Machines coming to take millions of Thai jobs: report

manarak · June 3, 2017

2 hours ago, thaibeachlovers said:

That's old thinking. Once AI comes in robots will make other robots, so the cost per unit will be very small. Plus, they'll service/ repair themselves.

I'm a programmer.

The view the general public has of AI is completely wrong and very over-optimistic regarding not only its capabilities today, but also regarding what it will probably be capable of in 20 years.

What you describe will maybe happen for the most simple of devices during the lifespan of my children.

fruitman · June 3, 2017

4 hours ago, thaibeachlovers said:

and the jobs they will do instead????????

Well if the labour is automated they have more time for other things right, like relaxing or teaching the kids.

Without automation Thailand will loose it's spot on the worldmarkets, for thai coffee it already costs double the price to name something. In W-Europe banana's are cheaper than in BKK, soon everythingn will be cheaper in Europe than in BKK and the Thai will loose their export and jobs.

Johpa · June 3, 2017

1 hour ago, manarak said:

I'm a programmer.

The view the general public has of AI is completely wrong and very over-optimistic regarding not only its capabilities today, but also regarding what it will probably be capable of in 20 years.

What you describe will maybe happen for the most simple of devices during the lifespan of my children.

Are you a CPU programmer or a GPU programmer? I have friends who are coders at some of the local software shops, including Microsoft, who have no idea what is happening on the GPU front. People here should take a few hours on YouTube and track down lectures by Geoffrey Hinton (now with Google), Andrew Ng (with Baidu), or Jensen Huang (with Nvidia), or Fei Fei Li (Stanford) to open your eyes to what is coming down the road. Yes, it is relatively early in the machine learning stage with Nvidia just now releasing the first GPU aimed specifically at machine learning. Robots taking over the world remain Sci-Fi, but machines replacing most labor, even in agriculture, is much closer than most imagine.

Here is a recent article on robotics (AI) in agriculture: https://www.wired.com/2017/05/robots-agriculture/

Edited June 3, 2017 by Johpa

fruitman · June 3, 2017

1 minute ago, Johpa said:

Are you a CPU programmer or a GPU programmer? I have friends who are coders at some of the local software shops, including Microsoft, who have no idea what is happening on the GPU front. People here should take a few hours on YouTube and track down lectures by Geoffrey Hinton (now with Google), Andrew Ng (with Baidu), or Jensen Huang (with Nvidia), or Fei Fei Li (Stanford) to open your eyes to what is coming down the road. Yes, it is relatively early in the machine learning stage with Nvidia just now releasing the first GPU aimed specifically at machine learning. Robots taking over the world remain Sci-Fi, but machines replacing most labor, even in agriculture is much closer than most imagine.

Here is a recent article on robotics (AI) in agriculture: https://www.wired.com/2017/05/robots-agriculture/

GPU provides graphic images in high quality, what will that change the agriculture business? I don't get it.

For thailand automation is a fancy term, they are not even past the "using tools" phase which is using large agriculture equipment on large plots of land.

oldcarguy · June 3, 2017

Where do you learn about CNC machining , 3D printing and other things that use G-Code ?

and is the same idea as G-code used in Robotics ?

Anything simple on You Tube to start ?

as far as AI in agriculture , I can see it used for planting , watering etc

but will it be able to pick ripe fruit and leave the rest ?

fruitman · June 3, 2017

4 minutes ago, oldcarguy said:

Where do you learn about CNC machining , 3D printing and other things that use G-Code ?

and is the same idea as G-code used in Robotics ?

Anything simple on You Tube to start ?

as far as AI in agriculture , I can see it used for planting , watering etc

but will it be able to pick ripe fruit and leave the rest ?

You can start with Arduino's who are very cheap. Everything for CNC or 3d printing is cheap these days and for sale on internet. Courses are on youtube.

Do you want to learn G-code or just build a certain machine? The programmers just download the code for 3d printers, it's not that hard.

There are robots who can pick fruit themselves but they are not perfect yet. For Thailand it would be an improvement if the fruitpickers could sit on a cart which drives them along the tree's. The tree's also have to have same size which is cut by the same cart.

In BKK i even never see real deliverytrucks for Shops like Tesco or BigC. I guess it's all done in small buses which i also don't see. When they ever open real large shops they will need bigger trucks and that will cost many drivers their job.

And when all Thai go shopping in supermarkets/large shops the markets can also be closed which means more lost jobs.

Automation is hardly needed in Thailand but they can start simple, don't need the most hitec systems. They can start by using powertools from Japan, not the cheapo brands but real quality machines which last for a decade.

jcsmith · June 3, 2017

2 hours ago, manarak said:

I'm a programmer.

The view the general public has of AI is completely wrong and very over-optimistic regarding not only its capabilities today, but also regarding what it will probably be capable of in 20 years.

What you describe will maybe happen for the most simple of devices during the lifespan of my children.

I'm also a programmer, and while I agree that the general perception of what AI can do currently is overblown, I don't think it will take until the end of our childrens lifespans for self-repair to only be available on the simplest of programs. I think the notion of human-like robots as repairman is a long way away of course, but auto-detection of problems, simple forms of self-repair I don't think those are far off pipe dreams. Self-awareness isn't happening any time soon, but machine learning is happening now. Right now it takes a lot of human input to direct, but as quantum computers mature past the D-Wave offerings, as 3d printing becomes cheaper, and as general purpose machine learning improves simply from a software standpoint it will be to replace many of our jobs not in another fifty years, but within the next ten years. The rest of my post isn't directly targeted at you but just my general thoughts.

Self-driving vehicles for example, how long is it before they replace the majority of taxis and 18 wheel shipping? How much safer will they be? How much more capable will they be at diagnosing and recognizing engine problems than your average driver?

Humans will have a role in customer support for some time, but much of the common support questions can be handled with software. Siri for example is obviously not an example of true machine learning, more of searching through monstrous data sets. But the ability of software to respond to logical questions from data is going to improve. As is the ability to recognize input in a more intelligent (for lack of a better word) manner.

Data input, an easy brute force and boring job. This is already losing a lot of steam to more and more intelligent forms of parsing and data mining. Computers are better suited to find patterns, and to parse data than humans would ever be. That is not new, but there are still millions of data processing jobs that won't be available forever.

I love the fact that I can swipe an ATM or a credit card to get gas without needing to interact with anyone. It's convenient but it also costs jobs.

Many developed countries have lost many farming jobs to machinery already. That's going to be the case in less developed countries, as well.

Once medical technology is available in everyone's phones (another great tool) it will give people less reason to visit the doctor's office. Less demand for positions will naturally mean less jobs.

Programmers, artists, PR people, etc may not be in any danger any time soon. But eventually they too will eventually feel the effects of this.

I just don't think any of this stuff is avoidable. It's also not necessarily a bad thing, provided that people can live reasonable lives. I'm one who thinks that things like Brain-Computer Interfaces are a positive part of the future. But certainly within the next 10-20 years there's going to be a lot of changes, a lot of jobs lost, while the population continues to grow. It's something that will need to be addressed and that people need to be (and are) thinking about.

Edited June 3, 2017 by jcsmith

ericthai · June 3, 2017

16 minutes ago, fruitman said:

For thailand automation is a fancy term, they are not even past the "using tools" phase which is using large agriculture equipment on large plots of land.

you are talking out your ass. I've been working in SE Asia including Thailand for the last 30 years. I have done allot of plant automation work in Thailand. Sure the small mom and pop places are using labor, but the industrial factories in Thailand are automated. Most of the farms most are small plots of land but even for those growing rice there are harvesters that are moved around from village to village to harvest the rice.

manarak · June 3, 2017

32 minutes ago, Johpa said:

Are you a CPU programmer or a GPU programmer? I have friends who are coders at some of the local software shops, including Microsoft, who have no idea what is happening on the GPU front. People here should take a few hours on YouTube and track down lectures by Geoffrey Hinton (now with Google), Andrew Ng (with Baidu), or Jensen Huang (with Nvidia), or Fei Fei Li (Stanford) to open your eyes to what is coming down the road. Yes, it is relatively early in the machine learning stage with Nvidia just now releasing the first GPU aimed specifically at machine learning. Robots taking over the world remain Sci-Fi, but machines replacing most labor, even in agriculture, is much closer than most imagine.

Here is a recent article on robotics (AI) in agriculture: https://www.wired.com/2017/05/robots-agriculture/

the other poster was talking about machines building other machines and servicing and repairing them - that's not just replacing labor.

the depth of the software required to do this is tremendous, it's not just about picking fruit.

and people imagine autonomous machines in a world where most electronic components aren't designed to last more than a handful of years, lol.

I don't say it's technically impossible to do, I say human labor will remain cheaper in most applications for a very long time.

fruitman · June 3, 2017

3 minutes ago, ericthai said:

you are talking out your ass. I've been working in SE Asia including Thailand for the last 30 years. I have done allot of plant automation work in Thailand. Sure the small mom and pop places are using labor, but the industrial factories in Thailand are automated. Most of the farms most are small plots of land but even for those growing rice there are harvesters that are moved around from village to village to harvest the rice.

So the harvesters have to be transported on a trailer to all the small farms? Over the bumpy roads every day.

And since you know it all, where can i buy the whole program of makita powertools in Thailand?? They only have old models and sure not the latest machines.

And for riceplanting i also haven't seen them using machines but i rarely come into the ricefields.

I also have never heard of a big bananaplantation in Thailand. Or big coffeeplantation. Do they even something like this in Thailand??

manarak · June 3, 2017

7 minutes ago, jcsmith said:

I'm also a programmer, and while I agree that the general perception of what AI can do currently is overblown, I don't think it will take until the end of our childrens lifespans for self-repair to only be available on the simplest of programs. I think the notion of human-like robots as repairman is a long way away of course, but auto-detection of problems, simple forms of self-repair I don't think those are far off pipe dreams. Self-awareness isn't happening any time soon, but machine learning is happening now. Right now it takes a lot of human input to direct, but as quantum computers mature past the D-Wave offerings, as 3d printing becomes cheaper, and as general purpose machine learning improves simply from a software standpoint it will be to replace many of our jobs not in another fifty years, but within the next ten years. The rest of my post isn't directly targeted at you but just my general thoughts.

Self-driving vehicles for example, how long is it before they replace the majority of taxis and 18 wheel shipping? How much safer will they be? How much more capable will they be at diagnosing and recognizing engine problems than your average driver?

Humans will have a role in customer support for some time, but much of the common support questions can be handled with software. Siri for example is obviously not an example of true machine learning, more of searching through monstrous data sets. But the ability of software to respond to logical questions from data is going to improve. As is the ability to recognize input in a more intelligent (for lack of a better word) manner.

Data input, an easy brute force and boring job. This is already losing a lot of steam to more and more intelligent forms of parsing and data mining. Computers are better suited to find patterns, and to parse data than humans would ever be. That is not new, but there are still millions of data processing jobs that won't be available forever.

I love the fact that I can swipe an ATM or a credit card to get gas without needing to interact with anyone. It's convenient but it also costs jobs.

Many developed countries have lost many farming jobs to machinery already. That's going to be the case in less developed countries, as well.

Once medical technology is available in everyone's phones (another great tool) it will give people less reason to visit the doctor's office. Less demand for positions will naturally mean less jobs.

Programmers, artists, PR people, etc may not be in any danger any time soon. But eventually they too will eventually feel the effects of this.

I just don't think any of this stuff is avoidable. It's also not necessarily a bad thing, provided that people can live reasonable lives. I'm one who thinks that things like Brain-Computer Interfaces are a positive part of the future. But certainly within the next 10-20 years there's going to be a lot of changes, a lot of jobs lost, while the population continues to grow. It's something that will need to be addressed and that people need to be (and are) thinking about.

interesting points.

I feel that replacing people with machines is a consequence of socialism blowing up labor costs.

what opportunities will there be for self-driving taxis in Bangkok?

In Zurich of course, 20 minutes taxi will set you back 70 USD... a case for automated taxis right there, but not where taxi driving is paid what it's worth.

then making the point of diagnosis of problems - look at current PCs.

they are a clearly delimited system, yet software is unable to diagnose all but the simplest problems.

why don't we have alerts for RAM misreads, unacceptable core voltages, driver incompatibilities...

AI is all software. get the AI to be able to write complex software, and then I will say, ok, the next age has arrived.

oldcarguy · June 3, 2017

28 minutes ago, fruitman said:

You can start with Arduino's who are very cheap. Everything for CNC or 3d printing is cheap these days and for sale on internet. Courses are on youtube.

Do you want to learn G-code or just build a certain machine? The programmers just download the code for 3d printers, it's not that hard.

I want to play with a 3D printer and a CNC Mill ,

but I also want to help my friends 10 year old kid to play with it over Summer Vacation ,

I understand I do not have to "learn" G-code but more the Program that does G-code ,

but the little video I have watched on Youtube seems to show that knowing some G-code can help troubleshoot a problem.

Do you have an YouTube videos or any training aimed at a 10 year old kid ?

Thanks

fruitman · June 3, 2017

8 minutes ago, manarak said:

why don't we have alerts for RAM misreads, unacceptable core voltages, driver incompatibilities...

I never had one but you need an APPLE sir.

I agree my windows10 has stupid issues/questions which it should handle itself but windows has become far too complicated and large. It's nice though but still can be improved.

And i'm happy my pc does never alert me for ram misreads or unacceptable core voltages....previous versions of windows were much worse.

Myself i also was an IT-pro for many years but technology changes very fast lately, Thailand can just buy the needed technology now, no need to develop it themselves which is a huge gain.

fruitman · June 3, 2017

2 minutes ago, oldcarguy said:

I want to play with a 3D printer and a CNC Mill ,

but I also want to help my friends 10 year old kid to play with it over Summer Vacation ,

I understand I do not have to "learn" G-code but more the Program that does G-code ,

but the little video I have watched on Youtube seems to show that knowing some G-code can help troubleshoot a problem.

Do you have an YouTube videos or any training aimed at a 10 year old kid ?

Thanks

I can easy find everything you need but if you think you can use G-code you can also use google and find the video's there.

https://www.banggood.com/Anet-A8-3D-Printer-DIY-Kit-1_75mm-0_4mm-Support-ABS-PLA-HIPS-p-1130694.html?rmmds=search

Search on this site for what you need, they have it all....read the reviews from other users and their tips, use the same software as them and read those websites for geeks or github or whatever they refer to.

The software is easy to install and the printer will work...after that you 'll have to learn how to program the printer but can use software for that and find tutorials in video on youtube. If the kid is 10 he might learn english from that.

I know a thai kid who speaks fluent english from watching youtube video's. He also knows everything about latest technology now and even has an american accent.

It's so easy these days for kids, they can get a online video for everything now...

ericthai · June 3, 2017

Just now, fruitman said:

So the harvesters have to be transported on a trailer to all the small farms? Over the bumpy roads every day.

And since you know it all, where can i buy the whole program of makita powertools in Thailand?? They only have old models and sure not the latest machines.

And for riceplanting i also haven't seen them using machines but i rarely come into the ricefields.

I also have never heard of a big bananaplantation in Thailand. Or big coffeeplantation. Do they even something like this in Thailand??

Yes, they transport the harvester from village to village where it will stay in the village for a few days. Yes, some of the roads are bumpy but they dont move far when they move. I never said Thailand was a state of the art country. Thailand can be so far backwards in things but then be right up front with the latest technology.

Not saying I know it all, just stating that Thailand is industrialized with real equipment, that it's not just a fancy word in Thailand. Just to let you know Makita has a factory in Chonburi. I have seen Makita for sale in shops in Isaan. I'm sure if you google Makita Thailand you can find distributors near you.

Yes, there are coffee plantations in Thailand along with Sugar, Pineapple, corn, rice etc.

Necafe has a good size processing factory in Navankorn. Dole as a factory in Champorn. The company I worked for we designed and installed automated systems, bulk material handling. etc so I have done allot of jobs in Thailand and from that know how industrial it is, most people dont realize how many factories there are in Thailand.

fruitman · June 3, 2017

3 minutes ago, ericthai said:

Yes, they transport the harvester from village to village where it will stay in the village for a few days. Yes, some of the roads are bumpy but they dont move far when they move. I never said Thailand was a state of the art country. Thailand can be so far backwards in things but then be right up front with the latest technology.

Not saying I know it all, just stating that Thailand is industrialized with real equipment, that it's not just a fancy word in Thailand. Just to let you know Makita has a factory in Chonburi. I have seen Makita for sale in shops in Isaan. I'm sure if you google Makita Thailand you can find distributors near you.

Yes, there are coffee plantations in Thailand along with Sugar, Pineapple, corn, rice etc.

Necafe has a good size processing factory in Navankorn. Dole as a factory in Champorn. The company I worked for we designed and installed automated systems, bulk material handling. etc so I have done allot of jobs in Thailand and from that know how industrial it is, most people dont realize how many factories there are in Thailand.

That's the whole problem, compaies like Dole can setup plantations but then the profit goes to them of course. Why can't the Thai setup a hitec banana plantation themselves and produce cheap banana's? Look here, this video i found in 10 seconds, in Belize they do have huge bananafarms.

And for expensive machinery like a harvester wouldn't you agree that a machine like that belongs on a huge farm in it's own shed and not in rural places unprotected? They need huge ricefields so the machine can do what it's good at all day long. Only that way a harvester is helping reducing produce prices.

On internet are nice video's about growing pistachenuts in california on huge scale..That's what the Thai need, automated farms and high volumes.

Boiled Frog · June 3, 2017

Better hope that they do not create a machine that can drive a taxi and give a massage.

20 percent of Thai GDP is currently coming from tourism and the current population is 68 million.

So that's 13.6 million out of a job overnight.

Boiled Frog · June 3, 2017

Just now, fruitman said:

That's the whole problem, compaies like Dole can setup plantations but then the profit goes to them of course. Why can't the Thai setup a hitec banana plantation themselves and produce cheap banana's? Look here, this video i found in 10 seconds, in Belize they do have huge bananafarms.

And for expensive machinery like a harvester wouldn't you agree that a machine like that belongs on a huge farm in it's own shed and not in rural places unprotected? They need huge ricefields so the machine can do what it's good at all day long. Only that way a harvester is helping reducing produce prices.

On internet are nice video's about growing pistachenuts in california on huge scale..That's what the Thai need, automated farms and high volumes.

Thai banana diffelent...

ericthai · June 3, 2017

Just now, fruitman said:

That's the whole problem, compaies like Dole can setup plantations but then the profit goes to them of course. Why can't the Thai setup a hitec banana plantation themselves and produce cheap banana's? Look here, this video i found in 10 seconds, in Belize they do have huge bananafarms.

And for expensive machinery like a harvester wouldn't you agree that a machine like that belongs on a huge farm in it's own shed and not in rural places unprotected? They need huge ricefields so the machine can do what it's good at all day long. Only that way a harvester is helping reducing produce prices.

On internet are nice video's about growing pistachenuts in california on huge scale..That's what the Thai need, automated farms and high volumes.

Actually Dole has a Thai partner. CP is all thai owned and very large company. Sure the best is to have a large plantation for the harvester, but Thailand has all these small farms so they do what they need to do. I haven't done any banana plants in Thailand so dont know.

fruitman · June 3, 2017

2 minutes ago, ericthai said:

Actually Dole has a Thai partner. CP is all thai owned and very large company. Sure the best is to have a large plantation for the harvester, but Thailand has all these small farms so they do what they need to do. I haven't done any banana plants in Thailand so dont know.

Well what i see in BKK is that many people grow banana's in their yards, they even have small plantations..But it's much work to grow banana's that way, they do it all by hand even the watering.

They also sell the banana's themselves on the markets to get max profit i guess. So they have to drive there by car and be busy with a few bunches of banana's. That makes it all expensive.

The video about the bananafarm is something the Thai farmers will probably never see on their cellphones at home. But they can learn a lot from it. I guess there will be similar movies for mangofarms and so. Would be great if we could buy fresh mangojuice in BKK.

jcsmith · June 3, 2017

40 minutes ago, manarak said:

interesting points.

I feel that replacing people with machines is a consequence of socialism blowing up labor costs.

what opportunities will there be for self-driving taxis in Bangkok?

In Zurich of course, 20 minutes taxi will set you back 70 USD... a case for automated taxis right there, but not where taxi driving is paid what it's worth.

then making the point of diagnosis of problems - look at current PCs.

they are a clearly delimited system, yet software is unable to diagnose all but the simplest problems.

why don't we have alerts for RAM misreads, unacceptable core voltages, driver incompatibilities...

AI is all software. get the AI to be able to write complex software, and then I will say, ok, the next age has arrived.

It's definitely a fun discussion.

Bangkok is probably a ways off from like self-driving vehicles imo simply because of lower prices of taxis in compared to the west, and higher prices of the vehicles. But eventually that would become cost-effective. I think that's really the limiter on a lot of this stuff, being cost-effective. In America the last numbers I read had more than 1% of jobs being driving jobs (truckers, taxi drivers, couriers, bus drivers, etc).

When it's cheaper to replace people with machines, companies will do it. But it will reach that point at different stages in different locations and fields.

I think we're a long way from real self-programming code. But I'm impressed with the ability of machine learning to master video games for example (my field), AlphaGo, etc. As an amateur poker player I'm also really interesting to know that limit holdem has already been mastered my machines, and to read some of the approaches that the software developed which are completely outside of the box in modern poker tactics, yet extremely effective. Many poker players make the bulk of their money online these days, but as bots become stronger, it's going to destroy that industry. Moving ahead to the future, when BCIs or optical implants become viable you would likewise have similar issues in live poker. As medical technology improves sports are going to deal with these issues, as well.

Change is jarring but inevitable. There's of course a lot of good things that can come out of this all, as well.

ericthai · June 3, 2017

4 minutes ago, fruitman said:

Well what i see in BKK is that many people grow banana's in their yards, they even have small plantations..But it's much work to grow banana's that way, they do it all by hand even the watering.

They also sell the banana's themselves on the markets to get max profit i guess. So they have to drive there by car and be busy with a few bunches of banana's. That makes it all expensive.

The video about the bananafarm is something the Thai farmers will probably never see on their cellphones at home. But they can learn a lot from it. I guess there will be similar movies for mangofarms and so. Would be great if we could buy fresh mangojuice in BKK.

There are many different types if banana's in Thailand. You will find allot of people just growing and selling to make a living or extra money. My wife planted banana trees a few years ago and sells some and lets people take what they want. To her it's extra baht. Dont know why you cant find mango juice in BKK. fresh fruits are shipped to BKK everyday.

Johpa · June 3, 2017

GPU provides graphic images in high quality, what will that change the agriculture business? I don't get it.

That is my point, people don't understand what is happening. GPUs are no longer about projecting images for gaming but about perceiving images. It has progressed well beyond identifying cats. The shift in focus from CPUs to GPUs marks the next quantum revolution in technology.

fruitman · June 3, 2017

20 minutes ago, ericthai said:

There are many different types if banana's in Thailand. You will find allot of people just growing and selling to make a living or extra money. My wife planted banana trees a few years ago and sells some and lets people take what they want. To her it's extra baht. Dont know why you cant find mango juice in BKK. fresh fruits are shipped to BKK everyday.

For mangojuice you need juicemango's and a juicemaker. I've never seen fresh mangojuice in BKK and i'm sure the quality tourists would love to try it. Thailand could be the hub of mango's and if they use automated farms it might give a good profit. But it has to be on large scale to keep costprice down.

I know a lot about automation and electronics and have tried to buy parts in BKK which is very hard and almost impossible to do.

Chinatown is the place to be and you hardly could walk around there and sure not use transport fast.

Add to that nobody in the electronicshops can speak a word english, shows a retailprice or has a real shop and the chaos is complete.

Then there's also a lot of fake and copycopy hardware and tools, importtax on qualitytools so that all works against the speed of automation in Thailand.

Compare that to the electronics-neighbourhood from Tokyo (akihabara) and Thailand is lightyears behind in technology/development.

oldcarguy · June 3, 2017

I am sure there are lesson plans to teach kids to use 3D printers etc , I have just not found them yet,

And as we know ,, the problem with Google and YouTube is OVERLOAD , there is so much content , much of it in so-so quality that is is better to ask the "group" which are the good ones ,

Maybe there is a group for Teachers who are helping kids learn this type of stuff ,

Anyone go to the Robot restaurant in BKK ? thats what we need more of..........overweight Robots :)

fruitman · June 3, 2017

6 minutes ago, oldcarguy said:

I am sure there are lesson plans to teach kids to use 3D printers etc , I have just not found them yet,

And as we know ,, the problem with Google and YouTube is OVERLOAD , there is so much content , much of it in so-so quality that is is better to ask the "group" which are the good ones ,

Maybe there is a group for Teachers who are helping kids learn this type of stuff ,

Anyone go to the Robot restaurant in BKK ? thats what we need more of..........overweight Robots :)

BKK has japanese robotrestaurants where the robot drives to your table instead of a waiter.

Yes i also would like to know which trainingvideo's are the best but in the meantime i just search them myself. Having a fast internetconnection helps a lot.

I would also love to hear where i can buy what i need in BKK but i gave up on that already. I'm tired of searching in chinatown. The place needs a good skytrain/subway connection.

But to build a 3dprinter like this should be do-able for you i guess, loads of people already did it. CNC-machine is almost the same and G-code you can learn in some hours. It's just a code which commands the motor to run and for how long.

You can buy this stuff in Chinatown but for double/triple prices of banggood.com so i saved you a lot of money today.

oldcarguy · June 3, 2017

there are more electronic places over by the India area , there really needs to be an English speaking "Guide" for these areas ,

Maybe Google translate will be good enough in a few years :)

I would just buy a cheap 3 D printer to learn on , and then a 3D router / Mill ,

for the Kid it will hopefully give his brain a work-out trying to figure how to make things , connect one part to another and just be mechanical and know how to work out a problem.......it has done me well thru the years !

This is the problem for Thailand and really many other places ,

Kids that are interested in this stuff have no place to learn it , most cannot afford a 3D printer , in the USA there are "summer camps" that teach this stuff ,

probably have the same stuff in Europe.

anyway I will smile at the first thing I make that comes out how I hoped !

fruitman · June 3, 2017

1 hour ago, Johpa said:

That is my point, people don't understand what is happening. GPUs are no longer about projecting images for gaming but about perceiving images. It has progressed well beyond identifying cats. The shift in focus from CPUs to GPUs marks the next quantum revolution in technology.

So if i want to connect a hi-tech 3d camera (with face recognition and all) to my computer do i need a computer with a nvidia graphicscard with it's own ddr5 memory? Something like a nvidia 1050ti with 4gb ram?

Does my computer use the gpu to build up it's 3d image? I didn't/don't know that. I thought the gpu is only to project the 3d image on the screen. To perceive 3d images one needs a 3d camera i though/assume.

I know gpu for computers are getting hot items but it's mainly for gamecomputers or cadcam-developers.

I do have a 3d camera here but no computer to connect it to (it has to be superfast) so i'm asking this to learn which new laptop i should buy. A good gpu won't hurt anyway but i still wonder if i need it to run the 3d camera...i need a usb 3.1 gen2 port, very fast intel processor and loads of ram that's all i know. They didn't mention the gpu to be important for the camera to work well.

manarak · June 3, 2017

4 hours ago, jcsmith said:

I think we're a long way from real self-programming code. But I'm impressed with the ability of machine learning to master video games for example (my field), AlphaGo, etc. As an amateur poker player I'm also really interesting to know that limit holdem has already been mastered my machines, and to read some of the approaches that the software developed which are completely outside of the box in modern poker tactics, yet extremely effective. Many poker players make the bulk of their money online these days, but as bots become stronger, it's going to destroy that industry. Moving ahead to the future, when BCIs or optical implants become viable you would likewise have similar issues in live poker. As medical technology improves sports are going to deal with these issues, as well.

well, regarding games, these machines aren't intelligent. you could argue that they learn, yes, they memorize and apply the moves that have the best statistical chance of winning.

calculating the best move from all possible moves - regardless of the tactics used - is not what I call intelligence and certainly not artificial intelligence.

manarak · June 3, 2017

2 hours ago, oldcarguy said:

there are more electronic places over by the India area , there really needs to be an English speaking "Guide" for these areas ,

Maybe Google translate will be good enough in a few years :)

I would just buy a cheap 3 D printer to learn on , and then a 3D router / Mill ,

for the Kid it will hopefully give his brain a work-out trying to figure how to make things , connect one part to another and just be mechanical and know how to work out a problem.......it has done me well thru the years !

This is the problem for Thailand and really many other places ,

Kids that are interested in this stuff have no place to learn it , most cannot afford a 3D printer , in the USA there are "summer camps" that teach this stuff ,

probably have the same stuff in Europe.

anyway I will smile at the first thing I make that comes out how I hoped !

there is this hype about 3D printing.

3D printing is little more than children's plasticine formed by robot hands - well, the material used is a bit more resilient than plasticine, but not much.

the key in producing stuff are the materials. if you want a knife, you need high grade stainless steel and a "printer" capable of working with it... we are back at the good old metallurgy machines.

of course you could also "print" a knife made of plasticine. won't be of much use though.

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