Non-o based on marriage

[paz]

Seems to me that in the end, everyone is saying the same: Tourist visa is converted, and then an extension of stay is granted. But some offices do make that difficult, or process the extension at a different time, etc.

 

 

 

[BritTim]

24 minutes ago, paz said:

Seems to me that in the end, everyone is saying the same: Tourist visa is converted, and then an extension of stay is granted. But some offices do make that difficult, or process the extension at a different time, etc.

I am saying something a little different, but you may consider it semantics.

 

I am claiming that the conversion process cancels your existing permission to stay, and gives to a single entry Non O visa, immediately used, and giving you a fresh 90-day permission to stay starting on the day the visa is issued. It differs from an extension in that (i) there is no extension stamp in your passport (just a visa and entry stamp) and (ii) because it does not add time to an existing permission to stay: it is a totally new entry.

 

While people generally do the conversion with the intention later of applying later for a one-year extension of their permission to stay, nothing in the process requires you to apply for any such extension. Indeed, one could imagine a case where someone on a tourist entry wanted to stay an addition 3-5 months in Thailand,  uses the conversion, followed optionally by a 60-day extension without ever applying for a one-year extension. I believe that would be acceptable.

[ubonjoe]

3 minutes ago, BritTim said:

While people generally do the conversion with the intention later of applying later for a one-year extension of their permission to stay, nothing in the process requires you to apply for any such extension. Indeed, one could imagine a case where someone on a tourist entry wanted to stay an addition 3-5 months in Thailand,  uses the conversion, followed optionally by a 60-day extension without ever applying for a one-year extension. I believe that would be acceptable.

Not sure it would be worth it just to get few more months of stay. It requires as stack of documents to do the visa application along with proof of 400k baht in the bank or 40k baht income.

[wallju]

3 hours ago, JackThompson said:

If you could share:

What financials-method was accepted?

Were you given a custom-made list of requirements?

Were you asked to pay an "extra fee" for service beyond the standard 2000 Baht and/or was an agent involved?

 

I hit a brick-wall there using an embassy income stat-doc with MFA certification backed up by bank-books with incoming-transfers, proving the income was genuine. 

I deposit about 2 months ago 400k baht to my thai account,i needed letter from bank  to immigration that proves that money came from overseas and from my own account.That letter is valid only for 2 days so i went to bank first to get fresh letter and then to Immigration.I also needed copys at my updated bankbook,IO check from those copys too that money has been there at least 2 months.

Girls at Immigration front desk gave me list of requirements and it was standard list but IO wanted more than that list says so i had to get rest of the documents before i went to Immigration again.IO wanted copy of tabian baan from my condo owner and copy at his ID,family pictures,hand written map from Immigration to my condo and we had to bring witness for interview.

Female IO was very rude and spoke only thai to my wife,ignored me completely and didn't spoke english at all.

When she finally took my application after hours of waiting she said that fee is 2000 baht,so i paid that.

I did everything with my wife,no need of agents.

[paz]

3 hours ago, BritTim said:

While people generally do the conversion with the intention later of applying later for a one-year extension of their permission to stay, nothing in the process requires you to apply for any such extension.

I think that is just your view of how "it should be", but is not Immigration practice. So they process conversions only when there are the requisites for the applicable 1-year extension, like marriage, retirement, or (the most difficult to get) employment.

Just like ubonjoe has been explaining above and heaven knows how many times before.

[BritTim]

2 hours ago, paz said:

6 hours ago, BritTim said:

While people generally do the conversion with the intention later of applying later for a one-year extension of their permission to stay, nothing in the process requires you to apply for any such extension.

I think that is just your view of how "it should be", but is not Immigration practice. So they process conversions only when there are the requisites for the applicable 1-year extension, like marriage, retirement, or (the most difficult to get) employment.

Just like ubonjoe has been explaining above and heaven knows how many times before.

I am wondering what, specifically, in my description of what happens you consider to be incorrect. I do not see anything that @ubonjoe wrote as disagreeing with what I have written (only questioning whether it would be worthwhile, in general, unless planning to apply for an extension later). The requirements for the in country visa are deliberately strict, as they do not want people using the process as an easy way of staying in Thailand. I think the primary motivation is to assist those who want to apply later for long term extensions who cannot apply for visas at consulates in the region, but only back in home countries. That does not change the essence of what actually happens. No one will come after you if you do a conversion, and after the 90-day stay, leave without requesting an extension.

[JackThompson]

5 hours ago, wallju said:

I deposit about 2 months ago 400k baht to my thai account,i needed letter from bank  to immigration that proves that money came from overseas and from my own account.That letter is valid only for 2 days so i went to bank first to get fresh letter and then to Immigration.I also needed copys at my updated bankbook,IO check from those copys too that money has been there at least 2 months.

Girls at Immigration front desk gave me list of requirements and it was standard list but IO wanted more than that list says so i had to get rest of the documents before i went to Immigration again.IO wanted copy of tabian baan from my condo owner and copy at his ID,family pictures,hand written map from Immigration to my condo and we had to bring witness for interview.

Female IO was very rude and spoke only thai to my wife,ignored me completely and didn't spoke english at all.

When she finally took my application after hours of waiting she said that fee is 2000 baht,so i paid that.

I did everything with my wife,no need of agents.

Thank you for the details.  It sounds like this is the only way for conversions at Jomtien - seasoned funds and no income-docs any more (they used to accept them with MFA cert). 

And thank you for confirming that desk uses a "custom list" of requirements - same as my experience, in that respect. 

 

On the address requirement - it gets worse.  For a 60-day or 1-year extension, they want the tabian bahn and ID from owner you needed before.  But, they also asked me for the tabien-bahn of my residence, including a "blueprint" view - maybe this is only if it is a condo.  Just be sure you go for that 1-year extension a month or so early, so you have time to meet any odd-requirements. 

 

The good news is, the "family" desk are meticulous with the docs (including landlord docs), but are polite.  But, do expect they will talk almost exclusively with your wife - which will be a recurring pattern in all "official" offices, and many other situations.

[wallju]

42 minutes ago, JackThompson said:

On the address requirement - it gets worse.  For a 60-day or 1-year extension, they want the tabian bahn and ID from owner you needed before.  But, they also asked me for the tabien-bahn of my residence, including a "blueprint" view - maybe this is only if it is a condo.  Just be sure you go for that 1-year extension a month or so early, so you have time to meet any odd-requirements. 

 

I had to bring my rental agreement and certificate of residence too,requirements list didn't include tabien baan from condo owner and IO told that requirement at the first time when we were applying.

Luckily condo owner send me copys at same week,he lives in Bangkok and he is quite busy with his work.

[jeab1980]

On 27/11/2017 at 6:38 PM, ubonjoe said:

You are wrong. They are 2 separate applications.

The application for the 90 day non immigrant visa (category O) application requires the same financial proof and supporting documents as the extension of stay based upon marriage. As soon as the visa stamp is done is it marked as used and a 90 day entry stamp is done. The fee for the visa is 2000 baht.

Then during the last 30 days of the 90 entry you can a apply for the one year extension of stay based upon marriage for a fee of 1900 baht. You must show the financial proof and supporting documents again.

Don't have to wait to get extension done at the same time in jontiem first one was 15 months in total

[jeab1980]

On 28/11/2017 at 1:11 AM, BritTim said:

OK, so please explain to me

• on what basis is that visa you get in your passport issued?
• why does your wife need to accompany you to receive the 90-day stay from the visa they put in your passport?
• why is there no extension stamp, but an entry stamp matching the date the Non O visa in the passport is issued, and an Admitted until date 90 days later?
• why are you charged 2,000 baht (the cost of a Non O visa) but nothing that seems to match the normal cost of an extension?

You are correct, I still do not get why a visa and entry stamp (but no extension stamp) given based on provided financial proof equivalent to that required at many consulates for a Non O based on Thai spouse, and wife present is somehow not a single entry visa based on having a Thai spouse.

 

You can not get  a NON O based on marriage from within Thailand you are talking about an Extension of stay by converting a tourist visa to a NON O.

[ubonjoe]

5 minutes ago, jeab1980 said:

Don't have to wait to get extension done at the same time in jontiem first one was 15 months in total

Not anymore. The make you wait until the last 30 days now. An exception is if paying special fees or an agent they do it at the same time.

[ubonjoe]

5 minutes ago, jeab1980 said:

You can not get  a NON O based on marriage from within Thailand you are talking about an Extension of stay by converting a tourist visa to a NON O.

You are contradicting you self in your post.

As I wrote before there are 2 separate and distinct applications done. One for a non immigrant visa (category O) and another for the extension of stay.

[Tanoshi]

1 hour ago, jeab1980 said:

You can not get  a NON O based on marriage from within Thailand you are talking about an Extension of stay by converting a tourist visa to a NON O.

Could you explain why then Immigration offer 2 forms for completion to obtain a Non Imm Visa.

You cannot get an extension based on marriage or retirement unless you hold a Non Imm Visa in the first instance.

 

For those who entered without a Visa (Visa exempt) the TM87 - Application for Visa.

I wish to apply for a Non Immigrant Visa.

Reason for application.  (Either, intend to apply for marriage or retirement extension is a reason)

 

For those who entered on a Tourist Visa, the TM86 - Application for Change of Visa.

I wish to apply for a Non Immigrant Visa.

Reason for application.  (Either, intend to apply for marriage or retirement extension is a reason

 

 

 

 

 

[Tanoshi]

22 hours ago, BritTim said:

While people generally do the conversion with the intention later of applying later for a one-year extension of their permission to stay, nothing in the process requires you to apply for any such extension. Indeed, one could imagine a case where someone on a tourist entry wanted to stay an addition 3-5 months in Thailand,  uses the conversion, followed optionally by a 60-day extension without ever applying for a one-year extension. I believe that would be acceptable.

 

Interesting theory Tim, but what would you state was the reason for the Non Imm Visa, if not to obtain an extension later.

 

In my experience, Immigration required a complete set of documents, and financial proof for the intended extension(s) to be submitted when applying for the Non Imm Visa. This was to ensure they met the criteria for said extension before issuing the Non Imm Visa.

 

In the case of a Swedish acquaintance who applied for a conversion from a TV, with the intention of obtaining an extension based on marriage, he was required to submit both a TM86 and a TM7 with the required financial and documentary proof for the marriage extension.

They called him 15 days later and issued the Non Imm O Visa (I can only guess they were approving his submissions met the criteria for the later marriage extension) before issuing the Non Imm Visa.

60 days later, (2 weeks ago) they issued the extension (already having been approved) without any further financial or documentary proof.

 

[electric]

Seems like OP wallju has successfully submitted his Non O application at Jomtien, with a full set of marriage docs included. Was exactly the same for me at Surin Immi 2 years ago when I converted my TR to Non O.

 

The very first question asked by Surin Immi Captain was "you have wife Thai ? Good ... we can do Non O for you now. Sit down please."  5555

 

Without the accompanying full set of marriage docs, including photos, money seeded etc etc, my Non O application would not have proceeded.

 

Had to supply all the exact same docs again 2 months later when I applied for 1 year extension based on marriage. (which seemed pretty silly .... but .... whatever)

 

 

[JackThompson]

1 hour ago, electric said:

Seems like OP wallju has successfully submitted his Non O application at Jomtien, with a full set of marriage docs included. Was exactly the same for me at Surin Immi 2 years ago when I converted my TR to Non O.

 

The very first question asked by Surin Immi Captain was "you have wife Thai ? Good ... we can do Non O for you now. Sit down please."  5555

 

Without the accompanying full set of marriage docs, including photos, money seeded etc etc, my Non O application would not have proceeded.

 

Had to supply all the exact same docs again 2 months later when I applied for 1 year extension based on marriage. (which seemed pretty silly .... but .... whatever)

But - Hopefully - They follow the official requirements at Surin - so you could use non-seasoned money or proof of income.  These are not options at Jomtien, when I tried a few months ago.