pattayadingo

Do they take your name and address / proof of residence when you tax it and get the basic insurance for your car or do you only need the book?

Thanks.

I had an accident and broke my toe and did some other minor damage to myself. I was taken to some hospital in the outback somewhere where they injected the toe with anesthetic, removed the nail, bandaged me up and gave me a Tetanus injection - all for 900 baht including the ambulance!! They did not have a surgeon on hand to fix the break.

Anyway they sent me back to Pattaya with the intention of dropping me off at Bangkok Pattaya Hospital on Sukhumvit. Instead, I went home and waited for an ex g/f to come from BKK to lend me a hand. And I am pleased I waited for her.

Pattaya Memorial off Pattaya Klang had no surgeon available either and sent us off to BKK Pattaya hospital. At this hospital they were talking of full anesthetic and surgery and keeping me in for 1 or 2 nights. The alarm bells in my head began to ring so I asked how much it would cost.

115,000 Baht. To fix a broken toe!!

I told them now way. Hell, I could fly to England 3 times and have it fixed for that amount of money and told them so.

The ex found one other place had a surgeon. Banglamung government hospital. Here they ( a nurse actually ) fixed the broken toe, sutured the wound with local anesthetic, kept me in overnight, cleaned the wound several times and gave me enough medicines to start a pharmacy. All for the princely sum of 4,500 Baht.

A big thanks to the staff at Banglamung hospital.

What a rip off at BKK Pattaya hospital who were going to take me to theatre and use a full anesthetic to do something a nurse did under a local anesthetic and it took her only a few minutes.

I need a clinic on Pattaya Klang, or nearby, to clean and re-dress (bandage) a broken toe.

Any recommendations please?

Thanks

How was she deceived? Even from her point of view? If I'd mentioned to her that I'd be willing to rent her and then refused, I could see that being a point of view. But I did not.

As I said, 95%+ of the girls working in farang areas, particularly bar-related ones, wouldn't consider being in a relationship with a farang without expecting some financial return.

This particular one was either innocent/stupid or honest in that she didn't try to deceive you.

I think it's likely she in no way thinks that what she proposed was "prostitution", in her culture it just isn't, it's just the normal type of arrangement for a TG to move in with a farang. And in fact she was offering her services at a very reasonable rate, which for her was a great sacrifice, not just financially but giving up face in the hope that she could make things work with you.

She'd only define prostitution as streetwalkers or explicitly P4P bar-girls, when the girl goes with many different multiple customers, not at all when there's only one. I admit it's splitting hairs, but that's how they preserve their self-dignity.

And most Thais would consider her much more worthy of contempt if she offered to move in with you for nothing, opening herself to being scammed by a horny farang looking to take advantage of good-natured TGs.

Which also happens a lot, you hear the young/handsome guys bragging all the time how they pulled a fast one just because the girl didn't state her ST price up front - dangerous shenanigans IMO but. . .

As would I (think her worthy of contempt), but in my case only if her intention was deceiving you into thinking she "really loved you" at such an early stage in the relationship, IOW the long con.

Listen you're free to define prostitution however you like and refrain from being a customer - just realize that there's a huge grey area out there, and IMO such an attitude leaves you much more open to being scammed, not less.

Odd that I have not been conned yet and long may that be the case.

We will agree disagree on what we feel is prostitution but to me a woman working in a bar generally does have customers and that would make her a prostitute in my eyes and a paid for 'g/f' from the off also smacks of prostitution to me or to put it a bit less offensively, a girl for hire by the month.

A 'financial return' makes it sound like work to me. Whereas me helping out because I am in a LTR with someone is different because I am doing it out of the goodness of my heart and have done so previously in village life.

As for her 'honesty' in the offer she made. That may well be the case in her eyes but I still will not accept what she or another similar woman wants if that is the case. Whatever her reasons for making the offer it could be she wants out of the scene or just a relatively easy ride through life.

It does seem as if we are splitting hairs to some degree but we all think about these things differently

Now I'm off to enjoy my freedom and single life and going to the pub

How was she deceived? Even from her point of view? If I'd mentioned to her that I'd be willing to rent her and then refused, I could see that being a point of view. But I did not.

As I said, 95%+ of the girls working in farang areas, particularly bar-related ones, wouldn't consider being in a relationship with a farang without expecting some financial return.

This particular one was either innocent/stupid or honest in that she didn't try to deceive you.

I think it's likely she in no way thinks that what she proposed was "prostitution", in her culture it just isn't, it's just the normal type of arrangement for a TG to move in with a farang. And in fact she was offering her services at a very reasonable rate, which for her was a great sacrifice, not just financially but giving up face in the hope that she could make things work with you.

She'd only define prostitution as streetwalkers or explicitly P4P bar-girls, when the girl goes with many different multiple customers, not at all when there's only one. I admit it's splitting hairs, but that's how they preserve their self-dignity.

And most Thais would consider her much more worthy of contempt if she offered to move in with you for nothing, opening herself to being scammed by a horny farang looking to take advantage of good-natured TGs.

Which also happens a lot, you hear the young/handsome guys bragging all the time how they pulled a fast one just because the girl didn't state her ST price up front - dangerous shenanigans IMO but. . .

As would I (think her worthy of contempt), but in my case only if her intention was deceiving you into thinking she "really loved you" at such an early stage in the relationship, IOW the long con.

Listen you're free to define prostitution however you like and refrain from being a customer - just realize that there's a huge grey area out there, and IMO such an attitude leaves you much more open to being scammed, not less.

There is a lot to consider here and a lot to be learned if open minded enough.

On re-read of the OP a relationship wasn't offered until she asked for it however she must have felt that she had a right to ask for the relationship in the first place. I have no problem with her entering into or expecting a financial arrangement in return for leaving the bar- I have a problem believing her character had not degenerated but completely changed from sweet, innocent keeper to stone cold foul mouthed hooker in a month.

Even now Mr Dingo is making excuses for her and as such I'm led to believe he's actively lying to himself, completely deluded to her true character or has left out (whether by accident or design) an integral part to the story.

Please note this is not an attack on on the OPs character just an honest opinion as solicited.

No attack taken

Using reasoning is not the same as using excuses and I'd like to think that I have used reason, especially to try to understand her attitude. The conclusion I came to is that she was upset at the time. That is not an excuse.

Other people have noted how quickly some Thai women fall into that trap of the B/G scene and in a two month period that is conceivable.

If you have no problem with a B/G wanting payment to leave the bar scene to live with you, that is up to you. I do not want to pay a B/G each month just to live with me, especially when it is her doing the asking and not me (not that i would). I'd rather contribute to a relationship financially because I want to, not because I am asked and that relationship would not include a B/G, but each to their own.

I and friends have witnessed some women go ballistic when thy think they have hooked someone but they have been played along by a holidaying foreigner. It is a sight to behold to see a woman played and beaten at her own game

But the idea of this topic was to generate ideas and opinions and that has happened and seems to have been a popular topic with little aggro in it too. That cannot be a bad thing in itself.

Next time, get an evisa...no scams then!!

http://www.mfaic.gov.kh/evisa/

E-visa not available through Trat. Limited crossing points accept e-visa.

If they blow their nose and cough phlegm into the pool, I'm glad i am not allowed in one.

I do miss having a bath though. I used to love watching the bubbles rise through the water to explode some noxious gas into the air when I let rip !!

Because Thai Visa forums can be such fun as well as being informative.

I'm on here when I am not making love to a beautiful Thai woman, out partying or watching my favourite television shows on my dvd player.

Maybe that many like myself may no be 100% happy with the way things are here in Thailand but that we live here because we want to. There are problems here but I do not feel the need to particularly mobilise to change things.

A trouble making site about Thailand would get blocked from here so many Thailand resident TV members would not be able to access it. Add that to the fact we are a very small minority here and we do not have residence status I feel most of it would fall on deaf ears.

I agree with robblok on this.

Sounds to me like a man with a wallet but no personality. You see these type of guys in the bars. All the women sat round having drinks bought and laughing about it later. I prefer to have the women come to me because I am me and not because I buy them drinks

Why waste money buying girls drinks ....... when you can just buy the girl? ........ DOH!

On a more personal note.

The only drink my wife will accept is fruit juice or iced tea. Very strict Buddhist (sadly), no alcohol or beef ever, no sex or meat on Buddha days (and she won't cook beef for me on Buddha day either).

I sometimes buy a woman a drink because I want to while I am talking to her. Depends on how I feel. I am after all a single man and that gives me free reign to do what I like as and whenever. When I have responsibilities or am in a relationship that is a different kettle of fish altogether.

My reason for calling it a con (offset) by quotation marks was not having a problem with her requirement but with her methodology, she looked for a quick sale for a quick commission, industries involved in quick sales teach us to look amongst family then friends first. She did, failed to close what she thought was a deal and then blamed the customer for not wanting the product.

OK, understand. From her POV she was the one who'd been deceived, she's most likely not capable of realizing that she could have got more by playing it long.

Which to me is a positive, not a negative, whether ignorance or honesty, often functionally equivalent.

I must admit I didn't see that angle when I read the OP - I'll go back and read - if she felt there was a relationship offered and was then stating the terms along which the relationship would function then my ramblings are of course incorrect and I must really learn to stop skim reading longer posts!!

How was she deceived? Even from her point of view? If I'd mentioned to her that I'd be willing to rent her and then refused, I could see that being a point of view. But I did not.

Maybe to her she thought, from what she had been told by others, that she could start by making a financial deal to start a relationship. In that case she was wrong, at least with me

This morning I went out for coffee, my 9 month old son came with me, the owner grabbed him off me for two hours and he was passed around the female customers, then I had him on my lap while the local college girls introduced themselves to us. And he's a wow with the hookers at the local bar. He also just delayed me posting this reply by 3 minutes.

He doesn't control my life, he enhances my life and introduces me to many attractive ladies (especially when mum isn't around, today she's attending high-school).

From personal experience, don't leave him alone with untrusted girls, not just talking about the sex workers either, some practices Thais consider normal are IMO not healthy and back home would definitely be prosecuted as abuse.

I have to say I don't bring my young ones to explicit sex industry venues, I want them to understand what they're seeing from a proper POV first, probably wait until they're at least eight or so. . .

How often I have seen foreign families take their children to a bar where the women are working and seen them swoon over a white child and that child being passed around. Some children are too young to understand what is going on others are old enough to see and understand to a degree.

When I see this happening at midnight and later, I have to question the morals and guidance of the parents. Women being groped and kissed and other occurrences like that cannot be all that good for a child to be watching.

When was the last time you saw a Thai child in a bar where women are selling themselves openly? I cannot recall such a time. Maybe that makes the morals of these working women better than that of some customers. Yet again I reiterate that not all these women are bad people for working where they work but do it out of what they deem to be a necessary evil.

MR OP , a facts of thai life ,-

why work ,,, be it in the laundry ,in a restauarnt , even teaching, for a pittance,, when a half good looking girl ,, can earn much, much more money ,, 20.000 - 60.000 bht ,/ mounth,,,, in the bars of phucket ,bkk , pattaya, granted would be less in the back waters , surin , udon , kk , etc.

thats the reason many issan ladies go for the easy opttion ,much easier , many money. a lot better than working in the rice fields , many sure. and the chance, of hooking a good / fat ATM.. i don,t blame them , i would do the same ,, if i had the bits and pieces, they have.

life is not fair ,

Having been in the Merchant Navy and been around a few places over the years I do know a bit about life and hardships. I also know that many women in prostitution are not always happy with what they do. Once you sit and chat to a lot of these women they are often choosy about who they will go with even for money.

A big problem is that too many people look at 'the goods for sale' and not at the woman or have any desire to get to know them and what they really think. Myself, I am happy to sit and talk to them, they can be interesting people. Yes many can be and are cold hearted. The life can make them that way. Many others have hearts but also have little option once they are into the 'trade'.

Life is not fair. If life was fair there would not be so many lonely old men as customers and not so many women working to supply them.

Sorry if this news upsets anyone but most Thai girls marry for love, not money.

I was going to 100% agree with this last, but on reflection I realize the truth isn't that straightforward. And of course for most Thai girls who marry older farang that isn't true at all, with the difference in age probably having a high negative correlation with the probability of your proposition.

The other qualifying factor is that since most Thai girls are dirt poor, the ones that allow themselves to marry for only love, without regard to any considerations of their future financial security would be pretty stupid wouldn't they. And I don't think most Thai girls are stupid, do you?

The degree to which a Thai girl already has some financial security in her life, IMO is generally the degree to which she'll permit the former to have more influence in her choice of mate above the latter.

However once you get up into the truly higher socio-economic circles, I suspect most girls there would not be willing to lose face and marry a totally skint guy, and if he's a farang even more so.

So perhaps the safest generalization (again IMO) is:

Most Thai girls will wait until they find the best of both worlds.

Some good points in that post.

Personally I'd believe it a case of 95% money with a big age difference of 30+ years. It has to be a rarity where a young woman in her 20's would be with an older man in his 60's for love, though it does happen.

Yes, if a woman needs love - and many Thai women would like a loving relationship IMHO - and they can have love with some reasonable amount security they would opt for that option very quickly.

Obviously there have to be other factors like family and peers to contend with because if the family say no to a relationship, especially the mother, that is usually the kiss of death in a relationship. Peers can be dealt with with a strong personality.

Ok, lets get back on topic please, and drop these personal arguments.

My apologies for replying to the comments you are referring to. I saw this post of yours afterwards.

I feel it is a good topic overall and would hate to see it closed because of some comments.

As far as I understood it, there was no relationship ( they may have had the makings of one), therefore why would money have to be discussed even? This young lady is not a dependent at all! that is entirely another matter!

What on earth has happened to "love" "excitement" "Butterflies" all the wonders of a making of a relationship.

I just dont buy into this third world poverty angle at all.

Of course sex workers have a place in this world, but I wouldnt recommend having a relationship with a SW. Purely my choice.

Tradition in Thailand is that you effectively buy your wife (no matter what her social background or educational level).

As my wife said to me (after about 6 months) "No woman in Thailand marries a man because she loves him, she marries a man she (or her parents) think can provide for her and her children, if later she learns to love him, that's a bonus (but not important)."

Sorry if this news upsets anyone but most Thai girls marry for love, not money.

bit simplistic - start a new topic, would like to drill down into what love in this instance constitutes. Love of money? Of him? of the security he provides or just plain old fashioned love...

as regards Laundry bird, it is conceivable that she changed in a short while but its more likely that this is who she always was and just learnt how to express it better if not correctly.

in my limited experience no "good" girl becomes a foul mouthed tramp with a sense of entitlement overnight. She was taught what was hers, she already believed it was hers and she decided the short "con" rather than the long game was the way to get it.

Or maybe she is desperate to escape an environment that is alien to her and tried in a haphazard way to find a way out and failed. then she used words she had learned from other women in the bar. Kee Neow (sticky sh*t) & Farang Kwai are normal Thai phrases. The F word isn't.

Of course I might be wrong on the point that she has always had this in her but I can only judge on what I knew of her before and what I heard the other day.

I bet there are many 'good' women start out in bars with the best of intentions and fall prey to the way the system works in these places. Watching and listening to the people you work with every day can easily change an impressionable person.

Just think about it like this, once you are no longer able to pay or get sick... what happens to the ones you pay to keep you company.

Funny how Thailand accumulates so many losers whose money can run out.

Thailand isn't the sort of country where those foreigners who aren't fully financed should be living.

Meaning that you are so seriously wedged up that you have covered your big arse for any eventuality! Come on Tommo you are talkiing a load of crap!

@ edwin

Just think about it like this, once you are no longer able to pay or get sick... what happens to the ones you pay to keep you company.

Funny how Thailand accumulates so many losers whose money can run out.

Thailand isn't the sort of country where those foreigners who aren't fully financed should be living.

Ok so its clear to you she stays with you for the money. No problem there, you know it your ok with it. You rented her you know your only redeeming asset is your money. I have no problem with that its your choice.

Money always can run out and people always can get sick. Has nothing to do with being a looser. Its a fact of life.

I agree with robblok on this.

Sounds to me like a man with a wallet but no personality. You see these type of guys in the bars. All the women sat round having drinks bought and laughing about it later. I prefer to have the women come to me because I am me and not because I buy them drinks

I find it difficult to believe that anyone with experience of Pattaya is surprised (or bothered) by any girl that decides to try and improve her income by working in a bar. And it's rather naive to assume that because she's turned to bar work it automatically makes her a "bad" girl.

I'm not surprised. Saddened is a better word.

Yes, I know it happens all the time in Pattaya and other similar places to other women. To me, to have known her before and to hear her now, is sad because it is more personal. I do not like to see someone who could have been a good friend - or maybe more - be sucked into this sort of life.

Yes PD, I also feel saddened for you.

You were the one to see her in the flesh, and witness the change. Other posters, not all, seem to tar all the girls with one brush including your J.

Admittedly you could pigeon-hole many of the girls, but there are always exceptions to the rule.

Good luck in your future quests for a meaningful relationship.

Have Fun on the way! Cheers.

Cheers for that

And I do hope to have more fun along the way and hope others do too.

Part of the reason for posting is the change in her that I have seen. I certainly did not expect such a quick change. Also if this topic gives others some insight into part of the life here and what can happen I feel that cannot be a bad thing. Too often we go to a bar and see the women working there and automatically label them without considering WHY they are there and I feel that is a sad indictment on society as we see it in places like Pattaya and similar places.

Roll on the future

Should have bought her a laundry shop.

Sorry, I have to laugh at that and hope I took it in the jest it was written with

Of course the fact that you in effect forced her out into the explicit sex trade reduced the odds of such a happy ending,

I did not force anyone into the sex trade and fail to see how you can come to that conclusion.

Gotta agree with the OP.

By BigJohhnyBKK's reasoning, I am responsible for the life trajectory of every women I've ever dated and not decided to marry.

Hogwash.

And there are lots of them- not because I'm popular, good looking or rich- but because I'm old and still single (again) and I've been around a loooong time.

Not a single one of them has ended up a prostitute, and even if any had, it certainly wasn't me that drove them to it.

Good post. I like and agree with your sentiments.

@BJB

1. Are you postulating that giving a regular allowance to a dependent is equivalent to explicit prostitution?

2. And do you think sex work is "wrong" in a moral sense, you just wouldn't want to associate with sex workers?

3. Or do you think that having such a relationship makes it impossible (rather than simply less likely) to have a "real" relationship?

As far as I understood it, there was no relationship ( they may have had the makings of one), therefore why would money have to be discussed even? This young lady is not a dependent at all! that is entirely another matter!

What on earth has happened to "love" "excitement" "Butterflies" all the wonders of a making of a relationship.

I just dont buy into this third world poverty angle at all.

Of course sex workers have a place in this world, but I wouldnt recommend having a relationship with a SW. Purely my choice.

Exactly. What did happen to love, excitement and butterflies in the making of a relationship. The wonderful desire of wanting to see someone every day, to hold their hand, to wake up on a morning with the urgent need to see them, to kiss and cuddle them.

If you are living together, to wake on a morning and gaze at their face as they sleep and for that to make you happy and buzz inside. Is that a romantic notion? Maybe it is but I'd rather stay a romantic at heart and wait, have the excitement of the chase and maybe find another woman like that, as I have had before in Thailand.

With regards to dependency I'd rather it be a mutual thing and have her go out to work - as i have said before - and then work out what is needed financially. Not simply to pay up and have a 'paid g/f'. It will never be a 50/50 relationship with regards to money but it should not be foreigners 100% paying.

She's working in Pattaya, she could have chosen a lot of other places to work in a laundromat. She went there for a reason, even if she was too shy to work in a bar at first she was hoping for a sponsor the whole time. She also knows you are in Pattaya, so assumes you are sleeping with prostitutes and are ok with paying for a girlfriend. She's there because she wants money, she expects that all foreigners in Pattaya will pay money for a girlfriend, so is upset when you don't pay out. You're looking in the wrong place if you don't want a girlfriend you have to pay a salary to, not likely to find it there.

I agree with 90% of what you say.

I do not expect to find a g/f in Pattaya and am not really looking for one here to be honest. And after chatting to a lot of the women here in Pattaya most do have stories. A few honest ones say they like what they do.

The flip side of the coin is that a whole lot of women will also not entertain a man who lives in Pattaya because they believe we are only here for sex.

I came to Pattaya for a change of scene. Yes, I like village life or small town life but I also love to party, have good English conversation and less difficulties with the language, that is why I am here.

In many ways I do like Pattaya and do defend it against many of the one line bashers of Pattaya, but now I'm once again looking for a quieter life elsewhere away from the 'madness' that can be Pattaya, though I will be back again at some point.

Nothing has changed the 'good woman'. She was always like that, you just didn't realize.

I do not think it was the 2 months working in a bar that changed the woman, it just brought out what was contolled/hidden or unseen by you.

I doubt that she was like this before hand. Having met some of her family they seemed decent hard working people. I feel I got to know her quite well. She had manners. I feel that her situation changed her and her beliefs have been altered by contact with others.

It is a gut feeling she really wanted out of the bar and when I refused what she was told she could financially get from a farang, she was shocked and surprised when I said no.

But, each to their own train of thought.

I agree with you. Some descend quicker into the abysss of he11 that the "entertainment" business is. I am not much of a drinker, but have visited the same places over the years and watched the transformation of the new hires. I think the biggest shock I ever had was a couple months ago when I saw a guy I had known for a year go for a quickie with a customer. This was someone who never ever would go with a customer, which is why I was so shocked. I didn't even think he did that. My long tine aquaintance at the bar said, don't be so surprised, his family was poor and they needed money. It was all about the money and if the price was right she'd do it too. (This woman is supposedly in an LTR, although her boyfriend works offshore.) My magical balloon of hope that used to keep me aloft with the notion that not everyone that worked in a bar was a whore was popped. I haven't been able to talk to this guy since, although he spotted me in Jungceylon and held out his hand and the best I could do was give a fake smile and say, ahh nice to see you, sorry I have to get to Big C. I haven't been back to the bar because I can't sit in front of someone that would say she'd cheat on her b/f if the money was right. (I suppose I should mention that she did say if she was married and had kids it would be different. Yea, right.) Maybe it's an open relationship, I don't know. Fact is, Thailand has such screwed up morals, one doesn't know if there is a sense of right and wrong to be found anywhere.

People talk about integrating and fitting in. Well sorry, in Patong that means adopting gutter morals. Maybe it's different up country or in Cha Am, I don't know. I only know Sodom and Gomorrah.

I have seen similar things too. Yet only the other night in one of my local bars is a lady who is in her 40's and she works serving drinks. She earns 3000 a month + tips and food ( the boss told me that is what she pays the women in her bar).

I asked if she has a boyfriend and she says she has, He is from Sweden. She is happy to be friendly with the customers and to have a laugh and a joke with us regulars too. The one thing she refuses to do is go with any of them for sex and I've seen her turn many offers down. She has drawn a line of how far she will go with the customers and refuses to go beyond it.

That tells me there are some women with good morals and what we might call a good old fashioned sense of duty.

On the other hand there was the woman who was happy to be in my bed several times before she flew off to Germany to be with her LTR.

So many different aspects of life here and I still prefer the attitude of the men and women in village life that I had before coming to Pattaya. Yet even some of those are obviously tainted.

Life here can be 'entertaining'.