Simple way to tell if computer has been taken over?

[Shiver]

I guess if someone was ultra paranoid then perhaps they could boot from a DVD and only use the hard drive for temporary storage which could be wiped every session(?) - I don't know if that's possible or not for a read only device, I haven't checked - someone else might chime in.  Security apps like Antivirus are trailing more than leading defence.

You could probably defend against most attacks that you know of, but it's the methods you don't know that would still catch you out.

I don't know how many people here are into cryptos, but if you are then it's likely you know of Andreas Antonopolous.  Computer security was his job, and his suggestion (re BTC wallets) was to have a fresh install on a computer that has never been on the internet and make a paper wallet and put it under a physical lock and key.  Not a useful answer to OP, but that's what one security expert does (or did before hardware solutions were available) in a narrow task area.  Remember too that wireless printers and the like can also be compromised as a way into the computer.  Wired devices generally don't need much of an O/S, so simple and stupid devices are actually smarter in that instance.

Earlier in this thread I was asking different distributions of Linux.  While that won't make it bullet proof,  hackers/crackers would generally use a Linux like system and would rather die than support Micro$oft, so in that sense by having Windows (or iOS) would be attacked much more frequently.

[thaibeachlovers]

On ‎10‎/‎14‎/‎2017 at 3:28 PM, KhunBENQ said:

An additional scan, free and without permanent installation.

McAfee Stinger. It's an on demand scanner with the full signature scan of the McAfee product.

 

https://www.mcafee.com/de/downloads/free-tools/stinger.aspx

 

Use the "Download Stinger" or "Download Stinger for x64 systems".

Then unpack the downloaded zip file to a folder and run "stinger.exe".

If your free AVG as well as Stinger (and the programs recommended above) don't find a problem it's somewhat unlikely that your computer is infected/"taken over".

 

I guess you interpret this "fatal flaw" as an indicator?

Can't remember this wording from a W10 error message.

Can you do a screenshot and insert here?

 

 

Thank you to all that replied. I don't understand any of the technical jargon though, and I wouldn't know how to do a "screenshot", whatever that is.

 

However, I was referring to my computer being used without my knowledge, rather than doing things that disrupt. I read that hackers commandeer many computers to do nefarious things, whatever that would be.

 

BTW, I always assume that everything I do on the computer is known by spotty boys in a big building somewhere, so I try to avoid anything of any actual value to someone else.

My default action when something goes wrong on a computer is to buy another one ( back home computer repair is legalised robbery, they charge so much ), and new ones are pretty cheap now, but I don't want anyone using my computer without my knowledge to do bad things, if I can avoid it.

One of these days I'm going to come to my senses and not touch another computer till they make it without MS filthware as standard at an affordable price. I know there is something called Linux out there, but like I said, I don't know enough about it to go out of my comfort zone.

 

PS It should have been "fatal error" not "fatal flaw". Doesn't seem to have made any difference though. So far.

 

[thaibeachlovers]

3 hours ago, CaptHaddock said:

The short answer is that of course there is no "simple" way to verify that a computer has not been compromised.  If there were, life would be a lot simpler.  There are arbitrary ways that an operating system may be hacked.  The more you know about systems the more likely you are to detect penetration. 

 

If you are worried that your computer has been penetrated then you should do a fresh install of the operating system.  I understand that many business travelers to China do a routine full wipe and reinstall of their laptops on return to the West.

I bought a new computer in LOS. Several replies have pointed out that a bogus OS may have been installed. If I get a "fresh install" done what guarantee do I have that it isn't also a fake? They didn't include a disc with an OS on it when I bought it and Power Buy don't sell Lenovo with an OS installed.

 

[CaptHaddock]

6 minutes ago, thaibeachlovers said:

I bought a new computer in LOS. Several replies have pointed out that a bogus OS may have been installed. If I get a "fresh install" done what guarantee do I have that it isn't also a fake? They didn't include a disc with an OS on it when I bought it and Power Buy don't sell Lenovo with an OS installed.

 

Of course,  you can't know.  You can take steps to increase the likelihood that you have a clean OS, e.g. by downloading a disk image from a trusted source such as Microsoft's website and verifying the checksum.  That would give you a high degree of confidence, but even taking those steps you could not be 100% sure.  Modern pc operating systems contains tens of millions of lines of code.  Microsoft has in the past shipped OS disks already infected with viruses.  There is no way to verify them 100%.  All protection measures are probabilistic.

[tolsti]

On 10/15/2017 at 4:50 AM, jgarbo said:

Depends on the OS. Windows is of course doomed from birth. It was designed with an NSA back door. Apple OS is good but "closed" (you don't know what's inside). I run Linux, which won't allow any installation of anything without  "root" (god) permission. All Linux code is open source, ie thousands of very smart, very angry folk check it constantly for bugs. Bugs are fixed in hours. Updates are automatic, according to importance. Keyloggers don't work because they need to be installed. Viruses don't work, unless you're on your fourth martini and go #.

At "blackhat" conventions, a yearly prize is given to hackers who can "break" a machine. Windows is a joke - 5 minutes. Mac - 20 minutes. Linux - not yet.  

However, the computer and OS may be smart but the operator is the problem. Three yr olds, no matter how cute,  should not drive Ferraris. Clicktards, who click on anything shiny, are the gateway for "pwning" a machine. Do you open your door to a stranger? Pick up cute hitchhikers? Accept drinks in a bar from anyone? Then stay away from computers.  

PS I install Linux on friends' machines after they tire of Windows' stupid bloated system & useless help. No complaints so far. You can make Linux look exactly like Windows (ugh) or run it far better. And Linux & all its apps are free.

Are you in Pattaya? I would like to try Linux on a machine... thanks

[amvet]

2 hours ago, thaibeachlovers said:

Thank you to all that replied. I don't understand any of the technical jargon though, and I wouldn't know how to do a "screenshot", whatever that is.

 

However, I was referring to my computer being used without my knowledge, rather than doing things that disrupt. I read that hackers commandeer many computers to do nefarious things, whatever that would be.

 

BTW, I always assume that everything I do on the computer is known by spotty boys in a big building somewhere, so I try to avoid anything of any actual value to someone else.

My default action when something goes wrong on a computer is to buy another one ( back home computer repair is legalised robbery, they charge so much ), and new ones are pretty cheap now, but I don't want anyone using my computer without my knowledge to do bad things, if I can avoid it.

One of these days I'm going to come to my senses and not touch another computer till they make it without MS filthware as standard at an affordable price. I know there is something called Linux out there, but like I said, I don't know enough about it to go out of my comfort zone.

 

PS It should have been "fatal error" not "fatal flaw". Doesn't seem to have made any difference though. So far.

1.  Google screenshot win 10 for the instructions   press Ctrl + PrtScr

then open paint and press paste then save the pic and post it on TV.

2.  You can buy a pc loaded with Android or you can load Ubuntu for free or you can load Win 10 for free.  You can buy a laptop computer with Android/or Windows cheap.  I believe Asus TX201LA will do both but check.  So if you want to get rid of Windows without any computer knowledge Android is the way most Thai people compute.

What are you doing when you get the message fatal flaw?  Is that exactly what the computer says?

 

 

Edited October 16, 2017 by amvet

[amvet]

1 hour ago, tolsti said:

Are you in Pattaya? I would like to try Linux on a machine... thanks

Linux is easy to try.  Download it to a flash drive and open your computer with the flash drive plugged in and check the box to try it.  More detailed instructions on the net

[oldcarguy]

Bogus Windows 10 can have  virus , many of the copy DVD programs you buy in Pantip type places are infected,

 

It seems that the stock Windows 10 virus protection is very good ,

 

BUT if you click on links in emails you do not know , that is your biggest threat,

 

I have heard you need to set - up a 2nd user that does not have permissions to add programs , then you know if something is trying to sneak thru

[amvet]

13 minutes ago, oldcarguy said:

Bogus Windows 10 can have  virus , many of the copy DVD programs you buy in Pantip type places are infected,

 

It seems that the stock Windows 10 virus protection is very good ,

 

BUT if you click on links in emails you do not know , that is your biggest threat,

 

I have heard you need to set - up a 2nd user that does not have permissions to add programs , then you know if something is trying to sneak thru

The program you are downloading may not tell you there is a virus in a secondary program.  You click install thinking you are getting a program to control your fan speed and instead you get a program that takes over your search engines and won't let you close your computer.  The only way I know of to protect yourself is download it to a computer you don't care about first and if it works OK on that and passes virus scans after it is installed then download it on your good machine.  Of course I don't do this.  I have AOMEI one key and re load my whole system if anything goes major wrong. 

[bendejo]

6 hours ago, Shiver said:

I guess if someone was ultra paranoid then perhaps they could boot from a DVD and only use the hard drive for temporary storage which could be wiped every session

 

Yes, this can be done with most Linux distributions these days, make a bootable thumb drive from an ISO.  This is sometimes still called by the archaic term  Live CD.  Before ubiquitous wifi came along and I had to go to internet 'cafes' I set up such a thumb drive but the people running the places didn't like the idea of me rebooting their machines and fiddling with the BIOS.

It's good for analysis -- if your machine is running weird and you don't know if the problem is your Win installation or your hardware it can help you figure that much out.

 

 

[JSixpack]

19 minutes ago, bendejo said:

 

Yes, this can be done with most Linux distributions these days, make a bootable thumb drive from an ISO.  This is sometimes still called by the archaic term  Live CD.  Before ubiquitous wifi came along and I had to go to internet 'cafes' I set up such a thumb drive but the people running the places didn't like the idea of me rebooting their machines and fiddling with the BIOS.

It's good for analysis -- if your machine is running weird and you don't know if the problem is your Win installation or your hardware it can help you figure that much out.

 

 

 

Lighter distributions are best for this to reduce loading times. Puppy Linux is the gold standard. I like AntiX as it's based on Debian. Both of these will allow you to set up "persistence," so that data can be saved from one session to the next. It's nice to have one's bookmarks saved, for example. User in the Linux forum mentioned a computer in a guesthouse, I think it was, that only ran Puppy from a CD, year after year.

[Meljames]

15 hours ago, thaibeachlovers said:

However, I was referring to my computer being used without my knowledge, rather than doing things that disrupt. I read that hackers commandeer many computers to do nefarious things, whatever that would be

The task manager shows your memory and CPU usage. Keep an eye on that, if you have unexplained spikes or changes in the usage, it could indicate a hacking.  

 

As long as everything is working OK and not being interfered with, I wouldn't worry about it.

 

 

Edited October 17, 2017 by Meljames

[amvet]

33 minutes ago, Meljames said:

The task manager shows your memory and CPU usage. Keep an eye on that, if you have unexplained spikes or changes in the usage, it could indicate a hacking.  

 

As long as everything is working OK and not being interfered with, I wouldn't worry about it.

Re his "Fatal Flaw" message.  More I think about that I would suggest it is from the Thai guy who put in the illegal copy of Win 10.  And it's purpose is to prevent Microsoft from updating.  That means he is missing https://www.computerworld.com/article/3230930/microsoft-windows/review-windows-10-fall-creators-update.html

 

Maybe does not want.  If it was me I'd wipe the hard drive and put in a legal or at least free Win 10 and let it update. 

[Meljames]

25 minutes ago, amvet said:

If it was me I'd wipe the hard drive and put in a legal or at least free Win 10 and let it update. 

 

Good advice. MS has been doing everything short of paying people to use Win 10. There's really no reason to be running a pirated version of it.

[amvet]

1 hour ago, Meljames said:

 

Good advice. MS has been doing everything short of paying people to use Win 10. There's really no reason to be running a pirated version of it.

Ya and since reading on TV about and installing classic explorer for Win 10 my computer shuts down and restarts all in about 10 seconds.  I don't know what it does or if it does anything but I'm sure a lot quicker now. 

[bkk6060]

Not a Tech guy at all but last week my laptop shut down and the screen said my OS was corrupted.

 

I went to Tukcom to a place on the 2nd floor blue sign IT Pattaya Co.  To the right at the top of the escalator.

They specialize in Asus.

 

Reloaded everything in a day 500 b works great.

[petermik]

7 hours ago, bkk6060 said:

Not a Tech guy at all but last week my laptop shut down and the screen said my OS was corrupted.

 

I went to Tukcom to a place on the 2nd floor blue sign IT Pattaya Co.  To the right at the top of the escalator.

They specialize in Asus.

 

Reloaded everything in a day 500 b works great.

Let,s hope it remains that way for you

[bkk6060]

Just now, petermik said:

Let,s hope it remains that way for you

ha thks.  I'll let you know if not.

[JamJar]

On 16/10/2017 at 1:48 PM, thaibeachlovers said:

I bought a new computer in LOS. Several replies have pointed out that a bogus OS may have been installed. If I get a "fresh install" done what guarantee do I have that it isn't also a fake? They didn't include a disc with an OS on it when I bought it and Power Buy don't sell Lenovo with an OS installed.

 

 

Easy enough to run a clean install with a verified download from Microsoft and to buy a licence online for 300 to 400 baht.

What the full model number of the Lenovo?

[hawker9000]

I haven't bought a laptop in a few years now, but the last time I did, it didn't come with any installation disc.  It DID come with a holo-label on the bottom with a Microsoft serial no.  The OS was pre-installed and the HDD had a "Recovery" drive which would essentially do a factory restore including all software & bloatware.   (But you could still MAKE your own recovery DVD; not the same thing as a Windows install disc though.)