Mandatory to use agents for customs clearance of mail parcels?

[melvinmelvin]

On the 28th/29th of July a parcel sent from UK arrived in Thailand.

It was sent through Royal Mail, now ParcelForce, as air mail express parcel.

For several days the tracking information showed: Arrived - delivery delayed.

 

2 days ago contact was made by FedEx, enquiring about copies of passports etc in order to do the clearance of the parcel.

 

Apparently the parcel has been taken aside for scrutiny and clearance, which is OK.

 

The parcel was addressed to a friend in central BKK, (soi 13 Sukhumvit).

It weighs about 3 or 3.5 kg. The value of the content is 862 pounds.

The content is spare parts for repairing a Toyota engine, a boat engine, which is duty free in Thailand.

(but of course subject to VAT)

 

It is unclear to me how FedEx got whiff of this parcel. It is unclear how they got involved and got hold of the relevant papers for this shipment.

 

Has anybody experienced anything similar?

I would have thought VAT was to be paid at the local post office and not to some Customs Office at Swampy.

 

Is it required that a clearing agent be used for getting parcels through customs?

 

 

[Gulfsailor]

As far as I know outboard engine as well as most parts have a 10% duty rate. (Hs code 8408 / 8409)

I don't know Royal Mail express, but some foreign mail companies use FedEx or similar couriers for time sensitive express services. 

In that case your shipment will need a customs agent to clear the shipment. This can be fedEx themselves or you can hire a third party agent to take care of it. Please be aware that there will also be some fees for the clearance itself. 

[robblok]

If it was send by Royal Mail its strange that fed ex got hold of it. I wonder why no explanation myself.

 

But this is an expensive parcel, so its normal for it to be taken apart if they are not sure about the value. Usually stuff like this goes to Lak Si where you can debate about the tax if its not clear. 

 

It either goes there or straight to the post office where you then have to pay the tax. 

[melvinmelvin]

35 minutes ago, robblok said:

If it was send by Royal Mail its strange that fed ex got hold of it. I wonder why no explanation myself.

 

But this is an expensive parcel, so its normal for it to be taken apart if they are not sure about the value. Usually stuff like this goes to Lak Si where you can debate about the tax if its not clear. 

 

It either goes there or straight to the post office where you then have to pay the tax. 

 

Lak Si would have been brilliant. Not far from where I stay.

(I don't know positively that the parcel is at Swampy. The FedEx office that made contact has address at Swampy.)

 

 

To the comment above yours:

I doubt VERY much that UK Royal Mail/ParcelForce is engaging with any courier service in order to deliver

an ordinary air mail parcel to Thailand, (I have reeled off an email to them asking about it).

(it is my experience and my friends experiences that parts for engines in boats are duty free,

 it is also documented here on Thaivisa, somewhere, that actually the whole engine is duty free,

 so is the boat itself)

 

 

[robblok]

3 minutes ago, melvinmelvin said:

 

Lak Si would have been brilliant. Not far from where I stay.

(I don't know positively that the parcel is at Swampy. The FedEx office that made contact has address at Swampy.)

 

 

To the comment above yours:

I doubt VERY much that UK Royal Mail/ParcelForce is engaging with any courier service in order to deliver

an ordinary air mail parcel to Thailand, (I have reeled off an email to them asking about it).

(it is my experience and my friends experiences that parts for engines in boats are duty free,

 it is also documented here on Thaivisa, somewhere, that actually the whole engine is duty free,

 so is the boat itself)

 

 

I would look at what gulf sailer is saying about the 10% and he even has the tax codes, so be prepared to pay. Just look them up

 

http://igtf.customs.go.th/igtf/en/main_frame.jsp?lang=en&left_menu=menu_integrated_tariff_search

 

I see around 8408 and 8409 a duty of 30% for engines. So I don't know where you got your information.

 

It could get expensive 30% + 7% vat.

[melvinmelvin]

11 minutes ago, robblok said:

I would look at what gulf sailer is saying about the 10% and he even has the tax codes, so be prepared to pay. Just look them up

 

http://igtf.customs.go.th/igtf/en/main_frame.jsp?lang=en&left_menu=menu_integrated_tariff_search

 

I see around 8408 and 8409 a duty of 30% for engines. So I don't know where you got your information.

 

It could get expensive 30% + 7% vat.

yes, car engines = 30%

2nd hand engines for boats = 0%

2nd hand boats = 0%

engine parts (new or old) for boats = 0%

 

(not the first time I'm bringing engine stuff into Thailand, I have the info from the CustomsDept)

 

there is info re this here on TV, but I find it very difficult to search for old info here.

 

not worried about the 10%, I am more worried about not having the situation under control,

 

FedEx has, today, requested an awfull lot of documentation from me re clearance, 4 signed copies of this and that,

my signature on 10-15 pages of documents (all in Thai - which I don't read)

as well as my original passport

all sent by EMS to their office at Swampy

 

[robblok]

The stuff i showed was for boat engines not sure if there is a difference for new and secondhand. But if there is then that would explain it. 

[melvinmelvin]

1 hour ago, robblok said:

The stuff i showed was for boat engines not sure if there is a difference for new and secondhand. But if there is then that would explain it. 

 

Thanks for that. This seems to be specific to outboards, (and 30% - not 10% as said above),

(mine is not outboard and its way way above 30 hp).

 

I have asked Customs in ChonBuri about such imports, have also asked Customs in Klong Toey/Taa Ruua

and also Customs at Swampy. All three concluded 0%, but that doesn't guarantee its right.

 

(reluctant to EMS my passport to FedEX, now, might take time to get it back,

 normally I don't really mind losing a passport, easy and cheap to get a new one for me,

 but my extension of stay is due for renewal in a couple of weeks time, so I don't need passport problems now)

 

Guess step one would be to get clarification from ParcelForce re FedEx having a role or not.

Then, get a shipper I know of to take this on.

 

[Gulfsailor]

3 hours ago, robblok said:

The stuff i showed was for boat engines not sure if there is a difference for new and secondhand. But if there is then that would explain it. 

 

4 hours ago, robblok said:

I would look at what gulf sailer is saying about the 10% and he even has the tax codes, so be prepared to pay. Just look them up

 

http://igtf.customs.go.th/igtf/en/main_frame.jsp?lang=en&left_menu=menu_integrated_tariff_search

 

I see around 8408 and 8409 a duty of 30% for engines. So I don't know where you got your information.

 

It could get expensive 30% + 7% vat.

30% is the ceiling rate. The actual current rate per notification is 10%. You can check that by clicking show all preferences. Then you can also see that certain origins have 0% duty under FTA's, but you do need the correct paperwork to take advantage of it. 

[melvinmelvin]

8 hours ago, Gulfsailor said:

 

30% is the ceiling rate. The actual current rate per notification is 10%. You can check that by clicking show all preferences. Then you can also see that certain origins have 0% duty under FTA's, but you do need the correct paperwork to take advantage of it. 

Thanks a lot for shedding light on this.

 

Origin? Does that mean country of production/manufacture? Or where it is sent from?

 

You seem to be good at this, I am not.

 

May I ask your best bet regarding a couple of things;

 

THIS PARCEL:

the content is spare parts (bought in UK) for a Toyota engine. everything would be wrapped in Toyota plastic bags

with Toyota spare part numbers printed on them.

The engine itself was imported 2nd hand from Japan and sold to me here in Thailand. (Have receipt.)

The engine is installed in my boat. I have Tabien Ruua in my name verifying that.

(this engine is on the aftermarket market in Thailand, plenty of them, but spare parts are fewer and further between)

 

As to duty: Would your best guess be 10% or zilch?

 

FUTURE ENGINE:

I am pretty keen on getting hold of a different Toyota engine for the boat.

My intention would be to import it 2nd hand from the US. If I could get a good grip of the Customs / fee side of such.

(this engine is on the market all over the world, except Thailand)

 

What would your best guess be re duty on this one?

 

(of course, Toyota engines are car engines. my Tabien Ruua documents that the engine is in my boat.

 regarding an import from US - of course I cannot prove that it will go straight into my boat)

 

(would survive 30%, 2nd hand ordinary engines are dead cheap in the US)

 

[Gulfsailor]

4 hours ago, melvinmelvin said:

Thanks a lot for shedding light on this.

 

Origin? Does that mean country of production/manufacture? Or where it is sent from?

 

You seem to be good at this, I am not.

 

May I ask your best bet regarding a couple of things;

 

THIS PARCEL:

the content is spare parts (bought in UK) for a Toyota engine. everything would be wrapped in Toyota plastic bags

with Toyota spare part numbers printed on them.

The engine itself was imported 2nd hand from Japan and sold to me here in Thailand. (Have receipt.)

The engine is installed in my boat. I have Tabien Ruua in my name verifying that.

(this engine is on the aftermarket market in Thailand, plenty of them, but spare parts are fewer and further between)

 

As to duty: Would your best guess be 10% or zilch?

 

FUTURE ENGINE:

I am pretty keen on getting hold of a different Toyota engine for the boat.

My intention would be to import it 2nd hand from the US. If I could get a good grip of the Customs / fee side of such.

(this engine is on the market all over the world, except Thailand)

 

What would your best guess be re duty on this one?

 

(of course, Toyota engines are car engines. my Tabien Ruua documents that the engine is in my boat.

 regarding an import from US - of course I cannot prove that it will go straight into my boat)

 

(would survive 30%, 2nd hand ordinary engines are dead cheap in the US)

 

Origin is where it was (mostly) manufactured. But you need to be able to proof this via certified documents. A normal foreign seller will not be able to help you with that. 

In regards to the duty that will be charged I suggest a visit to customs and ask. They are generally helpful. You can prepare by browsing through the hs codes and see which codes are most applicable. 

Please be aware that duties will be assessed on the value of the goods plus shipping and insurance. Value is not necessarily the price you paid for it abroad. Customs is free to use a different amount, based on the value of the comparable goods in Thailand if these are available. 

 Example:

- used engine in Thailand; 100,000 Baht

- used engine abroad plus shipping; 20,000 Baht 

at 10% duty rate you'd expect to pay 2000 Baht duty and furthermore 1540 Baht VAT, bringing the total cost to 23,540. However if the customs officer is aware that actual value of such motor is much higher in Thailand he may do the following;

Salesprice in Thailand ex Vat; 93,460 Baht. 

Normal importer margin of 30% assumed means imported cost is 71,900 Baht. Take out the 10% duty and you are left with a pre import value of 65,400 Baht. This will be the amount customs can use to asses your duties and VAT. So be warned that buying it cheap abroad and/or having a very low invoice value does not mean customs has to use that figure!

 

 

 

[melvinmelvin]

Right, thanks again.

 

Yes, probably a visit to the Customs Dept would be a good idea.

(whatever comes out of such a visit doesn't prevent the officer doing the clearance in the future would have the same ideas though, but mai pen rai - life is full of dangers)

 

I assume that Toyota would speak Japan by itself and would not need further documentation.

I never try cheating with low invoices..

 

The reason for buying abroad is that that particular Toyota engine is not available in Thailand, (strangely enough,

it is quite a remarkable power pack).

And it is cheaper to import from US than from Japan, Singapore, Hong Kong, Australia, NZ etc.

The 2nd hand engine market in the US is huge.

(we're talking of a bit less than 2000 USD delivered CIF Bangkok, if the engine was at the scrapyard market in Thailand it would cost a bit more I think, I'd guess about 25%)

 

Anyway, thanks again.

 

 

[Gulfsailor]

37 minutes ago, melvinmelvin said:

 

I assume that Toyota would speak Japan by itself and would not need further documentation.

 

 

 

That's an incorrect assumption. You need the correct documents to proof the origin, along with certain paperwork through which you request import under an FTA. 

 

Please also be advised that there are severe restrictions on importing used car parts. So when importing the engine make sure that the invoice and associated docs state it is a boat engine.

[melvinmelvin]

Yes thanks, I was aware of that last bit.

 

(guess I just forget about the origin though, prove that Toyota is Japanese?,

 it will have Toyota written all over it, several places)

 

good point about FTA, will check on that

 

[melvinmelvin]

On 5.8.2017 at 2:30 PM, Gulfsailor said:

As far as I know outboard engine as well as most parts have a 10% duty rate. (Hs code 8408 / 8409)

I don't know Royal Mail express, but some foreign mail companies use FedEx or similar couriers for time sensitive express services. 

In that case your shipment will need a customs agent to clear the shipment. This can be fedEx themselves or you can hire a third party agent to take care of it. Please be aware that there will also be some fees for the clearance itself. 

 

Yep,

you were right, I was not.

 

UK Royal Mail/now ParcelForce, uses FedEx as delivery agent in Thailand, for express packages.

Unfortunately, my parcel was sent express.

 

Been struggling with FedEx for a good week now, they think the parcel will be cleared Tuesday/Wednesday

(it arrived in Thailand on 28th of July, some express).

 

The papermill is impressive! Lots and lots of papers/copies and things to sign, typical Thai style,

thats OK, no problem, plenty of forest to produce paper from in Finland.

 

But the funny thing is, Thai Customs call this Paperless Customs Clearance. In the Customs building at the airport

there are PAPERLESS signs everywhere, amusing.

 

[Gulfsailor]

3 hours ago, melvinmelvin said:

 

Yep,

you were right, I was not.

 

UK Royal Mail/now ParcelForce, uses FedEx as delivery agent in Thailand, for express packages.

Unfortunately, my parcel was sent express.

 

Been struggling with FedEx for a good week now, they think the parcel will be cleared Tuesday/Wednesday

(it arrived in Thailand on 28th of July, some express).

 

The papermill is impressive! Lots and lots of papers/copies and things to sign, typical Thai style,

thats OK, no problem, plenty of forest to produce paper from in Finland.

 

But the funny thing is, Thai Customs call this Paperless Customs Clearance. In the Customs building at the airport

there are PAPERLESS signs everywhere, amusing.

 

Good to hear you are getting close. All the paperwork is to sign up for the paperless system. Next time should be super fast. Unless it's more than a year later, than you have to do all the paperwork again, in order to enjoy the paperless convenience.

[melvinmelvin]

Gulfsailor,

 

Higher up here you mentioned documenting the engine's country of production.

I said Toyota spek for itsef, you said no.

 

I actually checked up with Toyot Thaiand today, the engine I would like to import

from the us, Toyota 1VD, is manufactured in Argentina.

All 1VDs are manufactured in Argentina, Toyota Thailand said.

 

(so I guess, probably better to keep quiet about that)