Oh, look: it's the champion of freedom, reform and democracy!

The king of the whistleblowers!

I’m sure they have been in close contact ever since the demonstrations 4 years ago, which were all a plan to get another military take over!


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45 minutes ago, baboon said:

What can I say that hasn't already been said on this thread? Talk about a kiss-of-death endorsement...

Its bad news for the Democrats who will see their numbers dwindle even more.. Might be good news for the junta (or not not sure how this all is going to play out). 

 

But its in a way good news for the PTP their enemies the Democrats get weaker, though if this means the junta stays into power it is bad news for the PTP too. (IMHO then bad news for everyone)

 

But i really doubt how many would actually support the army when it comes down to voting. I could be totally wrong of course but everyone is saying their support is going down and down so when it comes down to a vote there should not be that many votes for them. Unless all the vote buying (read popular policies) and campaigning is working. Then IMHO it shows the Thai electorate does not really care who is in power as long as they benefit. (whoever offers most gets their vote no matter who it is)

Edited February 21, 20188 yr by robblok

5 hours ago, Chang_paarp said:

Oh my!!

 

Look who has crawled out from under a rock in an effort to get close to the trough again. 

Oh my!!

Look who are hovering around Thailand in an effort to be able to suck Thailand empty again.....

Edited February 21, 20188 yr by hansnl

A reasonably intelligent, highly idealistic yellow whistle-blowing friend of mine used to say in response to my amazement that she was following a man who had a long, public history of corruption that "People can change". Now I think she's embarrassed. Her post-junta response is "I'm bored with politics"> A lot pof people like her really should be ashamed of their gullibility.

2 minutes ago, tomta said:

A reasonably intelligent, highly idealistic yellow whistle-blowing friend of mine used to say in response to my amazement that she was following a man who had a long, public history of corruption that "People can change". Now I think she's embarrassed. Her post-junta response is "I'm bored with politics"> A lot pof people like her really should be ashamed of their gullibility.

It was not about following Suthep it was the outrage about the Thaksin amnesty and the rice scam that brought the people on the streets, later it was Suthep who just jumped in helping a bit to bring the government down.

 

Nobody could have expected the junta to stay this long, as previous recent coups they always left quite fast.

Suthep is the perfect choice to back Prayut. He perfectly embodies everything that is wrong with the Junta and those who support them.

 

Thaksin must be laughing his ass off, he looks angelic next to this creep.

This bloke has money behind him. Off the scene as a orange peel, now back with renewed vigor. 

 

Danger danger Will Robertson, so the robot said.

Not how I remember it, Robblok. The early groups that tried to get protests happening against Yingluck almost as soon as her government began - groups like PItak Siam and the White Mask crowd talked about shutting down and resetting the country for five years. They talked about the wasted coup of 2006. Yingluck's government was never accorded legitimacy from the "good" people,    These early groups didn't catch fire but they set the  tone and the junta has fulfilled all those promises. Then Suthep came along. The protests against amnesty were a genuine mass movement that he wriggled to the front of but once the bill was withdrawn, something else had to be found and so we had the rice scheme built up as the big bogey. The army had planned to take over well before they did and many people saw that a coup would mean a long period of military government. I saw it coming and I wasn't the only one. 

13 minutes ago, robblok said:

It was not about following Suthep it was the outrage about the Thaksin amnesty and the rice scam that brought the people on the streets, later it was Suthep who just jumped in helping a bit to bring the government down.

 

Nobody could have expected the junta to stay this long, as previous recent coups they always left quite fast.

They never have time limits on them these Junta's.

 

Suthep never jumped or pushed, he was offered the job.

 

The level of corruption offered by Thaksin has only been surpassed by this current crop of Generals.

 

The Rice Scheme was never audited and was investigated in record time.

 

Now that is not taking sides Rob, its being realistic with what has and is happening.

 

Suthep was insolvent but was spending 200,000 baht a day with his campaign. Even if he had the money, his tea money wouldn't go there but generous benefactor's paid for it so they could start making the money the T's weren't letting them make.

Just now, Chris Lawrence said:

They never have time limits on them these Junta's.

 

Suthep never jumped or pushed, he was offered the job.

 

The level of corruption offered by Thaksin has only been surpassed by this current crop of Generals.

 

The Rice Scheme was never audited and was investigated in record time.

 

Now that is not taking sides Rob, its being realistic with what has and is happening.

 

Suthep was insolvent but was spending 200,000 baht a day with his campaign. Even if he had the money, his tea money wouldn't go there but generous benefactor's paid for it so they could start making the money the T's weren't letting them make.

No there have never been time limits Chris, but look at recent history and you will see they always lasted about a year or so.

 

Suthep only got involved after people were enraged by the Thaksin amnesty and rice scheme.

 

Prove that Thaksins his corruption has been surpassed or accept it as your opinion as my opinion is that the corruption of Thaksin has never ever been surpassed.

 

Rice Scheme was investigated quite quickly (but still far to slow from the day that the fake G2G deals were mentionted to the final verdict about YL was far to slow. But IMHO almost all corruption cases are going far to slow, look at Suthep and his police stations.

 

Suthep obviously has backers, and your probably right why they wanted to get rid of Thaksin. They all want to be in power and making money. That is the whole problem here.. corruption is too profitable..  and being in power gives people that option of corruption. Until corruption is really attacked and not just of political enemies this vicious circle will go on forever.

56 minutes ago, hansnl said:

Oh my!!

Look who are hovering around Thailand in an effort to be able to suck Thailand empty again.....

 

Yea they want their chance to suck Thailand empty again, but who in power does not do that.. before I had my preference but now i see they all just want to suck Thailand empty. 

Sickening.

Another who should be hung for treason.

Mr P - bringing happiness to the people, and, what's the other one? Reconciliation? 

Read the above article, aint never gonna happen. The country is just too split along Yellow/Red lines.

And this guy just wants to open up all the old festering wounds again.

49 minutes ago, robblok said:

Prove that Thaksins his corruption has been surpassed or accept it as your opinion as my opinion is that the corruption of Thaksin has never ever been surpassed.

There is NO ACCOUNTABILITY currently Rob.

If this was just a road map to democracy, reconciliation, national security, nada yada bada, why are there so many big projects kicking off - fast trains etc, let alone the military hardware.

Anybody actually allowed to scrutinize the actual cost of a submarine?????

5 minutes ago, thaiguzzi said:

There is NO ACCOUNTABILITY currently Rob.

If this was just a road map to democracy, reconciliation, national security, nada yada bada, why are there so many big projects kicking off - fast trains etc, let alone the military hardware.

Anybody actually allowed to scrutinize the actual cost of a submarine?????

Absolutely right, Thaiguzzi: the scary thing is that for the past four years no scrutiny or accountability has been allowed whatsoever - so the junta mob can simply be sticking their hands in the till constantly and no one dare question them about it or even point a finger at them. Don't forget how Thailand's financial reserves have PLUMMETED under this 'government' - dropped by approximately 75%. That is staggering. Where has all that money gone? At least under Yingluck, people could and did question and challenge and demonstrate. Under the junta - no one is allowed even to ask - let alone get an honest answer.

 

The junta are a lawless law unto themselves.

38 minutes ago, thaiguzzi said:

Sickening.

Another who should be hung for treason.

Mr P - bringing happiness to the people, and, what's the other one? Reconciliation? 

Read the above article, aint never gonna happen. The country is just too split along Yellow/Red lines.

And this guy just wants to open up all the old festering wounds again.

The signs of 1992 are popping up again and again.

 

But, at the moment there isn't a good conflict resolution/dissolution mechanism.

 

Bad times...

12 minutes ago, thaiguzzi said:

There is NO ACCOUNTABILITY currently Rob.

If this was just a road map to democracy, reconciliation, national security, nada yada bada, why are there so many big projects kicking off - fast trains etc, let alone the military hardware.

Anybody actually allowed to scrutinize the actual cost of a submarine?????

There was no accountability back then, only reason we got some convictions for corruption is because of coups otherwise the PTP would also have shielded their people from investigation. That is the whole problem here.. once in power the PTP, democrats, junta, whoever puts their people in places of power to shield them from anti corruption investigations and other legal procedures.

 

This won't change, only time they go after corruption is if its from their political enemies. Its absolutely frustrating that it takes a change of government to go after corruption (of the previous government). Goes for the democrats too not just PTP. 

 

So many cases of corruption clear as day now the junta, then the PTP and when does it get prosecuted with succes.. only once the governments change and the people lose their protectors. 

8 minutes ago, Eligius said:

Absolutely right, Thaiguzzi: the scary thing is that for the past four years no scrutiny or accountability has been allowed whatsoever - so the junta mob can simply be sticking their hands in the till constantly and no one dare question them about it or even point a finger at them. Don't forget how Thailand's financial reserves have PLUMMETED under this 'government' - dropped by approximately 75%. That is staggering. Where has all that money gone? At least under Yingluck, people could and did question and challenge and demonstrate. Under the junta - no one is allowed even to ask - let alone get an honest answer.

 

The junta are a lawless law unto themselves.

Could you put your money where your mouth is and show me those financial reserves that dropped 75%. love to scrutinize what you put up. Because I believe its not true and has been discussed in the pas and proven as untrue.

 

For the record, i certainly believe there is corruption now and that it should be investigated.

 

Under YL corruption of the PTP could also not be really investigated until she was removed. That is a failure of the whole system here. Governments should not be able to stop or stall investigations like that. Unfortunately they can and do. 

 

The people.. there are fraudulent G2G deals... YL there is no corruption I checked...   then only after she got removed did we get a good investigation.. and guess what there were huge fraudulent G2G deals and YL was found guilty of inaction about that corruption.  So don't act like it was good back then it was not. But I agree now its even harder... It should get better but it never does.

1 minute ago, robblok said:

Could you put your money where your mouth is and show me those financial reserves that dropped 75%. ...

There were articles about it at the time (roughly a year ago?) in The Nation and here on Thaivisa Forum. I cannot remember the exact amount by which the reserves fell, but it was close to 75%, if not actually 75%. I think other posters will remember reading about those huge vanishings of national reserve funds ...

7 minutes ago, Eligius said:

There were articles about it at the time (roughly a year ago?) in The Nation and here on Thaivisa Forum. I cannot remember the exact amount by which the reserves fell, but it was close to 75%, if not actually 75%. I think other posters will remember reading about those huge vanishings of national reserve funds ...

Yes I remember those articles and it showed it was a cyclic thing that had to do with when tax get received. That is why i ask you to show this to me so I can point it out again. 

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22 minutes ago, robblok said:

There was no accountability back then, only reason we got some convictions for corruption is because of coups otherwise the PTP would also have shielded their people from investigation. That is the whole problem here.. once in power the PTP, democrats, junta, whoever puts their people in places of power to shield them from anti corruption investigations and other legal procedures.

 

This won't change, only time they go after corruption is if its from their political enemies. Its absolutely frustrating that it takes a change of government to go after corruption (of the previous government). Goes for the democrats too not just PTP. 

 

So many cases of corruption clear as day now the junta, then the PTP and when does it get prosecuted with succes.. only once the governments change and the people lose their protectors. 

As has been said on this forum and others a thousand times, even when accountability measures are weak as they historically are, the ultimate accountability is elections. That is what Suthep and the coup stopped. Any accountability at all 

Just now, tomta said:

As has been said on this forum and others a thousand times, even when accountability measures are weak as they historically are, the ultimate accountability is elections. That is what Suthep and the coup stopped. Any accountability at all 

That is not what elections are for, because it means that popular people can steal without fear of ever being held accountable. Win an election and you got your license to steal.. does not sound how democracy should be. The checks and balances should be there or else there is no real democracy. 

3 minutes ago, robblok said:

Win an election and you got your license to steal..

yes but you have to win one first

unless you have the joker(army)

hope we are going to get an election

1 minute ago, AGareth2 said:

yes but you have to win one first

unless you have the joker(army)

hope we are going to get an election

So its coups are bad... but if you win the election you got a license to steal.... IMHO both are bad and the system should be able to effectively deal with corruption. 

 

Also hoping we get an election of course but I don't agree if its a license to steal. 

7 hours ago, cornishcarlos said:

I thought he promised, about 4 years ago, that he wasn't going to be involved in politics ever again !!!!

Did you just break your promise, you cheeky monkey ??

The elite have bought him out the gimp box, as the threat from Pheu Thai is getting stronger again, even though they have tried everything to get rid of them... 

Damn right you are, Suthep clearly promised to stay out of politics, ...as Thaksin has also done several times already, but read the news about his(!) PT circus!

One simply cannot trust any of those 'old crocodiles' of politics, ...but it seems large swats of the Thai population still drink their words as if it was gospel. Doesn't that say a lot about the Thais, ...and the success of the des-education they are exposed to?

45 minutes ago, robblok said:

That is a failure of the whole system here. Governments should not be able to stop or stall investigations like that. Unfortunately they can and do. 

In the UK; Operation Countryman, (stopped by home office), a ditched inquiry into Saudi arms deals (Blair), stalling of recent paedophile inquiry (???).

 

Not many countries allow sensitive investigations. 

Edited February 21, 20188 yr by owl sees all

42 minutes ago, robblok said:

Yes I remember those articles and it showed it was a cyclic thing that had to do with when tax get received. That is why i ask you to show this to me so I can point it out again. 

It was even worse than I thought: according to this article,  http://www.khaosodenglish.com/politics/2017/02/06/thai-treasury-loses-85-since-coup/  the treasury reserves of the Thai nation are down by 85%! And of course the junta will come up with lies (what else do they spout) about this being a necessary 'adjustment' and a saving of 'interest'. Oh yes! We all believe you - bunch of thieving, mendacious and cowardly criminals!

 

 

Edited February 21, 20188 yr by Eligius

19 minutes ago, bangrak said:

Damn right you are, Suthep clearly promised to stay out of politics, ...as Thaksin has also done several times already, but read the news about his(!) PT circus!

One simply cannot trust any of those 'old crocodiles' of politics, ...but it seems large swats of the Thai population still drink their words as if it was gospel. Doesn't that say a lot about the Thais, ...and the success of the des-education they are exposed to?

I'm not so sure they "drink their words as if it was gospel" but what choices do they have in the few instances when they're graciously allowed to vote. Any honest, untainted candidate would receive no support from  the slimy kingmakers on both/all sides of the political spectrum so unless there is a grassrot movement for change that's simply too big to be resisted by the "invisible hands" it will take a long time for things to change.

And, of course, if the old elite keeps making those coups nothing will.

 

bluddy bogged down our 2014 holiday!!!

 

 

 

'ya know it people like him wot cause unrest!!' 

                                  courtesy Monty Python(R)