Turkey will never be EU member under Erdogan-Germany's Gabriel

[webfact]

Turkey will never be EU member under Erdogan-Germany's Gabriel

 

Turkish President Tayyip Erdogan speaks during a meeting of his ruling AK Party in Rize, Turkey, August 7, 2017. Murat Cetinmuhurdar/Presidential Palace/Handout via REUTERS

 

BERLIN (Reuters) - Turkey will never be a member of the European Union as long as it is governed by Tayyip Erdogan, German Foreign Minister Sigmar Gabriel said on Thursday, accusing the Turkish president of failing to take accession talks with the bloc seriously.

 

His remarks in an interview with mass-selling newspaper Bild are likely to further inflame relations between the two NATO allies after Erdogan urged German Turks to boycott Germany's main parties in next month's general election.

 

"It is clear that in this state, Turkey will never become a member of the EU," Gabriel said. "It's not because we don't want them but because the Turkish government and Erdogan are moving fast away from everything that Europe stands for."

 

EU leaders have been critical of Erdogan's crackdown on opponents before and after a failed military coup against him in July last year. Accession talks have ground to a virtual halt though Turkey remains a candidate for membership.

 

Turkey's Western allies fear that sweeping new powers Erdogan won in a tightly fought referendum in April are pushing Turkey away from democratic values.

 

Erdogan says both the crackdown and the increased presidential powers are needed to help tackle serious challenges to Turkey's security both at home and beyond its borders.

 

At a highpoint in tensions earlier this year, Erdogan angered Germany, home to 3 million Turks about half of whom can vote in the election on Sept. 24, by accusing German authorities of Nazi-like behaviour.

 

Relations between the two countries have also been strained by Turkey's arrest of a Turkish-German journalist and a German human rights activist.

 

(Reporting by Joseph Nasr; editing by Ralph Boulton)

 

-- © Copyright Reuters 2017-08-25

[Saladin]

I always saw Turkey as the big hope of rapprochement between Islam and the rest of the world, the enlightened Ataturk being one of my heroes. I appreciated how and why the cancer of religion was kept firmly under control

by  responsible governments. Then along came Erdogan The Spoiler, who has set Turkey and its goals back by decades. Despite the fact that the Turkish Intelligence agencies were apparently taken completely by surprise by the failed coup attempt against him, 50,000 people have subsequently been detained. This arrogant dictator must go ASAP so that Turkey can get back on track.

 

[Opl]

Turkey has chosen to give all the powers to a man. It is a structuring choice, which involves obvious risks of authoritarian drifts and high probabilities of seeing an Islamist dictatorship emerge in Turkey . European countries also have the right to distance themselves from  negotiating a possible entry of Turkey. A simple referendum will suffice. And the result will not be around 51% for and 49% against. This will be much clearer, more clearly legible and considerably easier to implement. It can reasonably be expected that the result will be 80% NO or more.

It is time for the EU to close the talks with Turkey, secure its borders with Turkey and move on. .

 

 

Edited August 25, 2017 by Opl

[Baerboxer]

Don't disagree with the analysis, that Turkey under Erdogan is unlikely to become a EU member state but why, again, do we have a German national politician feeling he can speak on behalf of the EU and decide for all the other member states?

The EU has a team, selected from member states, of people to do that. Again, signs that German politicians believe they are ruling the EU?

[Srikcir]

4 hours ago, webfact said:

"It's not because we don't want them but because the Turkish government and Erdogan are moving fast away from everything that Europe stands for."

Unfortunately reality bites. The EU will have to engage in some economic relationships with Turkey despite Turkey's shift away from democracy. It just won't be as an EU member.

Turkey lies in the path to Middle East oil & gas fields whose access by the EU would help EU energy's security from Russia. The irony for Turkey is that it is a net energy importer with long-term contracts with nations like Russia and faces possible penalties for breaching those contracts such as failure to take full contract deliveries. But Turkey currently lacks infrastructure to for develop its own O&G resources, provide national distribution and export facilities. Turkey needs EU capital.

http://www.cer.eu/sites/default/files/publications/attachments/pdf/2011/essay_turkey_energy_12dec07-1381.pdf

So I don't expect EU and Turkey to abandon one another over ideology.

[Foozool]

Seems 21 century will be a dark age for many countries. ☠️

 

 

Edited August 25, 2017 by Foozool

[ilostmypassword]

1 hour ago, Srikcir said:

Unfortunately reality bites. The EU will have to engage in some economic relationships with Turkey despite Turkey's shift away from democracy. It just won't be as an EU member.

Turkey lies in the path to Middle East oil & gas fields whose access by the EU would help EU energy's security from Russia. The irony for Turkey is that it is a net energy importer with long-term contracts with nations like Russia and faces possible penalties for breaching those contracts such as failure to take full contract deliveries. But Turkey currently lacks infrastructure to for develop its own O&G resources, provide national distribution and export facilities. Turkey needs EU capital.

http://www.cer.eu/sites/default/files/publications/attachments/pdf/2011/essay_turkey_energy_12dec07-1381.pdf

So I don't expect EU and Turkey to abandon one another over ideology.

Turkey and the EU already have a special economic relationship.

http://ec.europa.eu/trade/policy/countries-and-regions/countries/turkey/

[Srikcir]

27 minutes ago, ilostmypassword said:

Turkey and the EU already have a special economic relationship.

The link is before Erdogan's constitutional referendum.

But with the EU being by far Turkey's number one import and export partner gives the EU a lot of leverage in its current deteriorating relationship with Turkey.

[ilostmypassword]

12 minutes ago, Srikcir said:

The link is before Erdogan's constitutional referendum.

But with the EU being by far Turkey's number one import and export partner gives the EU a lot of leverage in its current deteriorating relationship with Turkey.

Turkey has its own lever: refugee immigration

[puck2]

2 hours ago, Baerboxer said:

Don't disagree with the analysis, that Turkey under Erdogan is unlikely to become a EU member state but why, again, do we have a German national politician feeling he can speak on behalf of the EU and decide for all the other member states?

The EU has a team, selected from member states, of people to do that. Again, signs that German politicians believe they are ruling the EU?

Baerboxer, if you would know the conditions then we wouldn't read your „alternative facts“.

 

From --->

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Enlargement_of_the_European_Union#Criteria

<------>

Once the negotiations are complete a treaty of accession will be signed, which must then be ratified by all of the member states of the Union, as well as the institutions of the Union, and the candidate country. Once this has been completed it will join the Union on the date specified in the treaty. …..

 

Therefore the small Luxembourg with a population less than 600,000 has the same power/vote as Germany with more than 80,000.000. As a consequence of the EU regulation Gabriel, representing Germany, has the same right to say no to the Turkish request as Luxembourg, i.e. .

 

That is „ruling the EU“? Concerning the population one could say, Germany is disadvantaged, but that is not the problem/subject here.

[Grouse]

3 hours ago, Baerboxer said:

Don't disagree with the analysis, that Turkey under Erdogan is unlikely to become a EU member state but why, again, do we have a German national politician feeling he can speak on behalf of the EU and decide for all the other member states?

The EU has a team, selected from member states, of people to do that. Again, signs that German politicians believe they are ruling the EU?

Veto

[Grouse]

At least Erdogan can do a deal with Theresa, Boris and the turkeys

[overherebc]

4 hours ago, Baerboxer said:

Don't disagree with the analysis, that Turkey under Erdogan is unlikely to become a EU member state but why, again, do we have a German national politician feeling he can speak on behalf of the EU and decide for all the other member states?

The EU has a team, selected from member states, of people to do that. Again, signs that German politicians believe they are ruling the EU?

We will ask the questions!!!!!

[ilostmypassword]

2 hours ago, Grouse said:

At least Erdogan can do a deal with Theresa, Boris and the turkeys

Doesn't seem so based on the terms of the Customs Union

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/European_Union–Turkey_Customs_Union

[Thailand]

 

Cyprus will keep Turkey out of the EU for a very long time, still too many open wounds.

[Saradoc1972]

17 hours ago, Baerboxer said:

Don't disagree with the analysis, that Turkey under Erdogan is unlikely to become a EU member state but why, again, do we have a German national politician feeling he can speak on behalf of the EU and decide for all the other member states?

The EU has a team, selected from member states, of people to do that. Again, signs that German politicians believe they are ruling the EU?

Someone else beat me to the answer, taking a new country as a member is a unanimous decision of all existing members. And you won't need Germany for that, just Cyprus and Austria. From what I seem to remember the Austrians would have a referendum on it. They did a poll in Austria a couple of years back and that came out between 80%-90% negative. To which some Turkish politician stated, Turkey was acknowledging that countries with big Turkish minorities seemed particularly unwilling to admitting Turkey into the EU. Don't need to even hold a referendum under those circumstances; if, that is, you could find an Austrian government in support, Mr. Kurz doesn't seem to find the idea at all palatable.

 

As to Germany's role in the "accession process", as far as that has not become euphemism in itself: that would be a decision for the European Commission, don't ask me where Parliament comes in here. Again, Germany does not rule or control the EU, just if Germany were to withdraw its support for Turkey here, things might start to look pretty bleak. But it would not be Germany's decision.

 

On a sidenote, a country can only join the EU when all disputes over territory have been settled, inside or outside. Spain/UK/Gibraltar, Germany/Switzerland/Austria over Lake Constance, Germany/Poland.... Now, Erdo with his dreams of a Neo-Osman Empire settling affairs with Greece and Cyprus, that seems pure fantasy, doesn't it? Hence, Gabriel's statement is more declaratory than anything else..