Midweek rant: Thai culture is one thing – politeness quite another

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Midweek rant: Thai culture is one thing – politeness quite another

 

File photo

 

If I walked up to one of those dolly bird university girls in the street and snapped her picture or started making a video there would be trouble.

 

I wouldn’t doubt for one minute that my own image and name would be plastered over social media and the police would probably get involved.

 

I’d be Thai public enemy number one – another foreign pest to complain about.

 

I don’t of course – I don’t even ogle…well not much. I’ll keep my eyes and my thoughts to myself.

 

Let’s face it anyone doing so would be harassing others – it seems obvious.

 

So why do people thing they have the god given right right to snap pictures and make videos of my children – and expect me to suck it up as they are grinning and leering, even handling my kids like fruit in the market?

 

I know my offspring are adorably cute “luuk khreung”. I know their skin is white and that is prized, their hair is a bit different and I’m sure we agree they will be models and movie stars one day.

 

But can’t you ask me first before stealing their images and sharing for likes with millions of friends on the internet.

 

I honestly don’t mind that much – but it would be polite to ask.

 

I have always believed that the Thais are a polite people – I read it in a guidebook - and comparing them to people I’ve seen around Asia in particular and the world in general I have no reason to change my mind.

 

So why is it so many think they can do selfies with my kids as if they were their own?

 

Would they do that if the parents of the cute offspring were Thai? I don’t think so.

 

Are they not asking me because they don’t know how to in broken English? Perhaps – but wouldn’t you think that a man with a Thai wife is likely to understand “khor thay ruup noi kha” or words to that effect?

 

Maybe they think that simple sentences in Thai are impossible for any foreigner.

 

Sunday at Dream World was not spoiled as a result. That would be absurd. It was a great day out but got me thinking.

 

It started with those guys who snap your picture as you arrive so they can flog you a crappy plate later. It has happened so often that I don’t really expect them to ask and I don’t buy their wares.

 

In fact, it amuses me that they won’t get a baht and might waste money as a result. He he…

 

But shouldn’t they ask.

 

Later it was the many people all over the park who spent their entire day taking pictures of themselves.

 

Tiring of that and seeing a selfie opportunity they turned to my kids. At least four or five times.

 

I said nothing. I didn’t forbid it. The wife would find it strange – almost rude if I did. I certainly didn’t want to spoil anyone’s day by making a song and dance of it.

 

But weren’t the people rude not to ask? What makes my kids somehow your property to do as you like with?

 

Too often you see Thais hiding behind their culture in situations like this. The culture says we all love children. The culture says we should all be one happy family. The culture says we shouldn’t make trouble, especially in public, for no reason.

 

But doesn’t the culture also talk about “grengjai” or imposing on another person’s feelings? Doesn’t the culture also stress the need to consider the needs of older people to a greater extent?

 

It seems a lot of that goes out the window when a foreigner is involved.

 

It’s fair game! Fair sport!

 

Is it an almighty leap of the imagination to think that I might object to my kids being all over the internet, being shared by all and sundry?

 

I think not.

 

My kids are only one and four but my point is you should ask. If they were older – heaven forbid in bathing costumes at a water park perhaps – then I’d certainly ask you not to.

 

As a teacher responsible for hundreds of children in public on school trips we had a policy. We had to.

 

We’d ask people angling to take snaps not to do so. If anyone did we’d ask them to stop – even delete the image and explain why.

 

If people were suspicious – men at a swimming pool perhaps - we’d have to call the police. Fortunately in my experience it never came to that.

 

Yes, this wasn’t a school trip. I was just having a day out. I kept smiling.

 

But I couldn’t help feeling that at the very least people should have asked.

 

And I was left with a sense that some people had left their famous good manners at home.

 

And thought their behavior was just fine.

 

Is the internet and smart phone era responsible?

 

Rooster

 

 

-- © Copyright Thai Visa News 2017-09-27

[Centrum]

Get a life.

[Samui Bodoh]

Yes, the people should have asked.

 

However, you are a 'farang' and your child a 'luuk khreung' and thus neither of you are worthy of proper politeness. You have been labelled as a non-Thai, and a non-Thai simply does not merit the same considerations as a Thai. It is that simple.

 

The power of the label is ugly. 

[Get Real]

Yes, the Internet and smartphone era is definately responsible. Along with everybody having a camera handy today and a combination of beleif that all people loves Facebook.

All people do not love Facebook. All people do not want to have their pictures spread all over the net. It´s all about privacy. You know, the one that went away when social media entered the mindset of 95% of the population. Just face it! Social media is the most misleading explaination for a virtual place where everybody seems to feel connected. There is absolutely nothing social with theese places.

Social is something that only exists in real life, and can never be replaced by the virtual and unrealistic playgrounds for children, teenagers and grown-ups that they´ve unfortunately namned social media.

And, yes! You should definately have the right not to allow people to take pictures without your conscent. Yes, people should be polite and actually feel the need to ask before taking a picture of total strangers, that they directly is going to post on Internet. It is an invasion of privacy. Has always been and is always going to be.
 

22 minutes ago, Centrum said:

Get a life.

I guess you are one of the people that don´t feel the need to ask and respect others. Probably also forgot the real meaning of the word polite.
So, don´t bother. Get back to your little electronic playground that you choose to call life.

Edited September 26, 2017 by Get Real

[Dexlowe]

Of course I agree with what you say - my little infant daughter (in pre-smartphone days) was often "manhandled" by over-enthusiastic Thais, especially sales ladies in department stores (odd). One day my wife came home with my daughter who had clear signs of physical "abuse" (angry red splotches around the cheeks) and was not her usual cheerful self, and it turned out, as it had often until then, been a result of my little girl being made to "perform" for the sales ladies (more on this later).

 

Wifey and I made a decision not to allow anymore handling of our child by others, and to her credit she hung tough, although with more subtlety than me (I just used my body and a glare to shield my kid, although on a couple of occasions when I was blind-sided, I had to use physical means to extricate her from groping hands). There weren't many supermarkets/department stores around then, nor foreigners with kids, so we soon became known as the "hands-off" couple, and apart from a couple of bimbos who were offended by my behaviour, were treated with more respect afterwards.

 

BTW, while Thais generally are great with kids, some (bored sales ladies?) are inclined to use them for their own entertainment, winding them up and practically forcing them to dance and so on for their own pleasure, often causing the kids some distress. Anyone agree? 

 

 

[LazySlipper]

2 hours ago, Centrum said:

Get a life.

 

Here here!

 

Got nothing better to write about?

 

 

[lupin]

"dolly bird" ? .. how old is this poster for crying out loud? ... 107?

[Kadilo]

I think there is a difference between snapping a cute baby and sticking your camera in front of a hot young uni student. 

I agree with the comments about Facebook. People who are obsessed with it don't realise how intrusive it is to people who don't use it. 

[Get Real]

27 minutes ago, lupin said:

"dolly bird" ? .. how old is this poster for crying out loud? ... 107?

The question is: Did you understand what he meant?

If yes, then the age or what words he choose doesn´t matter.

If no, the age still doesn´t matter. You are just one of thoose that grew up with a computer that you later change to a smartphone.
You really need to reevaluate your way of understanding people. Try once in a while to get out of the made up world. That´s a good start.

 

[klauskunkel]

Here is your solution, Rooster:

charge them money. The selfies would stop and you still comply with the culture.

[mikebell]

I love a good rant - particularly about quaint Thai customs; driving; police; Education; corruption; double pricing.  I've covered them all in my 'Amusing Thailand' Ebook.  

My favourite is who on earth told Thai business men that driving slowly round city centres broadcasting a garbled advert on a loudspeaker is good business practice and economic.

[Kadilo]

1 minute ago, mikebell said:

I love a good rant - particularly about quaint Thai customs; driving; police; Education; corruption; double pricing.  I've covered them all in my 'Amusing Thailand' Ebook.  

My favourite is who on earth told Thai business men that driving slowly round city centres broadcasting a garbled advert on a loudspeaker is good business practice and economic.

Was that a plug for your book?

 

[mikebell]

Just now, Kadilo said:

Was that a plug for your book?

 

I couldn't possibly comment.

[lupin]

33 minutes ago, Get Real said:

The question is: Did you understand what he meant?

If yes, then the age or what words he choose doesn´t matter.

If no, the age still doesn´t matter. You are just one of thoose that grew up with a computer that you later change to a smartphone.
You really need to reevaluate your way of understanding people. Try once in a while to get out of the made up world. That´s a good start.

 

I'm 72, I understood the language used. Wasn't aware commenting on the language used in the OP was a no no. Will confine comments to judging and labeling people as you have done in future.

 

Cheers

[Thian]

3 hours ago, Samui Bodoh said:

Yes, the people should have asked.

 

However, you are a 'farang' and your child a 'luuk khreung' and thus neither of you are worthy of proper politeness. You have been labelled as a non-Thai, and a non-Thai simply does not merit the same considerations as a Thai. It is that simple.

 

The power of the label is ugly. 

Well he could have been a real European King and his Queen plus prince/princesses...the Thai don't know that.

 

In that case would it be polite to make pictures of the European Prince or Princess without asking for permission to the real European King?

 

 

[Kadilo]

1 minute ago, Thian said:

Well he could have been a real European King and his Queen plus prince/princesses...the Thai don't know that.

 

In that case would it be polite to make pictures of the European Prince or Princess without asking for permission to the real European King?

 

 

Yeah they always pop into Dream World. 

[akampa]

15 minutes ago, mikebell said:

I love a good rant - particularly about quaint Thai customs; driving; police; Education; corruption; double pricing.  I've covered them all in my 'Amusing Thailand' Ebook.  

My favourite is who on earth told Thai business men that driving slowly round city centres broadcasting a garbled advert on a loudspeaker is good business practice and economic.

It also shows how stupid they are because where I live they do this advertising when most people are away off to work.

[Orac]

Can’t see the problem with harmless photos and other people getting ‘likes’ from my child’s image. A far more serious issue is the touching and need for physical contact with young kids that seems prevalent here. When I am out with my daughter I have often had to stop strangers, usually old women, from trying to touch my daughters face.

[akampa]

2 minutes ago, Orac said:

Can’t see the problem with harmless photos and other people getting ‘likes’ from my child’s image. A far more serious issue is the touching and need for physical contact with young kids that seems prevalent here. When I am out with my daughter I have often had to stop strangers, usually old women, from trying to touch my daughters face.

+1

[rkidlad]

I really don't know why anyone would want to take a picture of some stranger's kid. Sure, I guess kids can be cute, but you don't know that kid. As a male, if I see some hot bird and say, "You're hot. Can we take a selfie together, so I can show my friends and put it on Facebook?". That would be creepy, right? And I even asked for permission. 

 

When the girls in my office decide to shove their phone in my face and show me a pic of a 'cute kid', I always wanna pull my phone out and show them a picture of a nice pair of breasts. What? I thought we were sharing pictures of things we like to look at?

[Get Real]

13 minutes ago, Thian said:

Well he could have been a real European King and his Queen plus prince/princesses...the Thai don't know that.

 

In that case would it be polite to make pictures of the European Prince or Princess without asking for permission to the real European King?

 

 

Are you living in the same world as all other people?
I guess that you are well aware of that a king, queen, movie stars, actors, politicians and so on forever, are considered as official and public persons.
Of them people take photos all the time, they are used to it and it sort of comes with the work and their status.

No, most people don´t ask then. That was your welcome to the real world call. 

[Thian]

2 minutes ago, Get Real said:

Are you living in the same world as all other people?
I guess that you are well aware of that a king, queen, movie stars, actors, politicians and so on forever, are considered as official and public persons.
Of them people take photos all the time, they are used to it and it sort of comes with the work and their status.

No, most people don´t ask then. That was your welcome to the real world call. 

Yes they are public persons but that doesn't mean they like to be on picture all the time. I know that my King doesn't like it at all but while on holiday they do a press-moment so they all can get their pictures.

 

And about touching kids i think it's not done at all....imagine a lady chopping up chickens/frogs/turtles with bare hands and going to a foreign princess to touch her face and make selfies...

 

And my King likes to go to parks with his kids, also abroad...yes they bring security but all are undercover and stay away from them if possible. He also has a foreign Queen by the way.

[Get Real]

1 minute ago, Thian said:

Yes they are public persons but that doesn't mean they like to be on picture all the time. I know that my King doesn't like it at all but while on holiday they do a press-moment so they all can get their pictures.

 

And about touching kids i think it's not done at all....imagine a lady chopping up chickens/frogs/turtles with bare hands and going to a foreign princess to touch her face and make selfies...

 

And my King likes to go to parks with his kids, also abroad...yes they bring security but all are undercover and stay away from them if possible. He also has a foreign Queen by the way.

But, please get it! The rant is regarding common people. Not kings, not queens and their children. You know, you and me and all the other working families on the planet.

Nobody likes to get their children touched by dirty hands, or clean hands from people you just don´t know. Nobody should have the right to take just anybody´s photo and later post it on "anti"social media.

Put up a red card, and then start your pricess talk again. Are you seriuos??? 

[hansnl]

4 hours ago, Centrum said:

Get a life.

He has a life.

And wants to keep it that way.

Certainly is not funny pictures of your children are doing the rounds on "social media".

And yes, he has a point, or several points, it is quite rude taking pictures of others, even children, without asking for permission to do so.

[hansnl]

27 minutes ago, Thian said:

Yes they are public persons but that doesn't mean they like to be on picture all the time. I know that my King doesn't like it at all but while on holiday they do a press-moment so they all can get their pictures.

 

And about touching kids i think it's not done at all....imagine a lady chopping up chickens/frogs/turtles with bare hands and going to a foreign princess to touch her face and make selfies...

 

And my King likes to go to parks with his kids, also abroad...yes they bring security but all are undercover and stay away from them if possible. He also has a foreign Queen by the way.

You must be Dutch!

I presume you don't really understand where it is all about, do you?

The man is talking about privacy and rudeness.

[Thian]

25 minutes ago, hansnl said:

You must be Dutch!

I presume you don't really understand where it is all about, do you?

The man is talking about privacy and rudeness.

Yes privacy and rudeness against strange people you meet in a thema-park....(who might be royals from abroad, who knows).

 

Now which part didn't i understand?

[YetAnother]

5 hours ago, Samui Bodoh said:

Yes, the people should have asked.

 

However, you are a 'farang' and your child a 'luuk khreung' and thus neither of you are worthy of proper politeness. You have been labelled as a non-Thai, and a non-Thai simply does not merit the same considerations as a Thai. It is that simple.

 

The power of the label is ugly. 

i gave the thai people 5 years of positive expectations; every proceeding year, my expectations went down another 10 %; until i understood everything i needed to know about thainess; right about that time, expectations were Zero;

they are now negative based on their baseless racism and unjustified ultra nationalism; the way they treat non thai results in reverse discrimination and i do look down on them for that

[Curmudgeon1]

6 hours ago, Samui Bodoh said:

Yes, the people should have asked.

 

However, you are a 'farang' and your child a 'luuk khreung' and thus neither of you are worthy of proper politeness. You have been labelled as a non-Thai, and a non-Thai simply does not merit the same considerations as a Thai. It is that simple.

 

The power of the label is ugly. 

Lets not go there. Farangs treat Thais like they're inferior....in my experience the more "pedestrian" the farang the more superior they behave. 

 

[rkidlad]

4 minutes ago, Curmudgeon1 said:

Lets not go there. Farangs treat Thais like they're inferior....in my experience the more "pedestrian" the farang the more superior they behave. 

 

I treat 'Thais' as if I would treat anyone. Regardless of race, nationality or status. If you're nice to me, I'm nice back. If you're rude, boorish and/or just incredibly ignorant and boring, etc, I will leave you alone.

 

A person's race, nationality or status does not make me feel anything. I feel no disdain, nor am I at all impressed. I'll leave these feelings to be based on the individual's merit, or lack of. 

 

 

[Thian]

The only thing i do to a Thai kid is saying "sawadee krab, sabaai dee mai" while sticking out my hand for a handshake...mind you, i don't grab their hand but offer mine so they can give me a handshake if they dare.

Edited September 27, 2017 by Thian