JimGant

The flex points are between five months, seven months, and the two months of the new season's beginning. But, yeah, slighty disjointed, indeed.

You're right. They need to bring these folks under the same insurance mandate now required of OA extenders.

The OA's are an anomaly -- that's a whole, sad, not thought out program. But, the majority of retirees in Thailand are not OA's -- and that's where the requirement, from the Thai side, for self-insurance makes sense.

They're not looking for that pile of money you spend down to live day to day -- they're looking for a self-insurance pile of money, available for emergencies, that can't be dipped into, except for such emergencies. That they allow you to cut in half (to 400k) for part of the year, does show their fairness of flexibility. But, they certainly don't want that pile empty, on the day you crash your motorcycle -- and then run up huge hospital bills -- and don't have any medical insurance. Makes complete sense, since only folks with Non Imm OA extensions require medical insurance to live here in retirement. So, why not require the uninsured to have a dedicated source of funds that a hospital you stiffed can legally attach. Sounds fair to me, especially if I were a Thai, paying Thai taxes, and not wanting any of those taxes bailing out hospitals stiffed by indigent farangs. And, actually, if I were a Thai tax payer -- letting that self-insurance fund dip below 800k makes little sense. Stay tuned....

I find that getting my bank letter in the morning -- and have the clerk update the passbook *plus* make a photocopy of the passbook's last page -- eliminates having to visit Immigration's photo copy center just to do a one page copy, which I'd have to do if I'd updated my passbook outside the bank. I learned this the hard way, last year at CM, when I forgot to have the bank clerk make the photocopy. As a result, for an early afternoon appointment, I had to stand in a huge queue at the photocopy center, as they, like Imm, close for lunch. Thus, maybe updating at an outside the bank machine has less utility than you think.....

Sounds like LMG's policy, as they're the only ones, I believe, jumping the required policy coverage of 3M baht to a policy of 3.5M inpatient coverage. And, if this is the policy you have, then you do have a 60K baht outpatient coverage (not that it's required in the police order).

I think you're right. A few years back on this forum we did some number crunching of alternatives. Funding a Wise account and sending money from that was the winner. For some reason I've stayed with the bank debit option, finding it wasn't too far more expensive. Maybe I should relook the numbers....

As long as you don't have a re-entry permit. Don't know if you can do a same-day turnaround....

I assume your Chase bank is in the US... If so, I don't see the option for a "bank transfer" as a way to get money to Wise and then on to Thailand. If I'm to send money through Wise from my US bank, my options are: bank debit (ACH); wire transfer; debit card; or credit card. All my transfers over the years have been bank debit (ACH) -- and these are an ACH "pull" by Wise from my US bank account, which I established with Wise, using two trial deposits. A bank transfer is a "push" from your account -- so, yeah, you might run into trouble with your bank, unlike "pull" activity. But, as far as I can tell, bank transfers aren't an option for sending US dollars -- but they are for sending GBP and EURos. What am I missing here?

Not 100% certain, but this subject has been investigated on this forum for ages, as many of us would like to avoid probate with our bank accounts. And nobody has produced bank paperwork that would allow establishment of a POD beneficiary. Why? Maybe because Thailand doesn't honor trusts; and a POD is a form of trust. In the US, a POD is also called a "Totten Trust." So, for whatever reason, maybe Thailand doesn't allow POD type beneficiary arrangements due to their strange approach to trusts: And, no, I'm not an attorney. My mother and father were married.

Indeed. Let us know how it goes...

While physically in Thailand?

Don't quite follow...... If you reject the exclusions, LMG rejects your application in total. Thus, you get a rejection letter from LMG to show to Imm, to thus enable you to self insure. Right?

I thought we could go to our local Imm office to activate....? If LTR requires a trip to Bangkok, no thanks. Two hours to renew my current retirement extension at Chiang Mai Imm beats a roundtrip, with possible night overstay, to Bangkok -- not to mention peeing in a cup while in gridlock traffic.

I recall your post from another thread, and I believe the police order's mention of "partial denial" of insurance policy doesn't really apply to pre-existing conditions. Not sure what it applies to, but most (all?) insurance companies will write policies, excluding pre-existing conditions. But, with such a policy to wave at Immigration, you will have met their requirement for a TGIA policy needed to extend off of an OA visa. They're certainly not going to say, "You must show $100,000 self insurance in the bank to cover your pre-existing diabetes." Thus, the "partial denial," whatever the Thai translation, is just a confusion factor. Christ, my LMG policy has a pre-existing condition of terminal pancreatic cancer. Heck, just another exclusion line item in my policy (joke).

LMG appears to be the cheapest. The insurance is virtually worthless, if you go with the 1M baht deductible, which is per procedure, as I read it. But, it does satisfy the OA extension health requirement, which is all I want, as I have home country health insurance that gives me full coverage. Here's the latest link, with an interesting update: You can get a policy up to and including age 80 (renewable until age 100). The cutoff age used to be age 75. https://www.lmginsurance.co.th/en/long-stay-visa-plus-premium-plan-100000-usd And looking at the at the premium tables, which are the same as their older representation, I can renew through age 80 at 36,700 baht. The older table had my renewable premiums, after age 75, at 68,500 baht. Thus, a little less ridiculous price for a worthless policy. I believe LMG is the only one holding out a "3.5M baht" policy, when the police order only calls for a 3.0M baht policy. Why? Maybe they were hedging against an appreciating dollar, as the police order seems pretty emphatic about a $100,000 USD face value. Anyway, they under estimated.... But, I'm sure Thai health policies written in baht are the only sensible way to go. So a 3M policy, or a 3.5M LMG policy, should be entirely acceptable by Immigration. Lim, yes you'll need to cover the 3M requirement when you extend in November -- unless another police order comes out before then (doubtful). LMG requires no physical and will write a policy with as many preexisting conditions as you feel like declaring. It really is a joke, but it checks the OA health square.

Yeah, I look at the 800k as a sunk cost -- and one from the liquid, mattress end of my US retirement portfolio (i.e., only earning .08% in a savings account). So, opportunity cost is zip. But, as a non traveler, the Elite Visa would still require an annual visit to Immigration for a new extension stamp. So, don't really see the utility. Plus, why give a million baht to the Thai gov't, when a million baht left to some really nice Thai nieces and nephews would certainly ease their journey into old age. No. Going the Elite Visa route doesn't add up in my situation -- and is pretty selfish in the estate planning realm. (But, for frequent travelers, it might make sense -- as long as your wheelchair fits into the jetway...)

Yeah, great question. The LTR website certainly seems to say it's a "five year permission of stay."Great! If that means, for this non traveler, that I only have to go to Imm once every five years -- sold! But as earlier discussion, above, has shown -- confusion remains between what constitutes a visa -- and what constitutes a permission (subsequently an extension) of stay. BoI may be conveniently obfuscating this confusion, in the interest of sales. BoI also handles SMART visas, and here's what's said in relation to their permissions of stay: If so, why couldn't LTR visas warrant a five year permission of stay stamp? But, spend a lot more money on an Elite Visa, and here's what you get: So, if you don't travel during the year, plan to visit Immigration to renew your one year extension of stay. Doesn't quite add up in the realm of reducing visits to Immigration for non travelers..... (but, appears these types of visas were not set up for us fully-retired geriatrics). Anyway, one more question to sort out, just like -- is a visit to Bangkok anywhere in the application/renewal requirements? Hmmm.

Negative. That visa, like all visas, allows you to apply for entry into Thailand. Immigration has the discretion to, in the OA case, stamp you in for one year. Or to not stamp you in and send you back whence you came. Or stamp you in equivalent to valid period of required health insurance. The visa is certainly NOT the permission for a length of stay. In the US, that separate stay document is an "Admitted" stamp, designating your visa type and for how long you can stay. Or, in lieu of a stamp, many countries are now issuing "permission of stay" documents to be carried in your passport. In either case, you get that permission (or not) when you apply at an Immigration gateway with a valid visa (unless allowed a visa waiver option -- which still requires a permission stamp).

But, you can self-insure, with $100,000 in either a Thai bank, or a home country bank. So, this option is available to me. They've finally allowed a self insurance option for OA retirement extensions; but the 3 million baht must be in a Thai bank. Thus, LTR would better meet the insurance requirement for me -- until they finally figure out how to accept my Tricare insurance.

Makes sense for "Wealthy Global Citizens," where you need to show two years' proof of income. So last year's tax return, like a 1040 for Yanks, would show income and related taxes. Then, for this year, you'd need statements, like what the Air Force and Social Security send me in December, i.e., new pay rates for the upcoming year. But "Wealthy Pensioners" don't need two years' worth of income proof, so not sure where they're coming from with this..... Oh, well -- my current retirement extension has 11 months to run, so I can sit back and watch the chips fall. And the only reason the LTR looks attractive to this non traveler is 'cause it provides a release from the OA health insurance requirement (and maybe in 11 months my Tricare will finally be accepted).

There's another BoI site that addresses LTR application. Click on this: https://visa.boi.go.th/ Click on "Documents Required for Wealthy Pensioners" then note item 10 under "Evidence of Income:" Hmmm. Doesn't exactly match the income evidence found at this site: https://ltr.boi.go.th/ Anyway, believe the latter site is the main man. The site with income tax evidence appears to be a lash up of LTR added to an older SMART visa site... ... but it doesn't exactly inspire confidence that everyone's on the same page at BoI (also note the requirement for a photo -- didn't someone on this thread get asked to provide a photo (?) -- so maybe it is a requirement...

The quote about a visa being a permission of stay is from TerraplaneGuy

Woops, my mistake. Sorry.

My point exactly. But, not sure where you're coming from with this: