Govt cracks down on power-plant protesters

[rooster59]

Govt cracks down on power-plant protesters

By PRATCH RUJIVANAROM,
NATTAPAT PHROMKAEW
THE SUNDAY NATION

 

Anti coal-fired power plant leader Akkaradej Chakchinda is arrested by police at the Office of the Public Sector Development Commission yesterday.

 

POLICE cracked down on the protest outside Government House yesterday over the move to build a coal-fired power plant in Krabi, arresting 16 protesters including three leaders of the demonstration.

 

Legal experts condemned the move, saying it was a severe violation of the protesters’ rights and demanded that they be released immediately.

 

Full story: http://www.nationmultimedia.com/news/national/30306688

 

 

-- © Copyright The Nation 2017-02-19

[seahorse]

Why is Thailand not concentrating its efforts on local renewable resources like solar power?

[mtls2005]

Legal experts condemned the move, saying it was a severe violation of the protesters’ rights

 

 

555. Citizens and "rights", that's precious. You have the right to shut up, unless you're a yellow with a whistle and a clapper.

 

I guess every protest can be interpreted to be "political"?

[Eligius]

The people of Thailand have NO rights at all. That is effectively enshrined in the new 'Constitution', where each 'right' given to the Thais is immediately followed by a clause that says: 'unless this is against good morality of people'. And who decides what is 'good morality'? Why, the 'good people' of the junta and their ilk, of course.

 

And we are told that 62% of the Thais voted for this rights-stripping 'Constitution'. I don't believe it for a second. Controllers who are so nefarious and wicked as  to take away a whole nation's rights (in practice), will not hesitate to lie about it - and about everything else that suits their agenda.

 

 

[aussieinthailand]

So the use of military courts for civilians has stopped just the other day, or so the public were told,  but the military can and are still arresting peaceful protesters and taking them too military camps without seeing a lawyer or family for seven day's with out charge.

I wonder if any of the junta/military/family/friends have some kind of interest in the power plant or land or junta leader's nephew to contract to build it???

[scotchonrocks]

Coal fired power is so last century. The bad part is that the financing (if anyone will do it) is so long term abd locks in the status quo for 30 years forward. As rooftop and utility solar increases, it takes away all the demand from the coal fired stations during the day until the evening peak, and they simply cannot be operated with such large load swings or face the huge maintenance costs of the consequences of ramping. What an awful blight on the country. It's low cost labour advantage will be lost with high cost of power. Disgraceful and the protestors were right to complain even if their objections were more  about local pollution effects. Sad in the extreme.

Edited February 19, 2017 by scotchonrocks
Grammar

[robertthesculptor]

With the amazing abundance of sun, wind, and water power available at a better longtearm price, why would anyone go backwards to a technology of maybe 150 years ago.this is a serious problem as it only hurts the environment and the future of Thailand. 

[tbthailand]

Thailand and it's military governments, ... where human rights are not recognized. Period.

[Srikcir]

2 hours ago, aussieinthailand said:

I wonder if any of the junta/military/family/friends have some kind of interest in the power plant or land or junta leader's nephew to contract to build it???

A valid suspicion. The plant developers had said that if the permit was denied by the government, they'll instead build a gas-fired power plant (which is far more environmentally compatible) but it would be located in a different locality. The junta's adamant support for the Krabi location over a different location for a cleaner power plant suggests some undisclosed commitment to the coal-fired power plant location.

[fxe1200]

1 hour ago, robertthesculptor said:

With the amazing abundance of sun, wind, and water power available at a better longtearm price, why would anyone go backwards to a technology of maybe 150 years ago.this is a serious problem as it only hurts the environment and the future of Thailand. 

Solar power devices like photo-voltaic and thermo-solar-units are being installed decentralized and would feed the power grid with their surplus production. EGAT would lose its profits and that may not happen. The decision to build a coal-powered plant is a decision of the lobby. Furthermore such a plant can hardly be adjusted to the actual power demand. A gas-powered plant takes only four years to build and can easily be adjusted to the amount of electrical power needed. EGAT though focuses on cheap Chinese coal for maximum profits, and the government follows EGATs views.  Asking the government to think further than just from 12 to noon is asking to much. Stupidity rules, but this is no news in this coconut country.

[mduras01]

Krabi is a gorgeous place. Why build such a monster there??


Sent from my iPhone using Thaivisa Connect

[sawadeeken]

4 hours ago, aussieinthailand said:

So the use of military courts for civilians has stopped just the other day, or so the public were told,  but the military can and are still arresting peaceful protesters and taking them too military camps without seeing a lawyer or family for seven day's with out charge.

I wonder if any of the junta/military/family/friends have some kind of interest in the power plant or land or junta leader's nephew to contract to build it???

You have it absolutely right......... They aren't trying to wipe our corruption, they are just trying to wipe out 'their' competition.......

A military government at it's finest......... NOT ALLOWING a 'public' voice..........

You can bet that there is 'Big Money' involved for many in the 'military circle' of family and friends....

A number of years ago, Russia got rid of 'Communism"..... Have a close look around you.... You can see where it went.......

IMHO........

[FitnessHealthTravel]

Thailand is going BACKWARDS

[mtls2005]

Based on the available press...

 

The "government" arrested five or so protest leaders.

 

They have been released.

 

The "government" (actually EGAoT) has agreed to conduct complete and transparent environmental and health impact assessments, which I believe had previously 'fast-tracked' via Article 44.

 

The protesters appear appeased, perhaps they won the concessions, or they were "convinced" to abandon their protest while incarcerated?

[Brer Fox]

12 hours ago, seahorse said:

Why is Thailand not concentrating its efforts on local renewable resources like solar power?

Because solar power would require about 5,000 rai of batteries to allow somewhere like Krabi to have  the lights, fridges, a/cons, tv's running in people's homes. In case you didn't know there is NO solar power at nighttime or on cloudy days.

[SpaceKadet]

Every layman thinks that solar is the solution. The truth is that commercial solar power doesn't work. It cannot be adjusted to the power requirement peaks, it's very difficult to store for the time where it's mostly needed (i.e night), and don't even mention batteries is this context, the irradiation levels are unpredictable no matter where you are, and photo voltaic cells still have low efficiency.

But this is not about coal or not coal. The contract has already been promised to somebody, and so it must happen.

 

My personal choice.... go nuclear. Cheap, clean (sort of) and always available.... and if you really get pissed off at your neighbors, enrich your spent fuel, and nuke'em.

[Ahab]

12 hours ago, robertthesculptor said:

With the amazing abundance of sun, wind, and water power available at a better longtearm price, why would anyone go backwards to a technology of maybe 150 years ago.this is a serious problem as it only hurts the environment and the future of Thailand. 

Because it can provide a reliable source of power to the region? Solar works 50% at best, and the wind is not always blowing. Solar is great as long as you only need power during the day or have a light electrical load that can be ran off of a battery at night (LED lighting, a computer, etc.). The problem is that even if you could provide enough power to supply the grid with renewable sources of power (this is a very doubtful that it is even possible) you still have to have in reserve a reliable source of power that can be brought on line quickly when the renewables are not providing power (or enough power) to the grid. Basically with renewables you have to spend money on two or more sources of power, the unreliable and expensive renewable power AND the reliable, backup to fill the void every night and when it becomes cloudy (or the wind doesn't blow). This at least doubles the cost of the power infrastructure. The choice is fossil fuel , hydro-electric, or nuclear for a reliable stable power source. I don't think the Krabi area topography supports hydro-electric power (which involves dams and rivers), so pick your poison, either fossil fuel or nuclear.

 

Don't get me wrong, I like renewable sources of power on an individual basis, but as a source to power a grid they are poor substitutes without the reliability and stability required for a working electrical grid.

[wakeupplease]

1 hour ago, SpaceKadet said:

Every layman thinks that solar is the solution. The truth is that commercial solar power doesn't work. It cannot be adjusted to the power requirement peaks, it's very difficult to store for the time where it's mostly needed (i.e night), and don't even mention batteries is this context, the irradiation levels are unpredictable no matter where you are, and photo voltaic cells still have low efficiency.

But this is not about coal or not coal. The contract has already been promised to somebody, and so it must happen.

 

My personal choice.... go nuclear. Cheap, clean (sort of) and always available.... and if you really get pissed off at your neighbors, enrich your spent fuel, and nuke'em.

This lot go Nuclear you are joking aren't you?

 

Never heard of a maintenance scheduled and nuke the neighbours My My what a comment

 

another one of this neck of the woods quality residents delivering the facts again

[wakeupplease]

14 hours ago, scotchonrocks said:

Coal fired power is so last century. The bad part is that the financing (if anyone will do it) is so long term abd locks in the status quo for 30 years forward. As rooftop and utility solar increases, it takes away all the demand from the coal fired stations during the day until the evening peak, and they simply cannot be operated with such large load swings or face the huge maintenance costs of the consequences of ramping. What an awful blight on the country. It's low cost labour advantage will be lost with high cost of power. Disgraceful and the protestors were right to complain even if their objections were more  about local pollution effects. Sad in the extreme.

May be understand coal

But the rest is to technical for certain people too understand and don't want farangs here to teach them as farangs know nothing and are stupid

[plachon]

15 hours ago, robertthesculptor said:

With the amazing abundance of sun, wind, and water power available at a better longtearm price, why would anyone go backwards to a technology of maybe 150 years ago.this is a serious problem as it only hurts the environment and the future of Thailand. 

Try telling that logic to the 'coalocracies' of fossilized Australia and Trumpland. 

[SpaceKadet]

10 hours ago, wakeupplease said:

This lot go Nuclear you are joking aren't you?

 

Never heard of a maintenance scheduled and nuke the neighbours My My what a comment

 

another one of this neck of the woods quality residents delivering the facts again

You would be surprised how much I know about nuclear power plants construction, operation, maintenance and decommissioning. Hence my comment regarding going nuclear. There is simply no better price/performance option available. Even including the long term storage of waste. And I will repeat again; there is no commercially viable solar power plant in operation. All are showcases of technology. To get better than nuclear, we'll have to wait for the thermo-nuclear (fusion, plasma) reactors. For the past 60 years we've been told that the technology will be available in 20 years, and it still is 20 years.

But this is beside the point, we are discussing coal power and local residents resistance to it.

 

Coal power can be made environmentally friendly on the power generation level, but it requires extensive and expensive filters and maintenance. The not so environmentally friendly part is the transportation and storage of the fuel. We all know that what the Thai government says, and what is actually implemented are two very different things. Map TaPut is the prime example.

 

This plant is supposed to supply electricity to the south Thailand, and for almost 20 years now, EGAT has been trying to find a location. Originally, the project called for two 700MW plants that were supposed to be located in Bo Nok and Ban Krut, but a very strong and organized opposition to the project shut it down in 2009 (could be wrong on the actual year). One of the features of the project was 2km long coal offloading peer. Not so great for the marine life...

 

Now that the new powers are controlling the country anything is possible, as we have witnessed here.

 

The funny thing is that even China is going away from coal power and planning more nuclear plants.

 

Edited February 20, 2017 by SpaceKadet
typo

[Ace of Pop]

This lot go Nuclear you are joking aren't you?
 
Never heard of a maintenance scheduled and nuke the neighbours My My what a comment
 
another one of this neck of the woods quality residents delivering the facts again

Could aid Road Safety because we would all Glow in the Dark before they Serviced it


Sent from my iPhone using Thaivisa Connect

[ThaidaGwaii]

I'm an electrician.  Worked in the industry for 40 years.  You hae no idea what you are talking about.  I assume you work for the coal and gas people...

[wakeupplease]

no commercially viable solar power plant in operation

 

I just said that to one of the UKs top solar companies, he laughed and said if that guy knows as much about nuclear as he does about Solar then for god sake do not let the Thais go down that route

 

maybe you should pop over to Japan and tell them they have it all wrong on nuclear and then on to Europe, try Germany or any of the countries round there and tell them  "no commercially viable solar power plant in operation" even here in the UK we have investors who own the solar farms and making big cash on sales to the national grid.

 

Next time you drive around Thailand maybe lopburi open yer eyes as I see vast solar farms all shoving electricity somewhere

 

There are thousands of viable solar power plants in operation all across the world and if we can do it here in the UK with limited sunshine, what could Thailand do?

 

Solar panels today just need light not direct sunshine.

 

It that is wrong I have at least a dozen websites to re write for customers, hope not as some are 10 years old

[plachon]

12 hours ago, SpaceKadet said:

You would be surprised how much I know about nuclear power plants construction, operation, maintenance and decommissioning. Hence my comment regarding going nuclear. There is simply no better price/performance option available. Even including the long term storage of waste.

While you might think you know a little about these things, it is immediately apparent you know much less about the present economics of nuclear, solar and other forms of renewables, either in Thailand, Europe or elsewhere. There are tens of thousands of commercially viable solar plants worldwide, from small to large operations, even in mid-latitude countries like UK. And each year, the number increases at a staggering rate. By comparison, the economics of nuclear power continue to get worse year on year, as the full costs of construction, generation and  decommissioning become apparent.

Only in nations that cross-subsidise the power generation and defence side of nuclear programmes are continuing down this route of power development, at an ever greater cost to taxpayers and energy bill payers, who will ultimately have to underwrite these white elephants. In the UK, for example, after having said that they would not subsidise nuclear, the Tory govt have reneged on their pledge by guaranteeing the strike price of power produced at Hinkley Point C at twice the present wholesale cost of electricity. More expensive than the present generation cost of offshore windpower, incidentally. And all for a design of reactor not tried or tested elsewhere by owners EdF, who have messed up with building similar plants in France and Finland.  Solar generation costs are reducing all the time, and with advances in battery technology, represent a bright future for countries that make the transition from fossil fuels and nuclear dependence.