine for the overstay if they are able to link your 2 passports when you try to leave. They might do a stamp banning you from entry but a Thai cannot be denied entry to the country.

[cleopatra2]

Under immigration law , a Thai national is not regarded as an alien, thus not subject to immigration controll

[ubonjoe]

22 minutes ago, cleopatra2 said:

Under immigration law , a Thai national is not regarded as an alien, thus not subject to immigration controll

They are if they enter the country using a passport from another country.

[cleopatra2]

20 minutes ago, ubonjoe said:

They are if they enter the country using a passport from another country.

The passport does not confer nationality, but provides evidence of.

The immigration law definition does not provide for any such distinction, and section 57 allows a  Thai to provide such evidence of their nationality in respect of chapter 7 of the immigration act.

The penalty for overstaying is applicable to aliens only, section 81.

Edited August 4, 2018 by cleopatra2

[ubonjoe]

iii

26 minutes ago, cleopatra2 said:

The passport does not confer nationality, but provides evidence of.

The immigration law definition does not provide for any such distinction, and section 57 allows a  Thai to provide such evidence of their nationality in respect of chapter 7 of the immigration act.

The penalty for overstaying is applicable to aliens only, section 81.

Section 57 states this and it does have a procedure to prove it.

Quote

Section 57 : For the purpose of Chapter 7 miscellaneous ; whoever claims his nationality is Thai and if
there is not enough evidence for the competent official to believe that he has Thai nationality , it is
presumed that such a person is an alien until he can prove other wise.
An application for proof of nationality under Para.1 of this Section will be submitted to the
competent official in the accordance with the form and fees as prescribed in the Ministerial Regulations. If
such person does not satisfy the competent official’s order , he may apply to the Court asking for
consideration.
In the case where there is an application to the Court upon receiving and application, the Court
shall notify the Public Prosecutor, who may, in turn, have a right for objection thereto.

If they have already entered the country using another countries passport I would say it does not apply. I cannot see how section 7 is relevant. For section 81 they are considered a alien if they entered the country using another country's passport.

[cleopatra2]

19 minutes ago, ubonjoe said:

iii

Section 57 states this and it does have a procedure to prove it.

If they have already entered the country using another countries passport I would say it does not apply. I cannot see how section 7 is relevant. For section 81 they are considered a alien if they entered the country using another country's passport.

If using a foreign  passport meant they are considered an alien, this would be in violation of section 39 of the constitution. It would allow the authorities to both deport and bar a Thai  national

 

Edited August 4, 2018 by cleopatra2
incorrect section