oldcpu

Trying to understand what you are pondering here , ... I think, maybe you intended to say for the purpose of tax return determination? but not for exempt foreign income? Relevant is not only Royal Decree-18 (which states) but also Royal Decree 743 which, in one place, states: Those are two cases of exempt foreign income.

What tax rule is that? There is no such tax rule to the best of my knowledge - so you have me curious, wondering what rule you may have misinterpreted.

I agree with you - but I get the impression there is a view that global income (if remitted to Thailand ,even if tax exempt) is to be included in the determination if a tax return is needed. That is not my view, where mine is such remitted foreign income (if exempt per DTA or LTA or por-161/162) is not to be included in the tax calculation, which means not included in the assessment if a tax return is needed.

You need to read Royal Decree 18.

I don't fully understand your view. So are you claiming that income exempt Thai tax calculation (per a DTA/Royal Decree) should not be included in a Thai tax return form, but it should be used to decide of a Tax form return should be submitted? or are you saying its should be listed in a Thai tax return form, even thou the remitted tax exempt income is not mentioned anywhere in the tax form as an exemption? There is NO field in any tax form to deduct such DTA exempt income. For if said income is listed in a tax return form, again, there is no where (going back to 2017, and likely no where going back to 1969), .. is there any place under exempt income to list such DTA exempt income in a Thai tax return form. Thailand has had > 1/2 century to put such exemption field in a Thai tax return form and they have not put such in.

i think we are in agreement there. Where we don't yet see eye to eye is whether for cases that DTAs note foreign income is not taxable in Thailand (and hence Royal Decree-18 notes such is exempt) whether such tax exempt foreign income should be included in the calculation whether a tax return need to be submitted. My current view is such tax exempt foreign income should not be included in the tax calculation, ... and I believe your view is such tax exempt foreign income should be included in the tax return calculation (and then later, somehow, in a non-existent field in a Thailand tax return (which has been the case of no such exemption field for over > 1/2 century of Thailand tax returns) be deducted from tax payable on said tax return.

I replied on this in another thread. What in essence it does is lower the assessble tax threshold of a person (because such is likely exempt for purposes of tax calculation), and accordingly could contribute to the decision if a tax return is required or not required. .

I pointed out in a previous thread that Royal Decree 18 exempts taxation per the revenue code per selected DTAs. I did not note, but if you read the Royal Decree, it also makes it clear it is up to the Minister of Finance to be in charge and execute that Royal Decree. That Royal Decree came out in 1962. I confess I have not looked at Thailand tax forms (English & Thai language) going back to 1962, but I have looked back to 2017 (both languages). The best that I could observe, neither have a location on those tax forms to list income under DTAs as tax exempt. Yet the Royal Decree clearly states some foreign income can be tax exempt if covered under a DTA. It has ALWAYS been the case that foreign income remitted to Thailand in the year in which it is earned is taxable. If a tax return was required (despite such income being exempt (per Royal Decree/DTA)) then one would expect a location in the Thai tax form with a blank field for such income to be listed as an exemption. But there is NONE going back to 2017, and probably going back to 1962. Argueably, Thailand has over 1/2 century to put in the Thailand tax forms an exemption field for DTAs that are tax exempt. Thailand has not. Why? Why not? My interpretation (and I believe the interpretation of the Minister of Finance) is that any income that a DTA/Royal-Decree-18 notes is exempt Thai taxation (per Thai revenue code) is in fact exempt for taxation calculation. And hence since it can not be taxed (per Royal Decree-18/DTAs) it does not belong in a tax form, which means it does not form part of evaluating the level of assesable income. So if one has inadequate other income, it could equate to there being no requirement to file a Thai tax return. Once again - this is not new. Royal Decree (and Double Tax agreements) have been in place for decades. And for decades, there is no place in the Thai tax forms under exemptions to place income from DTAs.

With regards to point #2, note that Royal Decree 18, that notes Thailand compliance with Double Tax Agreements, states (translation): So Royal Decree 18 DOES exempt taxes per the DTAs (where applicable per individual DTAs). Does that help clarify this a bit in your view?

Where the discussions and disagreements tend to be is which income is assessable and which income is exempt (for the purpose of the tax calculation) [and hence not to be on a tax return form]. For a while, there were some who were saying exempt remitted income from before 1-January-2024 was assessable and had to included on a tax return (and then deducted) and that a tax return from those where that was their only funds brought into Thailand had to still file a tax return. I believe they are close now to have been proven wrong. Such exempt remitted income/savings (pre-Jan-2024) has been stated not to be on a tax return submission by some of the youtube tax advisor(?) / educators(?)) where further one or two noted that no Thai income tax return is required if the only source of year 2024 remitted funds to Thailand is income/savings from before 1-Jan-2024. And ... in the most part, those who claimed such (por-161/162 income/savings had to be on a tax return with the same income/savings then deducted on the same tax form (where there was no place on a tax return to deduct such)) are now in the most part silent in regard to funds covered by por-161/162 (or they have switched their view). Still - the discussions as to what is assessable income (re: income not taxable by Thailand due to some (not all)) DTAs continues (despite there being NO PLACE on either English nor Thai language Thai tax forms for DTA exempt income to be listed as exemptions). I suspect we will see opinions evolve on the demarcation for assessable income (in regards to income exempt for the purpose of tax calculation).

Yes - I find the words "state pension" or "government pension" as used by some on Aseannow a bit ambiguous, which is why I avoided using such words in my post. The DTAs, to the best of my knowledge, are more precise in defining the pensions (noting such for services rendered to government where applicable) - and IMHO don't have those ambiguities.

I wish it was three years - but sadly only 1 year.

User OJAS provided you a link to the Thai-Austria tax agreement. Note also that there are two Thai Revenue Department ministerial directives that are relevant: por-161/162. Together, what they in essence say is if any money you remit into Thailand can credibly be income/savings from BEFORE 1-January-2024, then it is exempt from Thailand tax. So make note as to how much money (ie cash) you had outside Thailand on 31-Dec-2023, and if you can show that money you brought into Thailand during year 2024 came from that pre-1-Jan-2024 'income/savings' accounts, then it need not be reported on a Thailand tax form. Clearly its important here that you have records of all of your accounts as of close business 31-Dec-2023, and also keep a record of all subsequent withdrawals from those accounts to support an approach (if audited) , if you try to claim 2024 remitted money to Thailand was pre-1-Jan-2024 savings/income.

There are limits to what accounts OECD via CRS has access to. For example: In the Canadian agreement with OECD it is quite clear that information on Canadian government regulated accounts for individuals (ie registered Canadian tax free accounts for money growth such as RRSPs, RRIFs and some others) are NOT reported to OECD via CRS, and Canada is under no obligation to provide such to OECD. Thailand has a similar agreement for Thai government regulated accounts of individuals. That may be a mute point - but I thought it important to make the observation that all information on all accounts is NOT provided via CRS to OECD.

Indeed. And further to your point some DTAs even say that (if pension not a civil servant/military pension) then the pension can only be taxed in the country of residence ... For example German pensions for those who are not civil servants/military pensioners are not to have their pensions taxed in Germany (if one is a resident of Thailand), but can only be taxed in Thailand . ... and then there is the Canada-Thai DTA that pretty much states any Canadian sourced pensions (or similar remunerations) can ONLY be taxed in Canada (and not taxed in Thailand ,even if one a resident of Thailand). The two DTAs could not be much more different in that aspect. IMHO it simply underscores the importance to check the DTA with Thailand of the source country of one's pension (where many on this and other threads on AseanNow have noted the importance to check such).

I picked up my International Driver's Licence today. All went very smooth once the LTR visa aspect was sorted.

I suspect there are only a handful of such threads needed dedicated to specific countries and the remainder could be lumped into one thread. Case in point, there is an old thread for DTAs for Canada , and that thread is dead as a door nail :

I purchased the Thai Government bonds to top up the money needed meet the BoI requirement of $250K US$ investment in Thailand as part of the requirement for a Wealthy Pensioner who is only claiming the > $40K US$ equiv/year income. No. One year bond is NOT adequate. 5-year is not adequate. It needs to be a 7 year or 10-year. I purchased the new bonds at a local Bangkok Bank Branch. Frankly, I did not care about the interest rate. If you are looking for an investment in Thailand with a good interest rate, then FORGET THIS APROACH (I put in caps deliberately). I did not care about the interest rate. I bought 2-million THB in Thai government bonds. Interest was 3%. 7-year maturity. Tax is automatically with drawn before interest paid. I was asked for a Thai TIN (which I did not have) when applying for the bond. I gave the bank my pink-ID #, their computer accepted that, and I obtained the bond. Frankly, the 3% interest worries me as being too high - as it could mean I will have to file a Thai tax return. My hope (??) is the automatic withholding tax will mean I don't have to file an income tax return. The Bank of Thailand (from whom Bangkok Bank gets the bond) would only give me a bond book, and not a bond certificate. BoI would not initially accept copy of the bond book. In the end, Bangkok bank printed on the last page of the bond book the bond interest rate, maturity/redemption date, and that satisfied BoI. But to re-iterate, I did not buy the bonds for investment. This was just money to top up the BoI $250K US$ requirement. The remainder of the $250K US (not covered by the 2-million THB in bonds) was my 50% ownership of my condominium unit (my wife owns the other 50%). And the 3% interest could bite me in the butt and force me to file a Thai tax return.

Thankyou for sharing your experience. I assume that your pension is a civil servant or military pension. I suspect there are some on the forum who won't believe you. I appreciate your sharing in spite of the disbelievers.

Thankyou for that. That should hopefully be helpful for those who have US Tricare. My hope is that those who have private health insurance from outside of Thailand (such as European Cigna or other) post an example of their letter (deleting personal aspects) so that those of us, with such non-Thai branch health insurance, can send such to our health insurance companies so that such can be used as a pro-forma that has been shown to meet BoI requirements.

Lol. I wish Revenue Canada saw it that way. Then my Canadian taxes would be much less. 😅

I think it depends on the individual. Given the local RD office refused me a Thai Tax ID, which I needed for some foreign trading accounts, by using my Thai pink ID #, in place of a Thai tax ID #, I was able to ( in a very timely time critical moment) unfreeze and transfer the trading accounts, and earn over $100k Cdn$. With out the pink ID I would have missed the stock buying opportunity that made me a lot of money. So a waste of time? I guess it all relative. I am not so wealthy that I consider $100k Cdn$ a waste. Good for you that you have so much money that you can thumb your nose at $100k Cdn$. I can only wish to have that much money to consider such a waste. Again, it depends on the individual and their situation.

In what line in the tax form do you plan to enter the exemption, and what is the precise description in the tax form for that line entry?

Ok. I do hope your approach works for you. I think thou, your situation is the DTA of your source country allows Thailand AND the source country to both tax some of your foreign sourced income. I believe (if correct) that has influenced your view. That is VERY different from countries whose DTA only allows only the source country to tax a specific income (and not Thailand). I do caution you not to include a tax exempt income if there is no place to deduct that income in the tax form. You could end up paying tax on that tax exempt income. I wish you all the best in sorting any problems that may cause you.

if it was exempt from Thai tax and not from filing, there would be an entry in the English AND Thai tax forms under tax exemptions. There is no entry in any 2017 to 2023 English/Thai nor 2024 (Thai) in the tax form exemption list. So by deduction that is exempt from including that income in the tax calculation in the tax forms.