Flying out 3 days after my 90 day report is due.

[The Deerhunter]

I am on an annual long-stay extension here and am flying out of LOS on business on 15th February,    My next 90 day report was due on the 12th of February.  I assume that with the 7 day grace period after my due report date, I can just ignore the report on the 12th and just fly out on the 15th with no laws being broken.  Does anybody see any problems with that?

[elviajero]

No problem. You can exit without reporting with no laws broken.

[PoorSucker]

You might get fined if they find out next time you make an extension. 

 

The seven days grace period will not remove your reporting obligation. 

[The Deerhunter]

56 minutes ago, PoorSucker said:

You might get fined if they find out next time you make an extension. 

 

The seven days grace period will not remove your reporting obligation. 

Hmmm.  Perhaps Ubon Joe has a comment on that.  It was exactly the kind of eventuality I had considered to be possible.  Wouldn't want that!

[ubonjoe]

5 minutes ago, The Deerhunter said:

Hmmm.  Perhaps Ubon Joe has a comment on that.  It was exactly the kind of eventuality I had considered to be possible.  Wouldn't want that!

I agree with him that they could notice that you did not do your report before leaving and fine you for it. Not likely but it is possible. 

[elviajero]

10 minutes ago, The Deerhunter said:

Hmmm.  Perhaps Ubon Joe has a comment on that.  It was exactly the kind of eventuality I had considered to be possible.  Wouldn't want that!

Immigration’s own rules don’t allow them to fine anyone unless they stay in the country longer than 96 days without reporting.

 

The report doesn’t become due until midnight on day 90. Immigration then, by law, give you 6 days to report without being fined. When you leave the country the count stops so you won’t stay longer than 96 days.

 

Here is is a recent thread on the same topic. Note the OP’s first hand experience.

 

People regularly leave within 97 days without reporting, and I have never heard of anyone getting retrospectively fined.

[BritTim]

6 hours ago, elviajero said:

Immigration’s own rules don’t allow them to fine anyone unless they stay in the country longer than 96 days without reporting.

 

We have had this discussion before. The law says 90 days, but you can report late (up to 7 days) and not be fined. Leaving after 96 days or after 150 days without reporting would be exactly equivalent. Yoy failed to make a 90-day report (which is not a 96-day report). If may be unlikely that your failure to report being 90 consecutive days in Thailand would ever be discovered and you be fined, Some immigration officials might even decide, like you, that it is a report of being 96 consecutive days in Thailand, but I do not think that is a correct interpretation of the law.

[Goethe]

As is so often the case, a question on Thaivisa produces many speculative answers. The only correct answer to this question is: Nobody knows for sure. In the end it all depends, as in the case of many immigration issues, on the interpretation of the Immigration Officer who looks at your passport. 

 

The only totally safe procedure is to report before the expiry of the 90-day period. Why take an unnecessary risk?

[elviajero]

6 hours ago, BritTim said:

The law says 90 days, but you can report late (up to 7 days) and not be fined.

Wrong. You are only reporting late if reporting on day 97+.

 

The report doesn't become due until midnight of day 90 so the first day you, by law, need to report is day 91. The law says you should report as soon after day 90 as possible. Immigration have set that 'asap after day 90' to be within the 97th day. Within 97 days means the last day you can report without being fined is day 96. If you report on day 97+ you can be fined.

 

• If you leave the country within 97 days it is impossible to ever exceed 96 continues days in the country, therefore, you cannot lawfully be fined.
• You are reporting that you are staying in the country longer than 90 days, therefore, if you are leaving within 97 days immigration do not need a report because you're leaving.
• There have been several reports from members who have asked immigration if they need to report if leaving within 97 days and every time they are told no. I've linked the most recent report. As far as I know there has never been a report of someone being fined retrospectively that left within 97 days.

Rather than continuing to "interpret" the rules/law and ignoring members first hand reports, I recommend you ask a few immigration officers yourself.

 

 

[Tanoshi]

Have to agree with elviajero.

 

 An alien can notify 15 days before or 7 days after the 90th day.

You can only be fined after the notification period has expired.

[BritTim]

2 hours ago, Tanoshi said:

Have to agree with elviajero.

 

 An alien can notify 15 days before or 7 days after the 90th day.

You can only be fined after the notification period has expired.

Can you be fined if you leave the country after 150 days (no check is made when you leave or re-enter Thailand to ensure a 90-day report has been done) and subsequently return to Thailand. If yes, why does the law term this a 90-day report, and not a 96-day report if you can ignore the reporting requirement?

[brianbbbb]

18 hours ago, The Deerhunter said:

Hmmm.  Perhaps Ubon Joe has a comment on that.  It was exactly the kind of eventuality I had considered to be possible.  Wouldn't want that!

just report its so easy in and out in not time

[Suradit69]

5 hours ago, Tanoshi said:

Have to agree with elviajero.

 

 An alien can notify 15 days before or 7 days after the 90th day.

You can only be fined after the notification period has expired.

We're really discussing two different things ... what is the strict interpretation of the law and, in reality, what is likely to happen.

 

I think technically one is obliged to make a report if he stays in the kingdom for 90 days or more. You can report up to 7 days late but the report should still be made. In the O/P's case, he will have been in the country for more than 90 days and he apparently will not report that ever.

 

I also agree that realistically nothing will come of it. Definitely no one at the airport will even check on it and it's unlikely his own immigration office will notice or be bothered by it.

 

6 hours ago, elviajero said:

Wrong. You are only reporting late if reporting on day 97+.

... or never making the report at all.

 

Pretty sure the obligation arises once one has been in the country 90 days. If that is never reported at all, it should be a violation.  Again, it's unlikely to have any consequences in the case of the O/P,  but a grumpy nit-picking officer at his home immigration office could make it an issue when he next reports or applies for an extension.

 

22 hours ago, The Deerhunter said:

  I assume ...  I can just ignore the report

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

Edited January 31, 2018 by Suradit69

[AsiaCheese]

While you may get 6 days slack for late reporting, reporting is still required (technically). Leaving the country isn't reporting (technically). It's all up to an immigration officer's interpretation the next time a 90-days or visa extention comes up. I went to ask in Jomtien once, when I flew out on day 91, and was told to do my 90-days reporting - which I did. Better safe than sorry?!

Edited January 31, 2018 by AsiaCheese

[elviajero]

6 hours ago, BritTim said:

Can you be fined if you leave the country after 150 days (no check is made when you leave or re-enter Thailand to ensure a 90-day report has been done) and subsequently return to Thailand. If yes, why does the law term this a 90-day report, and not a 96-day report if you can ignore the reporting requirement?

IMO, yes, because you stayed longer that 96 days without reporting. On day 97 of your 150 day stay a fine became due.

 

The law doesn’t call it a 90 day report. The law says that after staying in the country continuously for 90 days you must, ASAP, update your address. It’s an address report. 

 

 

[Tanoshi]

7 hours ago, BritTim said:

Can you be fined if you leave the country after 150 days (no check is made when you leave or re-enter Thailand to ensure a 90-day report has been done) and subsequently return to Thailand. If yes, why does the law term this a 90-day report, and not a 96-day report if you can ignore the reporting requirement?

I'd ask you to consider the following;

 

Firstly the TM47: Form for Alien to notify of staying longer than 90 days.

 

This is then confirmed by Immigration by the following:

An alien can notify 15 days before or 7 days after the 90th day. In case of the notification expired, an alien must notify by himself/herself and pay 2,000 baht fine.

 

Clearly the notification period doesn't expire until 7 days after the report date, thus no fine can be administered until after the expiry date. (97 days.)

 

 

 

 

Edited January 31, 2018 by Tanoshi

[BritTim]

8 hours ago, Tanoshi said:

I'd ask you to consider the following;

 

Firstly the TM47: Form for Alien to notify of staying longer than 90 days.

 

This is then confirmed by Immigration by the following:

An alien can notify 15 days before or 7 days after the 90th day. In case of the notification expired, an alien must notify by himself/herself and pay 2,000 baht fine.

 

Clearly the notification period doesn't expire until 7 days after the report date, thus no fine can be administered until after the expiry date. (97 days.)

I do not disagree with anything you wrote above. Our disagreement comes with what happens if, after 97 days, you have not made the required report of 90 consecutive days in Thailand. You believe that if you are outside Thailand, this cancels the requirement to report 90 consecutive days in Thailand. My claim is that while the fine for non reporting became enforceable only after you left the country (and could only be levied on your return) a required report of 90 consecutive days in Thailand was not made, and this is contrary to the law. I cannot imagine many would go to report on their return that they failed to make the report, but that is theoretically what they are required to do.

[JackThompson]

16 hours ago, Tanoshi said:

the notification period doesn't expire until 7 days after the report date

By my understanding, you have a 7-day grace period past 90-day to report - but this does not allow one to skip reporting.  Therefore, the grace period does not remove the requirement to report if staying in the Kingdom over 90 days.

 

8 hours ago, BritTim said:

I cannot imagine many would go to report on their return that they failed to make the report, but that is theoretically what they are required to do.

They probably would not.  The problem arises the next time they have to do a 90-day report.  If the IO sees that, in the past, the foreigner stayed in the country 90+days without reporting, they could be fined.

[rockingrobin]

1 hour ago, JackThompson said:

By my understanding, you have a 7-day grace period past 90-day to report - but this does not allow one to skip reporting.  Therefore, the grace period does not remove the requirement to report if staying in the Kingdom over 90 days.

 

They probably would not.  The problem arises the next time they have to do a 90-day report.  If the IO sees that, in the past, the foreigner stayed in the country 90+days without reporting, they could be fined.

 If the person leaves the kingdom within the 7 days , then there is no place of stay to report

 

[Goethe]

The official statement:

 

"If you are a foreigner staying in Thailand for a period longer than 90 days holding a Non-Immigrant Visa, you are required by Thai Immigration to report your current address every 90 days.

 

You must file this report within 7 days before, or 7 days after, your 90-day period expires. However, if you leave Thailand anytime during the 90-day period, then the day count will restart from 1 upon your re-entry into Thailand."

 

Note: The obligation to report is waived only if you leave Thailand "during the 90-day period", not after it. Under a strict interpretation of the above wording the 7-day grace period applies only to those who remain in the kingdom. If you are planning to leave a day or two after the 90-day period, the ONLY totally safe option is to report. Even if no one has ever heard of someone being fined for not reporting and leaving the kingdom after 92 or 95 days, that means nothing: there is always a first time.

[The Deerhunter]

On 31/01/2018 at 12:27 PM, Suradit69 said:

We're really discussing two different things ... what is the strict interpretation of the law and, in reality, what is likely to happen.

 

I think technically one is obliged to make a report if he stays in the kingdom for 90 days or more. You can report up to 7 days late but the report should still be made. In the O/P's case, he will have been in the country for more than 90 days and he apparently will not report that ever.

 

I also agree that realistically nothing will come of it. Definitely no one at the airport will even check on it and it's unlikely his own immigration office will notice or be bothered by it.

 

... or never making the report at all.

 

Pretty sure the obligation arises once one has been in the country 90 days. If that is never reported at all, it should be a violation.  Again, it's unlikely to have any consequences in the case of the O/P,  but a grumpy nit-picking officer at his home immigration office could make it an issue when he next reports or applies for an extension.

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

Thanks for the help everyone.  I had made up my mind to do a mail in report and then unexpectedly my wife has a business appointment with a client in the Eastern Seaboard / SrI Racha area tomorrow, Friday 2nd, so I will probably tag along on that and  do a personal report 10 days early; (i.e. in the 14 day pre-90 day window.)  No  great inconvenience and keeps everyone happy.  Otherwise a drive of 1.5 hours each way plus waiting time and a lunch somewhere, and then probably getting tied up in afternoon Chonburi traffic kills pretty much a whole day.

 

Thanks again for the help, folks. 

 

P.S.  Where do I find a postal address for Thai Immigration offices, Sri Racha, in particular?  I will probably try to remember to ask them tomorrow but I assume it SHOULD be on the Immigration website somewhere.

Edited February 1, 2018 by The Deerhunter

[rockingrobin]

8 minutes ago, Goethe said:

The official statement:

 

"If you are a foreigner staying in Thailand for a period longer than 90 days holding a Non-Immigrant Visa, you are required by Thai Immigration to report your current address every 90 days.

 

You must file this report within 7 days before, or 7 days after, your 90-day period expires. However, if you leave Thailand anytime during the 90-day period, then the day count will restart from 1 upon your re-entry into Thailand."

 

Note: The obligation to report is waived only if you leave Thailand "during the 90-day period", not after it. Under a strict interpretation of the above wording the 7-day grace period applies only to those who remain in the kingdom. If you are planning to leave a day or two after the 90-day period, the ONLY totally safe option is to report. Even if no one has ever heard of someone being fined for not reporting and leaving the kingdom after 92 or 95 days, that means nothing: there is always a first time.

When completing a 90 day report , you are declaring your present address. If no longer resident in the Kingdom there is nothing to report

[Goethe]

"If you are a foreigner staying in Thailand for a period longer than 90 days holding a Non-Immigrant Visa, you are required by Thai Immigration to report your current address every 90 days.

 

You must file this report within 7 days before, or 7 days after, your 90-day period expires. However, if you leave Thailand anytime during the 90-day period, then the day count will restart from 1 upon your re-entry into Thailand."

 

If you leave "during the 90-day period", you don't have report. If you leave the kingdom on day 91 or 96 without reporting, nobody knows how an individual Immigration Officer might interpret the rule. Perhaps no one has reported being fined so far, but that means little: there is always a first time.

 

Better safe than sorry!

[Suradit69]

1 hour ago, rockingrobin said:

 If the person leaves the kingdom within the 7 days , then there is no place of stay to report

 

He is maintaining and returning to his "place of stay" and he had plenty of opportunity to do the report as soon as, or before, or shortly after he had been here 90 days or when he returns to Thailand. When he returns to Thailand there will be a record of him staying in the country for a 90 day period without making a report. 

 

For many (most?) of us who regularly do the 90 day report, there is no reporting of a "place of stay." We just hand over our passport with the previous report stapled in it, the barcode is read and a new report printed with no reporting of current address. We could be living in a cardboard box under a bridge, but the report needs to be made.

 

If you're in the country on a 30 day permission to stay and stay here 31 days, it's true that there will be no penalty when leaving from one of the two airports in Bangkok, but that doesn't mean your permission was actually 31 days. A grace period is just meant to be a convenience. It doesn't change the fact that 30 days is 30 days and 90 days is 90 days.

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

Edited February 1, 2018 by Suradit69

[rockingrobin]

4 minutes ago, Suradit69 said:

He is maintaining and returning to his "place of stay" and he had plenty of opportunity to do the report as soon as, or before, or shortly after he had been here 90 days or when he returns to Thailand. When he returns to Thailand there will be a record of him staying in the country for a 90 day period without making a report. 

 

For many (most?) of us who regularly do the 90 day report, there is no reporting of a "place of stay." We just hand over our passport with the previous report stapled in it, the barcode is read and a new report printed. We could be living under a bridge, but the report needs to be made.

 

If you're in the country on a 30 day permission to stay and stay here 31 days, it's true that there will be no penalty when leaving from one of the two airports in Bangkok, but that doesn't mean your permission was actually 31 days. A grace period is just meant to be a convenience. It doesn't change the fact that 30 days is 30 days and 90 days is 90 days.

 

 

 

 

On exiting the permission of temporary stay becomes invalid. On re-entering an arrival card will be filled out, declaring the intended place of stay. 

[JackThompson]

1 hour ago, rockingrobin said:

When completing a 90 day report , you are declaring your present address. If no longer resident in the Kingdom there is nothing to report

 

2 hours ago, rockingrobin said:

If the person leaves the kingdom within the 7 days , then there is no place of stay to report

If the person stayed in the Kingdom for more than 90-days, and did not report, then they violated the law and could be fined when encountered by immigration in the future.  The rule is 90-days, not 97-days - the extra 7 days is for reporting w/o a fine if you don't leave.

 

Currently, 90-day reporting is not being enforced at airports - so this would only come up if he did something at an immigration office on a future visit.

Edited February 1, 2018 by JackThompson

[Tanoshi]

3 minutes ago, JackThompson said:

If the person stayed in the Kingdom for more than 90-days, and did not report, then they violated the law and could be fined when encountered by immigration in the future.  The rule is 90-days, not 97-days - the extra 7 days is for reporting w/o a fine if you didn't leave.

That's your interpretation Jack.

 

The published notice on 90 day reports by Immigration (in English) is as I posted previously.

''An alien can notify 15 days before or 7 days after the 90th day. In case of the notification expired, an alien must notify by himself/herself and pay 2,000 baht fine. ''

 

The notification period is 15 days before or 7 days after. Only after the notification period (97 days) has expired can an alien be fined.

If you therefore leave the Country on day 95 you cannot be later fined because you haven't breached the notification period.

Only after the 97th day of stay would you be in violation of making a 'late report'.

[BritTim]

1 hour ago, rockingrobin said:

When completing a 90 day report , you are declaring your present address. If no longer resident in the Kingdom there is nothing to report

You are given a seven day grace period to make a late report. It may be inconvenient to make use of this grace period, but that does not absolve you of the requirement to report. It is nonsensical to call this a 90-day report if, in fact, you only need to report being 96 consecutive days in the country.

[rockingrobin]

14 minutes ago, BritTim said:

You are given a seven day grace period to make a late report. It may be inconvenient to make use of this grace period, but that does not absolve you of the requirement to report. It is nonsensical to call this a 90-day report if, in fact, you only need to report being 96 consecutive days in the country.

No, the law reports asap, which has been determined to be 7 days.

By completing a departure card and giving it to immigration as you leave is equivalent to reporting that you are no longer resident in the country.

[BritTim]

5 minutes ago, rockingrobin said:

No, the law reports asap, which has been determined to be 7 days.

By completing a departure card and giving it to immigration as you leave is equivalent to reporting that you are no longer resident in the country.

An interesting argument that I have not seen before. The law says you must report using a TM47 form, but maybe a TM6 departure form is seen as being identical.