Resilient Laptops

[Sheryl]

My current laptop has about died and it is more than time to get a new one. I'm a consultant in oublic health and spend a lot of time in rough conditions in remote rural areas of Cambodia etc...so my laptops really take a beating. I have heard that there are some built to withstand a lot of bumps, jolts and the like...can anyone suggest a make and model? Preferrably HP because thast is the easiest in terms of repairs in this part of the world. I don't need anything fancy, no multimedia or the like, just basic software applications and internet.

Appreciate any suggestions, thanks

[Trevor]

You can do a web search for ruggedized laptops but they will likely be beyond your price range. Better to buy a cheapie with at least a year's guarantee and WRAP it up well.

[endure]

Try googling 'Panasonic Toughbook'

[britmaveric]

Try googling 'Panasonic Toughbook'

Rock hard and durable - used all over the world by military.

[Smokin Joe]

I've been given ruggedized laptops twice on jobs I went on and I was amazed at how many problems they had. Not sure which models they were but they were both expensive, approx 4000 USD and both had a lot of problems. Not mine personally, but of 8-10 in use each job a couple of them went down hard, and they were not even taken to the field much.

My advice is:

1. Buy the minimum laptop you need for your work.

2. Use external devices when possible, i.e. CD/DVD, so they can be used with a replacement.

3. Use TWO external USB hard drives (2.5" are very portable) for all data.

4. Have CD's for ALL software you use, including Windows. You can recover from a badly crashed computer or transfer to a replacement with ease.

Oh, and Happy New Year

[cdnvic]

Working out in the sticks you'll appreciate the 10hr battery life.

http://www.panasonic.com/business/toughboo...k-computers.asp

[whimsy]

Selecting a notebook from the business rather than 'home' model range from the major manufacturers will generally get you a tougher notebook. They are built to take the knocks of being carted around a lot.

I have found IBM's (now Lenovo) T series notebooks to be fairly rugged and well built, while much cheaper than a Panasonic Toughbook. IBM service would most likely be available in any centre big enough for HP service to operate. If it has to be HP, then take a look at their NC or NX line of business notebooks.

Check both companies web sites to view the model range and also service centre locations. Perhaps email or give them a call on their USA numbers to get some advice on what they would recommend for your needs.

[Sheryl]

Many thanks for all the tips.

Anyone had firsthand experience w/ the Panasonic Toughbook?

[Clipped]

for extreme mobile use , i'd get something small....the smaller display will use up less power, be easier to take around, and in the event your in an unsecure place can easily be locked up in the hotel safe...ive been impressed with the build quality of the sony vaios range...

that said, i just recently purchased a toshiba p105 with 17" monitor and wouldnt recommend something of this size to be hauled around...although it is an extremely powerful machine....the touchpad has a mind of its own and goes through a fully charged battery in less than 2 hours, using basic programs.

if you can handle the reduced hard drive speed a slower spinning hardrive will consume less power than a drive with a higher rotation eg; 4200 vs 7200 rpm

btw turn down the monitors brightness to conserve batteries, and hibernate/standby instead of 'turning off...will also save power.

you may want to check out 'alienware'

[Sheryl]

OK, well as predicted the resilent models are at twice (sometimes four times) as costly as regular notebooks plus very hard to find in Thailand...so I am leaning towards the just buy a cheap one and use a lot of external devices option.

There is a make called Alstar currently on sale quite cheaply (less than 20,000 baht) at lotus, I assume it's a clone, anyone know anything about it?

As I mentioned I don't need industrial strength memory nor extra features beyond an internal modem, and at the rate my computers bite the dust would prefer not to spend too much. But of course I don't want a lemon, either.....

Appreciate advice from all you computer whizzes out there...

(Which reminds me: there is a computer shop in Phnom Penh called "Lemon Computers", always gives me a laugh. Actually one of the better ones around there in terms of technical know-how...)

[Clipped]

check out fortune city-ratchada road or pantip....acers and toshibas can be had for less than 20,000...i saw one last time i was there for around 16,000 baht...i wouldnt mess with Alstar, sounds like something thats here today gone tommorrow.

Lemon computers?

how about

Assumption University? ...only in Thailand

[jhaung]

Just thought I'd chime in on this subject. To me finding a reliable laptop for both work and place has been a life long task. My first laptop a dell inspiron 7800 gave me so many issues that it totally turned me off from Dell, the support sucked even more. So my next laptop was an Compaq something or other,again had several issues. I'm on my fourth laptop now, the HP Pavilion series, I like it mainly for the built-in camera and what I thought was an avante-garde cpu(Core 2 Duo). The cpu speed leaves much to be desired and the camera is now probably the primary fav in terms of features on this laptop. For work I use a company issued IBM R-series notebook in conjunction with my desktop at work. I think of all the laptops I've had thus far the IBM thinkpad is the only laptop that I can consider reliable(uptime of 8 months w/ AC charger and still ticking).

Things to take into consideration:

1.) Size - I noticed some suggestions in terms of getting a laptop with a smaller size. I am also aspiring to purchase the Sony TX series or the IBM Thinkpad X series laptop. You must take into consideration that although technology is now advancing at a fast speed, laptops under the 14" diag size, deemed "Ultra portables" they will not be able to achieve the speeds you would get from a laptop that's around 14"-15". Additionally, they tend to be more delicate and the keyboards are super cramped.

2.) Quality - I've found that industry tested laptops, such as IBM or Sony have proven their worth in terms of reliability. Its like comparing a Toyota with a Kia or Hyundai.

Ultimately, you will find that a sacrifice must be made. Size will give way to less performance but portability. Quality comes in form of reliability. Don't buy an Avertec(laptops that are under $600USD) and expect it to still be functioning for months at a decent speed.

Key advice: Get a laptop at a price you are comfortable with and make sure that it is insured(Warranty) for its parts. Buying a laptop is like buying anything else in life, everyone has their own opinions on what's the best. Its up to the consumer to make the judgement. I'm just contributing my thoughts on this subject.

Below are two examples I mentioned above with detail:

Dell

haunted mouse cursor - If your thinking its the driver or caliberation, it wasn't. Support first blamed it on drivers which I admit was my first assumption too. Then it was a software that they thought was miscaliberated. Ultimately, the my support contract expired and they refused to work on the issue without charging me $50 per assistance. So make sure you get a good support contract and hardware maintenance.

Compaq

Poor harddrive quality, I suppose this can be blamed on the harddrive manufacturer but I think the Notebook vendor should share some of the blame since they are using a subpar company for their harddrives. The Hitachi drive corrupted after 3 months of use. Contacting support for Compaq now know has HP/Compaq was hellish at best. I was forced to explain the issue several times to their India team and none of them spoke coherent English for me to understand what and when they intended to replace the drive. Ultimately took 2 weeks for me to receive the replacement drive. 2 weeks downtime is not acceptable even for a consumer level notebook.

[Gary A]

I have had three different brand laptops. The Hitachi was the worst and had many different problems. The Toshiba, other than being the slowest was pretty dependable. The best was an IBM Thinkpad. In fact I still have it. The keyboard quit working but other than that it still keeps plugging along. I won't allow my Thai wife to use my new Lenovo T43p laptop and she really doesn't want to because the old IBM 600 is setup with Thai Windows and a remote Thai keyboard. If the new Lenovo (IBM) is anywhere as dependable as the old 600 I will be very happy.

[Crushdepth]

Our staff have been pretty happy with various IBM notebooks which they tend to abuse quite badly (I think we have about seven of them over the last couple of years and only one has crapped out - keyboard malfunction - which was fixed pretty easily). The same people *hated* earlier Compaqs - a lot of complaints including several about *rust* leaking out of the case!

Our other least favourite 'craptop' brand has been Acer, of which I am an unhappy user. Very shabbily made, things just start breaking after a while. I just wish it had been made slightly even more shoddily so that it would blow up and I could get a new one, but no such luck.

[Sheryl]

OK, many frustrating trips to places like Zeer and The Mall (and Lotus et al) later I am still without a purchase.

Lotus: had an excellent price HP, tho I'd prefer Lenovo or Toshiba was such a good deal I thought OK. Salesperson proved incapable of transferring contents of the hard drive of my current laptop to it and rude and lazy to boot, finally gave up after 3 wasted hours trying to buy it

Everywhere else: could not find a Lenovo ANYWHERE except 1 lone shop which had exactly 1 model. Rude and disinterested salesperson first refused to turn it on for me to try, then when he finally did, the touchpad didn't work...he said it didn't have the driver installed..I asked didn't it come with a system CD, he said Oh no, we have to download the drivers for you from the internet. Then he wandered away and never came back (Are they ALL like this??? Never had so much trouble spending money in LOS!!)

A very FEW places had Toshibas, but I was at a loss as to which model to get & bewildered by the specs which are mostly gibberish to me (I'm smart when it comes to what I do on computers but pretty clueless -- and uninterested -- re how they work!)

Anyhow, if you computer folk don't mind, can anyone tell me:

1) Which model of Toshiba I should look for?

2) WHERE I can find a Lenovo?

3) Which of the long list of specs really matter and what I should look for. I understand RAM and GB of HDD, that's it...and that the the one ending in Hz is probably the processor. But what type & speed processor do I want? Basically I want as fast as can be gotten without a big leap in price. And good quality.

As for the resiliant models I've long ago given up as it seems they are completely unavailable in this country and not a single salesperson could fathom what I was talking about or why anyone would care about that. (NOT due to language barrier...just clearly not something local consumers care about). At this point I'm just trying for as reliable and durable an ordinary laptop as I can get at reasoanable price. And preferrably not heavier than 2.4 kg.

Thanks in advance....

Edited January 16, 2007 by Sheryl

[Sheryl]

P.S. Forgot to ask, what;s the deal with BenQ, SVOA, Asus brands that I keep seeing? Any good? I've never heard of them before

[macan]

I also have worked a lot in rural areas in SE Asia; since 1998 I have only had two laptops both Toshiba and both still working. The first one didnt have enough memory and couldnt cope with the demands of more recent software.

As another post said go for a business model, if you can get a metal casing such as the alloy on my TE2100 and make sure that the hinges are cast as part of the body (sometimes they are plastic that cracks too easily. Give the screen a press from the outside while it's switched on to determine the strength of the casing.. the amount of distortion on the screen can give a rough idea of the strength.

Other rural development professionals I know use Fujitsu, HP and IBM. Applemac laptops are extremely tough (one is even made from bulletproof plastic) though you might have software compatibilty problems when exchanging files with your local counterparts.

Good luck, don't buy too cheap or it will break down when you need it most in the middle of nowhere.

[JimsKnight]

OK, many frustrating trips to places like Zeer and The Mall (and Lotus et al) later I am still without a purchase.

Lotus: had an excellent price HP, tho I'd prefer Lenovo or Toshiba was such a good deal I thought OK. Salesperson proved incapable of transferring contents of the hard drive of my current laptop to it and rude and lazy to boot, finally gave up after 3 wasted hours trying to buy it

Everywhere else: could not find a Lenovo ANYWHERE except 1 lone shop which had exactly 1 model. Rude and disinterested salesperson first refused to turn it on for me to try, then when he finally did, the touchpad didn't work...he said it didn't have the driver installed..I asked didn't it come with a system CD, he said Oh no, we have to download the drivers for you from the internet. Then he wandered away and never came back (Are they ALL like this??? Never had so much trouble spending money in LOS!!)

A very FEW places had Toshibas, but I was at a loss as to which model to get & bewildered by the specs which are mostly gibberish to me (I'm smart when it comes to what I do on computers but pretty clueless -- and uninterested -- re how they work!)

Anyhow, if you computer folk don't mind, can anyone tell me:

1) Which model of Toshiba I should look for?

2) WHERE I can find a Lenovo?

3) Which of the long list of specs really matter and what I should look for. I understand RAM and GB of HDD, that's it...and that the the one ending in Hz is probably the processor. But what type & speed processor do I want? Basically I want as fast as can be gotten without a big leap in price. And good quality.

As for the resiliant models I've long ago given up as it seems they are completely unavailable in this country and not a single salesperson could fathom what I was talking about or why anyone would care about that. (NOT due to language barrier...just clearly not something local consumers care about). At this point I'm just trying for as reliable and durable an ordinary laptop as I can get at reasoanable price. And preferrably not heavier than 2.4 kg.

Thanks in advance....

I can't comment too much on Toshiba (they aren't considered a top laptop maker, but nor are they a turkey) or the Lenovo model(sounds like some city Cortez and his boys might have visited )

However the specs of power you need to look into:

CPU. The Mhz processor speed. This has changed quite recently. Having a single faster and faster CPU inside your laptop has been supersceded by the Core Duo so think double what the MHz quote is ie 2.4 Ghz is roughly performace doubled.

Sticking with an Intel Pentium CPU core duo of about 2.13 GHz shouldn't see a massive price hike and would give reasonable performance. But there are deals and price changes every week so its almost impossible to advise you fully.

Memory. Are you using the laptop for games? For Developlment applications like dreamweaver Photoshop?. More is better 512 Mb as a minimum with 1 GB of RAM desirable. Another important factor on the memory riddle is this: What speed is the RAM running at? This can vary from slowish (DDR2 400) up to super quick and the latest speed (DD3 800). For a 1 GB RAM with DD3 800 speed you will pay more than for a 1 GB RAM DDR2 566.

Video Memory and Card. Firstly its very important to know if the Laptop has integrated graphics or not. If it has integrated Graphics then the video performance will be less than a laptop with a graphics card. However the battery life may be improved if its integrated!

If your hunting for a gaming machine then get a laptop with at least 256 MB of Video Memory and a 7000 series Graphics card or higher (Nvidea).

If you don't play decent games (HL2, Warcraft, Ghost Recon etc) on your laptop then go for integrated graphics, the price is a lot cheaper.

The disadvantage with laptops are that they are harder to fully customise than a desktop so often you'll have to choose a pre-built laptop with everything stuffed inside and installed already.

My laptop is a Compaq presario 2581 AT and it hasn't failed me yet however Its got a few gremlins that trigger the 'f' key every December! (I kid you not, I have to change the calander to stop it!)

Google a search for the laptop you desire followed by 'problems'. If you see direct links to forums where people are wailing of the bugs and problems they've had with the laptop then think twice.

Thailand only has a 'thing' for selling Acer / HP / Compaq and Toshiba. All of these tend to be lower quality to middle of the road quality grade laptops. I've negative rep on Toshiba and Acer.

The Vaio (possible typo) brand is now available and I've heard nothing negative about this laptop and it does look the part.

I'd choose either a HP, Compaq or a Vaoi these tend to be in the 38k - 75k with the top end Vaoi laptops breaking the 100k barrier. If the skys the limit then a Dell Inspiron (expensive and you'll have to import it from the States or Australia though).

[Trevor]

I sympathise with your problems buying here Sheryl. Mostly low-end models, indifferent staff and no standardisation in shops, plus a shitty environment (Bangkok) to boot.

That's why I bought mine in my home of England. You might also consider Singapore, Malaysia and Hong Kong if your travels take you there.

[jokinha]

Hi there please follow this link and it will lead you to a Thai site that sell the latest computers at decent rates...free delivery in Bangkok as far as I could understand....

http://www.login.co.th/product/notebook/

[jokinha]

After getting some ideas from the site I provided I think you should go to Pantip Plaza and compare prices...with five storeys full of shops selling the latest laptop models in the market I quite sure you will find one that suits you.

[macan]

On further reflection I also suggest that you get a surge protector, power supplies in many parts of Asia (rural Cambodia is worst that I have seen) are surging frequently and can burn out your power adaptor (the black box on your cable) which is expensive to replace; you can buy an inline device that is much cheaper and some of them also can protect from surges in telephone or network cables which can fry your modem or network adaptor.

Another big problem can be fire ants (the little red and black devils with the irritating bite) that love to get into your computer and adjust things ....with often permanently fatal results for the harddrive. No kidding i know of five people who have lost everything on their harddrives because of ants; i think their hard shells get mashed against the harddrive. To avoid this use chalk or spray around the desk legs and wall sockets or any other access points, don't eat at the desk and put your computer away in its bag when you are finished as they may launch a sneak attack during the night

[Sheryl]

After getting some ideas from the site I provided I think you should go to Pantip Plaza and compare prices...with five storeys full of shops selling the latest laptop models in the market I quite sure you will find one that suits you.

Ah the advice I dreaded yet knew must come sooner or later…PANTIP PLAZA. A place which, were Dante writing today, would most surely rank as one of the innermost circles of H_ll. Going to which ranks in my personal list of preferences somewhere below root canals and driving, in rush hour, through Soi Asoke….. AARRGGGH…….

Yes, what I need probably is in there, somewhere. But part of the torture of Pantip is the knowledge that whatever it is you need must be in there – but that you will NEVER find it, at least not before losing your mind altogether, which in my case takes only about an hour in the place.

Just kidding! (sort of). Thanks to all for the tips. I have found a Toshiba Satellite 100 at my local Big C at what seems a good price (36,600). As far as I gather it has the new double-type fast processor and certainly has more RAM and HDD space than I will ever use. The sales staff – although pleasant, which is more than I can say about any I encountered in the techie places -- were beyond clueless (defined as: knowing even less than I do, which if you have followed this thread, is saying something). The only reason that really matters is that I need to be able to transfer everything (files plus applications) from my old laptop to the hard drive of the new, and they cannot begin to do that.

So my question now is: what does that actually entail? Is it something I might be able to tackle myself, maybe with an external hard drive? Am not worried about “My Documents” type stuff, those I can just copy via a memory stick. It’s software and the various modifications to the basic systems files that software applications, as I understand it, make. I don’t want to have to purchase all my software anew and in any case there are a number of applications I use that are not available in LOS…plus I already have everything set up on my old computer exactly as I need & want it.

[Sheryl]

On further reflection I also suggest that you get a surge protector, power supplies in many parts of Asia (rural Cambodia is worst that I have seen) are surging frequently and can burn out your power adaptor (the black box on your cable) which is expensive to replace; you can buy an inline device that is much cheaper and some of them also can protect from surges in telephone or network cables which can fry your modem or network adaptor.

Thanks Macan. By inline device do you mean something that gets installed inside the computer? If so, what does one call it in Thai? I already use those external things you can buy altho I've heard they don't really do all that much.

Know what you mean re the red ants. To which I must add chinjoks (?sp). Haven't, knock on wood, done in a laptop on me yet but I've lost a desktop PCU, aircons, TVs and the stabilizer I have the whole house's electricity supply on, to them.

[macan]

I meant it goes inline on your power cable not inside the computer, you connect it to the cable ahead of the power transformer; maybe it's like the thing you have already that doesnt do much. A friend of mine who also uses one was at a workshop in Siem Reap where his transformer was the only one not left smoking after a sudden surge caused by an electrical storm.... lightning must have struck the power cables or something (thats another tip, unplug during electrical storms).

The one i had also allowed the network and modem inputs to be plugged into it for added protection.

[Sheryl]

Thanks to all for the advice.

I am now the happy owner of a new Lenovo Thinkpad...bought in Phnom Penh which I highly recommend to anyone inte4nding to by other than an HP/Acer or Compaq or the various clones popular in Thailand. Wide range of selection -- much wider than in LOS -- nice, attentive, polite and (wonder of wonders!) actually knowledgable sales staff. You can actuially have intelligent discussions about your needs and the pros and cons of various brands (all I ever got in Bangkok was blank looks and statements like "In Thailand people buy HP or Acer". ) Prices are competitive, and for US/European or Singaporean manufactured computers, cheaper than in LOS.

Oh and you can shop without being blasted with deafening noise....or stuck for hours in traffic....or pushed and shoved through packed crowds....

[youngkiwi]

Chiming in late on this one, but congratulations are in order. IBM notebooks are by far the most reliable and toughest on the market. We use them on the field and the cases are the strongest and most scratch resistant available.

[nikster]

P.S. Forgot to ask, what;s the deal with BenQ, SVOA, Asus brands that I keep seeing? Any good? I've never heard of them before

Asus has a very good reputation for quality.

BenQ does not. Sony = good quality but horrific service so stay away.

For quality, get an IBM ThinkPad T series, tried, trusted, indestructible.

Dell's quality has gone down lately and they are not wide-spread in SEA, so not so good. However, I just saw Dell introduced the "ATC" tough laptop, supposedly for military. As for toughbook, I don't know it. Reliability isn't just how hard the shell is, it's also about the innards etc etc.

I don't think you can go better than IBM at this point. The only reason I didn't buy one is that they don't have any high-resolution wide-screen machines. They have one now, the top end Z-series model, but it's very expensive and inexplicably comes only with a 100GB drive.

I have had pretty good experiences with MacBook Pro and Powerbook as well.

Ok I am way too late on this thread, congrats for making the right choice

Edited January 27, 2007 by nikster