Pakistani ‘Boxer’ in desperate fight to save his family

[rooster59]

Pakistani ‘Boxer’ in desperate fight to save his family

By THE NATION

 

 

Sakda Kaewbuadee Vaysse

 

A once-glorious fighter, forced to flee his home in Pakistan along with his family almost four years ago, is in dire need of help.

 

His wife, a former volunteer teacher for refugees in Bangkok, has been in immigration detention for the past two and a half years and is now seriously sick. 

 

The man and his three teenage children, who are said to be barely surviving in the City of Angels, have been in despair at their inability to help her. 

 

They fear for their future if their lives don’t improve, Sakda Kaewbuadee Vaysse posted on his Facebook page this week.

 

The man, identified only as “Boxer”, and his family have twice applied unsuccessfully for refugee status with the United Nations High Commissioner for Refugees (UNHCR), said Sakda, a well-known volunteer who helps foreigners facing deportation from Thailand.

 

Boxer claimed he had fought for his country at the Olympic Games and had been enjoying a high-profile and comfortable life until four years ago, when Muslim groups started attacking those with other faiths, including he and his family, who are Christian. His wife’s fingers were broken and his middle son, then aged 15, had his tongue and upper lip badly slashed. Those attacks prompted the family to flee, leaving behind Boxer’s own boxing gym and most of their money in banks that couldn’t be transferred in time. They entered Thailand in 2014 and had managed to stay by renewing their visas every three months. 

At the outset they still had money and they used it to help fellow refugees, while his wife set up a school to give free lessons to refugee children. The oldest son studied online with a Bangkok-based university but was told that for some unknown reason he would not be awarded his Bachelor’s degree, Sakda said. 

 

As their money ran low, the family moved into a single room and Boxer said he couldn't afford to renew his wife’s visa. 

 

She was arrested while teaching children one day and has since been in detention for two years and a half. Boxer would visit his wife regularly and became friend with Sakda. 

 

“I saw him sobbing and he told me his wife was too sick to walk and his request for her to go hospital had been denied. Officials would not allow a detainee to go to hospital without first receiving the family’s guarantee of their ability to pay for treatment,” Sakda said, adding that he personally gave Boxer Bt5,000 so his wife could get blood tests. Sakda then returned the following week when he learned the doctor wanted to do a second round of blood tests costing thousands of baht more, which he again paid. 

 

Boxer’s wife couldn’t make it to the second appointment as no detention centre official was available to escort her. When Sakda raised this with a nurse all he received was a cold, indifferent reply, he says. 

 

The nurse finally agreed to try to book an alternative date for the family to receive the results of her bloods tests and the only date they were given was … February 23. Asked for an earlier date, the nurse said the only doctor the hospital had who was familiar with her case was on leave until then, meaning that Boxer’s wife had to undergo yet more costly, updated blood tests and x-rays, Sakda said. 

 

He has tried his best to tell Boxer to keep faith and realise he and his family are not alone – but Sakda admits he doesn’t have any solution to the family’s problems.. “His wife is still in detention. Even if they could afford a plane ticket back to her home country – the whole family might be killed there. It is a dead-end," said Sakda. 

 

Source: http://www.nationmultimedia.com/detail/national/30332446

 

 

-- © Copyright The Nation 2017-11-25

[ezzra]

Not many people knows it but being a christian minority in Pakistan your live ain't worth shit there and your blood is free to let, they're hunted and persecuted like rabid dogs, their houses burned while they're in them, these miserably treated people are the real refuges, unlike the millions that marched on Europe to settle there because it's offers better economical opportunities, and again the

UN has dropped the ball, ignoring the urgent life or death plight of these people.....

[canuckamuck]

Well said Ezzra.

[wotsdermatter]

How many more times do we have to read about people seeking financial assistance for something we are not responsible for or have no knowledge of.  I have assisted many people only to find that some are just pulling the wool over the eyes of those who respond in a positive way.  Therefore, for me, for one, no more.

[nausea]

1 hour ago, rooster59 said:

have twice applied unsuccessfully for refugee status with the United Nations High Commissioner for Refugees (UNHCR)

I wondered why, looked it up - it's not all down to the UNHCR or Thailand, the UK was/is playing a major role in this.

 

In 2016 an All Party Parliamentary Group issued a report stemming from a visit to Thailand:

 

Main point:

"During the visit, it was discovered that the UK Home Office’s CIG (Country Information and Guidance) Report on Pakistani Christians and Christian converts, which states that such individuals are not at “a real risk of persecution”, was being used to justify unduly prolonging granting asylum to Christians fleeing Pakistan."

 

Also:

"The official line of the UK Government is that there is no persecution, the reality is the opposite of that and our report dispenses with that illusion."

 

In detail:

"Our report emerged from a visit to the detention centre in Bangkok where escaping Pakistan Christians are kept in degrading conditions. Instead of being helped to find asylum they have been left to fester while being told by the UNHCR that their cases will take years to process.  In London, we then held evidence  sessions at Westminster at which parliamentarians heard accounts of Christians being burnt alive, bombed, tortured, raped or mown down by murderers – while those responsible have been protected by a culture of impunity.  Others have been imprisoned on spurious charges."

 

(per http://genocidewatch.net/2016/02/25/pakistan-report/)

 

Don't know if the report's been acted on.

 

 

Edited November 25, 2017 by nausea
Grammar

[Get Real]

1 hour ago, ezzra said:

Not many people knows it but being a christian minority in Pakistan your live ain't worth shit there and your blood is free to let, they're hunted and persecuted like rabid dogs, their houses burned while they're in them, these miserably treated people are the real refuges, unlike the millions that marched on Europe to settle there because it's offers better economical opportunities, and again the

UN has dropped the ball, ignoring the urgent life or death plight of these people.....

Sure, as much as I agree with you there ar some thing that you still can´t do. By the way, I guess more people than you know about the situation between different religions in different countries.

As the wife were arrested for teaching, there must be something wrong with the paper work. Even as a person fleeing from a country you must go by the laws and rules in the country you are coming to. Should he and his familily be treated separately just because he was an olympic boxer before. Does that give you the first and exclusive top place in the line?

Off course I symphatise with his and his families difficulties, but there is still rules that has to be followed in the country you are coming too. If you do not break them, maybe UN will look at it in another perspective. Not sure at all, but maybe. They are made for helping people that suffer. Not people that suffer and break the law at the same time.

[jonclark]

Baerboxer.

Yes the rules need to be followed. But lets be clear that we both know the rules especially here are often structured in such a way to allow broad and often contradictory interpretations by different officials who operate with very little oversight.  That makes following the rules kinda hard especially when your desirability is determined by race and ability to pay in the eyes of the officials.

 

For me however the uttter lack of humanity shown by failing to provide even basic medical care to a fellow human is so shameful that it highlights human rights in Thailand as nothing more that a fashionable soundbite.

 

[graemeaylward]

What a mess! The UN need to get their act together to help Christians fleeing Pakistan, where there is no freedom of religious expression. Also, those of us who are Christians need to do our bit. Are their any Christian organisations involved?


Sent from my iPad using Thaivisa Connect

[trianglechoke]

Islam again. I am a former Muslim, white, English, koran fluent......... lefties, don't waste my time..... promote science not pseudo science.... or sociology as u guys see to call it. <deleted> Allah (how is it hate speech if Allah doesn't exist..... would <deleted> Santa be as bad???

Edited November 25, 2017 by trianglechoke
Mohammed told me to do it!

[Just Weird]

Presumably this woman was allegedly arrested for having no work permit and being on overstay.  She's been in IDC, allegedly, for 2 1/2 years, that's 912 days and one day's detention counts as 200 baht, I think, towards the maximum overstay fine of 20,000 baht.  So far, then, she has "paid" 182,400 baht (912 x 200b) by her detention.

 

Sadka, the volunteer who is reporting this, claims that the woman is so seriously ill that she cannot walk and is being denied hospital treatment because the IDC want a guarantee that the hospital bill will be paid.  Since when have the Immigration police had to take responsibility for a prisoner's ability to pay a hospital bill?  That never happens in an ordinary prison, a sick prisoner is taken to hospital or a doctor and treated free and payment, if any, would be a hospital's concern, not IDC's, surely?

 

Something doesn't quite sound right about this tale.

[Oxx]

Ridiculous.  Convert to Islam.  Problem solved.  One invisible sky wizard is much like the next.  And aren't "Allah" and the Christian "God" supposed to be the same thing? If you're stupid enough to believe in one, you're stupid enough to believe in the other.  Does it really matter if you take the day off on Friday or Sunday?

[canuckamuck]

23 minutes ago, Oxx said:

Ridiculous.  Convert to Islam.  Problem solved.  One invisible sky wizard is much like the next.  And aren't "Allah" and the Christian "God" supposed to be the same thing? If you're stupid enough to believe in one, you're stupid enough to believe in the other.  Does it really matter if you take the day off on Friday or Sunday?

You know they kill atheists too. Would you be so quick to convert?

[InMyShadow]

You know they kill atheists too. Would you be so quick to convert?

Not a relevant question. big bwana will never need to make that choice unless crazy enough to live amongst camel drivers or Pakistanis

[canuckamuck]

3 minutes ago, InMyShadow said:

9 minutes ago, canuckamuck said:

You know they kill atheists too. Would you be so quick to convert?

Not a relevant question. big bwana will never need to make that choice unless crazy enough to live amongst camel drivers or Pakistanis

London?

[maximillian]

10 hours ago, jonclark said:

Baerboxer.

Yes the rules need to be followed. But lets be clear that we both know the rules especially here are often structured in such a way to allow broad and often contradictory interpretations by different officials who operate with very little oversight.  That makes following the rules kinda hard especially when your desirability is determined by race and ability to pay in the eyes of the officials.

 

For me however the uttter lack of humanity shown by failing to provide even basic medical care to a fellow human is so shameful that it highlights human rights in Thailand as nothing more that a fashionable soundbite.

 

This is a Bahtist country, don't forget...  no care, no empathy but rules that favour the rich and powerful. A terrible justice system.

[maximillian]

10 hours ago, graemeaylward said:

What a mess! The UN need to get their act together to help Christians fleeing Pakistan, where there is no freedom of religious expression. Also, those of us who are Christians need to do our bit. Are there any Christian organisations involved?


Sent from my iPad using Thaivisa Connect

How about the Vatikan in Rome ? 

[InMyShadow]

London?

good point.

[Oxx]

7 minutes ago, maximillian said:

How about the Vatikan in Rome ? 

Vatikan't?

[paz]

3 hours ago, Just Weird said:

Sadka, the volunteer who is reporting this, claims that the woman is so seriously ill that she cannot walk and is being denied hospital treatment because the IDC want a guarantee that the hospital bill will be paid.  Since when have the Immigration police had to take responsibility for a prisoner's ability to pay a hospital bill?  That never happens in an ordinary prison, a sick prisoner is taken to hospital or a doctor and treated free and payment, if any, would be a hospital's concern, not IDC's, surely?

Sure, in mine as well as in your country a destitute sick prisoner gets free health care.

In Thailand... ask someone, check yourself. And check what happens when the prisoner/ detained is a foreigner.

Finally, also check what happens you as free foreigner go to a public hospital but it's clear from the onset you will have trouble paying the bill.

 

Let us know what you find.

 

[metisdead]

Posts in violation of the following have been removed:

 

8) You will not post disruptive or inflammatory messages, vulgarities, obscenities or profanities.

 

11) You will not post slurs, degrading or overly negative comments directed towards Thailand, specific locations, Thai institutions such as the judicial or law enforcement system, Thai culture, Thai people or any other group on the basis of race, nationality, religion, gender or sexual orientation.
 

[Just Weird]

13 hours ago, paz said:

Sure, in mine as well as in your country a destitute sick prisoner gets free health care.

In Thailand... ask someone, check yourself. And check what happens when the prisoner/ detained is a foreigner.

Finally, also check what happens you as free foreigner go to a public hospital but it's clear from the onset you will have trouble paying the bill.

 

Let us know what you find.

 

"In Thailand... ask someone, check yourself. And check what happens when the prisoner/ detained is a foreigner'.

I don't need to ask anyone, I know from personal experience that in Thailand a prisoner, Thai or foreign, does get treated without having to pay.  Prisoners in Thailand are not allowed access to any money, apart from a very restricted amount (9,000B) in a prison account (not cash) that can only be used for purchases inside the facilities.  It is not IDC's job to determine whether it's own detainees are allowed treatment depending on whether they can pay the hospital bill because IDC neither determines the bill nor is responsible for paying it.  That's why I'm doubting the veracity of the OP.

 

This is not about a free foreigner going for treatment, that is irrelevant, I know what the answer to that is.

[paz]

1 hour ago, Just Weird said:

"In Thailand... ask someone, check yourself. And check what happens when the prisoner/ detained is a foreigner'.

I don't need to ask anyone, I know from personal experience that in Thailand a prisoner, Thai or foreign, does get treated without having to pay.  Prisoners in Thailand are not allowed access to any money, apart from a very restricted amount (9,000B) in a prison account (not cash) that can only be used for purchases inside the facilities.  It is not IDC's job to determine whether it's own detainees are allowed treatment depending on whether they can pay the hospital bill because IDC neither determines the bill nor is responsible for paying it.  That's why I'm doubting the veracity of the OP.

 

This is not about a free foreigner going for treatment, that is irrelevant, I know what the answer to that is.

 

Seems like you're very convinced about Thai <-> Foreigner equal treatment, even if it in Thailand does not exist, especially when the Foreigner is detained and poor.

But myself have no problem believing that in this police / military run country, is is them that have the last word on that, and much more. 

 

[berybert]

Reading his story, I don't believe a word of it.

You got yourself into the mess, you get yourself out of it.

[Just Weird]

1 hour ago, paz said:

 

Seems like you're very convinced about Thai <-> Foreigner equal treatment, even if it in Thailand does not exist, especially when the Foreigner is detained and poor

 

Seems like you ignored what I said in my previous comment..."I know from personal experience that in Thailand a prisoner, Thai or foreign, does get treated without having to pay".

 

I'm not talking about equality per se for foreigners and whether it exists or not, I'm talking about the treatment sick prisoners get while they're incarcerated, Thai or foreign, from personal experience.

[Just Weird]

On ‎11‎/‎25‎/‎2017 at 8:38 AM, jonclark said:

 

For me however the uttter lack of humanity shown by failing to provide even basic medical care to a fellow human is so shameful that it highlights human rights in Thailand as nothing more that a fashionable soundbite.

 

By damning Thailand you're making the assumption that the OP story provided to The Nation is accurate, while not a lot of it rings true.

Edited November 26, 2017 by Just Weird

[paz]

1 minute ago, Just Weird said:

I'm not talking about equality per se for foreigners and whether it exists or not, I'm talking about the treatment sick prisoners get while they're incarcerated, Thai or foreign, from personal experience.

Alright, so Mr. Weird has spoken, the hospital is eagerly waiting to treat this person for free, the IDC is anxious to transport her as necessary, but fake news are being propagated to attract sympathy, because (as everybody knows) Thailand is at world's top when it comes to prisoners treatment.

 

 

[Just Weird]

4 minutes ago, paz said:

Alright, so Mr. Weird has spoken, the hospital is eagerly waiting to treat this person for free, the IDC is anxious to transport her as necessary, but fake news are being propagated to attract sympathy, because (as everybody knows) Thailand is at world's top when it comes to prisoners treatment.

 

 

"Alright, so Mr. Weird has spoken..."

Seems that you don't like what I say, even though it's true, as a result of real life experience.  That's your problem, not mine.  The 'fake news' (as you so originally describe it) is probably what you read in The Nation's re-published OP.

 

"...the hospital is eagerly waiting to treat this person for free...".

Did I say that?  No, I didn't.  But it would for a prisoner.

 

"...IDC is anxious to transport her as necessary..".

Neither did I say that.  But it would for a prisoner who had to get hospital treatment.

 

"...Mr. Weird...".

Really?  You need to be careful with personal attacks.

[paz]

Thai prisons violate human rights, report says
http://www.aljazeera.com/news/2017/02/thai-prisons-violate-human-rights-report-170228063213721.html

And countless other articles that anyone can find in seconds. But Mr. Just knows better, nevertheless from personal experience!

 

Wait now for his umpteenth response "I did say this, but not that". And then he gets offended if called nickname that he had chosen. Weird, really.