It is more than a little mean of the Nation to suggest Toon did not do enough to highlight the issue. His considerable actions spoke louder than any words. It is up to the media to now take on the baton and keep the topic in the public eye.

6 hours ago, Samui Bodoh said:

Good editorial again from the Nation!

 

What the Nation cannot/is not allowed to say is that the reason for underfunded health services and over-funded military acquisition programs is the lack of a democratically elected, accountable government.

 

An elected government, for all its many faults, is simply better at responding to the demands and needs of its citizens. If you ask the average 'Somchai' on the street whether he would prefer submarines or funded hospitals, the answer will be clear.

 

I sincerely hope that Thailand will return to a demand-responsive, accountable government soon.

 

I share that hope, it'll be a first, especially the 'accountable' bit.

 

But would point out that, from when the B30-health-scheme (now free treatment) was first introduced, the increased cost has never been properly-funded. Some posters on TV said this at-the-time.

 

And purely subjectively, my local hospital currently has its third major new building going-up in three years, there is clearly still at least some investment happening into the health-system, although I'm sure the usual sticky fingers will have been involved along-the-way.

6 hours ago, webfact said:

Toon completed his mission, but he failed to raise public awareness about what’s wrong with our public heath service and the shortfall in government funding. He did, however, expose two truths – that the government is not poor, and that many wealthy Thais are willing to donate millions to charity if it raises their celebrity status.

 

6 hours ago, webfact said:

Prime Minister Prayut Chan-o-cha secured a photo opportunity with Toon at Government House. Soldiers were assigned to assist on the route, and this week he was offered a lift back to Bangkok on a military aircraft. All of this was shameful. The military government should have already been addressing shortcomings in public healthcare. Instead, it ended up riding on the hero’s coattails, hoping some of his popularity might rub off. And meanwhile there’s been plenty of government money to purchase unneeded military hardware.

 

6 hours ago, webfact said:

failed to address the issue underlying the run – that the government fails in its duty to adequately finance public health services

Tells you a lot. Nothing will shame the Government coming from an ordinary rock-n-roller. 

 

Someone has to pay for the new toys.

2 hours ago, Bluespunk said:

Completely disagree, he has brought both issues to the forefront. 

 

Your article being an example of such. 

 

indeed, and part two is to ensure that advantage is taken of this public awareness with a viable, long term, adequately financed strategy for the health service. will it happen? i'm not holding my breath.

19 minutes ago, Ricardo said:

 

I share that hope, it'll be a first, especially the 'accountable' bit.

 

But would point out that, from when the B30-health-scheme (now free treatment) was first introduced, the increased cost has never been properly-funded. Some posters on TV said this at-the-time.

 

And purely subjectively, my local hospital currently has its third major new building going-up in three years, there is clearly still at least some investment happening into the health-system, although I'm sure the usual sticky fingers will have been involved along-the-way.

Hear hear! I'll see your accountable government in Thailand, and raise you a ' see an accountable government finish its term'.

 

My knowledge of health spending in general, much less Thailand specifically, is quite limited. That said, I would be surprised if the 30 Baht scheme or any other scheme was funded "fully". This is an issue that is very prevalent in my native country, and in pretty much every country in the world; what does a fully-funded health service/program/etc. look like? Off the top of my head, I would say that a fully-funded scheme (not sure what exactly to call it) could use up almost unlimited resources. Where do you draw the line? How do you properly decide what percentage of the budget goes where? How much do you spend on the very elderly who are quite ill (huge parts of the budget go here, and it is a... sensitive subject)? How much service and at what level do you provide to rural areas? Much more crowded urban areas? What is the proper ratio of spending between emergency rooms and preventive care? Etc. Etc. Etc.

 

No worries, I am not expecting any answers, but would welcome them if available.

 

The point in my original post which you quoted was merely to point out that elected governments, of whatever stripe, tend to provide more resources to a health care system rather than to a weapons program. And nothing else. Respectfully, not everything is about partisan politics.

 

Cheers and Happy New Year!

 

And to Khun Toon; Well done Sir!

 

2 hours ago, tonray said:

Ironically not countries any expats living here seem to be flocking to in droves....but you are certainly more than welcome to head over to Andorra for your next retirement Visa if that suits your plans. I wonder what Andorran girls are like...ha ha

 

I Googled them and came up with this.

 

https://www.google.co.th/search?q=Andorran+girls&client=firefox-b&dcr=0&tbm=isch&tbo=u&source=univ&sa=X&ved=0ahUKEwid7e7N-qvYAhUDOo8KHd6IATYQsAQIJg&biw=1536&bih=704

Mission accomplished for Toon. Well done, especially as he has put the thieving government and opportunistic media to shame.

 

Remember the so-called British "royal marine" two months ago who made a fuss about his charity super marathon, only to quit in Kampaeng Phet Hospital a couple days later? Pathetic. Toon has shown how it's done, and he isn't even a soldier, just a humble guy willing to help government hospitals. Let's hope it's money not wasted as usual.

41 minutes ago, chippendale said:

Mission accomplished for Toon. Well done, especially as he has put the thieving government and opportunistic media to shame.

 

Remember the so-called British "royal marine" two months ago who made a fuss about his charity super marathon, only to quit in Kampaeng Phet Hospital a couple days later? Pathetic. Toon has shown how it's done, and he isn't even a soldier, just a humble guy willing to help government hospitals. Let's hope it's money not wasted as usual.

 

I remember that but I don't remember you trying to do something like that.

 

I will pardon your ignorance as he was a Royal Marine (retired) and not a "so called"Marine.

Edited December 28, 20178 yr by billd766
added extra text

People need a hero and they will find them one way or the other. Good for Toon he saw a need and stepped up and did something, maybe it will inspire others to do the same instead of bickering on TVF

8 hours ago, Samui Bodoh said:

Good editorial again from the Nation!

 

What the Nation cannot/is not allowed to say is that the reason for underfunded health services and over-funded military acquisition programs is the lack of a democratically elected, accountable government.

 

An elected government, for all its many faults, is simply better at responding to the demands and needs of its citizens. If you ask the average 'Somchai' on the street whether he would prefer submarines or funded hospitals, the answer will be clear.

 

I sincerely hope that Thailand will return to a demand-responsive, accountable government soon.

 

 

"If you ask the average 'Somchai' on the street whether he would prefer submarines or funded hospitals, the answer will be clear."

 

And the reality is that your average Somchai is not that well informed as in many countries.

 

There's another possible question "Do you want the government to be serious about protecting the country from invasion / terrorists etc?"

 

Regardless of all of that, this and past governments for the last 40 years that I'm aware of haven't given anywhere near attention to health care.

 

Now stand by for the 'but thaksin gave the people 30 Baht health care'.... etc...

 

 

The problem isn't just that the hospitals are underfunded, it's also that the money they do get is siphoned off into corrupt officials pockets.

5 hours ago, Gulfsailor said:

Before declaring Toon or any of the rich donators to his cause 'heroes', it would be nice to see some tax returns. I doubt any of them paid even a tenth of the tax they would have if they declared their true income.

Nothing like a bit of completely unjustified and speculative vilification, is there?

4 hours ago, tonray said:

Ironically not countries any expats living here seem to be flocking to in droves....but you are certainly more than welcome to head over to Andorra for your next retirement Visa if that suits your plans. I wonder what Andorran girls are like...ha ha

Some very good looking ones, some not so good looking ones and some better not look at the ones.  

Edited December 28, 20178 yr by jenny2017

2 hours ago, Samui Bodoh said:

My knowledge of health spending in general, much less Thailand specifically, is quite limited. That said, I would be surprised if the 30 Baht scheme or any other scheme was funded "fully". This is an issue that is very prevalent in my native country, and in pretty much every country in the world; what does a fully-funded health service/program/etc. look like? Off the top of my head, I would say that a fully-funded scheme (not sure what exactly to call it) could use up almost unlimited resources. Where do you draw the line? How do you properly decide what percentage of the budget goes where? How much do you spend on the very elderly who are quite ill (huge parts of the budget go here, and it is a... sensitive subject)? How much service and at what level do you provide to rural areas? Much more crowded urban areas? What is the proper ratio of spending between emergency rooms and preventive care? Etc. Etc. Etc.

 

No worries, I am not expecting any answers, but would welcome them if available.

 

Agreed, it's a problem in pretty-much every country, it certainly hasn't been solved in the UK, so I certainly don't have any answers either. 

 

Thanks to modern-advances, you can easily spend the entire GDP on health-care, and there will still be things you can do but not afford.  A reasonable balance between health, and education/social-security/infrastructure-investment/defence/administration is the best that can be hoped-for.

 

A laudable target might be a basic safety-net, which Thailand might one day achieve, if ever they can persuade the majority of the people (especially the poo-yais) to pay some tax !

 

 

 
"If you ask the average 'Somchai' on the street whether he would prefer submarines or funded hospitals, the answer will be clear."
 
And the reality is that your average Somchai is not that well informed as in many countries.
 
There's another possible question "Do you want the government to be serious about protecting the country from invasion / terrorists etc?"
 
Regardless of all of that, this and past governments for the last 40 years that I'm aware of haven't given anywhere near attention to health care.
 
Now stand by for the 'but thaksin gave the people 30 Baht health care'.... etc...
 
 

A foolish post.In fact in the last 40 years the performance of all governments on public health has been rather good.The excellent progress can be clearly seen in the improved numbers in many areas from infant mortality to HIV/AIDS.

Thailand has no external enemies so your question is essentially irrelevant.Terrorism is not a major issue in Thailand yet and in any case the bloated military budget can always be tapped if necessary.

If you ask any man on the street in any country whether they favour public health expenditure over military expenditure the answer is the same - the latter.

In general your assertion that the average Thai is somehow less fitted to take sensible views than those elsewhere is not only unpleasantly mean spirited but patently untrue.


Sent from my iPhone using Thailand Forum - Thaivisa mobile app

9 minutes ago, Ricardo said:

 

Agreed, it's a problem in pretty-much every country, it certainly hasn't been solved in the UK, so I certainly don't have any answers either. 

 

Thanks to modern-advances, you can easily spend the entire GDP on health-care, and there will still be things you can do but not afford.  A reasonable balance between health, and education/social-security/infrastructure-investment/defence/administration is the best that can be hoped-for.

 

A laudable target might be a basic safety-net, which Thailand might one day achieve, if ever they can persuade the majority of the people (especially the poo-yais) to pay some tax !

 

 

Great post. Not too long ago, when the Thai Social Security, where I'm also paying in, was asking the government some serious questions. One of them was why none of the superrich soldiers who are currently ruling the country are paying into the fond.

 

   It doesn't seem logical to the little soldier that such a system is only working when enough people pay in. 

 

 

1 hour ago, scorecard said:

If you ask the average 'Somchai' on the street whether he would prefer submarines or funded hospitals, the answer will be clear."

 

And the reality is that your average Somchai is not that well informed as in many countries.

That is a racist comment. 

2 hours ago, billd766 said:

 

I remember that but I don't remember you trying to do something like that.

 

I will pardon your ignorance as he was a Royal Marine (retired) and not a "so called"Marine.

He's right, though. Most of us farangs aren't barstool ex-marines blathering on about combat heroics, shrapnel wounds and running ultra-marathons.

 

The retired Royal Marine wasn't exactly a veteran of El Alamein and Anzio. He looked far younger than that, judging by his selfies, and would have been expected to perform better.

16 minutes ago, Ricardo said:

 

Agreed, it's a problem in pretty-much every country, it certainly hasn't been solved in the UK, so I certainly don't have any answers either. 

 

Thanks to modern-advances, you can easily spend the entire GDP on health-care, and there will still be things you can do but not afford.  A reasonable balance between health, and education/social-security/infrastructure-investment/defence/administration is the best that can be hoped-for.

 

A laudable target might be a basic safety-net, which Thailand might one day achieve, if ever they can persuade the majority of the people (especially the poo-yais) to pay some tax !

 

 

Same as  in The Netherlands, good healthcare but expensive and the taxpayer is funding it and people themselves (with an extra insurance part). Nobody likes to pay for it and everyone wants the most care they can have. It is just not possible.

 

You will get moral problems like should we give a 70 year old a new liver or not as it would be better to spend it on care of younger people ect ect. With the advances in medicine there is just too much that helps but its not all afordable. Do you help one old person live 1 year longer or 1 younger person 15 years longer. Nobody wants to make those choices. 

6 hours ago, tubby johnson said:

He's right, though. Most of us farangs aren't barstool ex-marines blathering on about combat heroics, shrapnel wounds and running ultra-marathons.

 

The retired Royal Marine wasn't exactly a veteran of El Alamein and Anzio. He looked far younger than that, judging by his selfies, and would have been expected to perform better.

 

Google him.

 

If he was a veteran of El Aamein or Anzio he would be in his 90s by now and would be lucky to still be around.

1 hour ago, billd766 said:

 

Google him.

 

If he was a veteran of El Aamein or Anzio he would be in his 90s by now and would be lucky to still be around.

You've missed his point completely. A veteran of El Alamein and Anzio wouldn't be expected to run a marathon in 2017, let alone a mile.

 

The self-styled royal marine, on the other hand, is much younger and should have run better than, for instance,  a Thai rock singer.

12 hours ago, chippendale said:

You've missed his point completely. A veteran of El Alamein and Anzio wouldn't be expected to run a marathon in 2017, let alone a mile.

 

The self-styled royal marine, on the other hand, is much younger and should have run better than, for instance,  a Thai rock singer.

 

You seem to be about the Royal Marines age so why don't you show us all how to do it properly.

 

BTW did you Google the RM or look at his website yet?

9 minutes ago, billd766 said:

 

You seem to be about the Royal Marines age so why don't you show us all how to do it properly.

 

BTW did you Google the RM or look at his website yet?

Sure. I'll head to the pub tonight and bore people with my daring tales of Seal Team 6 exploits. I captured Saddam. I set Bin Laden's beard on fire. Then I'll drunkenly check into Kampaeng Phet Hospital. Failure to complete an ultra marathon has never looked more glamorous.