Teach Thailand without formal Degree

[sklmeeera]

I know its possible to work illegally in Thailand but is it possible to somehow get a work permit without a degree ? Assuming that one qualifies as a teacher with the experience ?

[Slip]

Possible, but not easy, at least in the OBEC schooling system.

[masuk]

In my opinion, the minimum requirement is the TEFL certificate.  (Teaching English as a Foreign Language).  This at least teaches the concepts of language learning, activities, references, teaching methods, and strengthens the grammar and punctuation.

A degree in say, horticulture, or soil science, is not really going to help.

[kingstonkid]

With the new rules about working I think it will be hard

 

It depends where you are looking

 

Your best bet would be to see If a.M agency will hire you

[dairy queen]

Thailand being Thailand, anything is possible. That said, if you want to get a teacher's license [which is required in order to get the work permit] it'll be an uphill struggle without a degree.

It's been a while since I was a teacher, but this was the case 10 years ago, and I doubt that things have changed much since then...

[anon467367354]

it's pretty much a shame where in this country two parties can't contract to do business together without the government interfering. Who really suffers from this micromanagement meddling? The Thai people of course. This government is so out to control the foreigners that they just can't see who it really hurts. Obviously the Thai people are just not smart enough to decide how to spend their hard earned money on what services on their own, they need to be controlled by an entity that is completely out of touch with the people.

I wonder what would happen if this issue were put to vote, the democratic way.

[brewsterbudgen]

As others have said, it's possible but not easy. Language schools and corporate teaching would be your best bet.

[12DrinkMore]

33 minutes ago, gr8fldanielle said:

it's pretty much a shame where in this country two parties can't contract to do business together without the government interfering. Who really suffers from this micromanagement meddling? The Thai people of course. This government is so out to control the foreigners that they just can't see who it really hurts. Obviously the Thai people are just not smart enough to decide how to spend their hard earned money on what services on their own, they need to be controlled by an entity that is completely out of touch with the people.

I wonder what would happen if this issue were put to vote, the democratic way.

 

I am not sure that you posted in the right thread.

 

Although I agree that governments around the globe have become self-serving and increasingly see their role at micro-managing the populations, I also find it sensible that qualifications are required before allowing people to work at professional jobs. It is not just Thailand.

 

 

[zyphodb]

51 minutes ago, gr8fldanielle said:

it's pretty much a shame where in this country two parties can't contract to do business together without the government interfering. Who really suffers from this micromanagement meddling? The Thai people of course. This government is so out to control the foreigners that they just can't see who it really hurts. Obviously the Thai people are just not smart enough to decide how to spend their hard earned money on what services on their own, they need to be controlled by an entity that is completely out of touch with the people.

I wonder what would happen if this issue were put to vote, the democratic way.

You don't get it, they don't want to make it easy for the general population to learn English, people would then be able to learn properly on the English speaking internet which they can't on the severely restricted Thai language one, The last thing a government run by the elite, for the elite needs is an educated population, this would be very dangerous for them....

[Jimdandy]

You might be able to get your 'foot in the door', then I would suggest you get the formal credentials finished either online or brick and mortar as soon as you can.

[Foozool]

You just need to pick some language schools and show yourself. You won't get satisfactory answer by phone calls. 

Good luck

[Ridge]

Short answer: yes

Long answer: yes, it's possible

[JimP]

I am sure there is some loophole the OP could exploit to obtain a work permit without the proper credentials.  What kind of standard of living does the OP expect to have working in a school that accepts someone without a degree? Let's say one does find work for a dodgy language school, or a countryside school without the proper credentials. There is still a waiver system, which makes sure of two things: 1. commitment/entrapment to one school whether you like it there or not 2. self-guided professional development while the school awaits a degree with 'Education' in its title.  Professional development courses like the PGCEi can run as high as 200,000 baht.  What person working in a Thai government school or a language school could realistically afford that?   

 

I think the question should be not whether the OP could teach in Thailand without proper credentials, but whether one would actually want to.  Look forward to large classes, little pay, and minimal support. But hey, if that's your thing, go for it.

 

[brewsterbudgen]

I am sure there is some loophole the OP could exploit to obtain a work permit without the proper credentials.  What kind of standard of living does the OP expect to have working in a school that accepts someone without a degree? Let's say one does find work for a dodgy language school, or a countryside school without the proper credentials. There is still a waiver system, which makes sure of two things: 1. commitment/entrapment to one school whether you like it there or not 2. self-guided professional development while the school awaits a degree with 'Education' in its title.  Professional development courses like the PGCEi can run as high as 200,000 baht.  What person working in a Thai government school or a language school could realistically afford that?   
 
I think the question should be not whether the OP could teach in Thailand without proper credentials, but whether one would actually want to.  Look forward to large classes, little pay, and minimal support. But hey, if that's your thing, go for it.
 

A degree (which can be in any subject) doesn't equal teaching credentials. A decent TEFL course, like a CELTA or Trinity, does. However, like it or not, a degree is normally required by schools. As I said earlier, corporate teaching, for which there is a big market in Bangkok, is less restrictive, as are some language schools which pay well for IELTS and other exam prep.

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[Dumbastheycome]

8 hours ago, gr8fldanielle said:

it's pretty much a shame where in this country two parties can't contract to do business together without the government interfering. Who really suffers from this micromanagement meddling? The Thai people of course. This government is so out to control the foreigners that they just can't see who it really hurts. Obviously the Thai people are just not smart enough to decide how to spend their hard earned money on what services on their own, they need to be controlled by an entity that is completely out of touch with the people.

I wonder what would happen if this issue were put to vote, the democratic way.

It needs  to be   considered  that  although  there  may be genuine individuals  who  are  frustrated  by the  mandate of  regulation that those  same individuals  are  not  aware  of the  fraudulent pretenders  it is designed  to  limit.

Thai people  are  no less  gullible  than  any  other  population in reality  but need  some  level of  defence   via  regulatory requirements such as  this as  any  other   nationality.  Two  party contracts   may well  be possible. But  pseudo two  party  (  third  party school employment)  is  what the   regulations  are  intended  for. Not  unreasonable   to  my  thinking.

[anon467367354]

11 hours ago, Dumbastheycome said:

It needs  to be   considered  that  although  there  may be genuine individuals  who  are  frustrated  by the  mandate of  regulation that those  same individuals  are  not  aware  of the  fraudulent pretenders  it is designed  to  limit.

Thai people  are  no less  gullible  than  any  other  population in reality  but need  some  level of  defence   via  regulatory requirements such as  this as  any  other   nationality.  Two  party contracts   may well  be possible. But  pseudo two  party  (  third  party school employment)  is  what the   regulations  are  intended  for. Not  unreasonable   to  my  thinking.

you actually would prefer having someone or something telling you who you can or cannot hire? Let the schools hire whoever they want, pay them whatever they want, fire them whenever they want.

The real issue is taxes, no system for people to hire whoever they want. There has to be some kind of work permit rather than a "green card" system. Thailand hinders itself which pseudo superiority regulations.

[anon467367354]

20 hours ago, 12DrinkMore said:

 

I am not sure that you posted in the right thread.

 

Although I agree that governments around the globe have become self-serving and increasingly see their role at micro-managing the populations, I also find it sensible that qualifications are required before allowing people to work at professional jobs. It is not just Thailand.

 

 

And obviously employers can't make that decision, but an organization that has never stepped foot in one's business can, right? Experience trumps a piece of paper. College degrees are no longer special because everybody and their mother can now go to college. Not so for he Thai people, but in western countries, anybody can get a college degree making them far less "special" than they used to be.

I'd take experience over some piece of paper any day, let's see what you can do.

[quandow]

Hasn't this topic been beaten to death 1000 times over?

 

You cannot legally teach in Thailand without a degree. Period.  You MAY be legally hired as an ASSISTANT at most likely a lower wage, or work for a school system that disregards the laws.

 

[ozmeldo]

On 09/15/2017 at 8:00 AM, gr8fldanielle said:

you actually would prefer having someone or something telling you who you can or cannot hire? Let the schools hire whoever they want, pay them whatever they want, fire them whenever they want.

The real issue is taxes, no system for people to hire whoever they want. There has to be some kind of work permit rather than a "green card" system. Thailand hinders itself which pseudo superiority regulations.

You make it out to be some libertarian issue but the fact is every school in Thailand would like to have competent, DEGREED foreigners on staff. The trouble is salary, location, workload and conditions and administrators. So they are confronted with the real world. The few directors that are ok with flunky teachers and redirecting proper salaries I think are few.

 

I worked at a school that kept non degreed teachers on out of laziness. One did ok job, three not so much. They are long gone now.

 

No idea except spite, bitterness and petty greed that non degreed keep habitually bringing up their stupid opinion that they think they should be allowed in a classroom as a ft teacher without a degree. Meanwhile, many are scrambling for graduate paper to stay in the system.

 

The pathetic thing is that they really have nothing better to offer over a degreed person. They are just hoping to fill some hole in a system for a visa and pocket money.

 

If you are of such value, go work at a language center. I constantly see jobs 4-600b per hour. I routinely turn down privates at 700 and even 800 an hour.

 

It's all about a visa and steady income and nothing to do with teaching, passion, kids, English.

 

These are the same people that call diplomas bits of paper, meaningless. They've done absolutely nothing with their lives and just looking to continue the party.

[brewsterbudgen]

Hasn't this topic been beaten to death 1000 times over?
 
You cannot legally teach in Thailand without a degree. Period.  You MAY be legally hired as an ASSISTANT at most likely a lower wage, or work for a school system that disregards the laws.
 

Not true. It is possible to teach business/corporate classes without a degree.

[sklmeeera]

2 hours ago, ozmeldo said:

You make it out to be some libertarian issue but the fact is every school in Thailand would like to have competent, DEGREED foreigners on staff. The trouble is salary, location, workload and conditions and administrators. So they are confronted with the real world. The few directors that are ok with flunky teachers and redirecting proper salaries I think are few.

 

I worked at a school that kept non degreed teachers on out of laziness. One did ok job, three not so much. They are long gone now.

 

No idea except spite, bitterness and petty greed that non degreed keep habitually bringing up their stupid opinion that they think they should be allowed in a classroom as a ft teacher without a degree. Meanwhile, many are scrambling for graduate paper to stay in the system.

 

The pathetic thing is that they really have nothing better to offer over a degreed person. They are just hoping to fill some hole in a system for a visa and pocket money.

 

If you are of such value, go work at a language center. I constantly see jobs 4-600b per hour. I routinely turn down privates at 700 and even 800 an hour.

 

It's all about a visa and steady income and nothing to do with teaching, passion, kids, English.

 

These are the same people that call diplomas bits of paper, meaningless. They've done absolutely nothing with their lives and just looking to continue the party.

Spot on . I dont give a fig about the teaching . I have been screwed over and abused by so many schools by now that its just all about getting the money and visa now . 

[anon467367354]

15 hours ago, ozmeldo said:

You make it out to be some libertarian issue but the fact is every school in Thailand would like to have competent, DEGREED foreigners on staff. The trouble is salary, location, workload and conditions and administrators. So they are confronted with the real world. The few directors that are ok with flunky teachers and redirecting proper salaries I think are few.

 

I worked at a school that kept non degreed teachers on out of laziness. One did ok job, three not so much. They are long gone now.

 

No idea except spite, bitterness and petty greed that non degreed keep habitually bringing up their stupid opinion that they think they should be allowed in a classroom as a ft teacher without a degree. Meanwhile, many are scrambling for graduate paper to stay in the system.

 

The pathetic thing is that they really have nothing better to offer over a degreed person. They are just hoping to fill some hole in a system for a visa and pocket money.

 

If you are of such value, go work at a language center. I constantly see jobs 4-600b per hour. I routinely turn down privates at 700 and even 800 an hour.

 

It's all about a visa and steady income and nothing to do with teaching, passion, kids, English.

 

These are the same people that call diplomas bits of paper, meaningless. They've done absolutely nothing with their lives and just looking to continue the party.

Interesting, "every" school wants DEGREED foreigners on staff? This is a fact because you've personally contacted every school or can show some proof of someone doing just that? I doubt it. I think schools want competent teachers and an exam should be given before being hired. Having a degree in chemistry does not mean you can teach English.

If most that you know are only here for some pocket money and meet visa requirements, that speaks volumes about the kind of people you hang around.

 

Schools hire people that don't hold degrees out of laziness? Do you think maybe there are not enough people with degrees that want to teach?

 

This doesn't pertain to me at all, got it? "No idea except spite, bitterness and petty greed that non degreed keep habitually bringing up their stupid opinion that they think they should be allowed in a classroom as a ft teacher without a degree. Meanwhile, many are scrambling for graduate paper to stay in the system."

 

Fact of the matter is Thailand is seriously lagging behind all the neighboring countries when it comes to proficiency in English, maybe something needs to change, like hiring qualified teachers, not those holding a piece of paper.

 

I'm not looking for work, I'm retired. I used to teach years ago, mostly the government, a lot of corporate,  some in public schools and some private schools. Get your high horse. I am not trying to make it easier for myself to get a job, I don't need a job, but thanks for your insight. And next time you get your motorbike or phone repaired, make sure that person is "certified", because if a person does not have that piece of paper certifying their qualifications, they just couldn't possibly do a proper job not could they?

 

 

[Thai Ron]

On 9/14/2017 at 11:17 AM, gr8fldanielle said:

it's pretty much a shame where in this country two parties can't contract to do business together without the government interfering. Who really suffers from this micromanagement meddling? The Thai people of course. This government is so out to control the foreigners that they just can't see who it really hurts. Obviously the Thai people are just not smart enough to decide how to spend their hard earned money on what services on their own, they need to be controlled by an entity that is completely out of touch with the people.

I wonder what would happen if this issue were put to vote, the democratic way.

Who does it hurt.

Most TEFL teachers just teach to pay for their jollies; they have absolutely zero interest in pursuing a career as an educator so good on the government for raising the standard (or at least, trying to) for those in public schools.

[lamyai3]

The whole degree debate is worthless due to a lack of parity in international standards. Traditionally in the UK very few people bothered with university due to the expense and the fact that degrees were not required to enter into the vast majority of professions. When I entered the workplace they were actually viewed as an irrelevance and a hindrance, replacing three or four years of valuable work experience (which most employers much preferred). The level of education received at O and A level was often of a higher standard than lots of what I've seen at university level in less developed countries.

 

The reason this rule is enforced here (in recent years especially) has nothing to do with teacher quality, but everything to do with a country that is choking in bureaucracy and red tape, and is obsessed with anything around social status. It's hardly surprising the country scored second from lowest in the whole ASEAN region in English ability when so many hurdles are placed in the way of willing teachers (which would include retirees and those who have settled here with plenty of life experience). Any teaching qualifications that are asked for should be relevant to the task at hand, such as the CELTA or a respectable TEFL course, in which any native speaker who has completed a decent programme will have already demonstrated a certain standard of proficiency. I remember having graduates work under me (not in teaching) and finding them to be no better equipped when it came to common sense than those who didn't have degrees; I also remember the same point of view expressed here in Bangkok in the late 90s from chatting with a school director here, long before the requirements were tightened up. 

Edited September 19, 2017 by lamyai3

[duanebigsby]

On 9/14/2017 at 8:10 AM, masuk said:

In my opinion, the minimum requirement is the TEFL certificate.  (Teaching English as a Foreign Language).  This at least teaches the concepts of language learning, activities, references, teaching methods, and strengthens the grammar and punctuation.

A degree in say, horticulture, or soil science, is not really going to help.

Your opinion, but not official. few schools give a rat's ass if you have a TEFL. If you want a work permit, the horticulture degree is far superior than just a TEFL.

[duanebigsby]

On 9/14/2017 at 9:06 AM, dairy queen said:

Thailand being Thailand, anything is possible. That said, if you want to get a teacher's license [which is required in order to get the work permit] it'll be an uphill struggle without a degree.

It's been a while since I was a teacher, but this was the case 10 years ago, and I doubt that things have changed much since then...

You don't need a teacher's license to get a work permit.

Those holding BEd degrees can get a teaching license and work forever in Thailand. Those holding non Education degrees get a waiver for the license. You can get up to 3- 2 year waivers giving a max of 6 years teaching.

[duanebigsby]

On 9/14/2017 at 9:06 AM, dairy queen said:

Thailand being Thailand, anything is possible. That said, if you want to get a teacher's license [which is required in order to get the work permit] it'll be an uphill struggle without a degree.

It's been a while since I was a teacher, but this was the case 10 years ago, and I doubt that things have changed much since then...

You don't need a teacher's license to get a work permit.

Those holding BEd degrees can get a teaching license and work forever in Thailand. Those holding non Education degrees get a waiver for the license. You can get up to 3- 2 year waivers giving a max of 6 years teaching.

[duanebigsby]

On 9/19/2017 at 3:09 PM, Thai Ron said:

Who does it hurt.

Most TEFL teachers just teach to pay for their jollies; they have absolutely zero interest in pursuing a career as an educator so good on the government for raising the standard (or at least, trying to) for those in public schools.

BS. There are many people who teach here without the baggage you're talking about.

[mike888]

On 9/17/2017 at 6:49 AM, brewsterbudgen said:

Not true. It is possible to teach business/corporate classes without a degree.

 

The "degree supremacists" on here dont understand int he real world noone gives a shit about your degree after your first job. Especially in business (not big corporate) and creative industries real world exp always trumps degree.

 

To think that these glorified babysitters even need so many qualifications in a country with a such a shit education/indoctrination system to make 1-2K/month makes me laugh lol

 

Thailand always has something for every budget, so I'm sure some schools have harvard educated nobodies, and others will just hire some nigerians with fake degrees for 30% of a white guy.

 

BTW I have an MBA and an honors bachelor degree from an ivy league college so I know how worthless they really are.

Edited November 1, 2017 by mike888

[Thai Ron]

16 hours ago, duanebigsby said:

BS. There are many people who teach here without the baggage you're talking about.

Baggage?? What baggage?

Don't look around this forum - check the Thai expatriate Facebook groups for an idea of the way many TEFL teachers are hatched.

Either some guy'sfallen in love with a local girl and wants her to stop working as a "cashier" or he can't find a decent paying job back home with the tiddlywinks degree from community college but, usually, he/she's run out of money but desperately wants to stay "lit"

All the unwashed will chip in saying "Teach English, bro/sis" and "it's easy, all you need is to look Western".

They don't give a monkey's about their students - they just want to fund the craic