Credo

I had a former neighbor who was a big fan of Hydroxychloroquine. He was taking that until the Ivermectin craze came along. He switched. He got Covid. He died. Oh, and he found a doctor that prescribed both, so it was done under 'medical supervision'. I think the family is contemplating suing the doctor. That could be an interesting case.

And the cigar goes to ......?

Apparently, it doesn't make you any smarter though.

How wrong you are. Kids who are bullied don't seek isolation. They seek acceptance.

I tend to think schools should open. I am not very trusting of the government, though. In most of the world, schools were closed when cases were high and opened when the cases dropped. In Thailand they did the opposite. The closed when cases were low and are planning on opening when cases are high.

If you are in the age or risk group, then definitely get it. If you are not and you are 6 to 8 months out from your 2nd vaccination, then it's a good idea if you can.

I pay precious little attention to anti-vaxxers. Unless they start spouting nonsense, I give them a pass. If you want to forego employment because your employer requires it, that's fine with me. I won't be encountering you working in a store. If you want to forego the countless other things, like getting on a plane or train or long-distance bus, then fine with me. You are welcome to sit in your ever-narrowing world and not be vaccinated. Oh, and if you want to forego being able to get a visa to stay in Thailand or even to visit, it's no skin off my back. Enjoy your ever dwindling world.

Well, apparently all those precious 'freedoms' that some people perceive as being taken away are only for young people. The elderly can be deprived of all their rights so that some people don't have to get a vaccine. Interesting.

There is no mention of Trump in the post.

Of course, if vaccination rates are high enough, we will see most ICU's empty. The areas with full and overcapacity ICU's are in areas with low vaccination rates and poor mitigation.

Oh, so your commentary is only about the hospital? Do you think if there were significant fewer covid cases that this would have happened? Oh, and this is what the article says. Because of the surge of the delta variant of COVID-19, hospitals have been overwhelmed with patients and there were no ICU beds available for Wilkinson. But if you don't like that example then try this one of a guy who was refused a bed at 43 hospitals. Oh, and no staff were being fired when this happened because there were NO vaccine mandates, so try not to deflect: Alabama man dies after being turned away from 43 hospitals as covid packs ICUs, family says https://www.washingtonpost.com/health/2021/09/12/alabama-ray-demonia-hospitals-icu/

The Covid test upon arrival is ridiculous. The opening only applies to airline travel and anyone flying in is going to have been most likely had a test for the flight. Those tests to give false results, so I test negative, fly in, test positive and end up in isolation (or worse). Then I suspect big problems getting a flight back.

I tend to agree. I don't trust the Thai government. I think they would tread lightly on any Condo that is majority Thai owned.

I'd be very interested to know just what vaccine is being given to all the politicians' children and what vaccine those making the medical decisions for thousands are giving to their kids?

I doubt we will ever really go back to normal. I think normal will be redefined. I think after pretty much every major pandemic has caused social changes that we don't go back on.

It should be a personal choice, but it isn't because it's a public health issue. When there is a risk of giving a disease to others, then your choices get limited. Just like Tuberculosis, you don't get to walk around and give it to others. It is the price we pay to live in large groups. If people don't want to work, don't want to eat out or go shopping and live an austere isolated hermit type life, then perhaps they can avoid the vaccine. Otherwise, we are a risk to one another.

I don't know what you expect, but I know we aren't here to be 'original' or to give responses to meet your idea of what is good. This thread is about people who will or won't take the vaccine and why. We have a reasonably good idea of the long term effects of vaccines in general. There are very long-term studies on the traditional vaccines. The only difference is this one substitutes some part of the Covid-19 virus in the adjunct. Other than the occasional anaphylactic reaction by people new to vaccination, the information and data is there. For the mRNA vaccine, the technology has been around, and used, since the mid-1990s. No mass produced vaccines were made from mRNA until Covid-19, but the technology has been tested and shown to be safe. mRNA vaccines have had previous trials for everything from influenza and Zika to HIV. So, we have a very good idea that all the technical information for vaccines is there. The only difference is what viral fragment is attached to it. For the mRNA there is none, but a messenger RNA strand that enters the cells, bind with the cells mRNA and teaches it to make a protein that identifies the protein in the spike Covid-19 virus. The traditional vaccines use the existing mRNA to do the same thing. We don't know the long term effects of Covid-19. We know what life was like before Covid. We know that there hasn't been long term effects from vaccines, except to get rid of a disease. Everybody has a somewhat different immune system. Some people have a robust response to a vaccine (or a disease), some have an overreaction, a cytokine storm, and other's just don't get much of an immune response at all. There's nothing wrong with being skeptical. There's nothing wrong with questioning, but the answers are the answers.

Unfortunately, your choice NOT to take the vaccine does affect what goes into my body. The virus, which is spread primarily by the unvaccinated, might just end up in my body, it might end up in children's body or their teacher. So, if you chose not take the vaccine, please stay home and away from everyone. Please wear a mask whenever you go out. If you are going to endanger me and my family, then I think you can take a little inconvenience as well.

I hope that works out for them, but I have my doubts. I had rather elderly relatives who visited some years back and I took them on all the tours, everywhere from Chiang Mai to Bangkok. They finally reached a point where they wouldn't get off the bus. They were really, really tired of seeing temples. They enjoyed the markets and some shopping, but the highlight was an (early) evening trip to Patpong. Both the market and a drink in one of the bars was a treat and they felt like they saw what Thailand was famous for. They were a little too conservative to take them to anything too seedy, but they enjoyed what they saw. The Temples and culture is nice and interesting, but it's the vibrant night life that is a major attraction, even for people who are older, not too adventurous and cautious.

I am aware of one school that fired 6 teachers who refused to get vaccinated a while ago. The only choice was Sinovac and the school made arrangements for all the teachers to be vaccinated. They wouldn't and they were discharged immediately.

If you are vaccinated and get a breakthrough case with the Delta variant, you are infectious. If it is one of the other variants or the original strain, you will not be infectious. Breakthrough infections are still not common. If you do not get Covid, you can't pass it on. If you get vaccinated you have a much, much better chance of never being infected in the first place.

I think you are confused about vaccine passports and vaccination records for foreigners to enter a country. They are two very different things.

I find it interesting how hindsight is 20/20 and everybody views the past through the knowledge of the present. Everything we now know was not known at the beginning of the pandemic. Were there missteps? Yes, but none of them were made in bad faith. Masks would have been a good idea from the get-go. But that would have been a big problem for some countries. I was in the US when Covid was becoming a concern. Virtually no masks. When I arrived in Thailand, everyone was wearing a mask. But no one seemed to know the actual behind it at that time. I attended a meeting with a group of colleagues. They all arrived wearing a mask, but removed them for the meeting -- in an enclosed area. When they went outside, they put them back on. It took time for scientists to figure out what masks worked. It took even more time to figure out that a cloth mask will work, just not as effectively. Even now I see a lot of incorrect use of masks. It's not easy for a populace to get this right. Most people don't seem to remember they are worn in conjunction with SOCIAL DISTANCING. Lockdowns work, but they are hard to enforce and can't really be used long-term. Most people forget the early lockdowns were geared toward keeping the health care system from collapsing. In that regard, they were effective. The damage to the economy is a whole different discussion.

Personally, I'll post this study on Facebook. Should scare the B'Jeezus out of a few of the people I know who are anti-vaxxers, anti-maskers, pro HCQ and Ivermectin. I wonder if they know how to fact check anything?

I think the one cherry picking data is you. The chances of a breakthrough infection are 1 in 5,000. That's a pretty good record. Since the first group vaccinated were the elderly, they are the first to experience waning immunity. It is also well known that the immune system in the elderly is less robust and that many did not show the same level of production of antibodies as younger people. So, yes, they are at higher risk of breakthrough infections. Still it remains low. Very low, I might add. https://news.yahoo.com/one-5-000-real-chances-183201138.html So, we know that breakthrough infections are most common among the elderly but the actual reasons are a little tricky. Is it because of waning immunity or is because of a less vigorous immune response? The other group that commonly have breakthrough infections are the immunocompromised. Again, the bodies immune response and the production of antigens is less than those who are not. But even with that you are 29 times more likely to end up hospitalized if you are unvaccinated than if you are vaccinated. https://medical.mit.edu/covid-19-updates/2021/08/breakthrough-infections The variants are the big unknown, but variants can only occur when the virus is spreading. The more vaccinations given, the more other mitigating efforts, such as social distancing and mask wearing, the fewer the infections and the less infections and the less infections the less mutations will occur.