Bandersnatch

I have said this many times PEA is expensive electricity compared to solar, but you only pay for exactly what you use. Solar you have to have a reasonable idea of how much you use and when in the day you will use it before you install. My usual recommendation is live in a house for a year before getting solar, buy an energy monitoring system that will let you know what energy you are using and when. The monthly PEA bill is a very crude tool for planning a solar system. A solar system with a very short payback will hardly ever produce more power than you can use, but it won’t save you much money in total.

I wouldn’t bank on being able sell power back as part of your financial calculations. when I looked the FIT was ฿1.68 per kWh it was later raised to ฿2.2 If you were on single phase electric the max size was 5kW which rose to 10kW on three phase. Your inverter had to be on the approved list. There are guys on this forum who have waited over a year for approval. My dealings with PEA is that rules gets changed quickly and not every office interprets them the same. ROI and Payback are not the same. Most people use payback as it’s the simplest to understand. Payback will depend on when in the day you use the power. During the day it’s easier to cover with solar than buying batteries for night. maintenance is really just keeping the panels clean outside the rainy season. Solar has no moving parts and tends to be pretty reliable. What maintenance do you do on your home electrics?

Most on grid folk will set their inverter priority to be Solar, then Battery, then Grid. You shouldn’t see any drop in power as they switch between sources. A cheap and easy solar entry system is 5or6kW of PV and a 5kW inverter. The next step would 10 and 10. You have to make a choice of not enough on 5kW or possibly too much on 10kW. As you seem to not want batteries there is nowhere for excess solar power to go. Sounds like the cheapest solution for you is 5 and 5, no battery and a bit more PEA. The thing about PEA as a backup you are only paying for the power you actually use. Although I am completely off-grid I wouldn’t recommend it if you’re only considering financials

As I’ve never used 3 phase or any 3 phase solar equipment, I don’t feel a can answer your questions. Power coming from V2L will be single phase you need to find a way to integrate the single phase into your system. Do you split the phases across different zones of your house? In which case you could treat one of the zones as a UPS using V2L.

Supply and fit can get expensive as the company makes a profit on the components and the installation. The good ones will warranty their work and offer after sales support. However, there are some companies who think consumers have no idea of the price of solar components and they feel free to charge whatever they want. hopefully with falling prices the savings will eventually start to get passed on to consumers.

Can you support that ฿500,000 figure with some actual examples as in my opening post?

I have been basically off-grid for 5 years using batteries, now that I’ve given my meter back I’m definitely off-grid.

4.8kW of panels It’s not solar production, but solar production for which there is a corresponding load. If you don’t want to buy a battery and your house load is 1kW you should be able to cover that load from 8am to 5:30pm

A 5kW inverter is never going to produce more than 5kW, but if you oversize the panels with say 6kW of PV you will get more in the morning and in the afternoon. This is one of my 5kW inverters with 4,845 Watts of PV. The Graph doesn’t show solar production but rather solar that was produced and consumed, as excess solar is curtailed. On this day I was charging my 2 electric cars so load consumption was quite high. This is another graph where I was charging my BYD for longer

The first problem with Batteries is Depth of Discharge (DOD) and Li-ion batteries have a 80% DOD so you are only getting 8kWh out of a 10kWh battery. There are also some efficiency losses converting DC to AC to run the aircon. Aircon sizes and power draws vary. I designed my house to be very well insulated and well sealed. I use 8,500 BTU aircons that have a max power consumption of 680W, but most of the time it’s only the fan that is running. If you have big leaky windows your aircon will be constant cooling warm air that finds it’s way into the room so it will spend more time operating close to it’s max power consumption.

Good to know, thanks for that. I think that will be my plan. Maybe BYD will come up with a fix for repairing damage to the small plastic areas, because the rest of the car seems fine.

The solar panels will provide power during daylight hours. If your household load a night is about 500 watts, the battery should see you through the night. Installation is very difficult to estimate, because it varies so much based on the site and what ancillary equipment you use. Such as rails, brackets, cables and breakers. I think ฿20,000 would be a reasonable quote.

I felt the falling price of solar deserves it’s own topic https://aseannow.com/topic/1319773-solar-power-is-cheap-and-it’s-going-to-get-even-cheaper-very-soon/

Don’t listen to the barstool experts when they talk about solar being too expensive, they’re wrong - they usually are. https://www.pv-magazine.com/2023/11/23/solar-module-prices-may-reach-0-10-w-by-end-2024/ Tier one solar panels are already at ฿6.5/Watt Inverters are already as low as ฿4K per kW Batteries are already at ฿5k per kWh with expectations to see further substantial falls this year So just using the prices quoted above 5kW of Solar = ฿32,000 5kW Inverter = ฿20,000 10kWh Battery = ฿50,000 Total cost = ฿102,000 or ฿52,000 without the battery

I have already shared my payback. Using these figures for your example of 10kWh/day usage 5,000 watts of PV @ ฿5/W = ฿25,000 5kWh of BESS @ ฿5k/kWh = ฿25,000 5kW of Inversion @ ฿5k/kW = ฿25,000 Total cost (not including installation and ancillaries) = ฿75,000 Savings PEA Bill 3,650kWh/yr @ ฿5/kWh = ฿18,250/year Payback = 4 years Or Total cost including installation and ancillaries (estimated) = ฿100,000 Savings PEA Bill 3,650kWh/yr @ ฿5/kWh = ฿18,250/year Payback = 5.5 years

This guy put a wrap on, didn’t like it but it took the paint off when he pealed off the wrap https://www.facebook.com/share/p/6sczZMvBoCCvqrcN/?mibextid=I6gGtw

"I would think these stats have changed alot" 10% in 2010 and you think it is now over 50% But no evidence offered to support your thinking.

Mr Stuck Record - sorry Photo taken after car wash https://www.facebook.com/groups/bydsealthailand/permalink/230545010048178/

6 years ago while I was researching battery options I contacted Redflow and they gave me details of their reseller here in Thailand. Items manufactured in Thailand but made in factories located in free trade zones which are designed to encourage exports are treated as imported when they enter Thailand proper and taxed as such. I was quite interested in Redflow’s ZBM2 10kWh zinc-bromine flow battery made in Thailand. The price to purchase after it had been shipped from Thailand to Australia was ฿260,439 but in Thailand where it was manufactured, the price was ฿550,000 I bought some cheap deep cycle gel batteries instead and a few years later paid ฿69,000 for an equivalent sized LFP battery.

This is a common misconception made by visitors to Thailand that only see the big cities and resort towns. In fact the vast majority of Thais live in detached houses giving plenty of opportunities for adding solar.

Phone batteries and EV batteries are not the same. Leave your phone out in the sun here for a few minutes and it shuts down. EVs have active cooling. My car has a 580km range when it is new. The warranty on the battery is 8 years or 160,000km. If the capacity drops to less than 70% in that time (worse case scenario) the battery will be replaced. So after 8 years it will still have over 400km of range and fast 150kW charging speed. At home you will be slow charging using a 7kW wall charger compared to 150W DC rapid charger. So heat will not be a problem. When DC charging active cooling is working and charge speeds can slow if the temperature rises to much, although I have never experienced this unless charging over 80%. If you are really interested in EVs in Thailand, I started a discussion:

I have 2 Thai friends who have solar businesses and sell almost exclusively to Thais and they are very busy. Haven’t you seen solar panels for sale everywhere? Or maybe you don’t get out much. This is the solar group my wife is in and it has 180,000 members The comment you made about my car was also incorrect. The BYD Seal was the second best selling EV last month in Thailand, they sold over 3,000

Are you going to provide any evidence to support that statement? You clearly don’t have solar and yet you are posting in the Alternative/Renewable Energy Forum where many of us here have had solar for years.

6 years on no rats - the snakes eat them all