Thais get 75% of rail deal

[webfact]

Thais get 75% of rail deal
By PRATCH RUJIVANAROM,
WASAMON AUDJARINT
THE NATION

 

 

Bt134 billion of civil work on high-speed line to go to local contractors

 

BANGKOK: -- TECHNOLOGY transfer will be included in all three contracts for construction of the Bt179.4 billion Thai-Chinese high-speed train project, Transport Minister Arkhom Termpitayapaisit said.

 

After a teleconference with Chinese counterparts on Monday, he said Thai professionals would benefit from the transfer of technical know-how on designing, civil |construction, track, electrical, mechanical and other work.

 

In addition, he said that more than 100 Thai engineers would take part in the construction of the project, to ease concerns after a sweeping Article 44 order was issued by Prime Minister Gen Prayut Chan-o-cha to “facilitate” Chinese personnel to work in Thailand.

 

Among the exemptions, Chinese engineers and architects would not have to obtain engineering licences issued by the Thai councils.

 

Government spokesman Sansern Kaewkamnerd said the Engineering Council of Thailand would provide training and tests to ensure that Chinese counterparts follow domestic laws when working on the project.

 

The government also promised the council that around 10 types of local materials would be used in the construction, with the exception of some parts that would need “advanced technology” from China, the spokesman said.

 

Of the total Bt179 billion cost, about Bt44 billion – 25 per cent of the whole budget – would be given to China. The remaining 75 per cent of the budget would be offered to Thai contractors.

 

“There would be no median price because the railway is going to ultimately link with China. We can’t approach other countries like Japan, [South] Korea or the Europeans to have their participation,” he said.

 

“The PM wishes that Thais should have rounded consideration. If we make agreements with anyone and we care only about our own benefits, who on earth would want to cooperate with us?” he said.

 

The project should be viewed for its economic benefits as the high-speed train could help distribute prosperity, he said.

 

The same reason was cited by Prayut, who urged people to “make a difference for the future” instead of criticising the project.

 

“You shouldn’t just look at [physical] gains like how many passengers will get on the trains. But we have to think about economic benefits in the local area,” the premier said.

 

Prayut said the Article 44 order had been “tailored” to solve specific problems and other parts of the project would still be subject to a regular bidding process.

 

“We are going ahead with this project for national, not personal, benefits,” he said.

 

Meanwhile, Faculty of Engineering King Mongkut’s Institute of Technology Lat Krabang dean Komsan Maleesee said that the government should include technology transfer as a condition in the contract to let Thai engineers learn high-speed train technology from China.

 

“I do not agree with the idea to let the Chinese experts work on this project alone without Thai involvement, because we will not get the high-speed train technology from China. 

 

“I suggest there should be laboratories for project designing and the development in Thailand in partnership with Thai universities in order to encourage knowledge sharing between Chinese experts and |Thai academics,” Komsan said.

 

He said universities and academics here already had a firm fundamental engineering knowledge, and were ready to learn more. And a partnership with universities would allow academics to spread the knowledge to the next generation and boost the country’s technology advancement.

 

“This is better than letting a private company work in partnership with the Chinese, as we have learned lessons from the past that we often failed to absorb new technologies from foreign investors. For instance, we let the Japanese firms set up the automobile industry in Thailand for a long time, but now we are still not able to build our own cars.”

 

Komsan said the government should also spell out in the deal how much Thai materials should be used, to boost local firms’ abilities.

 

However, Mana Nimitmongkol, head of the Anti-Corruption Organisation of Thailand, expressed concern that the exemption of laws on NCPO order 30/2560 to rush the project may open loopholes for corruption.

 

“The laws that have been waived in the NCPO order include the Concerning Offences Relating to the Submission of Bids to Government Agencies Act, which we use as the legal tool to punish wrongdoers in government agencies,” Mana said. 

 

“This law does not have any impact on the progress of the project. It will only apply, if there is graft in the governmental project bidding, so waiving this law shows the intention to get rid of the tool to prevent and punish corruption on this project.”

 

Source: http://www.nationmultimedia.com/news/business/30318643

 

-- © Copyright The Nation 2017-06-21

[Bluespunk]

Hope the long spoons are being polished up. 

[steven100]

Khun Prayuth Chan O Cha secured 75% of the project cost for Thailand contractors.

This government continues to push for economic sustainability with evidence such as this. Many other project also initiated for the Thai economy are ongoing and forecast for the 2017-18.

Khun Prayuth Chan O Cha is doing a good job to bring stability and security to thailand following years of insecurity and anarchy by the previous PM's.

Khun Prayuth Chan O Cha

Edited June 20, 2017 by steven100

[canuckamuck]

What could go wrong?

[wakeupplease]

is that 75% of 33% probably

 

[bartender100]

Maybe they should be looking at the future of transport,  HYPERLOOP, i believe it will happen

 

 

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Hyperloop

 

https://www.theguardian.com/technology/2016/may/11/hyperloop-supersonic-train-test-propulsion-system

[Dobredin Ghusputin]

1 hour ago, webfact said:

100 Thai engineers

That takes care of one light bulb.

 

 

[Dobredin Ghusputin]

1 hour ago, webfact said:

10 types of local materials

 

That's the recipe for somtam.

[leeneeds]

179 + sub  + amour cars= a lot of stored rice , 

 

so much unnecessary wastage , Korat has a good airport but very rare any flights go from there to Bangkok,

it costs an average 230 baht one way via bus from Korat to Bkk, what price will the tickets be for the train, 

at least  600 baht ( my opinion ) , many will give the service a miss, options of travel will keep seats empty,

 

 

 

 

 

[terminatorchiangmai]

100 Thai engineers to do a one mans job ?

 

The government also promised the council that around 10 types of local materials would be used in the construction, with the exception of some parts that would need “advanced technology” from China, 

 

Please use advanced technology everywhere !!

[SABloke]

So 75% of the construction budget goes to Thais, but I want to know how much of the profits they will get after the lines open for business? 

[mtls2005]

The PM is "demanding" that the public support "his" rail deal.

 

If an "elected" red-shirt government tried to do ~ 5% of what the Junta has done, the yellows would 'hand-clappered' themselves silly by now.

 

 

[Familyaffairs]

Exemptions only for Chinese ? No open bids called for ? This violates WTO rules, and could/should lead to Thailand losing WTO and MFN status.

Edited June 21, 2017 by Familyaffairs
Typo

[Srikcir]

9 hours ago, webfact said:

TECHNOLOGY transfer will be included in all three contracts for construction of the Bt179.4 billion Thai-Chinese high-speed train project

That could make the overall project profitable if Thailand is able to duplicate this rail technology elsewhere in Thailand and the rest of the world - unless Prayut agreed to a noncompete agreement not to go international to market the rail system, ie., in competition with the Chinese. If the latter applied, overall profitability might be very limited - perhaps intentionally.

9 hours ago, webfact said:

We can’t approach other countries like Japan, [South] Korea or the Europeans to have their participation,”

Didn't stop Thailand from soliciting those countries to participate in other rail and port developments within Thailand. I suspect this was a limitation imposed by the Chinese in exchange for the 75% of the budget would be offered to Thai contractors.

9 hours ago, webfact said:

If we make agreements with anyone and we care only about our own benefits, who on earth would want to cooperate with us?”

The Chinese don't seem to have a problem with this philosophy.

9 hours ago, webfact said:

Mana Nimitmongkol, head of the Anti-Corruption Organisation of Thailand, expressed concern that the exemption of laws on NCPO order 30/2560 to rush the project may open loopholes for corruption.

Who would have thought? But then here's the explanation:

9 hours ago, webfact said:

“This is better than letting a private company work in partnership with the Chinese, as we have learned lessons from the past

Such as, government-to-government agreements gives only the government access to the "wishing well."

[Redline]

I assume all of this will be a transparent process so all of this can be tracked.  Discount on future arms deals are in order.  Thai people will not be able to afford the train anyway

[Retiredandhappyhere]

On 6/21/2017 at 5:45 AM, steven100 said:

Khun Prayuth Chan O Cha secured 75% of the project cost for Thailand contractors.

This government continues to push for economic sustainability with evidence such as this. Many other project also initiated for the Thai economy are ongoing and forecast for the 2017-18.

Khun Prayuth Chan O Cha is doing a good job to bring stability and security to thailand following years of insecurity and anarchy by the previous PM's.

Khun Prayuth Chan O Cha

7

Sorry, but I saw no "evidence", only a lot of words, as usual.  

 

Still, it was good to hear that the project was going ahead for NATIONAL and NOT PERSONAL reasons.  Just the same as the tank, personnel carrier and submarine orders then?

[YetAnother]

On 6/21/2017 at 4:47 AM, webfact said:

he said Thai professionals would benefit from the transfer of technical know-how on designing, civil |construction, track, electrical, mechanical and other work.

sounds like trial and error to me; no existing expertise

[Trumpish]

Well maybe. Giver the Thai predilection for corruption and incompetence, I'll wait with mounting glee as this unfolds. Like I said to another poster recently. I'll meet you in 5 years and we can look back on what we are looking forward to at the moment. I wonder who'll be laughing...

 

Maybe I'm wrong to see this as a defining issue for Thailand. Maybe I'm wrong to think they'll balls it up like they balls most things up. Maybe the junta-huggers (as I have seen them described) will queue up to attack my lack of confidence in their herose. I guess time will tell if I'm right or wrong. 

 

He who laughs last, laughs best, and I'm chucking and shaking my head already because it seems they can't even get the damn thing started properly. Getting it finished will be a whole other thing. Passenger demand? Bangkok to Nakhon Ratchasima. That's only start the day the sea starts lapping at their doors.

Edited June 22, 2017 by Trumpish

[Cadbury]

On ‎21‎/‎06‎/‎2017 at 5:45 AM, steven100 said:

Khun Prayuth Chan O Cha secured 75% of the project cost for Thailand contractors.

This government continues to push for economic sustainability with evidence such as this. Many other project also initiated for the Thai economy are ongoing and forecast for the 2017-18.

Khun Prayuth Chan O Cha is doing a good job to bring stability and security to thailand following years of insecurity and anarchy by the previous PM's.

Khun Prayuth Chan O Cha

Tugging the forelock to the Almighty again Steven. Can't help yourself it seems.

When all else fails there is always delusion. 

 

[Trumpish]

1 hour ago, Retiredandhappyhere said:

Sorry, but I saw no "evidence", only a lot of words, as usual.  

 

Still, it was good to hear that the project was going ahead for NATIONAL and NOT PERSONAL reasons.  Just the same as the tank, personnel carrier and submarine orders then?

It's his best bet at leaving a legacy that people won't laugh at. Of course he wants to force it through. No experience in HSR? No matter, Thais are honest, industrious and quick to learn. So why did China want to hire Chinese only?

Edited June 22, 2017 by Trumpish

[Cadbury]

On ‎21‎/‎06‎/‎2017 at 6:18 AM, wakeupplease said:

is that 75% of 33% probably

 

No! 75% of SFA more likely.

[Trumpish]

15 minutes ago, Cadbury said:

No! 75% of SFA more likely.

Less the RTA cut. Fees and the like...

[Cadbury]

12 minutes ago, Trumpish said:

Less the RTA cut. Fees and the like...

I love the optimistic term "negative profit".

[Trumpish]

1 minute ago, Cadbury said:

I love the optimistic term "negative profit".

<sigh> yup.

[steven100]

8 hours ago, Cadbury said:

Tugging the forelock to the Almighty again Steven. Can't help yourself it seems.

When all else fails there is always delusion. 

 

It appears it doesn't matter what this government achieves ....   you just want to whinge.

Why not try to enjoy life ... 

Sad that every day is met with bitterness ....  why live here ...

Edited June 22, 2017 by steven100

[Cadbury]

42 minutes ago, steven100 said:

It appears it doesn't matter what this government achieves ....   you just want to whinge.

Why not try to enjoy life ... 

Sad that every day is met with bitterness ....  why live here ...

I do enjoy life and living here Steven, much to your dismay it seems.

One of the things I do enjoy is responding to those junta huggers such as yourself with their pompous anti-democracy, pro-military opinions.

I would not describe it as whinging; more like expressing my own opinion (if I may be allowed to have one contrary to your own) about the way the country is being run by an all knowing pro-censorship jackboot military regime with a pretentious leader who has worrying priorities like an unhealthy interest in salacious female singers. 

So it seems in your own quaint selfish way I should agree with you in everything you say or leave. I think that says a lot about the sort of person you are. I pity those around you.

 

 

[mtls2005]

How much will the Junta get? 15%?

[tomacht8]

 

Their own transport experts warn against this project.

And why this hurry with paragraph 44?

This is not a threat to national security.

There are already many transport possibilities between nakhorn and bkk.

[tomacht8]

3 hours ago, steven100 said:

It appears it doesn't matter what this government achieves ....   you just want to whinge.

Why not try to enjoy life ... 

Sad that every day is met with bitterness ....  why live here ...

Why do you prescribe others bitterness? Have you ever come to the idea that others pay taxes here, work here, raise children here and have thai families? 

And do you think that people who ask public spending money love less thailand than uncritical yes sayers?