EU still open to Britain changing mind on Brexit

[CG1 Blue]

12 minutes ago, dunroaming said:

Not according to what is being said. By changing our minds Brexit would simply be cancelled, so not a matter of re-joining at all.

 

As for my comments about changes in the EU rules.  I wasn't suggesting special rules for the UK, rather for changes for all EU countries. It would give the EU the chance to tweak some of the regulations that many countries find unpalatable.  We are not in the position that we were in when Cameron came back with a pretty pathetic deal.  We are now much further down the road so there is no comparison.  In fact it could be argued that we are in a stronger position with the threat of Brexit.

 

However I doubt that May will go down that road given her weak position. 

If the EU agreed to reform in certain areas of policy and regulations, I'm sure the majority in the UK would be happy to stay in.

I don't share your optimism about this though. My feeling is that the EU would see this as losing face.

[CG1 Blue]

7 minutes ago, dunroaming said:

You continue to just blame the EU for all this.  It was us that said we wanted to leave but still keep all the benefits of staying in.  A bit like I want a divorce but still want to live in the house, drive the car and sleep with my wife without paying my share of the bills. The answer was rather predictable.

 

As for the voting the slips would probably read

 

Remain:

Just scrap Leaving as we are going to be massively worse off if we leave.  No new terms as we won't have left at all.

 

Leave:

Head for the creek but sorry there are no paddles!

No new terms - are you sure about that?

 

Speaking in Strasbourg (in 2017), Guy Verhofstadt, the former Belgian Prime Minister, who is now responsible coordinating the EU parliament’s Brexit stance, suggested there would be a price to pay should Britain wish to remain in the bloc. 

“Emanuel Macron, the new French President, spoke about an open door. I agree,” Mr Verhofstadt said. “But like Alice in Wonderland not all the doors are the same. It will be a brand new door, with a new Europe, a Europe without rebates, without complexity, with real powers and with unity. That is the door towards Europe.” 

 

 

 

 

[dunroaming]

1 minute ago, CG1 Blue said:

If the EU agreed to reform in certain areas of policy and regulations, I'm sure the majority in the UK would be happy to stay in.

I don't share your optimism about this though. My feeling is that the EU would see this as losing face.

I have no optimism of it happening with May as PM.  She just keeps narrowing her options with her Brexit rhetoric.

 

As for the EU losing face I totally get that.  There are currently talks in Europe of reviewing some of the regulations as the UK is not the only one unhappy with them.  Instead of losing face, which is going to happen if the UK leaves anyway, it would be an opportunity to say that they have persuaded us to stay.  If we go then the EU becomes more fragile.  With us in it gets stronger.  They must see that, hence their announcing publicly that they would welcome us changing our minds.  Clearly that is directed towards the British public rather than the government.

[RickBradford]

If somehow the UK reversed the Brexit decision, it would (rightly) be treated by the EU kommissars as an utter joke.*

 

No more special deals, no more opt-outs, join the Euro with an end to the pond starlings (as a Nigerian acquaintance of mine would say), acceptance of an EU army, mandatory refugee quotas and ever closer integration to a federal superstate.

 

Everything, in fact, that the people of the UK, (including every region of England except London), voted against. The country, as represented by its government, might deserve such a fate, but the people wouldn't.

 

* Insert pause here for people to say: "But it already is an utter joke"

[dunroaming]

5 minutes ago, CG1 Blue said:

No new terms - are you sure about that?

 

Speaking in Strasbourg (in 2017), Guy Verhofstadt, the former Belgian Prime Minister, who is now responsible coordinating the EU parliament’s Brexit stance, suggested there would be a price to pay should Britain wish to remain in the bloc. 

“Emanuel Macron, the new French President, spoke about an open door. I agree,” Mr Verhofstadt said. “But like Alice in Wonderland not all the doors are the same. It will be a brand new door, with a new Europe, a Europe without rebates, without complexity, with real powers and with unity. That is the door towards Europe.” 

 

 

 

 

Yes we all know Verhofstadt and his rhetoric.  Bit Like Mays "no deal is better than a bad deal".  That was just bullsh*t as well. When all sides are singing from the same hymn sheet I may take them seriously.  The EU desperately want us to stay in and are not going to put barriers up to prevent that. Still lot's of posturing and no progress.

[dunroaming]

4 minutes ago, RickBradford said:

If somehow the UK reversed the Brexit decision, it would (rightly) be treated by the EU kommissars as an utter joke.*

 

Clearly that is your opinion but just like me they are only our individual opinions.  You know no better than me what the EU Commissars would think or say.

 

Anyway I would love to banter more but I have to go and get my pink nylon sheets out of the washing machine 

[RickBradford]

Hope you kept the temperature cool....

[CG1 Blue]

28 minutes ago, dunroaming said:

I have no optimism of it happening with May as PM.  She just keeps narrowing her options with her Brexit rhetoric.

 

As for the EU losing face I totally get that.  There are currently talks in Europe of reviewing some of the regulations as the UK is not the only one unhappy with them.  Instead of losing face, which is going to happen if the UK leaves anyway, it would be an opportunity to say that they have persuaded us to stay.  If we go then the EU becomes more fragile.  With us in it gets stronger.  They must see that, hence their announcing publicly that they would welcome us changing our minds.  Clearly that is directed towards the British public rather than the government.

Maybe if the EU engaged more with the UK public it would have helped during the referendum debate. Come to think of it, why didn't Juncker or any of the others come over to the UK and address the public before the referendum?

 

"If we go then the EU becomes more fragile.  With us in it gets stronger."

 

I like your sentiment here. Comments like this from EU leaders might have changed the 'them against us' feelings that exist with the majority in the UK.

 

 

 

 

[nauseus]

2 hours ago, dunroaming said:

You continue to just blame the EU for all this.  It was us that said we wanted to leave but still keep all the benefits of staying in.  A bit like I want a divorce but still want to live in the house, drive the car and sleep with my wife without paying my share of the bills. The answer was rather predictable.

 

As for the voting the slips would probably read

 

Remain:

Just scrap Leaving as we are going to be massively worse off if we leave.  No new terms as we won't have left at all.

 

Leave:

Head for the creek but sorry there are no paddles!

The referendum slip offered leave or stay - nothing about benefits or anything else.  

[CG1 Blue]

1 hour ago, nauseus said:

3 hours ago, dunroaming said:

You continue to just blame the EU for all this.  It was us that said we wanted to leave but still keep all the benefits of staying in.  A bit like I want a divorce but still want to live in the house, drive the car and sleep with my wife without paying my share of the bills. The answer was rather predictable.

 

As for the voting the slips would probably read

 

Remain:

Just scrap Leaving as we are going to be massively worse off if we leave.  No new terms as we won't have left at all.

 

Leave:

Head for the creek but sorry there are no paddles!

The referendum slip offered leave or stay - nothing about benefits or anything else.  

That's a good point. It wasn't "us" (the people) who asked for all the benefits of membership. We (the people) just wanted out.

The campaigns on both sides (including the leaflet Cameron had sent to every household) clearly stated a vote to leave was a vote to leave the single market.

[Thongkorn]

It's about 19 unelected men who cannot be sacked or reprimanded,  making decisions , Behind closed locked doors in secret for 500 million people, Nothing to do with Money. That's what the majority voted to leave.

[Khun Han]

10 hours ago, Samui Bodoh said:

Good, well-written post.

 

However...

 

Who would want to do trade deals with the UK? That is a serious question, not a snarky one.

 

Yes, it is true that trade deals aren't permanent, but partners expect their partners to stay in for a long time as there are always economic adjustments that are made to take advantage. I wouldn't want to enter into a trade deal with the UK as making the required changes to my own economy would be too risky (generally speaking). Sorry, but the UK has shown itself to be a fickle partner; who wants to join up with a fickle partner?

 

What trade deals are out there for the UK? I see often Brits talking about joining other trade deals, but I never hear any specifics. Rejoin an EU trade deal? If that is it, why leave? NAFTA? It is unlikely that the UK would be allowed to join; NAFTA already has a financial center (New York ), why would anyone agree to allow London in as a competitor? TPP? It will be much smaller without the US, and the UK is not a pacific country. The Chinese version of TPP? That will benefit China, and the UK is too far away. MERCOSEUR? The UK is not a Latin American country.

 

So, serious question. What trade deal(s)?

 

Cheers

 

Most of our important trading partners within the EU have broken ranks to varying extents in recent months to express their determination to maintain close trading and cultural ties with the UK post-brexit. Many major trading nations outside the EU have expressed serious interest in setting up trade deals with us post-brexit. Beyond citing the official EU 'united' stance, and pooh-poohing the prospective trade deals with non-EU countries with baseless negativity, do you have any factual evidence that the UK will struggle to trade with other nations post-brexit?

[Stargeezr]

The EU must have just realized how much money they will not be getting once Britain is gone, and how

much money they won't be getting from the bankrupt countries!  Run Great Britain, run and don't look back.

Geezer

Edited January 17, 2018 by Stargrazer9889
error

[SABloke]

13 hours ago, ilostmypassword said:

Actually, it's the fifth largest economy on a nominal basis. That means according to the exchange rate. But for most citizens (expats excluded) what's more pertinent is PPP - Purchasing Power Parity. Which is how much you can actually buy with your pound, or euro, or rupee etc.  And on that basis the UK is #9.

http://statisticstimes.com/economy/countries-by-projected-gdp.php

According to your link the UK will be #9 in 2022.  Also, for most citizens PPP per capita is more pertinent than PPP, because it shows how much of the pie you get to share. China drops from 2nd to 70th by those measures for example and the UK from 6th to 20th (According to the World Bank), whereas Qatar jumps from 56th (PPP) to 1st (PPP/capita).

 

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/List_of_countries_by_GDP_(PPP)_per_capita#Lists_of_countries_and_dependencies

[MaeJoMTB]

15 hours ago, roderick17 said:

I thought there had been a vote, and the British  people decided to leave!!

Only Globalist votes count.

[johna]

17 hours ago, roderick17 said:

I thought there had been a vote, and the British  people decided to leave!!

Right but the remoaners are desperately trying to overturn a democratic vote, it is irrelevant whether Brexit will be good or bad for the British Economy, that remains to be seen. The driving factor in the yes vote was immigration and a loss of sovereignty, not the economy.

[ilostmypassword]

6 hours ago, johna said:

Right but the remoaners are desperately trying to overturn a democratic vote, it is irrelevant whether Brexit will be good or bad for the British Economy, that remains to be seen. The driving factor in the yes vote was immigration and a loss of sovereignty, not the economy.

Because democracy means not being able to change your mind.

[CG1 Blue]

Here's a conspiracy theory for you.

 

Theresa May / the UK government never intended to take us out of the EU and devised an ingenious plan:

 

Phase 1: Project fear (part two), where all the globalists bombard the people with negativity

Phase 2: May conducts negotiations with all the ferocity of a kitten, and concedes to every EU demand

Phase 3: Concerted push from all angles for a 2nd referendum

Phase 4: The EU go on the charm offensive, saying the UK can cancel Brexit

Phase 5: 2nd referendum is announced, with the choice being Remain, or Leave with a terrible deal

Phase 6: Remain wins a majority, and May can't be accused of not carrying out the will of the people

 

Once we're locked in again the EU will be able to pull the UK into line, make us join the Euro, get rid of the rebate, drag us towards the European super state including Euro army, and gradually increase EU judicial  and fiscal powers.

 

It's often said that Leavers didn't know what they were voting for.  Remainers need to think hard about what they are voting for, which is definitely not the status quo!

 

 

 

 

 

Edited January 18, 2018 by CG1 Blue

[ilostmypassword]

53 minutes ago, CG1 Blue said:

Here's a conspiracy theory for you.

 

Theresa May / the UK government never intended to take us out of the EU and devised an ingenious plan:

 

Phase 1: Project fear (part two), where all the globalists bombard the people with negativity

Phase 2: May conducts negotiations with all the ferocity of a kitten, and concedes to every EU demand

Phase 3: Concerted push from all angles for a 2nd referendum

Phase 4: The EU go on the charm offensive, saying the UK can cancel Brexit

Phase 5: 2nd referendum is announced, with the choice being Remain, or Leave with a terrible deal

Phase 6: Remain wins a majority, and May can't be accused of not carrying out the will of the people

 

Once we're locked in again the EU will be able to pull the UK into line, make us join the Euro, get rid of the rebate, drag us towards the European super state including Euro army, and gradually increase EU judicial  and fiscal powers.

 

It's often said that Leavers didn't know what they were voting for.  Remainers need to think hard about what they are voting for, which is definitely not the status quo!

 

 

 

 

 

And how will the EU make the UK join the eurozone? How will it drag the UK towards the European super state? 

 

[CG1 Blue]

24 minutes ago, ilostmypassword said:

And how will the EU make the UK join the eurozone? How will it drag the UK towards the European super state? 

 

Take a look at Juncker's state of the union speech back in September. They don't want any exceptions anymore. I forgot to mention they want every nation to be in the Schengen area. Here's an extract from the pro-Remain Guardian newspaper:

 

Juncker proposed more help for all EU countries to join the euro, so that it could be truly “the single currency of the European Union”, along with a wide range of institutional changes, including the creation of an EU finance minister and the widening of the Schengen area, in which passport-free travel is allowed.

In a call for the presidencies of the European commission and the European council, the body comprising the member states’ leaders, to be combined and directly elected in the future, Juncker said the EU needed to be more flexible and streamlined. “Europe would be easier to understand if one captain was steering the ship,” he said.

[Basil B]

On 17/01/2018 at 1:21 AM, webfact said:

EU still open to Britain changing mind on Brexit

I think the headline should read:

"EU want's Britain to change mind on Brexit"

 

[nauseus]

3 hours ago, ilostmypassword said:

And how will the EU make the UK join the eurozone? How will it drag the UK towards the European super state? 

 

Hypnotism??