It's 'farang' Not 'falang'!

[benlovesnuk]

helloooooooooooooo,

i believe (though once back in 1990 was actually proved to be wrong- one time only, of course this is dry english humour....ha..........ha)

words in thai are written as to be directly spoken, you read what you say and how to pronounce from wthe written

though the word is spelt farang

thai's drop the r to l based around it being difficult to say and so most say falang in conversation, just like arai is sometime alai etc etc

i am told if i speak in this manner i would be appreciated to be more understood as a thai rather then a foreign man speaking thai.....

its just a lazy way of speaking

what i think we should be concerning ourselves with is when writing in word mine defaults to us english which means it tells me that everything is spelt with a z not an s, i find this preposterous i am english after all i should know.

ha ha see its my humour again its crazy and its taking over... ha

[huggybear]

Has anyone noticed that when falang/farang men speak Thai they do so in a naff, lispy, high pitched way.

It might be because their usual interlocutors are young women. So they are mimicking them inadvertantly.

Thai men don't squeak, they have normal voices commensurate with male vocal chords.

Yes, I have noticed this too and find it weird.

I was once introduced to a farang guy in Bangkok, and when introduced the person doing the introduction said "so-and-so speaks excellent Thai". Then when the guy spoke his "excellent Thai" his voice was two octaves higher than usual.

So I'm in the Bier Garden about two weeks ago and hear some guy order like he had just sucked in helium, turn around, and there he is ! Mr. so-and-so and his "excellent high pitched Thai"!

Edited February 21, 2008 by huggybear

[happyjackthe4th]

Thai's can pronounce pretty much bloody anything , if there's cash invoved

[Zpete]

Dunno if this has been said before.

Farang is for most people.

Falang is Chinese....... rite?

eg: Flied lice.......wot ya thinx?

[kolasaab]

Seems many of TV members have live-in Issan GFs - judging by the large number of posts mentioning 'falang'.

Whilst this might be how Issan girls say the word in Issan/Lao, it's not a correct transliteration of the Thai word ฝรั่ง. It's pronounced 'farang' because that's a ror reua in the middle (basically a letter R). (If it were 'falang' then it would be spelt ฝลั่ง

This is not a post about Thai language. It's just a rant about people using the wrong English spelling because they can't read Thai !

Rant over....

Simon

LOL.......funny you bring this up. My fiance, from Lumduan, and I had a discussion about this last night. I asked her what the correct was the correct way to say it and she said "farang". I asked why do so many say "falang" and her reply was that not to many Thai's can pronounce the "r" properly so it sounds like "falang".

BTW, her native tongue is Cambodian, that's all they speak in the village.

I was having breakfast with a thai lady in chaweng last year and jenifer lopez was singing on tv. The thai lady said i like this song to which i replied (its cra_p). She says, what does that mean?? to which i reply, if something is rubbish then we say cra_p. The next day we were doing the same thing and u2 were on tv and i said Oh! i like this track, to which she replied (its cla_p)

[Pepe']

I must admit honestly, I'm confused...

[qwertz]

Speaking of crap, in the Chinese restaurant where I live, the English menu offers crap on toast.

[happyinthai]

Speaking of crap, in the Chinese restaurant where I live, the English menu offers crap on toast.

no "klap on tost" surely??

[aaaaaa]

Dunno if this has been said before.

Farang is for most people.

Falang is Chinese....... rite?

eg: Flied lice.......wot ya thinx?

and as I've heard often here in Thailand - French also fly, not only lice ! (or rather "flanch fly")

[AnotherATM]

Hi

I rarely hear any Thai roll the 'R' in any word containing it unless they are fooling with it. Ok, technically the R should be rolled, but if the vast majority of Thais shorten it to 'L' then why shouldn't a Far/lang also do it? If it's spoken with an L then I see no point in spelling it with an R considering that the original word isn't even spelt in the western alphabet. Let's face it, if a word is mispronounced for long enough it will eventually be entered into dictionaries in it's distorted form; that's why so many US Americanisms have made it into the Oxford Dictionary.

I find it quite ironic that this point should be raised in an English speaking forum when so few of it's members can speel that language carrectly (no offense intended to U.S. Americans.... or anyone else for that matter).

[seasider]

You could liken it too cockneys or people in the uk that use 'Estuary English'. How many pronounce there 'h's ?

It's slang, common people speaking in a common way. I guess you good say it's a form of laziness as it's easier to drop your 'h's or replace your 'r's with an 'l'. Newsreaders and the like do pronounce their 'h's, most people at street level don't.

In the same way most thai newsreaders do pronounce their 'r's, although sometimes rolled.A good friend of mine, many years ago, was dating a thai newsreader from the army tv channel, think it was channel 11 (iirc) and she definitely pronounced her 'r's !

[dee123]

....is this thread still going ??.....see what you've started Simon,..

[pop_corn]

vely vely true mistel, but when you pronounce all the R's like L's then it make it falaaaang!!!!

hehehe

[meadish_sweetball]

I rarely hear any Thai roll the 'R' in any word containing it unless they are fooling with it. Ok, technically the R should be rolled, but if the vast majority of Thais shorten it to 'L' then why shouldn't a Far/lang also do it? If it's spoken with an L then I see no point in spelling it with an R considering that the original word isn't even spelt in the western alphabet. Let's face it, if a word is mispronounced for long enough it will eventually be entered into dictionaries in it's distorted form; that's why so many US Americanisms have made it into the Oxford Dictionary.

It's up to you how you want to sound - it's tlue most Thais do not make a creal distinction between /r/ and /l/ and since this is lathel common even among educated Thais, they don't cale much except with peopre who speak in public.

Unlike some othel illegural plonunciations and choice of wolds, substituting /r/ for /l/ and vice velsa is not learry an impoltant social malkel so go ahead and say 'falang' and plonounce 'rally' as 'larry' and the othel way alound if it blings you happiness.

[jukapot]

Surprised this thread or thlead (in thai) has been reborn again. Makes me think of the story of the American who saved for years to take a dream vacation in Hawaii. When he finally made it to Hawaii he went up to the first native he saw and asked “Pardon me sir, How do you pronounce the name of this place. Is it hawaii or havayii?” The native responded “havayii, of course” The traveler said “thank you so much”. To which the native replied “You're velcome”.

The word is “Falan” and is Lao as spoken in Issan and Laos. My wife always told me that as a young girl they spoke Lao in her village and because of the school system she reads and writes Thai. For the most part the Issan are ethnic Lao who were resettled in Issan by the Thai some time ago after Vientiane was taken by the Thai army. Indeed when I was in Vientiane from 67 - 73, people were going back and forth across the river freely, It really didn’t serve as much a border for the locals. Families lived on both sides of the border and those homes near the river often had pictures of both kings, because they weren’t sure which was theirs’. Those like my wife who went to thai schools knew they were Thai, but ethnically Lao. In fact very proud to be Thai.

When USAID was kicked out by the Communist Government, the Lao employees could only get paid in Kip, and they had to go to the American Embassy in Vientiane to collect. The former Lao employees of the US Government who were refugees in Thailand were required at the risk of their lives, to sneak back into Vientiane and collect the worthless currency. The other alternative was to go to the American Embassy in Bangkok, declare that they were really Thai and get paid in dollars. Many did just that. When it became time to allow refugees into the US, these former Lao employees were unfortunately disqualified because they had declared them selves Thai into order to collect wages due them. Fortunately, I was able to help a few friends and their families get through because I was able to declare that they had served in the Lao Army and were truly Lao. After almost 40 years, My wife and I are still very close friends with our Lao/Thai friends.

Recently, I came across this blog, where the author very nicely explains how the Issan are really Lao. http://www.thai-blogs.com/index.php/2006/0...t_isaan?blog=28

Now that’s finally, I met my own little hawaiian in Nongkhai, Recently I spoke to my wife’s nephew on the phone and said something about speaking Lao, He corrected me very quickly and said “NO. I speak Issan - not Lao”. Who am I to tell him what language he speaks.

I have my own feelings why the Issan want to disassociate themselves from the Lao. So be what it may. When I visit in few months, I’ll speak Lao to the older generation, and speak Lao to the younger generation. If no one understands me, it’s because I’m a little rusty after being away for 35 years.

By the way. The word for restaurant is lan a han in Thai but han a han in Lao. No R’s.

What to they call restaurants in Udorn these days. That’s Udon with an r.

[AnotherATM]

As my partner says, "Falang always light, Falang know evlyting!", though I think she's picked up a tendency towards sarcasm from me.

[SebD]

My lady and all her girlfriends always substitute the R in most (but not all, strangely enough) words with an L.

A close (male) Thai friend always sticks to using an R and "rolls" (trills?) it, too.

I was teasing her about it, one day, but she brought my teasing to an end by saying just about every word she new (both English and Thai) that contains an R in it, to perfection. Rolling them and otherwise, at will.

I was astounded and asked her why, if she could pronounce her R's so perfectly, she didn't do so in general conversation.

"I not want be snob" she informed me. "Thai people think you just try to be "higher" if speak like that."

Apparently, it's the equivalent of an English aristocrat speaking with a "plum" in their mouth.

I asked why our male Thai friend did it. "All Thai flends [sic] hate him for it! He try to be snob! Try to look like he a "high" person!" she retorted.

I've since discovered, at first hand, that pretty much every single Thai person I know can not only incorporate the R in their speech, when they choose to, but can do so infinitely better than I can. Whatever I try, I just can't make an R trill (anyone know the secret?).

You might wanna try it with your own Thai friends, if you haven't already.

Round and round the rugged rock, the ragged rascal ran - that should sort the men from the boys.

Edited March 21, 2008 by SebD

[Gimbo]

As my partner says, "Falang always light, Falang know evlyting!", though I think she's picked up a tendency towards sarcasm from me.

I read somewhere, possibly here on the forum where a someones Thai wife had hizzed at her husband: "You farang know everything and understand nothing!"

Quite a good sumation of this topic I guess....

[ade100]

At my local so called "farang supermarket" (whatever that means) they have in the kitchen section the "Flying Pan". This is the official wording on the box, I swear.

[madjbs]

Surprised this thread or thlead (in thai) has been reborn again. Makes me think of the story of the American who saved for years to take a dream vacation in Hawaii. When he finally made it to Hawaii he went up to the first native he saw and asked “Pardon me sir, How do you pronounce the name of this place. Is it hawaii or havayii?” The native responded “havayii, of course” The traveler said “thank you so much”. To which the native replied “You're velcome”.

I really think you should check your history books before you try to educate the forum

[Pundi64]

Seems many of TV members have live-in Issan GFs - judging by the large number of posts mentioning 'falang'.

Whilst this might be how Issan girls say the word in Issan/Lao, it's not a correct transliteration of the Thai word ฝรั่ง. It's pronounced 'farang' because that's a ror reua in the middle (basically a letter R). (If it were 'falang' then it would be spelt ฝลั่ง

This is not a post about Thai language. It's just a rant about people using the wrong English spelling because they can't read Thai !

Rant over....

Simon

Yes you are so right-

Go to www.thai-language.org and click into the dictionary

[jukapot]

Surprised this thread or thlead (in thai) has been reborn again. Makes me think of the story of the American who saved for years to take a dream vacation in Hawaii. When he finally made it to Hawaii he went up to the first native he saw and asked “Pardon me sir, How do you pronounce the name of this place. Is it hawaii or havayii?” The native responded “havayii, of course” The traveler said “thank you so much”. To which the native replied “You're velcome”.

I really think you should check your history books before you try to educate the forum

If I wanted to educate the forum I would have given the name and date of the American tourist in Havayii, but if I did I would have embarrassed my self in revealing that I was the traveler..

By the way I have done some reading on Thai history and have a very close friend who co- authored a major book on thailand. We've had many great conversations about the Lao and Issan.

Cup chai lai lai, soak dee sahai (thank you very much, good luck, comrade)

In the words of that great Thai statesman whose name I can not remember

why is there so much aggression and anger in the replies? Rather sad and pathetic in my opinion. :D

[Neeranam]

Apparently, it's the equivalent of an English aristocrat speaking with a "plum" in their mouth.

Exactly.

[AnotherATM]

why is there so much aggression and anger in the replies? Rather sad and pathetic in my opinion.

I think it's a natural bi-product of that lethal cocktail of testosterone and pride. You must remember, the majority of posts are from Far/lang men and we know how competitive they can be, especially if they don't have to face the recipient of their aggression. Most things about the average Far/lang man is so much bigger on the Internet.

[simon43]

I thought my post had died a death a long time ago

Some interesting posts here, but some many off-topic. My moan was about westerners mispronouncing the Thai word 'farang'. (I'm not going to write in Thai since this isn't a linguistic discussion...). Yes, the word is pronounced differently in Issan/Lao. Maybe so many westerners mispronounce it because they have Issan girlfriends/wives??

Simon

[AnotherATM]

I thought my post had died a death a long time ago

Some interesting posts here, but some many off-topic. My moan was about westerners mispronouncing the Thai word 'farang'. (I'm not going to write in Thai since this isn't a linguistic discussion...). Yes, the word is pronounced differently in Issan/Lao. Maybe so many westerners mispronounce it because they have Issan girlfriends/wives??

Simon

Hi.

I don't think it is an Issan thing though. I understand that females from that region of Thailand have a bad name throughout the country, most certainly among Thai women, but the 'r', 'l' issue, from my experience, is country-wide.

Okay, it is quite unique to some countries that words, in the fickle English language, are modified to a simplified version according to pronunciation but, outside North America at least, the spellings are preserved irrespective of how they are pronounced. So, while I think it is acceptable to pronounce the word in question with the 'r' sound, I thought it was purely the spelling by English speakers that the OP had issue with.

The English interpretation of the spelling of many Thai/Cambodian words is questionable; like the seemingly indescriminate use of the letter 'h' whenever the letter 'p' appears; e.g., The place-name 'Phan' is not pronounced 'Fan', so why include the P?

Bye!

[madjbs]

Sorry Jukapot but your history is very suspect. People in Isaan do not speak Lao, they speak a dialect of Thai which is closer to Lao than central Thai, perhaps with the exception of some villages right on the border. Furthermore some parts in South Isaan speak dialects closer to Khmer. Wherever you are people do not greet each other by "sabai dee" for example, and they use particles such as "khrub, Kha".

Another point that you make that is wrong is claiming Isaan people are actually Laotians who were displaced by ethnic Thais What is an ethnic Thai? Central Siamese Thais, Lao, Issan....they all come from the same ethnic group, they are all Tai. Moreover the people of Isaan have been of the Thai Lao subset all through history since the fall of Angkor, they were not displaced by anyone. It is true that Lao and Isaan are occupied by people who ethnically are more similar than people other parts of Thailand, this is because these people have only been split up by international borders during modern times and over time the people of Isaan have been in contact with more people of other ethnic sub sets compared to Laoations who still have a country made up of mostly ethnic Lao.

Edited March 22, 2008 by madjbs

[madjbs]

The English interpretation of the spelling of many Thai/Cambodian words is questionable; like the seemingly indescriminate use of the letter 'h' whenever the letter 'p' appears; e.g., The place-name 'Phan' is not pronounced 'Fan', so why include the P?

If it had no "P" it would be just "han"

If it was "Pan" then nobody would know if it should be pronounced Pban (ป) or Pan (ผ)

Therefore it is necessary to create another sound using English letters that is not part of the English language.

Ph(Transliteration)=P(in English)

P(Transliteration)=Pb(in English)

There are more sounds in Thai than we have similar letters in English so we are always going to have to make do with something, better to just learn to read Thai.

Edited March 22, 2008 by madjbs

[bsided69]

When i first arrived here a few years ago i asked a friend who has lived here for years why Thais didn't pronounce their r's and he said "Because they're LAZY "

I believe him now

I Remember trying to catch a bus from near the Border Of Lao many moons ago when I was a newbie. The Woman said the next bus was going to Chaing Li. I looked it up in the lonely planet. Couldnt find it anywhere. I asked her again. She just sort of scowled and siad "Chaing Li,next bus Chaing Li" Quick look through the index and thought she might be mistaken with Chiang Rai? I asked her this and I think she got a little bit miffed. I wasnt taken the pish, but she thought I was. I settled for the next bus to Chaing Mai. No misunderstanding there.

[AnotherATM]

The English interpretation of the spelling of many Thai/Cambodian words is questionable; like the seemingly indescriminate use of the letter 'h' whenever the letter 'p' appears; e.g., The place-name 'Phan' is not pronounced 'Fan', so why include the P?

If it had no "P" it would be just "han"

There are more sounds in Thai than we have similar letters in English so we are always going to have to make do with something, better to just learn to read Thai.

dam_n! Only two letters to chose from and I type the wrong one. I think I've typed these two letters too many times and my fingers are trying to tell me something. Perhaps it's time to turn this thing off for a while.