Steely Dan

Well...duh!  Same thing as if you were cleaning your shotgun in a crowded schoolyard, drunk off your ass.

So you agree with my point then? It would be better use of Police resources to try to reduce the carnage which results from drink driving than perpetuate the sham of pretending to rid Thailand of all recreational drugs which the authorities know full well is impossible and is done as a political expedient.

Are you attempting to compare the seriousness of running a stop light, or paying a woman for sexual favors, with that of taking drugs?

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If you run a light whilst intoxicated with a legal drug like alcohol I would suggest that's a lot more serious than being in a club whilst stoned and hence only a threat to oneself.

who gives a ###### about a bunch of trouble making Islamic extremists? Did the Buddhists go mad and start trouble when they did them machete drive-by choppings on the monks?

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Without recourse to trial some of the people arrested might have only been guilty of minor offences, and even those accused of the most heinous of crimes should have access to a trial and not be summarily executed, be it out of negligence or intent. Your refusal to separate the wheat from the chaff is just the kind of approach Al-Quaeda use and unfortunately might result in equally indiscriminate reprisals throughout Thailand. I support the irradication of all Muslim fanatics but to comprehmise your own rule of law merely strengthens their hand.

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The murdered Thai monks didn't get much of a trial either.

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Agreed, and I can hardly think of a more sickening disgusting thing for anyone to do, may the purpetrators rot in ###### for all eternity - But to retaliate indiscriminately only serves to recruit more fanatics. Imposing martial law and a curfew until the guilty are caught may seem like a collective punishment but would focus the minds of the southern muslims as to where their interests lie. If they reverted to completely peaceful protest I would have a lot of sympathy for their cause.

I think there is far less of a drug problem in countries with the death penalty than countries will probation or community services. Maybe killing them is not the answer that most people would like... Perhaps a prison with all the drugs the world has to offer, and freely distributed... could even have different wings... Heroin Wing, Cocaine Wing, Tobacco Wing...

Somewhere there must be an answer?

I think you should have a re-think on this one; Holland has decriminalised soft drugs for decades and provides ecstacy purity testing facilities in nightclubs and yet Holland has a far lower incidence of drug addiction than many Countries with stricter laws. The only downside is a degree of drug tourism in Amsterdam.

I apologize for the edge on this post.

Instead of killing drug dealers and their patrons, why don't we instead shoot alcoholics.  Alcohol causes far more probloems in every society than do drugs.  But, I do not think that the head of Chang Beer would agree with that idea.  Or, better yet, simply enforce the laws aginst drunk driving and the like. 

If one believes that it is right for the government to halt the consumption of a drug or otherwise by the populace because one small minority becomes easily addicted, then what else should the government do to the majority because of the requirements or in fact, genetic weaknesses of a small minority?

If personal weakness, including biological, leads one to behave in such a way as to harm oneself, then  maybe the government should simply hold these people in a safe location so that the rest of society can live in such a way that their genetic design allow them to.

I do not smoke, drink, use any form of drug nor have I ever.

The major problems with drugs are crime due to their being expensive as they are illegal.

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I'm in total agreement and where you point to the prevention of susceptable individuals having access to the drugs which harm them I would point to many aboriginal communities which have voluntarily foregone alcohol as they have developed no native tolerance to it.

One pleaded guilty....must be stupid eh ???

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I'm sure you are aware that if you insist you are innocent you are killed.

If you plead guilty you are spared.

And you still have to suggest that pleading guilty actually means anything?

Let me be clear, I don't do drugs and I don't sanction the use BUT on the other hand I don't really see why anyone should limit anyone else's freedom to do to themselves what they want.

If drugs were legalized there would be no profit in dealing and hence no incentive to make anyone else addicted. Furthermore, those who were addicted could go to the pharmacy or wherever and get their drugs without having to resort to a life of crime to support the habit.

Logically it would seem that someone with the power to make decisions has an interest in keeping this a profitable market.

Legalize drugs!!! Oh yeah... great idea... NOT.

I am one of those people who are easily 'addicted' something to do with a lack of receptors in the brain that trigger dopamine into the system. There are millions of people like me... I am hooked on nicotine. I cannot stop. I have tried every way known to man, including hypnosis and therapy. I am not a stupid person, my IQ is 142 and still I cannot stop smoking. I am now 60 had a quadruple bypass at 48 and still smoking 30 cigarettes per day. It is killing me and nothing I can do about it. Along with heart disease, I have emphasima (spelling?) and lung damage from TB.

Now here's the problem with legalization. Kids will have access to dangerous drugs as I had as a kid. They will do what I did... and get older kids to buy them for them. They will, or many of them will have no chance in life... they will become addicts as kids and die early, or suffer brain dammages... It happens NOW even when drugs are expensive. Kids still get hold of them.

I think Thailand has the right approach.

I do sympathise with you being addicted to the biggest killer drug on the planet, second only to Alcohol - unless you take into account the number of murders or accidental deaths where alcohol was a contributory factor, especially in Thailand where drinking and driving seems to be regarded as a bit of a joke. Now kids can and do get access to these legally available (and taxed) killer drugs so by your logic instant prohibition should be introduced for alcohol as some people are more predisposed than most to becoming alcoholics. The economist produced an excellent article in 2002 covering the case for legalising all drugs in my oppinion anyone who read it could only conclude that the current situation is madness costing lives due to impure drugs, lining the pockets of drug dealers and preventing proper attention being given to treatment and rehabilitation, not to mention the huge economic benefits of not enforcing prohibition and the collection of tax revenues.

Now IF there has been no setting up of the two men convicted and they were dealing in large quantities of heroin then I have little sympathy for them as they knew the risks. I do however think that the governments of the world bear equal blame in making drug dealing so lucrative through their misguided policies.

who gives a ###### about a bunch of trouble making Islamic extremists? Did the Buddhists go mad and start trouble when they did them machete drive-by choppings on the monks?

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Without recourse to trial some of the people arrested might have only been guilty of minor offences, and even those accused of the most heinous of crimes should have access to a trial and not be summarily executed, be it out of negligence or intent. Your refusal to separate the wheat from the chaff is just the kind of approach Al-Quaeda use and unfortunately might result in equally indiscriminate reprisals throughout Thailand. I support the irradication of all Muslim fanatics but to comprehmise your own rule of law merely strengthens their hand.

There is a standard of civil liberties and rule of law in most developed societies for good reasons.

What happens if I smoke a splif in another country such as Amsterdam in a legal coffee shop, and then hop on a flight to Thailand and get fleeced in a drug-pissing shake down?

No laws were broken in Thailand, I was not seen with drugs or caught in the act, was not breaking other laws (provocation), and yet I would then be subject to Thai laws and rules of bribery for an act that was legal elsewhere.

The problem with nebulous sieges and arrests is that they produce nebulous results

that have nothing to do with the rule of law.  And it will not reduce drug use; avoidance of the root issues never do.

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A very good point;- Indeed unless there is internationally agreed standards of enforcement, detection and right to civil liberties then the entire act of attempting prohibition is fundamentally flawed. I must say I blame the U.S 'war on drugs' policy which is yet another exercise in flawed logic to follow prohibition, McCarthyism and the more recent 'War on terror'. The trouble is that such crusades have worldwide consequences one being the making of political capital or removal of government opponents, which is the case with quasi democracies. Never has my signature quote been more appropriate.

Muslims do seem to have serious difficulties living in peace with non-Muslims in too many parts of the world for it to be coincidental.  This begs the question why?

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Any subjugated homogenous group of people will eventually rebel.

Muslim/Muslim wars are by no means uncommon , the closest ( geographically) example to hand is the war between Malaysia & Indonesia.

The most recent Iraq and Kuwait.

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Is there a Country on earth small enough to not possess a minority with a grievence legitimate or otherwise? The trouble is that if grievences are pursued with a religiously motivated fundamentalism and medieval barbarity then their actions must be seen to yield nothing, otherwise this will only encourage every single disaffected group to adopt the tactics of Al Quaeda. Oh for a world without religion.

I will not mince my words in stating that those who kill Monks with machetes and murder school teachers are nothing short of scum of the earth and should be executed AFTER due trial and process. However to allow around 80 prisoners to suffocate whilst in police custody beggars belief. In the west people would be thrown in jail for transporting animals in the negligent manner the authorities did - Thaksin has brought disgrace on Thailand but depressingly I see the lack of political awareness amongst the Thai populace in general will probably mean he will get re-elected. However I predict that the prospects of Al Quaeda turning their attention to Thailand are now a racing certainty.

I know for a fact the guy turned himself in accompanied by his lawyer. In the clink at the moment though not yet charged. Apparently supplying prescription drugs without permission carries a sentence of up to 3 years in Thailand; As I previously stated I don't think this is the case but there are a long list of chemicals he was mixing together to make his products so who knows. The real rub is that the Thai police have apparently up to one year to charge him.

Call me picky but I don't think I'd rely on a home made herbal anti-herpes cure. Anyway that's enough for now: I just hope for his sake that this is much less serious than other illegal drugs.

I can tell more as I know of the guy, he lives in my apartment block! As I understand it he sold creams which were meant to prevent pregnancy and the transmission of STD's including aids plus other treatments for getting rid of genital warts. This was not an ecstasy or methamphetamine factory; at least not as far as I'm aware. The guy was already in trouble when he was caught though with more than a year overstay on his visa but this is not crime of the century so I guess he must have panicked and done a runner.

I have a multi entry tourist visa. This allows me to enter LOS four times for a duration of 60 days each time. Is it possible to extend each 60 day stay by a further 30 days and to do so does this have to be done in Bangkok or is it possible to do in Chiang Mai?

Anyone sophisticated enough to attempt an online securities fraud would im my oppinion be most unlikely to choose cannabis via the post as the method for a drugs supply business. The street value of 500g of cannabis would not be worth their while relative to the risk they run. If found guilty they'll probably get six months for the securities fraud and ten years for the drugs.

I bet the Iranians don't try to get extradited back to Iran to face trial seeing as what they do to thieves in that neck of the woods.

Unfortunately thaksin seems to take his attitude to law enforcement straight out of a 2000AD comic; the Police don't uphold the law, they are the law - unto themselves. I think the judicial assasination of suspected drug dealers has alas perpetuated a climate where the police act with impunity. It will not change from within so it's down to the likes of us to keep this high profile as the UK foreign office will try to bury it as quick as possible.