Air pollution alert in 14 Thai provinces

[roger waters]

Kho samui? same same BKK

[Destiny1990]

They want to do something about it does it means to sue Greenprace for defamation?

[Destiny1990]

Here is an idea make a mandatory yearly inspection check for all vehicles older then 3 years.Vehicles who produce to much pollution take them out from the roads.Vehicles who dont pass the complete test need be crushed including tuktuks etc!I 

[RPCVguy]

As of June of this year, near real time for particulates has been added to the options on the Earth Nullschool website. Particulate data began being stored on the site in June 2017 .AND the interactive site allow access data back to that time
To view specific values, click on a location - anywhere in the world. I was looking at the fires in Canada - some spots hit over 6,000 on August 8th.
 

https://earth.nullschool.net/#current/particulates/surface/level/overlay=pm2.5/orthographic=-261.67,20.73,1107

Click on the word "EARTH" at the lower left to access the menu

 

Edited August 9, 2017 by RPCVguy

[jmacken306]

7 hours ago, soalbundy said:

be interesting to see how London, Paris, Berlin, or New York would rate with these tests, probably not much better, London would probably be worse.

It's much better in the USA, we don't have buildings turning black with shoot from the factories smoke stacks,  I lived in Milwaukee, we were lucky to not have over two warnings for elderly etc in a five year period. Then that was because there was no breeze, the temp was high 90's. Most big cities have different gas formulas for summer and winter, cars n trucks tested every two years, fail no license plate renewal until fixed. That's just the surface of things done.....

[Destiny1990]

6 hours ago, 4MyEgo said:

Everyone needs an air purifier, best thing I did was invest in the best one on the market, life changing, my sleep is as good as it was when I was a kid, you can notice the difference in the quality of the air, too bad I can't inject the machine directly into my body 555

Really are u convinced it improves the air quality in ur unit?even with the aircon on?which air purifier did u buy?

[mrfill]

7 hours ago, soalbundy said:

be interesting to see how London, Paris, Berlin, or New York would rate with these tests, probably not much better, London would probably be worse.

Well, why not look it up for yourself on http://aqicn.org/city/usa/newyork/

 

Currently the highest around New York is 64, London 64, Paris 62, Berlin 51

[DerekMarshall]

8 hours ago, aussie11950 said:

Thats burning rubbish that everyone does in their back yard or on the stree

 Yep and  care free burning at that too! I remember the old bint from in front of my house burning her rubbish not giving a sh*t or single thought and sending the smoke down wind and ..well smoking out our house .. little baby and all, and small children and eldrely in other nearby houses! ..quickly got the hose out! 

 

Next day? shame sh*t! 

 

made a regular habit of making sure here pile of collected rubbish was wet...depending on wind direction of course!!

(other direction nice open field) 

[MaxYakov]

Bangkok, where I live, is #4 from various sources. I've always worn a dust/fume filter mask while out on my bicycle. Bangkok has a severe case of motor vehicle disease which will not be cured any time soon and pollution from who-knows-what other sources.

 

Time, while I still have some, to either consider another country or live where there is clean air in Thailand. Is there any clean air in Thailand?

 

P.S.: This article didn't seem to draw the same high reply count as more dramatic and much less important articles. Now why would that be?

Edited August 9, 2017 by MaxYakov

[LALes]

Pattaya is not included in the findings because the list is about provinces, not cities.  See Chonburi.

[pby92]

8 hours ago, soalbundy said:

be interesting to see how London, Paris, Berlin, or New York would rate with these tests, probably not much better, London would probably be worse.

For today in Paris it's between 20 and 25 ug/m3

[MaxYakov]

47 minutes ago, Destiny1990 said:

Really are u convinced it improves the air quality in ur unit?even with the aircon on?which air purifier did u buy?

I've been filtering my room air for the last eight years in Bangkok. The filter material I have used is 3M Filtrete material which I've placed on the air conditioners or certain types of fans. I'm currently using it in the open air/bug-screened bathroom window and an evaporative cooler that's being used as a fan and they get filthy very rapidly just from natural (no powered fan) air flow in and out of that window. The evaporative cooler is used as a fan with all air passing through it being filtered. The filters in this coolers get dirty very quickly even when the room is kept completely isolated except for entry/exit.

 

I don't see how using (or not using) A/C in a room has any bearing on the air pollution other than if filtering is being used to augment the A/C's existing filtering (which is typically coarse-mesh and will not remove small particles).

 

I believe doors and open windows are the biggest source of pollution in a room. I always keep my windows and doors closed, except for the aforementioned bathroom's natural air flow (and 3M-filtered) window. I keep the bathroom door closed at all times to limit pollution. The next step would be to install air locks and purify the air in an airlock-protected room/apartment/condo. If you saw how fast and how dirty my 3M filters get dirty you would not think this is a ridiculous idea.

 

I was going to buy a room air purifier years ago, but decided not to due to the high cost. I'm reconsidering this decision.

 

[aegdawson]

I would question those numbers.

 

I was there in June with two separate sets of particle measuring equipment. The only way I could get anywhere close to the numbers mentioned in the article was by standing on Sukhumvit road at rush hour under Nana BTS station where the air doesn't circulate. 

 

While I don't doubt there are bad days the averages mentioned didn't seem achievable. 

 

There are days when the air flows from the north bringing along a fair bit of Chinese import! 

 

I suspect the burning season will also be pretty bad. I'll be back there by then. 

 

As a comparison; the outskirts of Rome Italy close to the beach have been showing approximately double the levels of particulate matter than what I registered in Bangkok. Possibly due to the many fires they've been having.

 

Perhaps WHO should look into the numbers reported in Southern Europe  which looks perticulay low in comparison to the reading I got! 

[Destiny1990]

29 minutes ago, MaxYakov said:

I've been filtering my room air for the last eight years in Bangkok. The filter material I have used is 3M Filtrete material which I've placed on the air conditioners or certain types of fans. I'm currently using it in the open air/bug-screened bathroom window and an evaporative cooler that's being used as a fan and they get filthy very rapidly just from natural (no powered fan) air flow in and out of that window. The evaporative cooler is used as a fan with all air passing through it being filtered. The filters in this coolers get dirty very quickly even when the room is kept completely isolated except for entry/exit.

 

I don't see how using (or not using) A/C in a room has any bearing on the air pollution other than if filtering is being used to augment the A/C's existing filtering (which is typically coarse-mesh and will not remove small particles).

 

I believe doors and open windows are the biggest source of pollution in a room. I always keep my windows and doors closed, except for the aforementioned bathroom's natural air flow (and 3M-filtered) window. I keep the bathroom door closed at all times to limit pollution. The next step would be to install air locks and purify the air in an airlock-protected room/apartment/condo. If you saw how fast and how dirty my 3M filters get dirty you would not think this is a ridiculous idea.

 

I was going to buy a room air purifier years ago, but decided not to due to the high cost. I'm reconsidering this decision.

 

Interesting is it with a top notch air purifier there is maybe no need to place extra filters on ur A/C Units? As the air purifier will clean all the air in the unit?

Edited August 9, 2017 by Destiny1990

[MaxYakov]

15 minutes ago, Destiny1990 said:

Interesting is it with a top notch air purifier there is maybe no need to place extra filters on ur A/C Units? As the air purifier will clean all the air in the unit?

Yes, I agree, however, one still wants to pre-filter, such as the outside air bathroom window, and keep doors and windows closed to keep as much load as possible off the air purifier. Its filters can be expensive. I know because I once bought one to put on my evaporative cooler which I converted-to and used as a fan. With the money I've spent on 3M Filtrete filter material, I could have bought a high-quality air purifier. Poor person's solution probably cost more than someone with the higher budget allocated to air purification.

 

I wear a dust/fume mask when I'm out and about, but I fear it will not stop the 2.5 micron particles. I know it's stopping stuff, though because its replaceable, three-layer filter gets dirty. These are available at Home-Pro.

 

I don't like to keep my apartment closed at all times and sometimes open it up (balcony and bathroom door) when I've judged the pollution to be at a minimum such early in the morning and when it's raining.

 

Thanks for the reply!

Edited August 9, 2017 by MaxYakov

[Destiny1990]

32 minutes ago, MaxYakov said:

Yes, I agree, however, one still wants to pre-filter, such as the outside air bathroom window, and keep doors and windows closed to keep as much load as possible off the air purifier. Its filters can be expensive. I know because I once bought one to put on my evaporative cooler which I converted-to and used as a fan. With the money I've spent on 3M Filtrete filter material, I could have bought a high-quality air purifier. Poor person's solution probably cost more than someone with the higher budget allocated to air purification.

 

I wear a dust/fume mask when I'm out and about, but I fear it will not stop the 2.5 micron particles. I know it's stopping stuff, though because its replaceable, three-layer filter gets dirty. These are available at Home-Pro.

 

I don't like to keep my apartment closed at all times and sometimes open it up (balcony and bathroom door) when I've judged the pollution to be at a minimum such early in the morning and when it's raining.

 

Thanks for the reply!

For condos i try always to select units on highest floors as it might benefits air quality. Rarely units that i rent have bathroom windows its usually always enclosed rooms with small exhaust fans for moist air. But with aircon pumping air in the unit i going to need to buy a higher power air purifier. I need research this more.

Edited August 9, 2017 by Destiny1990

[soalbundy]

2 hours ago, mrfill said:

Well, why not look it up for yourself on http://aqicn.org/city/usa/newyork/

 

Currently the highest around New York is 64, London 64, Paris 62, Berlin 51

well I don't like to pry. So farangland isn't super either although you say they are the highest numbers 

[salavan]

10 hours ago, aussie11950 said:

I think a good start would be to make any open burning illegal. 

Thats burning rubbish that everyone does in their back yard or on the street. 

Crearing land of stubble after harvesting is a big problem too. 

Make a reward available to anyone reporting field burning or a smoky truck or bus or old desiel ute. 

And enforce pollution laws. 

Every evening I smell plastic burning gives off cyanide fumes

[zzidenn]

10 hours ago, soalbundy said:

be interesting to see how London, Paris, Berlin, or New York would rate with these tests, probably not much better, London would probably be worse.

https://waqi.info/

just in case you want to check 

 

[MaxYakov]

1 hour ago, Destiny1990 said:

For condos i try always to select units on highest floors as it might benefits air quality. Rarely units that i rent have bathroom windows its usually always enclosed rooms with small exhaust fans for moist air. But with aircon pumping air in the unit i going to need to buy a higher power air purifier. I need research this more.

I don't see why you seem to think that A/C in a room somehow pollutes the room/apartment/condo air.

 

I haven't seen an A/C unit that has anything to do with outside air other than piping the refrigerant from/to the outside compressor. This is done through piping (as well as the evaporator condensate's being drained to the outside through plumbing). This plumbing is sealed from outside air (unless it's a very sloppy installation - that couldn't happen in Thailand ).

 

Can you explain your reasoning on this?

 

PS: Yeah, I don't do "condos", but there was one statement made by a TV commenter that one has to be at least at the seventh floor or above to avoid the bulk of the pollution. In Bangkok, I'd want to be a lot higher that that. I'm getting pollution on the sixth floor in the Asok area. I could be that your location in Bangkok is more important than your altitude w/r avoiding air pollution. But who knows for sure? Anyone?

Edited August 9, 2017 by MaxYakov

[Dazinoz]

1 hour ago, Destiny1990 said:

For condos i try always to select units on highest floors as it might benefits air quality. Rarely units that i rent have bathroom windows its usually always enclosed rooms with small exhaust fans for moist air. But with aircon pumping air in the unit i going to need to buy a higher power air purifier. I need research this more.

 

If it is split system AC, i.e. outdoor unit and indoor unit, there is no connection between the outside air and inside air. The separate units are only circulating the respective are.

 

If it is older window or wall mounted unit where it is one complete unit then there was a lever to allow outside air to come inside. Haven't seen these sold in a long time.

[Destiny1990]

3 hours ago, MaxYakov said:

I don't see why you seem to think that A/C in a room somehow pollutes the room/apartment/condo air.

 

I haven't seen an A/C unit that has anything to do with outside air other than piping the refrigerant from/to the outside compressor. This is done through piping (as well as the evaporator condensate's being drained to the outside through plumbing). This plumbing is sealed from outside air (unless it's a very sloppy installation - that couldn't happen in Thailand ).

 

Can you explain your reasoning on this?

 

PS: Yeah, I don't do "condos", but there was one statement made by a TV commenter that one has to be at least at the seventh floor or above to avoid the bulk of the pollution. In Bangkok, I'd want to be a lot higher that that. I'm getting pollution on the sixth floor in the Asok area. I could be that your location in Bangkok is more important than your altitude w/r avoiding air pollution. But who knows for sure? Anyone?

Hmm i not so technical and u r correct however i feel that when u a/c unit is always on like mine usually is that in such case u need a stronger air purifier then if the aircon is never on in the same room is it? I have lived in Asoke but now live in Jomtien 34 th floor.Again i need study it more before i will purchase an air purifier but it looks like a good investment.

[Khun Jean]

edit: someone already posted the link before. :)

 

I escaped the bad air in Bangkok. I am now living in Prachuap city and the difference is remarkable.

 

 

Edited August 9, 2017 by Khun Jean

[Destiny1990]

6 hours ago, MaxYakov said:

I don't see why you seem to think that A/C in a room somehow pollutes the room/apartment/condo air.

 

I haven't seen an A/C unit that has anything to do with outside air other than piping the refrigerant from/to the outside compressor. This is done through piping (as well as the evaporator condensate's being drained to the outside through plumbing). This plumbing is sealed from outside air (unless it's a very sloppy installation - that couldn't happen in Thailand ).

 

Can you explain your reasoning on this?

 

PS: Yeah, I don't do "condos", but there was one statement made by a TV commenter that one has to be at least at the seventh floor or above to avoid the bulk of the pollution. In Bangkok, I'd want to be a lot higher that that. I'm getting pollution on the sixth floor in the Asok area. I could be that your location in Bangkok is more important than your altitude w/r avoiding air pollution. But who knows for sure? Anyone?

Hi Max,

some guy said if u regularly change ur aircon filters at ur condo then the inside air quality of the unit is fine.Just only the air when u go outside is bad in most asian urban inner cities..

[MaxYakov]

2 hours ago, Destiny1990 said:

Hi Max,

some guy said if u regularly change ur aircon filters at ur condo then the inside air quality of the unit is fine.Just only the air when u go outside is bad in most asian urban inner cities..

Not in my experience. In fact I have augmented my A/C filtering because the filters all the A/C evaporator filters I've seen were very coarse and primarily are just for lint and that's about it. This is how and why the 3M Filtrete (TM) additional filtering material is sold specifically for indoor A/C evaporator units because they and their customers are aware of the relative ineffectiveness of the standard A/C filtering. Access your A/C filter and take a look at it and you'll see what I mean.

 

Also, AFAIC if the doors and windows of a room/apartment/condo are kept closed and the entire thing is air-tight, then it is a closed system like the ISS. Unfortunately, this is very unhealthy because of, at least, the CO2 build up and eventual lack of oxygen from breathing - not from the A/C (unless there is a refrigerant leak, of course). This is why outside air has to introduced into the room/apartment/condo on a regular basis. This will, of course, unavoidably bring in outside air pollution unless somehow the outside air is cleaned before entering. Such air cleaning would be highly unusual and fairly difficult and expensive to do, I should think.

 

With one of my rooms, I actually built a huge filter for an entire window to bring in cool outside air at night to save A/C (electricity) costs. Very "penny-wise and pound-foolish" of me due the high cost of the filter material, and building the filter and my labor, etc. It was experimental and kept me off the streets a bit.

 

I also experimented with using a synthetic foam material soaked in palm oil similar to the carburater air filters that lawn mowers use and the oil-bath air cleaners that once upon a time cars used. This was a success based on how quickly the filters got dirty. However, it was a little messy, cleaning the filters, and it made the room smell like palm oil (not so bad actually).

 

You should think independently about this issue and critically evaluate every statement made by "some guy or gal" (including me). It is largely common sense, AFAIC and experience living in a modern world where man's machines have gotten a little (or a lot) out of control.

 

I'll give you a hint:

 

When there is local air pollution, say from a fire at an oil refinery, and it is severe what do they tell the residents to do who might be subject to this pollution that could be life-threatening? If you lived near a large oil refinery or any industry that could potentially, because of an accident for example, produce severe air pollution, you would know the answer to this (because your life, or at least your health, may depend upon it). The people living in close proximity to the oil refinery in Martinez, CA certainly know what to do and there is an automated system to notify the local residents.

 

There is even a specific term for the action the local residents have to take under those emergency conditions. This is also what people are told to do high pollution days as well in cities where health-threatening air pollution is a danger.

 

Breathe Freely (if you can).

 

PS: Perhaps the residents of these highly-polluted cities should be "sheltering in place" during certain times of the day. Of course, that's not going to happen plus I'd bet that most residents cool their abodes directly with polluted outside air so the action would be meaningless.

Edited August 9, 2017 by MaxYakov

[MaxYakov]

6 hours ago, Destiny1990 said:

Hmm i not so technical and u r correct however i feel that when u a/c unit is always on like mine usually is that in such case u need a stronger air purifier then if the aircon is never on in the same room is it? I have lived in Asoke but now live in Jomtien 34 th floor.Again i need study it more before i will purchase an air purifier but it looks like a good investment.

Agreed that at least an air purifier would be good insurance if one didn't know how polluted the air is. In my case, I know exactly what to do to get a rough idea of how polluted the air is.

 

I would simply run my evaporative cooler/fan with a fresh filter and see how long it takes the filter to get dirty (as I have done many, many times in the past). The filter material on the sixth floor on Sukhumvit Soi 16 (Asok) in a matter of hours of operation will turn grey from pollution (it starts pure white) and in a few days will be absolutely black from the carbon in the air. And this is in a room that is essentially closed to outside air with a door that is normally closed and with windows closed all the time! Unfortunately, for health reasons (!), I have to routinely open the room to the outside rooms in my apartment which in turn are ventilated occasionally from outside air through normal door openings during entry and exit.

 

Think about it.

 

I'd be curious to know what your actual pollution is. As high as you are and where you are one would think that it would not be too bad. I, as Lord Kelvin  have a tendency to want to measure something before saying anything about it, 

Edited August 9, 2017 by MaxYakov

[Destiny1990]

21 minutes ago, MaxYakov said:

Agreed that at least an air purifier would be good insurance if one didn't know how polluted the air is. In my case, I know exactly what to do to get a rough idea of how polluted the air is.

 

I would simply run my evaporative cooler/fan with a fresh filter and see how long it takes the filter to get dirty (as I have done many, many times in the past). The filter material on the sixth floor on Sukhumvit Soi 16 (Asok) in a matter of hours of operation will turn grey from pollution (it starts pure white) and in a few days will be absolutely black from the carbon in the air. And this is in a room that is essentially closed to outside air with a door that is normally closed and with windows closed all the time! Unfortunately, for health reasons (!), I have to routinely open the room to the outside rooms in my apartment which in turn are ventilated occasionally from outside air through normal door openings during entry and exit.

 

Think about it.

Gosh u really into it..Why do u not relocate  to a less industrial greener area of Thailand for example Koh Samui?

If u was going to buy a purifier is there a particular model/brand that u like?

[VegasExpat]

Is there a decimal point missing in that chart?  for example is BKK  32 (in red) or 3.2. while Chonburi is shown as  21 (in black ) and should be 2.7 and its highest reading is 67 (in red) assuming that red numbers mean in excess while black numbers mean ok. Just asking

[wakeupplease]

21 hours ago, johnarth said:

simple stop making cars and trucks, that includes electric, just had an email about electric cars that will blow your minds when it comes out in the news in a couple of years time if I knew how to share on here I would

try copy and paste its an old way but works

Edited August 10, 2017 by wakeupplease

[MaxYakov]

1 hour ago, Destiny1990 said:

Gosh u really into it..Why do u not relocate  to a less industrial greener area of Thailand for example Koh Samui?

If u was going to buy a purifier is there a particular model/brand that u like?

Thanks. I call these things "phony-baloney" projects although I don't see how trying to breathe cleaner air and save money at the same time is phony. But I like to research and build stuff so it kept me busy and off the street.

 

If I were going to relocate it certainly would probably be out of Thailand. I've seen enough here, Thank You very much. Wish I could help with the purifier. I'd have to research the market and don't want to commit to a purchase at this time (although I should If I'm going to stay in Bangkok). But now that you mention it maybe I should buy one, since I've been blowing money on less important items this year, that's for sure. I'll get back to you (or not).