Benefits of joining the military

[anto]

Just now, jeab1980 said:

In my many years in the service only once did i see any bullying. In my part of HM armed forces bullying was not only outlawed but activly dealt with by oppo's. 

There have been many cases of Bullying within the Army in Aldershot .Thats only one place of know of .

[vogie]

8 minutes ago, anto said:

There have been many cases of Bullying within the Army in Aldershot .Thats only one place of know of .

There are always exceptions to the rule, and it should be stamped out, suffice to say I my army career I never came across such practices.

[jeab1980]

10 minutes ago, anto said:

There have been many cases of Bullying within the Army in Aldershot .Thats only one place of know of .

Yes i have seen the reports of such. Not being part of the army.  I can only coment on my service.

[sirineou]

My Nephew (not the brightest at the time ) joined then USAF after high school about twenty years ago and specialized a an  airplane mechanic, upon his discharge he got a job with the Greek air force (dual citizenship)  as a consultant, 

now he is working in the USAF as a civilian  employee, and has done very good for him self. If it was not for the military I am not sure what he would have done with his life.

Having said that, when my daughter expressed a similar interest, I threaten to lock her up in a room until she came to her senses.

Different times now, and the prospect of seeing action in the US military. very hi.

She could either kill,being killed, injured or witness a lot of killing, all not good prospects for my daughter.

I dont mind dying or killing for my country, but  I will certainly not do it for Exxon.

 

[jeab1980]

15 minutes ago, sirineou said:

My Nephew (not the brightest at the time ) joined then USAF after high school about twenty years ago and specialized a an  airplane mechanic, upon his discharge he got a job with the Greek air force (dual citizenship)  as a consultant, 

now he is working in the USAF as a civilian  employee, and has done very good for him self. If it was not for the military I am not sure what he would have done with his life.

Having said that, when my daughter expressed a similar interest, I threaten to lock her up in a room until she came to her senses.

Different times now, and the prospect of seeing action in the US military. very hi.

She could either kill,being killed, injured or witness a lot of killing, all not good prospects for my daughter.

I dont mind dying or killing for my country, but  I will certainly not do it for Exxon.

 

Isnt that her decision not yours?

[sirineou]

Just now, jeab1980 said:

Isnt that her decision not yours?

Let me take this opportunity to say , as I should have had in my previous reply, that I dont make any value judgments for those who have. Simply my opinion on the subject to consider. 

 

It is certainly her decisions but I have an opinion on the subject and lucky for me, my daughter respects my opinion.

She is young , bright but does not yet have the experience necessary to consider all factors, Not only there are things she does not know, but there are things she does not know, she does not know.

Until l such time that she does, it is my responsibility as a parent to point these things out for her to consider. 

I know she will make mistakes , and I understand that she need to make her own mistake and grow from them,

but there are some mistakes one does not come back from,

again my responsibility as a parent to prevent them as best as I can.

 

[jeab1980]

27 minutes ago, sirineou said:

Let me take this opportunity to say , as I should have had in my previous reply, that I dont make any value judgments for those who have. Simply my opinion on the subject to consider. 

 

It is certainly her decisions but I have an opinion on the subject and lucky for me, my daughter respects my opinion.

She is young , bright but does not yet have the experience necessary to consider all factors, Not only there are things she does not know, but there are things she does not know, she does not know.

Until l such time that she does, it is my responsibility as a parent to point these things out for her to consider. 

I know she will make mistakes , and I understand that she need to make her own mistake and grow from them,

but there are some mistakes one does not come back from,

again my responsibility as a parent to prevent them as best as I can.

 

In the end regardless of what you say or belive she will make her own desicion and do as ahe sees as right. Both my parents were military during and after the war. In fact all my brothers and sisters were military.  My dad in particular having been through the shit and beyond. Tried to steer me twds a civilian life. I took his points and his views onboard best i could at the age of 15. Then as soon as i reached 15 and 9 months of age i joined HM armed forces. My dad realising i would join at a later date anyway signed his consent to be a junior in HM Forces. One year and 3 months later i emerged from being a boy soldier to a fully fledge green behind the ears fully trained rank and two weeks after that i was patroling the streets of Belfast. So my life went on through varuous conflicts. I saw what my dad saw and did what he did. Mutual respect paved the way to a fantastic relationship with him. What i learnt in the years of my sercive still holds true today in my everyday life. Yes i lost some great friends i remember them always. I would not swop one minute of my time served would i change anything if i could do it again. Of course i would i would be minutes earlier in certain places and some of my oppos would still be with us today thats a given. Change anything else not a chance. My boy in the UK (say boy hes already retired from the military having served 25years). Did i try and steer him into the forces NO. Did i try to steer him to civvy street NO. I told him what to expect within the forces couldn't tell him anything positive about civvy street at the time as i was still in. We have the same relationship as i had with my dad now. As i do with other ex forces sometimes no words are needed. 

Edited June 2, 2017 by jeab1980

[sirineou]

25 minutes ago, jeab1980 said:

In the end regardless of what you say or belive she will make her own desicion and do as ahe sees as right. Both my parents were military during and after the war. In fact all my brothers and sisters were military.  My dad in particular having been through the shit and beyond. Tried to steer me twds a civilian life. I took his points and his views onboard best i could at the age of 15. Then as soon as i reached 15 and 9 months of age i joined HM armed forces. My dad realising i would join at a later date anyway signed his consent to be a junior in HM Forces. One year and 3 months later i emerged from being a boy soldier to a fully fledge green behind the ears fully trained rank and two weeks after that i was patroling the streets of Belfast. So my life went on through varuous conflicts. I saw what my dad saw and did what he did. Mutual respect paved the way to a fantastic relationship with him. What i learnt in the years of my sercive still holds true today in my everyday life. Yes i lost some great friends i remember them always. I would not swop one minute of my time served would i change anything if i could do it again. Of course i would i would be minutes earlier in certain places and some of my oppos would still be with us today thats a given. Change anything else not a chance. My boy in the UK (say boy hes already retired from the military having served 25years). Did i try and steer him into the forces NO. Did i try to steer him to civvy street NO. I told him what to expect within the forces couldn't tell him anything positive about civvy street at the time as i was still in. We have the same relationship as i had with my dad now. As i do with other ex forces sometimes no words are needed. 

Sure, no disagreement there,

in the end it id certainly her decision.And I was glad she did not join, many other career paths  available to her.

At the time you made the decision to join was a different world, perhaps then, I would had joined also.

Now?

 also we are from different countries with different military priorities. 

One needs to conciser this.

With out getting in to the politics of the thing , I think we can agree that,  Joining the military in one country could be a totally different experience , than joining the militarily in an other .

[jeab1980]

7 minutes ago, sirineou said:

Sure, no disagreement there,

in the end it id certainly her decision.And I was glad she did not join, many other career paths  available to her.

At the time you made the decision to join was a different world, perhaps then, I would had joined also.

Now?

 also we are from different countries with different military priorities. 

One needs to conciser this.

With out getting in to the politics of the thing , I think we can agree that,  Joining the military in one country could be a totally different experience , than joining the militarily in an other .

Maybe maybe not.  Not much diffrence within the services from lets say Nato countries apart from cultural diffrences snd language oh and one has a union within the Army!  Worked with several allies over the years some better than others but all brothers in arms.  If your asking would i join up now Yes in a heartbeat but then im biased towards the military. Good luck to your daughter by the way.

[Flustered]

Refreshed after a short holiday and a thread that holds no interest for FMs who have nothing to contribute except to bait others.

 

Simon, at 58 you are a lot younger than many American reservists I worked alongside in Iraq (Mosul) during the Sadam overthrow. They were loving it. Experience, enthusiasm and gratitude that they could serve their country yet again. Most of these were in an intelligence roll and not boots on the ground. It was good to meet some that I actually knew from the 70s. 'Nuf said about that.  Shsss.

 

Any of us who have served in the colours (UK) have had good times and bad. You forget the bad and remember the good (or is it the other way round). The military teaches you discipline, self reliance  and a belief in yourself. If you are lucky, you get into a trade like electronics where you can earn a bit more than a bob or two once you go into civvy street.

 

I will however say that the US forces and the Australian forces are treated a damn sight better once they leave than the UK ones. Once you leave the UK military you are on your own. No special hospital treatment for the injuries you picked up (NHS will deal with  that mate). Piss poor pension unless you are "one of the boys" and an officer. Then you are jumped up a rank and invariably offered a job in the MOD. All of the Majors and Colonels of my Regiments moved into MOD jobs so they could while away the time until 65. But one thing the officers did not have was a belief in themselves, they always downloaded onto the nearest OR. 

 

One thing that comes out of military life is a black sense of humour and that is hard on many civvies who do not understand it  Also "Political Correctness"....What is that?. A spade is a spade and if you can't take a joke, don't join. You also get to immediately spot those who claim to be ex military but have never served a day in their lives.

 

Would I do it all again? You bet I would. 

 

 

[anto]

>>Once you leave the UK military you are on your own. <<

Many who leave the Military life ,where everything is taken care of ,end up sleeping under Waterloo Bridge London when they leave and run out of money .

[Flustered]

4 minutes ago, anto said:

>>Once you leave the UK military you are on your own. <<

Many who leave the Military life ,where everything is taken care of ,end up sleeping under Waterloo Bridge London when they leave and run out of money .

Spot on with the exception of "The Old Boy Network".

 

Also, I see one or two posts from people "claiming" to have served that obviously have not.

[Flustered]

6 hours ago, anto said:

>>. Not all will enjoy or even cope with the lifestyle, but many will.<<

 

It suits a certain type of person .A lot of bullying goes on in every Army  ,which was hidden before and is now more out in the open .Its not for sensitive Souls .

All depends on the definition of bullying.

 

In my basic training (late 60), dirty recruits were given bass broom and ajax showers and it was common for those who let the sqaud down to be tied in the bed and left out in the middle of the parade ground in the early hours of the morning (winter). These were just two of the milder punishments that would be tagged as bullying in today's girly boy army. And it was even worse during the conscription years. 

 

Bullying, it makes a man of you and shines your boots.

[Caps]

I was in the British Army (Infantry) for 22 years. '84' to '06'.  Loved it.  Yes you have good and bad days but the vast majority were good, been all over the world and been involved in some conflicts.

I would do it all in a blink of an eye and I would also stay in the same job.  What I missed the most is the camaraderie and the constant  P!55 taking with the very dry wit.  Hence I am now in where I am now, its just like being back in.

It was the best thing I did with my life and gave me good life skills which are still helping me now.

What I will say is that I think that the US military look after their Retired/Vets better that the British Army does.

It is nice having the pension coming in and knowing that I have a reasonable amount in the bank before I even get out of bed.  4.5 years left then hopefully I can finally retire properly...finger crossed.

I have also found that even though I have been left for 11 years now I still have the horrible dry wit which does not go down too well with Civvies and that I do not suffer fools, incompetence or laziness lightly 

On the bullying side of things, it can happen anywhere in any environment.  But in my early days it was nothing a Kangaroo couldn't sort out, (those who know will know)

Edited June 2, 2017 by Caps
added bits

[Caps]

9 minutes ago, Flustered said:

Spot on with the exception of "The Old Boy Network".

 

Also, I see one or two posts from people "claiming" to have served that obviously have not.

Ummmm who?

[jeab1980]

1 minute ago, Caps said:

Ummmm who?

Yes do tell whos the walters

[Caps]

Just now, jeab1980 said:

Yes do tell whos the walters

I really annoys me after busting my b@115 for all those years, to think that people try and bluff it.  But saying that I could use some figure 11's 

[sirineou]

 

If the military is such a great environment for personal growth as many seem to suggest  why then the suicide rate among active personal is more than twise than that in the general population 

https://www.usatoday.com/story/news/nation/2016/06/12/military-suicide-rates/85287518/

and after discharge significantly higher than that of the general population?

https://www.publichealth.va.gov/epidemiology/studies/suicide-risk-death-risk-recent-veterans.asp

 

US stats

Edited June 2, 2017 by sirineou
to ad "US Stats" caveat

[vogie]

16 minutes ago, jeab1980 said:

Yes do tell whos the walters

Not me, are we narrowing down the contenders. It's becoming more like an Agatha Christie novel?

Edited June 2, 2017 by vogie

[Caps]

5 minutes ago, sirineou said:

If the military is such a great environment for personal growth as many seem to suggest  why then the suicide rate among active personal is more than twise than that in the general population 

https://www.usatoday.com/story/news/nation/2016/06/12/military-suicide-rates/85287518/

and after discharge significantly higher than that of the general population?

https://www.publichealth.va.gov/epidemiology/studies/suicide-risk-death-risk-recent-veterans.asp

The list would probably be long....but that is not the thread....is it?

If you want to start another thread then feel free then we can all be on a downer and the suicide rates just might go up

Edited June 2, 2017 by Caps

[sirineou]

4 minutes ago, Caps said:

The list would probably be long....but that is not the thread....is it?

I you want to start another thread then feel free then we can all be on a downer and the suicide rates just might go up

I was under the impression that this was a thread concerning the pros and cons of joining the military. I would say that a significantly  higher suicide rate is a con, but if I am wrong I apologize.

Edited June 2, 2017 by sirineou

[vogie]

9 minutes ago, sirineou said:

 

If the military is such a great environment for personal growth as many seem to suggest  why then the suicide rate among active personal is more than twise than that in the general population 

https://www.usatoday.com/story/news/nation/2016/06/12/military-suicide-rates/85287518/

and after discharge significantly higher than that of the general population?

https://www.publichealth.va.gov/epidemiology/studies/suicide-risk-death-risk-recent-veterans.asp

 

US stats

The thread is going off on a tangent, it's about the 'benifits of joining' I'm becoming depressed. ?

[Flustered]

23 minutes ago, Caps said:

Ummmm who?

Even one of our retarded I Corpse could spot the phoney. Just look for the one post wonder.

[sirineou]

4 minutes ago, vogie said:

The thread is going off on a tangent, it's about the 'benifits of joining' I'm becoming depressed. ?

Sorry Vogie, stay away from your gun until you feel better

 

[jeab1980]

14 minutes ago, sirineou said:

I was under the impression that this was a thread concerning the pros and cons of joining the military. I would say that a significantly  higher suicide rate is a con, but if I am wrong I apologize.

Beacuse like civies millatary personel are not imune to depression and mental health problems. What affects one does not effect others. PTSD affects people in all walks of life. Unfortunatley due to tbe nature of the beast millitary personel tend to see a lot more shall we say shit than the average civvie therefore uping the figures of suicide of ex or serving members of the armed forces. Its really hard to talk to people about what you may have seen or done when on active service. Talking to your wife or a shink in most cases is a no no. Talking to someone who can relate to you ie another ex or serving military person is a lot easier as they can easily relate. But the biggest problem is individuals keeping things bottled up inside fiening normality. Its a major problem which has a long long way to being sorted.

Edited June 2, 2017 by jeab1980

[vogie]

4 minutes ago, sirineou said:

Sorry Vogie, stay away from your gun until you feel better

 

My wife is in charge of my gun now, and it still fires prematurely. ?

[Flustered]

19 minutes ago, Caps said:

The list would probably be long....but that is not the thread....is it?

If you want to start another thread then feel free then we can all be on a downer and the suicide rates just might go up

Now we are talking.  Black humour.

 

When our Regiment was formed out of several dispersed Squadrons, we were also given a large intake of highly strung Spec Ops. In the first year alone we had three suicide attempts....all failures of course.

 

1. Hanging by his tie from the toilet door frame...frame broke

2. Cutting wrists....across instead of down.

3. Overdose....Piriton? The troop had a whip round of real drugs for him.

 

In all cases they were dealt with by our resident therapist, Mac The Medic. A burly Scotch Sergeant Medic who proceeded to lecture them on "if you are going to attempt suicide, do it properly" He then went into graphic detail on how to and the results complete with photographs.

 

Never had another case or attempt after that. Tough love as they say.

 

Today, it would be counselling and therapy.

 

Hey Vogie, if you are fed up with life, go for a ride in a REME serviced vehicle.....555...This thread has woken me up from my bout of Egyptian PT.

 

These are the benefits of a military career, a great outlook on life, the universe and everyfing.

 

Edited June 2, 2017 by Flustered

[Caps]

^^^^^ awesome

Black humour is the best 

[sirineou]

1 minute ago, jeab1980 said:

Beacuse like cicies millatary personel are not imune to depression and mental health problems. What affects one does not effect others. PTSD affects people in all walks of life. Unfortunatley due to tbe nature of the beast millitary personel tend to see a lot more shall we say shit than the average civvie therefore uping the figures of suicide of ex or serving members of the armed forces. Its really hard to talk to people about whst you may have seen or done when on active service. Talking to your wife or a shink in most cases is a no no. Talking to someone who can relate to you ie snother ex or serving mitary person is a lot easier as they can easily relate. But the biggest problem is individuals keeping things bottled up inside fiening normality. Its a msjor problem which has a long long way to being sorted.

Brother I hear you, certainly not an easy thing. 

an other reason is also close proximity to means  an act toward suicidal impulses.

Trust me when I say that I have the greatest respect toward those who serve, Simply considering the pros and cons otherwise this would become the

Mutual military appreciation society.

[Caps]

Going back to the Thread Title.

 

Being in the Army made we walk upright and be proud.  It also made me to be able to stand on my own two feet and move on in life whatever is thrown at you.

Also on the plus side I clean, wash and iron with the best of them and I am not to bad at cooking too...must be all those years with menu A lol.   I still miss the 10 man rat pack sausages

Edited June 2, 2017 by Caps