How to plumb my pool

[carlyai]

How to connect water pipe.
I need to connect 4 off 2" water pipes, that will be nozzles for the pool water inlets, to a pipe that goes back to the pump.

There is hardly any flexibility in the pipes as they are 16.5 strength.
So would you T off each pipe from the pool into the longer run pipes or how would you do it: step by step?

The 4 pipes to be connected are the bottom ones.


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[leyali]

How to connect water pipe.
I need to connect 4 off 2" water pipes, that will be nozzles for the pool water inlets, to a pipe that goes back to the pump.

There is hardly any flexibility in the pipes as they are 16.5 strength.
So would you T off each pipe from the pool into the longer run pipes or how would you do it: step by step?

The 4 pipes to be connected are the bottom ones.


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You must connect the pipe as on the pic i send, make the T always exactly in the middle of the pipe. Else you will get the most water on the first pipe and in the last one almost no water and no pressure.

[carlyai]

You must connect the pipe as on the pic i send, make the T always exactly in the middle of the pipe. Else you will get the most water on the first pipe and in the last one almost no water and no pressure.

Well you've got me. I never even thought of doing it that way. I like it, I like it, but have you a small bit of info to back this up?

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[grollies]

1 hour ago, carlyai said:

How to connect water pipe.
I need to connect 4 off 2" water pipes, that will be nozzles for the pool water inlets, to a pipe that goes back to the pump.

There is hardly any flexibility in the pipes as they are 16.5 strength.
So would you T off each pipe from the pool into the longer run pipes or how would you do it: step by step?

The 4 pipes to be connected are the bottom ones.


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You got 4 on the other side as well? Any on one pool end wall?

[carlyai]

No that's it. got the 2 skimmers on the other side.

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[carlyai]

I tried to keep as many pipes as possible under the dirt and not under cement or tiles, hence the 4 inlet pipes will be under the turf. Not quite what you recommended. ?

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[leyali]

No that's it. got the 2 skimmers on the other side.

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So it's mean you have the inlet and the outlet on the same side of the pool?
And you have 2 skimmer?

[grollies]

45 minutes ago, carlyai said:

No that's it. got the 2 skimmers on the other side.

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What size is the eyeball port aperture? From memory standard ports are around 17mm.

[grollies]

9 minutes ago, leyali said:

 

So it's mean you have the inlet and the outlet on the same side of the pool?
And you have 2 skimmer?

 

Nope, he said 2 skimmers on the opposite wall to the 4 return ports.

[carlyai]

Nope, he said 2 skimmers on the opposite wall to the 4 return ports.

Well really, I have not done the calculations, but have accepted advice and come to my conclusion, rightly or wrongly?

So I've ended up with 4 water pipes I have to connect to a main water feed.
I thought id'e put a 90 degree bend on the end and T sections on the rest and install a long pipe back to the pump station. Everything is 2".

In all my water pipe work, I don't seem to be able to get it exactly right: some times I put in a 90 degree bend, and cut off the joining pipe, but there seems to be mm difference in joining and gluing pipes.
If I am to make the return pipe up first, I need a 90 degree bend, and 3 T joins, then glue them all on the pool water inlets, or with my new thinking, 2 lots of 2 pipes as per a great recent post.

That's why I think Thai Visa is so good; you live out in the sticks and you can throw something up , get knowledgable replies, and choose.


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[carlyai]

What size is the eyeball port aperture? From memory standard ports are around 17mm.

The port office is 14 mm and connects to 2" pipe.

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[Crossy]

Personally, as a control freak, I would bring all the pipes for the return ports, skimmers, main drain and vacuum port(s) back to a marshalling point and put individual valves on each line. Full control of how your water flows.

 

It's not like PVC valves are particularly expensive

 

But that's just me, we do have four (4) 16-way electrical distribution boards in our 3 bedroom home.

[carlyai]

Thanks for reorganizing my post.
Are the PVC valves just on/off, or can you partially open or partially close them?

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[Crossy]

The simple (cheap) ball type are infinitely variable. These chaps:-

 

 

Get them at your local DIY store.

[grollies]

24 minutes ago, carlyai said:

The port office is 14 mm and connects to 2" pipe.

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You really should do the calcs.

 

14mm x 4 ports = 615mm2 surface area.

 

2" pipe (60mm OD, 5mm WT, 50mm INTERNAL diameter) = 1963mm2

 

In effect you're gagging in your pump discharge by 60%, decreasing flow and backing up pressure in your return pipes.

[BEVUP]

? Are you to have 1 pump connected to 2 skimmers or 1 for each skimmer - I would go for 1 on each skimmer so if 1 pump fails you have some circulation 

I see the've done the usual & put the returns maybe 2 ft down they should only be 200 mm below water level as they are there to push any floating debre on the surface to the skimmer 

Do you also have a drain that will connect into your skimmer line with a valve

 

[carlyai]

You really should do the calcs.
 
14mm x 4 ports = 615mm2 surface area.
 
2" pipe (60mm OD, 5mm WT, 50mm INTERNAL diameter) = 1963mm2
 
In effect you're gagging in your pump discharge by 60%, decreasing flow and backing up pressure in your return pipes.

That sounds bad. But forgive my lack of understanding.

If I throw away the filter etc and just have a 2HP pump, where the inlet and outlets are connected to 2" pipe, why won't the flow rate at the 4 combined outputs , be the same as at the output 2" pipe? The pressure may be greater, but why will the flow rate change? each outlet is 14 mm which is 56 mm total and the 2" pipe ID is 50 mm.

Shows you how little I know. [emoji21]

I don't understand the 1963 mm either.



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[grollies]

2 x 1" pipes don't equal a 2" pipe.

 

Have a look at a pump curve and see how flow decreases with head. By restricting the number of return ports you're putting addition head pressure against the pump so, no, the flow won't be the same.

 

In addition, you're going to get a big pressure surge on the return pipework when the pump starts.

 

Circulation is important and utilizing the characteristics of your pump to maximize flow will be vital to clean water.

 

The surface area of your 2" pipe is around 1960sq.mm.

 

The combined surface area of your 4 return ports is 615sq.mm In effect you'll be running your pump with against a half-closed valve.

[Naam]

2 hours ago, carlyai said:

I don't understand the 1963 mm either.

A=π·25²
A=1963.495
that's according to my male dog. the female says A=1963.5

[Naam]

1 hour ago, grollies said:

2 x 1" pipes don't equal a 2" pipe.

Prof. Dr. G. Rollies is correct!

[Naam]

17 hours ago, carlyai said:

That's why I think Thai Visa is so good; you live out in the sticks and you can throw something up , get knowledgable replies, and choose.

don't forget to stock enough beer for pool inauguration day when we check your work!

[sappersrest]

4 hours ago, Crossy said:

Personally, as a control freak, I would bring all the pipes for the return ports, skimmers, main drain and vacuum port(s) back to a marshalling point and put individual valves on each line. Full control of how your water flows.

 

It's not like PVC valves are particularly expensive

 

But that's just me, we do have four (4) 16-way electrical distribution boards in our 3 bedroom home.

OK this by far is the best method of connecting pipework to a pool not the most cost effective but as fittings are so cheep it really is the way to go.

 

SUCTION

Join both bottom drains together then bring into plant room in one pipe with valve.

Bring both skimmers into plant room individually with one valve on each leg.

Join these together to form common suction connect to pump.

 

DELIVERY

 

Bring  4 no 1 1/2 inch pipes into the plant room  from  the pool each with a valve and connect to common delivery pipe from filter.

 

No need for 4 x2 inch pipes.

 

May I suggest you have 3 skimmers instead of  2 as  the ideal deliver through each skimmer is 5m/3 per hour

[Crossy]

Are return ports with larger hole available?

 

Sticking a 14mm hole on the end of a 2" pipe does seem somewhat restrictive.

 

 

[sappersrest]

So as designing any project you need a base line, i.e. what is expected at a certain span in time wether it be concrete no of shoe skirts etc to be delivered over a given time in hours days etc

Well the same is to be said with pools .

 

Private pools i.e. family and friends only

 

The first thing in the specification is the pool turn over in hours so in this case we will use 4 hours which seems to be the accepted norm

 

So we calculate the following pool volume in m/3 divided by the required turnover time gives us the pool flow in hour m/3 per hour.

This will the give us the base figure from which all our calculations can be made i.e.  pump size ,filter size no of inlets,  outlets i.e. skimmers or channel size.

 

Filter size aim for a flow of of around 25 m/3 per hour per m/2 of filter.

 

Pump size you all ready will have the required flow so it is just a case of working out the suction and delivery head losses then pick a suitable pump from manufacturers literature.

Delivery inlets the velocity of each inlet should not really exceed 1.5m/sec. using this figure in conjunction with the manufactures lit should give you the correct  no of pool inlets required.

Skimmers see manufacturers litrature for flow rates generally between 3 -7m/3 per hour.

Bottom sumps the velocity should not exceed  0.5 m/sec so again with manufactures lit the appropriate size can be worked out.

 

With luck later today I will give you a worked example with numbers and specific manufacturers details and in fairness to the sponsor I will use info on there website.

 

If any one would like to give me a m/3 figure to work with, that will be ok otherwise I will use 11x5 x1 deep

[carlyai]

Ok....14 x 4 x 1.5

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[grollies]

1 hour ago, sappersrest said:

OK this by far is the best method of connecting pipework to a pool not the most cost effective but as fittings are so cheep it really is the way to go.

 

SUCTION

Join both bottom drains together then bring into plant room in one pipe with valve.

Agreed.

 

1 hour ago, sappersrest said:

Bring both skimmers into plant room individually with one valve on each leg.

Join these together to form common suction connect to pump.

 

DELIVERY

 

Bring  4 no 1 1/2 inch pipes into the plant room  from  the pool each with a valve and connect to common delivery pipe from filter.

With the utmost respect 4 return ports are not enough to handle the pump delivery. A minimum of 8 are needed assuming a 2hp pump with delivery 30m3/hr.

 

For delivery I would have a 3" header pipe from pump room to pool and tee-off from there.

 

4 (or 8) individual 1-1/2" pipes with valves shouldn't be necessary and will introduce multiple pipe joints with the increased potential for leaks.

 

1 hour ago, sappersrest said:

 

No need for 4 x2 inch pipes.

 

May I suggest you have 3 skimmers instead of  2 as  the ideal deliver through each skimmer is 5m/3 per hour

3 skimmers agreed although, again, a 3" header from pump room to pool, ditto above.

[grollies]

On second thoughts I'm going to step back from this thread to avoid conflicting advice and giving Carl kittens.

 

@sappersrest is very knowledgeable on pools, go with his advice.

 

Cheers,

 

grolls

[Crossy]

Carl has already had the kittens, but he's early enough in the construction to make changes.

[grollies]

1 hour ago, Crossy said:

Carl has already had the kittens, but he's early enough in the construction to make changes.

Nope, he's got his walls poured, good luck drilling through that to add another skimmer/return ports.

 

But he has to decide on what changes are needed. since I was offering different advice I thought I'd back off.

 

IMHO he's had some bad advice already, not having bottom drains in the bottom of the pool, number of skimmers and return ports and their position.

 

All IMHO.

 

 

Edited May 9, 2017 by grollies

[carlyai]

Thanks all for upsetting me. Maybe fill it in and plant rubber trees. Anyone know anything about rubber trees?

Will consider the options. Thanks again.

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